28 Film Discussion Threads Later

[MacGuffin]

What is the etiquette on spoilers?

The movie in question is older than six months and I dug up its discussion thread. Spoilers still required or no?

Just use spoiler tags. The little "S" icon, second-to-last of the second row on your toolbar in the "reply to thread" page.

[soitgoes...]

You didn't like Mad Detective? I think it came before Exiled (although released on Blu-ray and DVD in the UK afterward). It seems like it'd be a bit difficult to dislike.I didn't say that. It was good, but it was released after Exiled, and was definitely not as good. Sparrow wasn't as good as Mad Detective and Vengeance not as good as Sparrow. His last film falls comfortably in the mediocre range. I haven't seen Linger, but from I've gathered it would be the worst of his four most recent.

[Sven]

Derek, I love that you appreciate Body Double enough to award it four stars. It really is wonderfully audacious.

[Derek]

Derek, I love that you appreciate Body Double enough to award it four stars. It really is wonderfully audacious.

It's the one DePalma that hits on all cylinders for me. It's sexy, hilarious, playfully experimental, intelligent and just all-around engaging. Probably the best use of a "bad" performance ever. Wasson is amazing, but in such an untraditional way; DePalma really used him perfectly within the film's artificial construction.

[Russ]

It's the one DePalma that hits on all cylinders for me. It's sexy, hilarious, playfully experimental, intelligent and just all-around engaging. Probably the best use of a "bad" performance ever. Wasson is amazing, but in such an untraditional way; DePalma really used him perfectly within the film's artificial construction.
On-the-nose observation of Wasson. An example of DePalma's chess-piece direction of Wasson was during the amazing sequence with him as a stalker at the outdoor Mall.

[Stay Puft]

I haven't seen Linger, but from I've gathered it would be the worst of his four most recent.

Linger was pretty lame, yeah.

[Qrazy]

I didn't say that. It was good, but it was released after Exiled, and was definitely not as good. Sparrow wasn't as good as Mad Detective and Vengeance not as good as Sparrow. His last film falls comfortably in the mediocre range. I haven't seen Linger, but from I've gathered it would be the worst of his four most recent.

Perhaps, but he's still obviously at the height of his career stylistically. I have no doubt he'll soon find another high calibur script to match his approach and we'll have another amazing film. Also, Exiled is not his best film.

[Irish]

Also, Exiled is not his best film.

If it's not, then it's got to be up there.

I haven't seen everything he's done, but the opening to Exiled is a breadth of fresh air in a tired genre.

[TripZone]

I'm partial to Throw Down.

[soitgoes...]

Also, Exiled is not his best film.
Which is?

[megladon8]

I think I'll go see Vengeance at the IFC in December.

[Qrazy]

Which is?

We've already had this conversation.

[Ivan Drago]

:eek: I just found out that James Murphy (of LCD Soundsystem) did the score for Greenberg. I am now interested in Greenberg.

[Irish]

Whoa. Blown away by the Korean thriller The Chaser. Intense, compelling, violent.

My god, this movie does everything right. I couldn't believe it. It's been years since I've seen a top notch thriller.

Unbelievably good.

[balmakboor]

Just rewatched There Will Be Blood. God what a great movie. I can easily see myself watching it once year from now on.

[KK2.0]

just finished Bill Maher's Religulous i'm probably biased since i'm an atheist, but this doc was a ton of fun.

[B-side]

just finished Bill Maher's Religulous i'm probably biased since i'm an atheist, but this doc was a ton of fun.

It is funny. Sure, it's obnoxious, but it's still relevant and potent.

[baby doll]

It is funny. Sure, it's obnoxious, but it's still relevant and potent.I generally like Maher, so I should probably watch this. Incidentally, why does the media talk about the Pope's opinion on condoms as if it mattered, thereby granting it legitimacy? It's like asking Sarah Palin her opinion on climate change, and then reporting on it as if it mattered more than the findings of climate scientists.

[B-side]

I generally like Maher, so I should probably watch this. Incidentally, why does the media talk about the Pope's opinion on condoms as if it mattered, thereby granting it legitimacy? It's like asking Sarah Palin her opinion on climate change, and then reporting on it as if it mattered more than the findings of climate scientists.

Haha, I have no idea, man. I'm right there with you. Doesn't make a bit of sense.

[balmakboor]

I generally like Maher, so I should probably watch this. Incidentally, why does the media talk about the Pope's opinion on condoms as if it mattered, thereby granting it legitimacy? It's like asking Sarah Palin her opinion on climate change, and then reporting on it as if it mattered more than the findings of climate scientists.

Because a helluva lot more people in the world care about the Pope's opinion about condoms than about Sarah Palin's opinion on anything.

[KK2.0]

Not a very good comparison, the pope is the leader of millions of christians around the world, while Palin is just an american polititian. I'm worried when he visits Africa, where AIDS epidemic is out of control, and tells to his people they can't use condoms unless if they are a prostitute or homosexual.

[baby doll]

Because a helluva lot more people in the world care about the Pope's opinion about condoms than about Sarah Palin's opinion on anything.Obviously the pope isn't as stupid as Sarah Palin, but the idea that he makes these grand pronouncements on stuff that he knows nothing about (like having sex) and every Catholic on the planet is supposed to listen to him as if he were this font of spiritual wisdom (and here's a guy who covered up for pedophiles because he thought it more important that the church be perceived as non-corrupt than for it to be in fact non-corrupt) is utterly ridiculous.

[Spinal]

Not a very good comparison, the pope is the leader of millions of christians around the world, while Palin is just an american polititian.

I'm not saying Palin is the Pope. But she is now seen as a leader by millions of Christians. Personally, I think both are ridiculous.

[balmakboor]

Obviously the pope isn't as stupid as Sarah Palin, but the idea that he makes these grand pronouncements on stuff that he knows nothing about (like having sex) and every Catholic on the planet is supposed to listen to him as if he were this font of spiritual wisdom (and here's a guy who covered up for pedophiles because he thought it more important that the church be perceived as non-corrupt than for it to be in fact non-corrupt) is utterly ridiculous.

Please don't mistakenly think I agree with the Pope. I'm an atheist myself. And his pronouncement about condoms only being acceptable for gays and prostitutes makes me wonder if he is as stupid as Sarah Palin.

But the Pope is the leader of what probably amounts to more like billions of Catholics and they do hang on every word he says.

[baby doll]

Please don't mistakenly think I agree with the Pope. I'm an atheist myself. And his pronouncement about condoms only being acceptable for gays and prostitutes makes me wonder if he is as stupid as Sarah Palin.

But the Pope is the leader of what probably amounts to more like billions of Catholics and they do hang on every word he says.Granted, Palin isn't as influential as the pope. My basic point was that he's not an expert on condom use any more than Palin is an expert in evolutionary theory, so why major news organizations would consider his opinion on condoms worthy of consideration is something of a mystery to me. Okay, it's the weekend so there's not much going on, but by reporting on it, they're granting him legitimacy. It's one thing for the Vatican newspaper to report on it, but when the Canadian Broadcasting Company picks it up, I'm like: If they're going to talk about AIDs prevention, surely there are more qualified people to speak to.

Incidentally, since Italy has one of the lowest birth rates on the planet, I don't imagine that every Catholic worldwide is hanging on his every syllable.

[Spinal]

It's one thing for the Vatican newspaper to report on it, but when the Canadian Broadcasting Company picks it up, I'm like: If they're going to talk about AIDs prevention, surely there are more qualified people to speak to.

But he's dressed in ornamental garb! Surely his opinion must have validity.

[baby doll]

But he's dressed in ornamental garb! Surely his opinion must have validity.You got me there. And those Prada slippers are pretty cool.

[endingcredits]

makes me wonder if he is as stupid as Sarah Palin.


To be fair, the Pope spent twenty years as a scholar and professor of theology. His discourse is steeped in canonical catholic doctrine. Palin is stupid on a whole. nutha'. level.

[balmakboor]

Incidentally, since Italy has one of the lowest birth rates on the planet, I don't imagine that every Catholic worldwide is hanging on his every syllable.

I don't know if that stat automatically equates to rampant condom use in Italy, but you may be onto something. I know the churches hold regular classes on the rhythm method (they call it planned parenthood) but every family I know who has taken the class (not to mention the teacher) has gotten unplanned pregnant. So that doesn't seem to work. Most Catholics I know have little interest in abstinance. But I can't imagine they are using condoms. They've told me that commiting such a sin puts them in too great a danger of going to Hell. They actually believe that if they use a condom and get killed in a car crash before they can confess that they are screwed for eternity. (Um, pardon the pun.)

[Spinal]

I know the churches hold regular classes on the rhythm method (they call it planned parenthood) but every family I know who has taken the class (not to mention the teacher) has gotten unplanned pregnant.

:lol:

*thinks of the children*

:sad:

[Irish]

Not to defend Bernie but:

You guys forget that there are entire westernized countries that consider themselves Catholic. Spain, Ireland, Poland and Mexico leap to mind. So if a guy whose opinion holds sway with a huge number of people, regardless of context, it will make the news. The rough equivalent in the US is .. probably Warrent Buffet, Bill Gates, or Oprah. (Hell, just in the last couple of months Gates and Winfrey got a helluva lot of press for spouting off on US education, an area in which neither of them, afaik, have any direct experience).

So it's a mistake to think that, because the Pope never had sex, he can't form and espouse an opinion on birth control. I'm a man, I've never had an abortion, never fired a gun and haven't been on death row. But I can articulate a good argument about abortion, gun control and the death penalty without having any firsthand experience.

[balmakboor]

Not to defend Bernie but:

You guys forget that there are entire westernized countries that consider themselves Catholic. Spain, Ireland, Poland and Mexico leap to mind. So if a guy whose opinion holds sway with a huge number of people, regardless of context, it will make the news. The rough equivalent in the US is .. probably Warrent Buffet, Bill Gates, or Oprah. (Hell, just in the last couple of months Gates and Winfrey got a helluva lot of press for spouting off on US education, an area in which neither of them, afaik, have any direct experience).

So it's a mistake to think that, because the Pope never had sex, he can't form and espouse an opinion on birth control. I'm a man, I've never had an abortion, never fired a gun and haven't been on death row. But I can articulate a good argument about abortion, gun control and the death penalty without having any firsthand experience.

What he said was pretty much what I was trying to say.

[B-side]

To be fair, the Pope spent twenty years as a scholar and professor of theology. His discourse is steeped in canonical catholic doctrine. Palin is stupid on a whole. nutha'. level.

http://www.thetubevideo.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/09/Resized%20therock-madtv.jpg

[KK2.0]

I'm not saying Palin is the Pope. But she is now seen as a leader by millions of Christians. Personally, I think both are ridiculous.

I didn't realize she had so much influence. Everytime i read something about her, is basically making fun of her.

but yeah, both are ridiculous, the pope scares me more though. i mean look at him!

http://s-ak.buzzfed.com/static/enhanced/web04/2010/4/12/8/enhanced-buzz-19440-1271074662-74.jpg

I loved the part in the movie where he starts describing how the stories of several other deities are similar to Jesus, and the scene where he preaches scientology at the park and everyone makes fun of it, although other religions as just as looney.

[endingcredits]

I know the churches hold regular classes on the rhythm method (they call it planned parenthood) but every family I know who has taken the class (not to mention the teacher) has gotten unplanned pregnant. So that doesn't seem to work.

It sounds like one of those placebo birth-control methods one sees in the adverts of old-time magazines.

http://openlearn.open.ac.uk/file.php/3477/!via/oucontent/course/549/dd305_1_008i.jpg

[Spinal]

I didn't realize she had so much influence. Everytime i read something about her, is basically making fun of her.


Well, somebody's gotta be casting all those Bristol Palin votes on Dancing with the Stars.

[Grouchy]

I want to come back a little to the part about Bill Maher being good. I'm a pretty big fan of stand up comedy. Some of the performers that make me laugh are George Carlin, Bill Hicks, Chris Rock, Jim Jeffries and Jerry Seinfeld.

But, you know, I once saw a show by this Bill Maher guy ("But I'm Not Wrong"), and he's terrible. Embarassingly bad. He picks the easiest fucking targets in the world and doesn't even know how to make his attacks funny. He doesn't know how to build a joke properly or how to give it a punchline. I could do the show he did there. He says a bunch of obvious stuff most people who go see a show such as his will obviously agree with and tries to pass it off as comedy. I'd probably like the guy as a person, but I wonder what his fellow comedians must privately think about him.

[Winston*]

I couldn't stand Religulous, turned it off. My God is that Bill Maher guy smug and unfunny

[Spinal]

He's much better in a talk show format than he is doing stand-up.

[B-side]

I want to come back a little to the part about Bill Maher being good. I'm a pretty big fan of stand up comedy. Some of the performers that make me laugh are George Carlin, Bill Hicks, Chris Rock, Jim Jeffries and Jerry Seinfeld.

But, you know, I once saw a show by this Bill Maher guy ("But I'm Not Wrong"), and he's terrible. Embarassingly bad. He picks the easiest fucking targets in the world and doesn't even know how to make his attacks funny. He doesn't know how to build a joke properly or how to give it a punchline. I could do the show he did there. He says a bunch of obvious stuff most people who go see a show such as his will obviously agree with and tries to pass it off as comedy. I'd probably like the guy as a person, but I wonder what his fellow comedians must privately think about him.

His stand-up is generally pretty rote stuff. He just sort of provides a sarcastic commentary on current events. It's not so much comedy as it is a one man political show. I don't find it particularly funny either, and even though he often is pretty smug and lacking the gift of gab of someone like Carlin, his show is the best place to get real political debate.

[Melville]

Bill Maher is obnoxiously simplistic and smug. But George Carlin is obnoxiously above-it-all; Bill Hicks is as well, but with humorless delivery, and he obnoxiously presents inanity as insight; and Chris Rock is obnoxiously shrill.

[B-side]

Bill Maher is obnoxiously simplistic and smug. But George Carlin is obnoxiously above-it-all; Bill Hicks is as well, but with humorless delivery, and he obnoxiously presents inanity as insight; and Chris Rock is obnoxiously shrill.

I agree with pretty much all of this. Granted, I haven't seen much of Hicks' stand-up, but what I have seen was pretty bland. But what do I know? I love Dane Cook.

[Milky Joe]

Bill Maher is obnoxiously simplistic and smug. But George Carlin is obnoxiously above-it-all; Bill Hicks is as well, but with humorless delivery, and he obnoxiously presents inanity as insight; and Chris Rock is obnoxiously shrill.

Sorry, but no. Incorrect.

[endingcredits]

Doug Stanhope and Louis C.K. are my current favorites in stand-up.
I like harsh, bitter, self-deprecating comedy.

[Grouchy]

Bill Hicks is a wise man, a challenger, a preacher. You guys aren't fit to lick the sweat off his balls.

[B-side]

Doug Stanhope and Louis C.K. are my current favorites in stand-up.
I like harsh, bitter, self-deprecating comedy.

Not seen any Stanhope, but Louis CK is my favorite. Self-deprecation is the best.:D

[endingcredits]

Bill Hicks is a wise man, a challenger, a preacher. You guys aren't fit to lick the sweat off his balls.

He may be all of those things, but he's not funny and his delivery sure sucks.

[Boner M]

Yeah, I can only tolerate Hicks in quote form.

Agreed w/ the Louis C.K. love. Don't follow standup much, but I try and seek out everything he's done.

[Milky Joe]

Bill Hicks is a wise man, a challenger, a preacher. You guys aren't fit to lick the sweat off his balls.

!!!!!!

[B-side]

Yeah, I can only tolerate Hicks in quote form.

Agreed w/ the Louis C.K. love. Don't follow standup much, but I try and seek out everything he's done.


Dangerous Game (Ferrara, 1993) ***

Today was a good day for Boner. He said things Brightside agreed with and rated Dangerous Game appropriately. He will be spared my sword.

[Melville]

Sorry, but no. Incorrect.
How so? He's just lame iconoclasm, annoying 'voice-of-sanity-amidst-all-this-unreason-spread-by-evil-people', contradictory in the midst of his supposed points, stereotyping and simplistic ranting (his rants against marketing and popular music are idiotic). I can't stand him, and I've never laughed at a single thing I've heard him say.


Bill Hicks is a wise man, a challenger, a preacher. You guys aren't fit to lick the sweat off his balls.
Bill Hicks sucked balls. As a punishment. I assume he didn't like doing it.

EDIT: Yeah, Louis CK is the funniest man alive. Self-deprecation ftw.

[Grouchy]

How so? He's just lame iconoclasm, annoying 'voice-of-sanity-amidst-all-this-unreason-spread-by-evil-people', contradictory in the midst of his supposed points, stereotyping and simplistic ranting (his rants against marketing and popular music are idiotic). I can't stand him, and I've never laughed at a single thing I've heard him say.
Why are you annoyed by his perfectly accurate jabs at the establishment? It sounds like you're precisely the audience that he was aiming at, the one that'd benefit the most from his insight.

[Milky Joe]

I'm really disappointed in you, Melville.

Bill Hicks was an American hero. End of debate.

[B-side]

As a bit of an aside, you can watch the original Alice in Wonderland film adaptation from 1903 here (http://mubi.com/films/24647) for free. I enjoyed it.

[Melville]

It sounds like you're precisely the audience that he was aiming at, the one that'd benefit the most from his insight.
:lol:

I'm really disappointed in you, Melville.
:lol:

What were his insights, and how was he heroic? All the things I've heard him say are completely obvious and simplistic, things I thought about when I was a teenager and immediately discarded or incorporated into a more nuanced system of thought. Saying all marketing is evil and worthless is neither insightful nor accurate. It's not even funny as hyperbole.

[Watashi]

Everyone knows Patton Oswalt is the best.

[B-side]

Everyone knows Patton Oswalt is the best.

I do love me some Oswalt.

"Sometimes an alligator's driving a car and sometimes you're wearing a hat made out of meat."

[Milky Joe]

I said the debate was over. I'm not going to subject something so near and dear to my heart to your blasé intellectual mill.

[B-side]

I love that Milky Joe charm.

[Melville]

I said the debate was over. I'm not going to subject something so near and dear to my heart to your blasé intellectual mill.
:lol:

Fun times.

[MacGuffin]

Why does it always feel like Laura Linney is getting angry at everyone?

[Sven]

I said the debate was over. I'm not going to subject something so near and dear to my heart to your blasé intellectual mill.

It would be cool if you did work out a defense. I'd love to read it, as I am mostly of Melville's position (less embittered) and have never read any satisfying piece bolstering his work. I have only ever encountered enthusiasm, with little in the way of reason. Lots of "hero," "prophet," "before his time," etc. It feels a little culty.

[Spinal]

I'm not going to subject something so near and dear to my heart to your blasé intellectual mill.

I feel like this on a daily basis. And yet I keep coming. I must have a masochistic streak.

[Qrazy]

I don't know if that stat automatically equates to rampant condom use in Italy, but you may be onto something. I know the churches hold regular classes on the rhythm method (they call it planned parenthood) but every family I know who has taken the class (not to mention the teacher) has gotten unplanned pregnant. So that doesn't seem to work. Most Catholics I know have little interest in abstinance. But I can't imagine they are using condoms. They've told me that commiting such a sin puts them in too great a danger of going to Hell. They actually believe that if they use a condom and get killed in a car crash before they can confess that they are screwed for eternity. (Um, pardon the pun.)

Sodomy is the lesser sin.

[soitgoes...]

We've already had this conversation.

The Election 2 is greater than Election and Exiled post you made? Because that only tells me you liked Election 2 more than Election and Exiled. I can make an assumption I guess, but I know you've seen quite a few To films, and the possibility exists that something else out of his 50+ director credits might be better.

[Qrazy]

The Election 2 is greater than Election and Exiled post you made? Because that only tells me you liked Election 2 more than Election and Exiled. I can make an assumption I guess, but I know you've seen quite a few To films, and the possibility exists that something else out of his 50+ director credits might be better.

Well that, but I'm also pretty sure we had another conversation before that conversation. :P

[soitgoes...]

Well that, but I'm also pretty sure we had another conversation before that conversation. :PProbably, but as much as you might like to think, I don't always write down all your likes and dislikes. :P

[soitgoes...]

I do remember that you didn't care much for Olmi's The Tree of Wooden Clogs. It worked with me to an extent. It took me about an hour to get into it, but once I did, I was drawn in. I loved the way he interweaves the various stories. All simple stories, but I found them to be full of life. I wanted to give it an extra half star, but I can't shake that first hour which frankly bored me. Much better than 1900 though.

[B-side]

Faces (Cassavetes 68) ***½

This pleases me.

[Boner M]

Today was a good day for Boner. He said things Brightside agreed with and rated Dangerous Game appropriately. He will be spared my sword.
It's settling reall well, too. More than ever, Ferrara's pacing and structure goes so much against the grain of how movies usually operate, that it's hard to know whether it's iconoclasm or cocaine doing the work. But the overall shapeless melange gets so close to the heart of filmmaking and the creative process in general, and the pain and delirium of putting one's demons into their own art. So few films about filmmaking manage to get past facile explorations of 'life imitating art and vice versa OMG!'; with this one you get the feeling that Ferrara was sorting the knots of feeling out in the process rather than dutifully recreating a thesis. It's Ferrara's own Opening Night.

[B-side]

It's settling reall well, too. More than ever, Ferrara's pacing and structure goes so much against the grain of how movies usually operate, that it's hard to know whether it's iconoclasm or cocaine doing the work. But the overall shapeless melange gets so close to the heart of filmmaking and the creative process in general, and the pain and delirium of putting one's demons into their own art. So few films about filmmaking manage to get past facile explorations of 'life imitating art and vice versa OMG!'; with this one you get the feeling that Ferrara was sorting the knots of feeling out in the process rather than dutifully recreating a thesis. It's Ferrara's own Opening Night.

Definitely. It's a purging of demons of sorts. I wouldn't say it's near as good as Opening Night, but it's really good.

[Qrazy]

Probably, but as much as you might like to think, I don't always write down all your likes and dislikes. :P

I was more so hoping you'd remember a previous conversation we've had given that I remember them. *tear*

[MadMan]

Bill Maher is obnoxiously simplistic and smug. But George Carlin is obnoxiously above-it-all; Bill Hicks is as well, but with humorless delivery, and he obnoxiously presents inanity as insight; and Chris Rock is obnoxiously shrill.Aside from agreeing with you about Bill Maher, the rest of this is horribly wrong. Its your opinion, man, and that's fine, but Hicks was smarter than you think, and Carlin isn't obnoxious, and by being smarter than most people, yes he can get away with being above it all. I had no idea that was a valid criticism, as the job of a comedian is at times to point out the folly and stupidity of man. Rock may come off as such, but his standup is hilarious and usually spot on, so I ignore that aspect of his comedy and his personality.

Watching Hicks, I never once got the feeling that he was presenting "Inanity as Insight" (what the hell does that even mean?). He wasn't afraid to speak his mind intelligently and in a very hilarious fashion, touching upon many topics in ways that are surprisingly still relevent to this day. His spiel on gays in the military, for instance, may be offense to some but his main point still remains: that its insane for the military to reject certain people because they are gay, even though the whole busines of the military is to kill people. Why the hell should it matter if they're not straight? Everytime I've watch Hicks' standup, I've busted out laughing. I just think it isn't your particular brand of comedy, and that's fine, but to say that he didn't have any insight that was meaningful is false. And Carlin is one of the godfathers of standup-without folks like him, Lenny Bruce, Bill Cosby, etc. standup as we know it would not even exist.

[soitgoes...]

I was more so hoping you'd remember a previous conversation we've had given that I remember them. *tear*I only remember your touch.

[B-side]

This is happening 45 minutes away from me on December 7th and 8th:


Renegade auteur Crispin Hellion Glover returns to UICA to present his notorious features It Is Fine! Everything Is Fine. and What Is It? Both programs also feature a different version of Crispin Hellion Glover’s Big Slide Show, an hour-long dramatic narration, plus a Q&A and book signing with Glover. A cash bar will be available for all patrons on both nights. Tickets for each event are $15 for UICA members, $20 general admission. Tickets to see both shows are $25 for UICA members and $35 general admission. All day-of-show tickets are $25 each.

I wish I had money and someone willing to go with me.

[origami_mustache]

I enjoyed Carlos Reygadas's Japón and Battle In Heaven, but was a little skeptical after Silent Light. His new short "This Is My Kingdom" in the Mexican anthology film Revolution was incredible though and has restored my faith that he is a special talent.

[soitgoes...]

This is happening 45 minutes away from me on December 7th and 8th:



I wish I had money and someone willing to go with me.Yeah, this is happening here in Eugene this week I guess. Also your Phantom Carriage rating is too low.

[endingcredits]

His spiel on gays in the military, for instance, may be offense to some but his main point still remains: that its insane for the military to reject certain people because they are gay, even though the whole busines of the military is to kill people. Why the hell should it matter if they're not straight?

His satire on the discrimination faced by homosexuals in the armed forces is not a very good example of a great feat in the comedic presentation of a subtle observation of the human condition. Anyone possessed of any social awareness at all should find such things obvious.

[number8]

Pretty much the last three pages made me take a hammer to my skull from the wrongness displayed.

[Melville]

His satire on the discrimination faced by homosexuals in the armed forces is not a very good example of a great feat in the comedic presentation of a subtle observation of the human condition. Anyone possessed of any social awareness at all should find such things obvious.
Yeah, an example of noteworthy insight it ain't.


Pretty much the last three pages made me take a hammer to my skull from the wrongness displayed.
Pics or it never happened.

[number8]

Pics or it never happened.

You're a virus with shoes, is what you are.

[Milky Joe]

You're a virus with shoes, is what you are.

I don't want any gay people around me while I'm killin' women and children.

[Irish]

Pretty much the last three pages made me take a hammer to my skull from the wrongness displayed.

I think it's difficult to judge past comics by present day standards. So much of their material, observations and humor comes from current culture, being very much "in the now." In other words, they get dated fast.

So yeah, Hicks might seem simple and obvious by today's standard, but the point is that 20 years ago, the stuff he was saying at the time he was saying wasn't obvious at all.

A different generation would be having this exact conversation about Bill Cosby, Richard Pryor, and Eddie Murphy. Or Lenny Bruce. Or SJ Perlman and HL Mencken.

[Milky Joe]

The difference between those comics and Bill Hicks is that absolutely everything Bill Hicks said is still vital and relevant today, and actually even moreso. This is why Bill Hicks is still considered among comedians to be one of, if not the high water mark for comedy in America.

[number8]

Bill Hicks and Norm McDonald are two great comedians I know of who have more admirers in the comedian circle than they have fans. Who else is considered a "Comedian's Comedian" like these two? I'm sure there are a few more.

[Derek]

Bill Hicks and Norm McDonald are two great comedians I know of who have more admirers in the comedian circle than they have fans. Who else is considered a "Comedian's Comedian" like these two? I'm sure there are a few more.

Sam Kinison, maybe?

[Irish]

The novel was ... bizarre. I feel compelled to see this movie, though:

http://www.theparisreview.org/blog/2010/11/22/sex-lies-and-hemingway/

[number8]

Sam Kinison, maybe?

I thought of him, but wasn't sure. Haven't really heard that many comedians reference him.

Bill Hicks is almost always included in any comedian's "influences" list.

Norm MacDonald is comedian kryptonite. You put him in a room with other comedians and they will all immediately lose their shit laughing even when the audience doesn't get it.

[Derek]

I thought of him, but wasn't sure. Haven't really heard that many comedians reference him.

Bill Hicks is almost always included in any comedian's "influences" list.

Norm MacDonald is comedian kryptonite. You put him in a room with other comedians and they will all immediately lose their shit laughing even when the audience doesn't get it.

Hicks is probably the ultimate comedian's comedian. Pryor and Carlin are obvious answers, but their mainstream success makes it hard to label them that. I don't know about Kinison, but I do know that the only time I hear him talked about is by other comedians and it's always as if he was a god. For modern comedians, Stephen Wright gets talked about a fair amount. Andy Kaufman would probably fit in there if you even want to consider what he did stand-up.

[number8]

Wright's a good one, actually.

[Ivan Drago]

I still have no idea why it took me 22 years to see Apocalypse Now for the first time. Fucking amazing film.

[B-side]

Sam Kinison, maybe?

I turned off one of his specials. I'm a fan of the screaming, but he's just not very funny.

[B-side]

Also your Phantom Carriage rating is too low.

Eh. It's decent enough, but I'd consider it the worst one of his I've seen so far. The first few scenes in part II -- with the carriage confiscating souls -- are excellent. It took a while for me to get involved. I was floating in and out throughout, but I grew more fond of it as it went along.

[balmakboor]

I still have no idea why it took me 22 years to see Apocalypse Now for the first time. Fucking amazing film.

Yep. I still struggle with which version I prefer. The leaner 1979 version with its superior exit for Kilgore, but that also feels the flaws of the Brando scenes more severely. Or the longer, richer, but less effectively paced "Redux" cut. I lean toward the latter. Brando's brooding in shadows works better for me coming at the end of an art film rather than an action film.

I just rewatched Redux and liked the French sequence better than ever. For me, it is like a silent movie that perfectly balances the Ride of the Walkries beach village attack. The Walkries were women who came down from heaven to scoop up worthy soldiers and take them to heaven. Visually, the French sequence is about a woman who descends from heaven to escort Willard up to heaven. Given a film where the hero is differentiated from the villains specifically by how he better treated his wife, the Redux's greater emphasis on female characters seems appropriate.

But, the 1979 cut is ultimately more viscerally effective in the moment.

Btw, I'll be rewatching The Deer Hunter this weekend. It is the better film I think.

[KK2.0]

He's much better in a talk show format than he is doing stand-up.

only knew him for his talk shows, now i´m curious to watch his stand-ups and check out the love/hate.



back on topic, also watched Scott Pilgrim. Edgard Wright never disappointed me, and this one is no different.

[MadMan]

His satire on the discrimination faced by homosexuals in the armed forces is not a very good example of a great feat in the comedic presentation of a subtle observation of the human condition. Anyone possessed of any social awareness at all should find such things obvious.Okay, first off, not everything has to be subtle for it to be meaningful or insightful. Secondly, as already noted by others in this thread, at the time it was incredibly insightful and quite socially aware to be in favor of throwing away "Don't Ask Don't Tell." And considering that even now the policy is being debated in Washington, I would say that what Hicks was talking about is still very relevent. Just admitting that he's not your brand of comedian or that you don't find him funny is fine with me, but saying that Hicks wasn't being ahead of his time with many of his comments or that he didn't have anything interesting to say is flat out wrong.

balmakboor to me the Redux is indeed more richer, but I agree that the original had better pacing. Both versions are brilliant films, regardless.

[Derek]

Okay, first off, not everything has to be subtitle for it to be meaningful or insightful.

But subtitles make everything more meaningful, don't they?

[Qrazy]

subtle.

subtle.

subtle.

SUBTLE.

[Boner M]

subtle.

subtle.

subtle.

SUBTLE.
You could've been a little more subtitle with that.

[MadMan]

But subtitles make everything more meaningful, don't they?:P :| :lol: Absolutely

Speaking of subtitles, Brotherhood of the Wolf was a fairly cool action/horror movie, although in some ways it overabused slow mo. Those fight scenes were pretty exciting to watch, though. The beast once it shows up was bad CGI, so I'm glad that the film makers waited up later to fully show it attacking people.

[MadMan]

subtle.

subtle.

subtle.

SUBTLE.I still can't read it.....




;)

[Qrazy]

You could've been a little more subtitle with that.

http://roflrazzi.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/celebrity-pictures-rock-rihanna-subtlety-unclear.jpg

[Boner M]

Romance - Cathy, could it be that you're just doing it all wrong?

[Boner M]

Bob Odenkirk's Write a Screenplay in 12 Years (or more!) (http://www.viceland.com/int/v17n10/htdocs/write-a-screenplay-in-12-years-547.php).

[Melville]

Secondly, as already noted by others in this thread, at the time it was incredibly insightful and quite socially aware to be in favor of throwing away "Don't Ask Don't Tell."
In the clip I heard, he was responding to contemporaneous trials and battles over legislation, which means that it was already a matter of public debate and that many people were concerned about or actively fighting against the ban on gay military service, and later, against the "Don't Ask Don't Tell" compromise. (The fact that there was even a compromise to be made shows that there was significant support for lifting the ban. And gays were allowed to openly serve in similar countries at around the same time, such as Canada as of 1992.) The only difference between Hicks' opinion and many others is that he phrases it as part of an attack on militarism in general. But that's an even older, more standard thing to attack. Arguing for equal rights and against military isn't insightful (let alone incredibly so). When "Don't Ask Don't Tell" started, I would have thought everything Hicks said was obvious, and I was eleven.

EDIT: Norm MacDonald is awesome. Steven Wright is pretty great too.

[balmakboor]

Bob Odenkirk's Write a Screenplay in 12 Years (or more!) (http://www.viceland.com/int/v17n10/htdocs/write-a-screenplay-in-12-years-547.php).

A better title would've been "How to Write a Screenplay in 21 Years."

I've been working on my first screenplay for about 27 years.

[transmogrifier]

I still have no idea why it took me 22 years to see Apocalypse Now for the first time. Fucking amazing film.

http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lai4k4a9wG1qe0eclo1_500 .gif

[B-side]

The Edge of the World is terrific. It's like an earlier, shorter and more technically impressive version of How Green Was My Valley. I think I'd place this just barely above that. Where Ford was more interested in the characters occupying his chosen setting, Powell seems to place equal emphasis on the setting itself, framing people in distant shots that often suggest looming danger. Ford lets the characters' emotions shine through and drive the narrative, whereas Powell more often casually observes the hand of fate and modernity's role therein, symbolized by the imposition of nature. Nearly every shot in the film deserves to be framed and admired by itself.

[StanleyK]

I have a question regarding The Big Lebowski. What's the significance of the soundtrack often turning out to be non-diegetic music? It's a neat touch, I think, but I'm not sure of what it could mean.

[ledfloyd]

http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lai4k4a9wG1qe0eclo1_500 .gif
man, i didn't realize that was moving at first and it really freaked me out when i caught a glimpse of it out of the corner of my eye.

[Sven]

I have a question regarding The Big Lebowski. What's the significance of the soundtrack often turning out to be non-diegetic music? It's a neat touch, I think, but I'm not sure of what it could mean.

Call me daft, but could it be that it is because most film's soundtracks are non-diegetic? I'm not sure what significance you are looking for.

[balmakboor]

Call me daft, but could it be that it is because most film's soundtracks are non-diegetic? I'm not sure what significance you are looking for.

I think he means that one is led to believe that the music is part of the characters' experience only to discover that it isn't. I can't remember the movie well enough to say for sure though.

[Irish]

Call me daft, but could it be that it is because most film's soundtracks are non-diegetic? I'm not sure what significance you are looking for.

The Coens play with it though ... I never noticed until it was pointed out to me, but watch the scene where Lebowski meets Lebowski for the first time.

It's old Hollywood style, the gumshoe going to meet the rich old man in an oak paneled mansion with roaring fireplaces and grand staircases and the like, obviously aping the opening of The Big Sleep.

On the soundtrack, there's big portentious music playing, and it's the kind of overtly dramatic stuff that tells you the guy Lebowski is going to meet is important as hell.

But while the scene plays out, it's revealed ... that music isn't on the soundtrack, it's playing in the room the two characters are standing in.

It's a very funny, little, one-off joke and I find it amazingly clever. I'm not sure it has any meaning outside of the Coen Brothers being movie fans who like to play with the immediate artificiality of the medium, similar in a way that Tarantino did in Pulp Fiction did during the cab ride with Butch and Esmerelda Villalobos, shooting the scene with obvious backscreen projection that makes it obvious the actors are on a soundstage.

[Sven]

But while the scene plays out, it's revealed ... that music isn't on the soundtrack, it's playing in the room the two characters are standing in.

So then the point is that the music is diegetic, not non-diegetic. Well, they do play it up for gags quite a bit in that film, but I don't think it has any significance, per se, greater than being used for punctuation.

[number8]

Yeah, did StanleyK mix up what diegetic and non-diegetic mean?

[balmakboor]

Yeah, did StanleyK mix up what diegetic and non-diegetic mean?

It appears so.

[Irish]

Those terms should have some kind of nickname, like foley.

[MacGuffin]

Yeah, and I don't think there is any significance to the fact that the music is diegetic other than The Dude likes to listens to headphones when he gets high.

[soitgoes...]

Pigs and Battleships (Imamura, 1962) ***½Have you seen Intentions of Murder yet? It's his best work, at least tied for best with Black Rain.

[MacGuffin]

Have you seen Intentions of Murder yet? It's his best work, at least tied for best with Black Rain.

Nah, not yet. I'm going in chronological order: Pigs and Battleships, The Insect Woman and then Intentions of Murder. I also have Death by Hanging and have watched (and loved) Vengeance Is Mine.

[Boner M]

I also have Death by HangingOshima.

[MacGuffin]

Oshima.

Oops!

[soitgoes...]

Oshima.
:lol:

All their films look the same anyways.

[MacGuffin]

:lol:

All their films look the same anyways.

Actually as far as Oshima goes, I just got the Eclipse box set, which is likely the reason I mixed the two up.

[balmakboor]

Actually as far as Oshima goes, I just got the Eclipse box set, which is likely the reason I mixed the two up.

It looks like we're going down similar paths. I know my Christmas giftcards are earmarked for Oshima and Costa boxsets.

[soitgoes...]

Actually, as far as Oshima goes, I just got the Eclipse box set, which is likely the reason I mixed the two up.
I prefer Imamura to Oshima. The latter gets too new wavy for me. That said, I really look forward to The Ceremony which is inexplicably one of those films I have, but always overlook when I choose to watch something, much to Derek's chagrin I imagine.

[balmakboor]

Btw, am I the only fan of late Imamura around here. I loved The Eel, Dr. Akagi, and Warm Water Under a Red Bridge.

[MacGuffin]

I prefer Imamura to Oshima. The latter gets too new wavy for me. That said, I really look forward to The Ceremony which is inexplicably one of those films I have, but always overlook when I choose to watch something, much to Derek's chagrin I imagine.

Yeah, I typically always have hundreds of movies I could potentially watch (what with Netflix Instant Watching as well as the movies I've bought and haven't watched yet). But what ends up happening far too often is that I end up becoming indecisive on what to watch based on my mood, patience level, alertness, etc. and end up not watching anything.

[MacGuffin]

Btw, am I the only fan of late Imamura around here. I loved The Eel, Dr. Akagi, and Warm Water Under a Red Bridge.

I really want to see The Eel. Kôji Yakusho is always excellent.

[TripZone]

Not into Imamura.

[megladon8]

It was the first truly cold day here, so I'm thinking I'll have to put The Shining on tonight.

[soitgoes...]

Not into Imamura.Weird. What have you seen?

[TripZone]

Weird. What have you seen?

The Eel, Vengeance is Mine. Both very meh.
I have three of this others here to be watched. One in HD!

[soitgoes...]

The Eel, Vengeance is Mine. Both very meh.
I have three of this others here to be watched. One in HD!Well The Eel is very meh. Vengeance not so much. I'm not really sure of your tastes so I can't point you in any direction. All I can say is all three of the Criterion box set films are at least pretty good, but the same can be said of all his films I've seen except The Eel, so there you go.

[MacGuffin]

Well The Eel is very meh.

Everyone seems to like it tho.

[TripZone]

Everyone seems to like it tho.

Yeah, well (http://www.imdb.com/chart/top).

[soitgoes...]

Everyone seems to like it tho.
The only one who really liked it for his consensus here was balmakboor, granted only five people voted for it. IMDb likes it I guess, as does Rosenbaum.

[balmakboor]

Yeah, well (http://www.imdb.com/chart/top).

I remember visiting that page for the first time years ago and seeing The Shawshank Redemption at the top. Haven't bothered with it since.

[MacGuffin]

I remember visiting that page for the first time years ago and seeing The Shawshank Redemption at the top. Haven't bothered with it since.

It's shite.

[soitgoes...]

Extended weekend viewings:

Black God, White Devil (Rocha)
Three Brothers (Rosi)
The Life of Jesus (Dumont)
Vidas Secas (Pereira dos Santos)
The Ceremony (Oshima)

[soitgoes...]

I have Godard's Histoire(s) du cinéma, but I should say that I'm scared of watching it.

[Boner M]

I have Godard's Histoire(s) du cinéma, but I should say that I'm scared of watching it.
Probably the most accessible Late Godard, and my favorite too. Don't be scared.

Weekend:

Destricted
A Real Young Girl
Seventh Heaven (Borzage)
Due Date or Red Hill or Jackass 3d at the movies

[soitgoes...]

Probably the most accessible Late Godard, and my favorite too. Don't be scared.I'm more scared that I'm going to hate it than anything. If I do, then I can probably kiss goodbye the desire to watch anything by the man after say Tout va bien.

[Russ]

Certified Copy (Abbas Kiarostami, 2010) - when even the film's defender's shout "It's not pretentious", you'd best believe that it most certainly is. Damn. It was difficult making it to the end of this dreck. Yeesh.

[TripZone]

Jesus.

[soitgoes...]

Well the first section of Histoire(s) du cinéma is certainly interesting enough to continue watching the rest. I think it would make a great backdrop to project onto a wall during a party or something.

[Qrazy]

The Eel, Vengeance is Mine. Both very meh.
I have three of this others here to be watched. One in HD!

I was not too keen on Vengeance is Mine and haven't seen The Eel but The Pornographers and The Insect Woman and The Ballad of Narayama are all pretty good.

[TripZone]

Well the first section of Histoire(s) du cinéma is certainly interesting enough to continue watching the rest. I think it would make a great backdrop to project onto a wall during a party or something.
I'm waiting for the Madman edition, with Adrian Martin collaborating.


I was not too keen on Vengeance is Mine and haven't seen The Eel but The Pornographers and The Insect Woman and The Ballad of Narayama are all pretty good.
I trust you, Qrazy.

[soitgoes...]

I trust you, Qrazy.:sad:

[Watashi]

Target is selling the LOTR Blu-Ray boxset for a ridiculous price of 7.99. (http://www.target.com/Lord-Rings-Picture-Trilogy-Blu-ray/dp/B003HPAYZG/ref)

That's 67.00 dollars off!

[TripZone]

:sad:

Also, soitgoes. I just haven't known him as long.

[Qrazy]

:sad:

Trip and I dislike a lot of films together. :P

[Qrazy]

Also, soitgoes. I just haven't known him as long.

I vouch for him, the two of us have quite similar tastes.

[TripZone]

I vouch for him, the two of us have quite similar tastes.

Oh, I already respect him greatly for sho.
But of course even someone with opposite taste is helpful for gauging what a film's worth might be!

[soitgoes...]

Oh, I already respect him greatly for sho.
But of course even someone with opposite taste is helpful for gauging what a film's worth might be!I am Brightside's cinematic opposite.

Actually, we agree on a number of films. That doesn't stop me from giving him a hard time about the ones we don't agree on.

[Dillard]

Watching Carnival of Souls for the first time. Great line by the landlady: "It's these houses, they're big enough to hide a man in every corner." !!!

[TripZone]

I am Brightside's cinematic opposite.

Actually, we agree on a number of films. That doesn't stop me from giving him a hard time about the ones we don't agree on.

It is necessary that one give Brightside shit at all times.

[B-side]

The Edge of the World is terrific. It's like an earlier, shorter and more technically impressive version of How Green Was My Valley. I think I'd place this just barely above that. Where Ford was more interested in the characters occupying his chosen setting, Powell seems to place equal emphasis on the setting itself, framing people in distant shots that often suggest looming danger. Ford lets the characters' emotions shine through and drive the narrative, whereas Powell more often casually observes the hand of fate and modernity's role therein, symbolized by the imposition of nature. Nearly every shot in the film deserves to be framed and admired by itself.

Has no one else seen this? I don't think I've seen it discussed much, if at all.

[B-side]

It is necessary that one give Brightside shit at all times.

I take it like a champ.

Sometimes.

[soitgoes...]

Has no one else seen this? I don't think I've seen it discussed much, if at all.I have. I like it quite a bit. Its biggest problem is that it was one of the first Powell films I've seen, and therefore a lot of the particulars have been clouded over by bong hits and hops, oh and time too I suppose. I definitely remember it being beautiful. A revisit is in order. Also for Black Narcissus which also was viewed a long time ago.

[soitgoes...]

I take it like a champ.I can vouch for this. I've seen the pictures.

[Qrazy]

Has no one else seen this? I don't think I've seen it discussed much, if at all.

Yeah I've seen it. It's pretty good although to be honest I found it somewhat forgettable. I slightly prefer the semi-similar Whiskey Galore (Mackendrick). I also found How Green was my Valley to be the more formally impressive of the two. But Powell was a master so Edge does deserve respect and it's place in the grand cinematic canon.

[B-side]

I have. I like it quite a bit. Its biggest problem is that it was one of the first Powell films I've seen, and therefore a lot of the particulars have been clouded over by bong hits and hops, oh and time too I suppose. I definitely remember it being beautiful. A revisit is in order. Also for Black Narcissus which also was viewed a long time ago.

It's my favorite thing Powell and/or Pressburger have touched so far. I owe Black Narcissus a rewatch, though. And I still need to see what nearly everyone considers their best work; The Red Shoes. I'm just such a sucker for cinematography, and the way the form of The Edge of the World -- the photography in particular -- fed into the narrative and thematic material won me over rather quickly and I stayed engrossed throughout. I'm pretty close to bumping it to a 9.


I can vouch for this. I've seen the pictures.

:D

[Ivan Drago]

Throwing ratings completely out the window, I liked Troll 2 a lot more than The Human Centipede. While the former was bad, it was at least fun, whereas the latter was just bad. Then again I watched Troll 2 while intoxicated so that added to the fun factor too.

[soitgoes...]

It's my favorite thing Powell and/or Pressburger have touched so far. I owe Black Narcissus a rewatch, though. And I still need to see what nearly everyone considers their best work; The Red Shoes. I'm just such a sucker for cinematography, and the way the form of The Edge of the World -- the photography in particular -- fed into the narrative and thematic material won me over rather quickly and I stayed engrossed throughout. I'm pretty close to bumping it to a 9.
The only year between 1939 and 1949 where he/they didn't make a film I deem at least good was 1942. He/they were probably the most solid director(s) of the 40's.

[B-side]

The only year between 1939 and 1949 where he/they didn't make a film I deem at least good was 1942. He/they were probably the most solid director(s) of the 40's.

Seems so. I didn't realize Powell had directed so many films by himself. I think I have a new obsession looming.:P

[balmakboor]

Has no one else seen this? I don't think I've seen it discussed much, if at all.

Yes. And I agree with your love. I don't find it technically superior to HGWMV though, whatever that means.

Powell with and without Pressburger was amazing.

[number8]

Target is selling the LOTR Blu-Ray boxset for a ridiculous price of 7.99. (http://www.target.com/Lord-Rings-Picture-Trilogy-Blu-ray/dp/B003HPAYZG/ref)

That's 67.00 dollars off!

Well, this is sold out, but I started browsing their sales and found Fist of Legend Blu-ray for $3.99. So... Thanks.

[B-side]

Yes. And I agree with your love. I don't find it technically superior to HGWMV though, whatever that means.

You don't know what that means? It means I find The Edge of the World to be a superior film on the technical front. That is, I think the cinematography is superior above anything, though that's not to speak ill of the cinematography in How Green Was My Valley, which is great. I just found the Powell to be more expressive in its framing and editing.

[Raiders]

I agree with Brightside here. The Edge of the World is gorgeous filmmaking. It's been a long, long time since I saw How Green Was My Valley, but I definitely prefer my memory of Powell's film to Ford's. Much more expressive from what I recall.

[Yxklyx]

Has no one else seen this? I don't think I've seen it discussed much, if at all.

Haven't seen the Powell film in a long time but I liked it a lot (#7 in 1937) - I didn't care for the Ford film (too oversentimental for my tastes). Another early Powell that should be seen is 49th Parallel - at least for the weird story.

[endingcredits]

Sunset Blvd. (Wilder, 1950) presented a well-crafted, compelling depiction of an insane, loathsome, but also very pitiful actress, whose days of glory and fame in silent film have long past. Wilder's dynamic style and technical bravura captured and accentuated Norma's variegated psychology and its manifestations. I'll give a few examples. In her first scene, wherein she goes into an invective tirade on words and their detriment to cinema, the visuals are 'blurred' and dreamy; we are now letting go of Gillis' reality, the modern Hollywood that is 'real' chronologically, and moving into Norma's insane chronological non-reality. Later, when Betty comes to see Gillis at Norma's home, Wilder's cinematography reveals the home and all its trappings to be ordinary, prosaic, and unromantic: the dream is lost.

[MacGuffin]

I don't know if I've said it before, but I've always thought Gloria Swanson was the weakpoint in Sunset Blvd.

[Sven]

I don't know if I've said it before, but I've always thought Gloria Swanson was the weakpoint in Sunset Blvd.

Then you, my friend, did not understand Sunset Blvd.

[MacGuffin]

Then you, my friend, did not understand Sunset Blvd.

Don't be pompous, Sven. I understood it fine, I just didn't like her performance.

[Sven]

Don't be pompous, Sven.

Just let me be ME, man!

[MacGuffin]

Just let me be ME, man!

If it helps any, I've been meaning to give Night Moves a look here soon.

[balmakboor]

You don't know what that means? It means I find The Edge of the World to be a superior film on the technical front. That is, I think the cinematography is superior above anything, though that's not to speak ill of the cinematography in How Green Was My Valley, which is great. I just found the Powell to be more expressive in its framing and editing.

One film can be vastly more expressive than another while being technically considerably inferior. I think the technical craftsmanship of both is impeccable although the Powell does occasionally show its more limited resources.

For what it's worth, I'm most fond of A Canterbury Tale and Peeping Tom from Powell.

On an unrelated note, I just rewatched The Deer Hunter and find it to be on the very short list of greatest films of all time.

[Spinal]

Gotta risk pomposity and agree with Sven's sentiment.

[StanleyK]

Yeah, I was mixing up diegetic with non-diegetic; my bad.


So then the point is that the music is diegetic, not non-diegetic. Well, they do play it up for gags quite a bit in that film, but I don't think it has any significance, per se, greater than being used for punctuation.


On the soundtrack, there's big portentious music playing, and it's the kind of overtly dramatic stuff that tells you the guy Lebowski is going to meet is important as hell.

But while the scene plays out, it's revealed ... that music isn't on the soundtrack, it's playing in the room the two characters are standing in.

Well, if it is used just for gags, then at least it certainly works wonders.



Also Sunset Blvd. rules, endingcredits is right on the money.

[StanleyK]

A Clockwork Orange is one of the most challenging films about morality ever. To present such a deplorable character as Alex DeLarge, and then to even so claim the right to a moral choice to be inalienable to the human condition, is a very ballsy and rewarding approach. Too bad the film itself says so, quite explicitly, by way of the chaplain character; he really just basically tells you what the movie is about in the scene following Alex's "rehabilitation". A most un-Kubrick-like move, particularly disappointing as the film is the culmiation of his favorite theme- Ludovico technique aside, the stripping of Alex's possession and clothes is the epitome of dehumanization, synthetized in a hilarious scene of Kubrick's brand of dark humor.

[Boner M]

Destricted - Begins with a closeup of a half-chub pulsating on the verge of an erection; an apt metaphor for the quality of this collection. Matthew Barney's (where the aforementioned image is from) is memorably strange and not much else, like much of his work. Richard Prince's is a neat concept - exploiting the nostalgic qualities of an old porn VHS - but could've been elaborated further. Gaspar Noe's 1/2 hour of tedium has nearly ruined the lingering goodwill I had toward him. Sam Taylor-Wood's is a gag that probably only works in the company of a large audience. Larry Clark's is roughly what you'd expect & too long, but not bad. The Balkan one is the winner by default, I guess, mainly cos of the animated sequences.

Boiling Point - Long forgotten 1993 Wesley Snipes vehicle that has rep in some circles as a termite-art neo-noir par excellence; a virtually action-free piece that even flirts with dreamy melancholy at times. Too formulaic to be truly memorable, but there's satisfaction to be had in watching how steadfastly this denies its core audience the high-octane charge they've come for. Dennis Hopper is godawful though; baffling that he considers this some of his best acting work.

[Spinal]

Destricted - Begins with a closeup of a half-chub pulsating on the verge of an erection; an apt metaphor for the quality of this collection. Matthew Barney's (where the aforementioned image is from) is memorably strange and not much else, like much of his work. Richard Prince's is a neat concept - exploiting the nostalgic qualities of an old porn VHS - but could've been elaborated further. Gaspar Noe's 1/2 hour of tedium has nearly ruined the lingering goodwill I had toward him. Sam Taylor-Wood's is a gag that probably only works in the company of a large audience. Larry Clark's is roughly what you'd expect & too long, but not bad. The Balkan one is the winner by default, I guess, mainly cos of the animated sequences.


Oh, you didn't get the version with the pooping. You lucky person.

[Boner M]

Oh, you didn't get the version with the pooping. You lucky person.
It isn't listed on the IMDb either... must be an extra special bonus for Netflix users.

[Spinal]

It isn't listed on the IMDb either... must be an extra special bonus for Netflix users.

I think it's an American version of the DVD. At least, according to the official website for the film.

[baby doll]

Weekend:

The Chelsea Girls (Andy Warhol, 1966)
Fata Morgana (Werner Herzog, 1971)
Hôtel Monterey (Chantal Akerman, 1972)
Ludwig (Luchino Visconti, 1972)
Sleeper (Woody Allen, 1973)
Ju tu il elle (Chantal Akerman, 1974)
News From Home (Chantal Akerman, 1977)
Les Rendez-vous d'Anna (Chantal Akerman, 1978)

[Boner M]

News From Home (Chantal Akerman, 1977)
****, plz. I think it's even better than Dielman.

[MacGuffin]

I guess I find Swanson to just be a bit one-note in it, maybe too overtly theatrical. I like the movie overall.

[Qrazy]

I guess I find Swanson to just be a bit one-note in it, maybe too overtly theatrical. I like the movie overall.

She was a silent film star. She still thinks of herself as a silent film star. The entire world for her has become a silent film, hence theatricality.

[MacGuffin]

She was a silent film star. She still thinks of herself as a silent film star. The entire world for her has become a silent film, hence theatricality.

I realize she is intentionally annoying and theatrical. I think there are different kinds of ways annoying or theatrical can be channelled, and the way she chose began to grate on me by the time the movie ended. I think she'd be more appropriate if she was sane.

[Melville]

****, plz. I think it's even better than Dielman.
Agreed.

[baby doll]

****, plz. I think it's even better than Dielman.Let's wait until I see it first.

[MacGuffin]

Hotel Monterey is a beautiful, beautiful film.

[Ezee E]

Sitting at the parents' house, watching The Godfather on AMC, and I wonder if I underrate it. I fall in love with it immediately again, and it feels like I'm watching it for the first time all over again, and I get especially pissed when the commercials come on. I should've definitely put it in my tops for the 70's.

[Irish]

I should've definitely put it in my tops for the 70's.
Imagine me slapping you across the face, with a satin glove, Daffy Duck style.

;-)

[Derek]

I think she'd be more appropriate if she was sane.

Why not have Holden alive in the pool at the beginning, treading water and narrating the entirely different film you apparently want? ;)

[Qrazy]

Why not have Holden alive in the pool at the beginning, treading water.

Good point. That would definitely make the film less cynical. I think you're onto something here.

[Stay Puft]

On the topic of Akerman, has anyone seen her later work? I only ever see people talking about her 70's work. I noticed Netflix has a couple of her newer films streaming, The Captive from 2000 and Tomorrow We Move from 2004. Thinking about watching them. Any thoughts?

[Duncan]

On the topic of Akerman, has anyone seen her later work? I only ever see people talking about her 70's work. I noticed Netflix has a couple of her newer films streaming, The Captive from 2000 and Tomorrow We Move from 2004. Thinking about watching them. Any thoughts?

I've seen The Captive. Remember liking it at the time, but can't recall much of it. It was the sort of standard feminist setup of a guy keeping a woman in a house, but by the end you're all like, but who was really the captive? A lot of it is shot in intentionally drab taupes and beiges. Still camera, long takes. And then it's punctuated by these really glorious car rides that are kind of dreamy and creepy and sexy.

[balmakboor]

On the topic of Akerman, has anyone seen her later work? I only ever see people talking about her 70's work. I noticed Netflix has a couple of her newer films streaming, The Captive from 2000 and Tomorrow We Move from 2004. Thinking about watching them. Any thoughts?

I've seen From the East. It has its merits. Lots of very long tracking shots of scenes throughout Eastern Europe with no hint of anything particularly dramatic taking place -- other than what's already inherent with people going through cold, snowy days throughout Eastern Europe. I loved how it looked as I've loved how all of her films looked.

[balmakboor]

I've seen The Captive. Remember liking it at the time, but can't recall much of it. It was the sort of standard feminist setup of a guy keeping a woman in a house, but by the end you're all like, but who was really the captive? A lot of it is shot in intentionally drab taupes and beiges. Still camera, long takes. And then it's punctuated by these really glorious car rides that are kind of dreamy and creepy and sexy.

Sold. Consider it added to my queue.

[balmakboor]

Sitting at the parents' house, watching The Godfather on AMC, and I wonder if I underrate it. I fall in love with it immediately again, and it feels like I'm watching it for the first time all over again, and I get especially pissed when the commercials come on. I should've definitely put it in my tops for the 70's.

Every time I watch it, my love and admiration grows.

The same goes for The Deer Hunter. God what a brilliant piece of work. I took another look yesterday. Now I'm rereading Robin Wood's essay about it. I think he really nailed it.

[balmakboor]

Speaking of Dielman. Ever since the Eclipse line started, I've been far more interested in what they are releasing than what the main line is putting out. I already own the two Ozu sets and the Alan King set. I've seen the Makavejev and Louis Malle sets. And I really want to go through the Shimizu, Kaurismaki, Fuller, Shepitko, Bernard, Dearden, Klein, and Akerman sets.

So many sets, so little time.

[balmakboor]

Holy crap I still love Meet Me in St. Louis.

[Ezee E]

With Beloved on the way, it's random Netflix boost time:

The Man Who Fell To Earth
The Bad Sleep Well
Red Beard
An Angel at my Table
Your Friends & Neighbors
Whip It
Downhill Racer
Born to Kill
A Matter of Life and Death
The Great Silence

[Kurosawa Fan]

RED BEARD!!!

[Ezee E]

Two Kurosawas no less. This is why I look forward to random bumping of my queue.

[Derek]

Two Kurosawas no less. This is why I look forward to random bumping of my queue.

I'd like to use my vote to have you remove Whip It from your queue. Otherwise, go with Your Friends & Neighbors so I can hear Boner spout vile things about it again. :)

[Spaceman Spiff]

Boner spouting vile things is a sight to see. Just make sure to get out of the way.

[Mara]

Boner spouting vile things is a sight to see. Just make sure to get out of the way.

If you don't know Boner is a poster, this post is really funny.

[DavidSeven]

The Town (Affleck, 2010) **½
127 Hours (Boyle, 2010) *

Let's be friends.

[Morris Schæffer]

RED BEARD!!!

I didn't see Ezee E's prior post so I assumed Red Beard from Rotten Tomatoes posted in this thread and you were so exstatic that you just screamed out the poster's name, as if to welcome his long-overdue arrival on this board.

In actual movie news, I saw Jarhead yesterday. Definitely worth a look, or five thousand looks, but my reaction is pretty much that it doesn't excel in any other area. Or perhaps I just don't want see soldiers being bored off their asses, but kicking asses instead. But again, I was still pretty much engaged all the way through.

What's the consensus on that movie here?

[soitgoes...]

Fuck me for ignoring Demme's Stop Making Sense for so long. It's quite inexplicable on my part, the soundtrack is one of my favorites that always gets play. I just figured, yeah the music's great, what else could a film bring? Jesus. I'd hate to mention just Demme as the driving force behind this. I don't know exactly where his creative influence starts and stops here, but it's obvious that Byrne was a showman quite unparalleled. Every song offers something new. It never feels boring, not even close. The energy... I could go on breaking down the greatness of each song past the fact that there really isn't a mediocre song in the entirety of the set, how each one is filmed to give a certain uniqueness.

If you have never seen this, even if you aren't a fan of the Talking Heads, find this film and watch it ASAP. I challenge you to not love this film.

[B-side]

find this film and watch it ASAP

Alright. Downloading now.

[soitgoes...]

Alright. Downloading now.
:lol:

Uh oh. No, I stand by my comment that I challenge you not to love this.

[B-side]

:lol:

Uh oh. No, I stand by my comment that I challenge you not to love this.

I like Talking Heads, and I like having fun. I'm going to start it in about 5 minutes.:D

[soitgoes...]

I like Talking Heads, and I like having fun. I'm going to start it in about 5 minutes.:DYou're golden then. I'm off to bed, but I expect some sort of blurb on your reaction to read tomorrow.

[B-side]

You're golden then. I'm off to bed, but I expect some sort of blurb on your reaction to read tomorrow.

Will do.:)

[Boner M]

Let's wait until I see it first.


News From Home (Chantal Akerman, 1977) / **
http://www.gifsoup.com/view3/1092972/gernando-o.gif

[Morris Schæffer]

Just bought Robert Aldrich's Emperor of the North with Lee Fuckin Marvin, Ernest Fuckin Borgnine, and Keith Fuckin Carradine. Anyone seen this? It's a favorite of mine, but God it's been so long since I've seen it.

[B-side]

Well, that was a ton of fun. I'm not sure how much Demme and his crew added to the experience, but Byrne can play the hell out of an acoustic guitar, and the whole band was a blast to watch. My only complaint is that I didn't care for the performance of "Once in a Lifetime." Obviously a very minor complaint.

[Ezee E]

I didn't see Ezee E's prior post so I assumed Red Beard from Rotten Tomatoes posted in this thread and you were so exstatic that you just screamed out the poster's name, as if to welcome his long-overdue arrival on this board.

In actual movie news, I saw Jarhead yesterday. Definitely worth a look, or five thousand looks, but my reaction is pretty much that it doesn't excel in any other area. Or perhaps I just don't want see soldiers being bored off their asses, but kicking asses instead. But again, I was still pretty much engaged all the way through.

What's the consensus on that movie here?
I think it's great and not boring at all.

[Sven]

My only complaint is that I didn't care for the performance of "Once in a Lifetime." Obviously a very minor complaint.

Come on, the head smack is genius!

[Spinal]

Yeah, that's pretty much the highlight of the film.

[baby doll]

http://www.gifsoup.com/view3/1092972/gernando-o.gifI'll have to watch it again, but on first viewing, I just couldn't get into it.

[soitgoes...]

Well, that was a ton of fun. I'm not sure how much Demme and his crew added to the experience, but Byrne can play the hell out of an acoustic guitar, and the whole band was a blast to watch. My only complaint is that I didn't care for the performance of "Once in a Lifetime." Obviously a very minor complaint.
Well I'm glad you ended up liking it, but I have to agree with the others that that song was a definite highlight.

[soitgoes...]

I'll have to watch it again, but on first viewing, I just couldn't get into it.

Also, yeah, watch it again. It's awesome.

[balmakboor]

When it was first released, Stop Making Sense was screened in many dance venues. I never actually went, but I heard it was the perfect way to experience it.

[Derek]

The Exterminating Angel - **


Uh, what the fuck, E?

[Qrazy]

Just bought Robert Aldrich's Emperor of the North with Lee Fuckin Marvin, Ernest Fuckin Borgnine, and Keith Fuckin Carradine. Anyone seen this? It's a favorite of mine, but God it's been so long since I've seen it.

I've seen it. Fun times.

[Dead & Messed Up]

De Palma's Blow-Out was pretty great.

[Sven]

De Palma's Blow-Out was pretty great.

Is.

[Yxklyx]

When it was first released, Stop Making Sense was screened in many dance venues. I never actually went, but I heard it was the perfect way to experience it.

When I saw it the whole movie theater danced - this was down at the university.

[StanleyK]

The Mirror was, perhaps unsurprisingly, a lot better than what I got from my first two viewings. It's an incredibly dense work, easy to get confused at first, but it definitely sticks with you in the long run. Maybe a bit too reliant on poems and literature in a few instances, but the titular moment- the boy, left alone by his mother in a waiting room, viewing himself in the mirror- is pure cinematic bliss.

Tarkovsky ruled the school, you guys. He was the school ruler.

[dreamdead]

Red was fun. Malkovich and Mirren make the material enjoyable. And Parker is still gorgeously radiant.

Campion's Two Friends, one of her first features, is not especially interesting formally, but the idea of high school female growth and maturation do warrant coverage. Unfortunately, the idea of telling the story backward seems pointless.

Lee Chang-dong's Secret Sunshine is typically well acted, but moreover it's a well designed screenplay with evocative reversals and a fascinating take on faith.

[Ezee E]

Uh, what the fuck, E?
Should I even bother explaining myself to you on this one? I know I'll just get a :rolleyes: in return on this one.

I rented it simply because it was Bunuel without knowing what it was all about. I've never really cared for the different levels of classes type of movie in which everyone essentially boils down to a stereotype. There's some funny stuff for sure, but it grew tiresome for me. I guess I should say... The Extermehnating Angel.

[Derek]

Should I even bother explaining myself to you on this one? I know I'll just get a :rolleyes: in return on this one.

I rented it simply because it was Bunuel without knowing what it was all about. I've never really cared for the different levels of classes type of movie in which everyone essentially boils down to a stereotype. There's some funny stuff for sure, but it grew tiresome for me. I guess I should say... The Extermehnating Angel.

I'm just curious since it's not a film too many people dislike. But yeah, if you're looking for realistic, fleshed-out characters, this is definitely not your film. My thoughts (http://www.tinymixtapes.com/film/exterminating-angel-criterion) if you're curious.

[Ezee E]

I'm just curious since it's not a film too many people dislike. But yeah, if you're looking for realistic, fleshed-out characters, this is definitely not your film. My thoughts (http://www.tinymixtapes.com/film/exterminating-angel-criterion) if you're curious.
I'm trying to think of a movie similar to this that I like. I'll have to get back to you on that. I just thought it was too drawn out for its own good though.

[Boner M]

Speaking of De Palma, I was halfway into Raising Cain last night and the disc froze. So far it is fucking awesome and feels like the most impressively crafted film ever made.

[TripZone]

Speaking of De Palma, I was halfway into Raising Cain last night and the disc froze. So far it is fucking awesome and feels like the most impressively crafted film ever made.

Deliriously enjoyable. The slow motion climax is fucking awesome.

[Sven]

Speaking of De Palma, I was halfway into Raising Cain last night and the disc froze. So far it is fucking awesome and feels like the most impressively crafted film ever made.

Yeah, top twenty film for me, I think. It only ever rises in my esteem.

[Raiders]

It's lame that I haven't ever seen Raising Cain.

[balmakboor]

The Philip Seymour Hoffman documentary The Party's Over probably comes the closest of anything I've ever seen to grappling with U.S. politics in the way I grapple with the subject. I loved the scene where he interviews Michael Moore.

[Skitch]

Catching up...

First of all, best banner ever. Really, really awesome.

Made one hell of a haul on blu-rays on black Friday.

I can accept pretty much anybodys negative comments on Predators, but damn, the opening up to the title screen is so freakin cool. :)

[Irish]

In actual movie news, I saw Jarhead yesterday. Definitely worth a look, or five thousand looks, but my reaction is pretty much that it doesn't excel in any other area. Or perhaps I just don't want see soldiers being bored off their asses, but kicking asses instead. But again, I was still pretty much engaged all the way through.

I read the book when it was published and then saw the movie some years later. The problem with both is that they're necessarily anti-climactic.

There's curious thematic bookends in the picture. At the start, the most interesting revelation was that the grunts-on-the-ground watch war movies like Apocalypse Now as if they were porn. There's a big build up that something, anything is and could happen ... but at the end, it doesn't. When Swofford has that guy in his scope, ready to pull the trigger, and then is ordered to stand down, it's unsatisfying, a let down. It may have been necessary to stay true to events, but as a narrative it doesn't work. It creates a story without an ending, without any particular meaning.

[Derek]

It may have been necessary to stay true to events, but as a narrative it doesn't work. It creates a story without an ending, without any particular meaning.

I don't even like the film, but that position is absurd. The anti-climax is the meaning of the story. They go into battle expecting action and after weeks of boredom, absolutely craving it, yet the war they were in wasn't won on the ground and dude's sharp-shooting skills end up being all-for-naught. I didn't think it could be much clearer. Just because there's no ending, or whatever McKee-ish slave-to-the-narrative term you want to throw in there doesn't mean the film is devoid of anything.

[Irish]

I don't even like the film, but that position is absurd. The anti-climax is the meaning of the story. They go into battle expecting action and after weeks of boredom, absolutely craving it, yet the war they were in wasn't won on the ground and dude's sharp-shooting skills end up being all-for-naught. I didn't think it could be much clearer. Just because there's no ending, or whatever McKee-ish slave-to-the-narrative term you want to throw in there doesn't mean the film is devoid of anything.

Whatever high end gloss we want to paint it with, this is, and was positioned as, a war movie. A genre film. You walk into it with certain expectations, as Morris said, "I want see soldiers kicking ass." Because it was based on a memoir, it can't deliver what it needs to deliver.

As a movie, this comes off as more a collection of uneven anecdotes, not a narrative film. Most of the people who have seen it walk away with some kind of vague dissatisfaction, and I think that's where it comes from: There's a gun on the mantel from the start, and not only is it never fired, it's never even picked up.

[Chac Mool]

David Fincher's "Zodiac" is even better on second viewing. I liked it a lot when I first saw it (a few months after its theatrical release), but I was a bit off-put by its quietness, slavish attention to procedural details and overall lack of flash.

These very attributes -- evidenced in date/time cards on every second scene, repeated scenes of law enforcement bureaucracy and newsroom politics, countless crime scene details and historical events mentioned in offhand conversations -- are exactly what struck me as brilliant the second time around. The script by James Vanderbilt is rich, layered, filled not only with events and interesting characters, but with fascinating details on investigative procedure. Yes, it's based on real events, but crucially, it feels real.

A film based on such a screenplay needs to be two things: coherent and interesting. Because of Fincher's direction -- in retrospect, as magnificently controlled as his work this year -- "Zodiac" is not only that, but also emotionally charged. Fincher's approach shows us the story almost exclusively through the eyes of witnesses and investigators -- there are precious few crime scene reconstructions or speculative dramatic re-enactments here. Since the Zodiac's identity is unknown, he is considered tangentially, through the hidden structures of his "work" and the careening lives of those who chase him. The film's emotional and intellectual arc therefore circles around this hidden center, and the audience becomes as obsessed as Toschi, Graysmith and Avery with finding the underlying pattern, the answers that seems to hover right there while remaining invisible.

The cathartic scene in the diner, in which Graysmith proposes an answer to the puzzle, is built up through these screenplay and directorial choices for close to two and a half hours, and hits with the same wallop as, say, the final courtroom speech in Oliver Stone's "JFK". I was left shaking and thrilled.

[Watashi]

Whatever high end gloss we want to paint it with, this is, and was positioned as, a war movie. A genre film. You walk into it with certain expectations, as Morris said, "I want see soldiers kicking ass." Because it was based on a memoir, it can't deliver what it needs to deliver.

As a movie, this comes off as more a collection of uneven anecdotes, not a narrative film. Most of the people who have seen it walk away with some kind of vague dissatisfaction, and I think that's where it comes from: There's a gun on the mantel from the start, and not only is it never fired, it's never even picked up.
You have weird opinions, dude. Jarhead wasn't good, but you missed the entire point of the movie.

[Sven]

Most of the people who have seen it walk away with some kind of vague dissatisfaction...

My response was the opposite. I feel some kind of vague satisfaction with it, not being able to pinpoint exactly what it is I find defensible. Perhaps it is its success at layering its approach to tedium, perhaps it was the incredible photography, or the strangely aloof narrative. I think it is clearly Mendes's best film (though I do not like his work much).

You do not seem to appreciate mold-breaking much.