28 Film Discussion Threads Later

[Watashi]

Christian Bale sings the Powerpuff Girls theme song. (http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/video/christian-bale-sings-powerpuff-girls-theme-12394380)

[balmakboor]

I now have a new most anticipated movie. Scorsese, Chloe Moretz, Jude Law, Georges Melies, 1930s Paris, film preservation... My mind does flip-flops over the possibilities. This bit is by the book's author:

Dear readers,

When I was a kid, two of my favorite books were by an amazing man named Remy Charlip. Fortunately and Thirteen fascinated me in part because, in both books, the very act of turning the pages plays a pivotal role in telling the story. Each turn reveals something new in a way that builds on the image on the previous page. Now that I’m an illustrator myself, I’ve often thought about this dramatic storytelling device and all of its creative possibilities.

My new book, The Invention of Hugo Cabret, is a 550 page novel in words and pictures. But unlike most novels, the images in my new book don't just illustrate the story; they help tell it. I've used the lessons I learned from Remy Charlip and other masters of the picture book to create something that is not a exactly a novel, not quite a picture book, not really a graphic novel, or a flip book or a movie, but a combination of all these things.

I began thinking about this book ten years ago after seeing some of the magical films of Georges Méliès, the father of science-fiction movies. But it wasn’t until I read a book called Edison's Eve: The Quest for Mechanical Life by Gaby Woods that my story began to come into focus. I discovered that Méliès had a collection of mechanical, wind-up figures (called automata) that were donated to a museum, but which were later destroyed and thrown away. Instantly, I imagined a boy discovering these broken, rusty machines in the garbage, stealing one and attempting to fix it. At that moment, Hugo Cabret was born.

A few years ago, I had the honor of meeting Remy Charlip, and I'm proud to say that we've become friends. Last December he was asking me what I was working on, and as I was describing this book to him, I realized that Remy looks exactly like Georges Méliès. I excitedly asked him to pose as the character in my book, and fortunately, he said yes. So every time you see Méliès in The Invention of Hugo Cabret, the person you are really looking at is my dear friend Remy Charlip, who continues to inspire everyone who has the great pleasure of knowing him or seeing his work.

Paris in the 1930's, a thief, a broken machine, a strange girl, a mean old man, and the secrets that tie them all together... Welcome to The Invention of Hugo Cabret.

Yours,

Brian Selznick

[Grouchy]

Yeah, Saturday Night Fever is fantastic.

[Boner M]

Struggling to say why Diary of a Country Priest was a struggle to get through. I think it's might be the fact that Bresson's style isn't fully-formed at this point, so the combination of half-emoting/half-not actors and a full-blown sweeping score gives everything the faint whiff of melodrama, and in lieu of his subsequent films, sort of non-committal. The titular priest seems designed be taken as a real character rather than a totem of suffering ala Balthasar, Mouchette, the Pickpocket etc... and I dunno, I just never found him or the film very convincing. I don't feel confident in this reaction and probably owe the film another viewing, but this is the first time since Trial of Joan of Arc that I've found a Bresson film torpid rather than a stellar portrait of spiritual torpor.

[Sycophant]

Can anyone name a movie that's 90 minutes of sequined disco? I want this movie.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Struggling to say why Diary of a Country Priest was a struggle to get through. I think it's might be the fact that Bresson's style isn't fully-formed at this point, so the combination of half-emoting/half-not actors and a full-blown sweeping score gives everything the faint whiff of melodrama. The titular priest seems designed be taken as a real character rather than a totem of suffering ala Balthasar, Mouchette, the Pickpocket etc... and I dunno, I just never found him or the film very convincing. I don't feel confident in this reaction and probably owe the film another viewing, but this is the first time since Trial of Joan of Arc that I've found a Bresson film torpid rather than a stellar portrait of spiritual torpor.

I'm not sure I've ever agreed with you more than I do with this post.

[Russ]

Struggling to say why Diary of a Country Priest was a struggle to get through. I think it's might be the fact that Bresson's style isn't fully-formed at this point, so the combination of half-emoting/half-not actors and a full-blown sweeping score gives everything the faint whiff of melodrama. The titular priest seems designed be taken as a real character rather than a totem of suffering ala Balthasar, Mouchette, the Pickpocket etc... and I dunno, I just never found him or the film very convincing. I don't feel confident in this reaction and probably owe the film another viewing, but this is the first time since Trial of Joan of Arc that I've found a Bresson film torpid rather than a stellar portrait of spiritual torpor.


I'm not sure I've ever agreed with you more than I do with this post.
Yeah, this.

Agree on so much (including owing it a rewatch), but especially the narrative deficiency/shortcoming of the title character.

[Sven]

Can anyone name a movie that's 90 minutes of sequined disco? I want this movie.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080492/

Only change "90" to "124". And yes, you do want this.

[TripZone]

Can anyone name a movie that's 90 minutes of sequined disco? I want this movie.

Tony Manero

heh heh heh

[Derek]

Struggling to say why Diary of a Country Priest was a struggle to get through. I think it's might be the fact that Bresson's style isn't fully-formed at this point, so the combination of half-emoting/half-not actors and a full-blown sweeping score gives everything the faint whiff of melodrama, and in lieu of his subsequent films, sort of non-committal. The titular priest seems designed be taken as a real character rather than a totem of suffering ala Balthasar, Mouchette, the Pickpocket etc... and I dunno, I just never found him or the film very convincing. I don't feel confident in this reaction and probably owe the film another viewing, but this is the first time since Trial of Joan of Arc that I've found a Bresson film torpid rather than a stellar portrait of spiritual torpor.


I'm not sure I've ever agreed with you more than I do with this post.


Yeah, this.

Agree on so much (including owing it a rewatch), but especially the narrative deficiency/shortcoming of the title character.


http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080492/

Only change "90" to "124". And yes, you do want this.

http://cdn.uptownalmanac.com/preset_3/halfbaked.jpg

Fuck you, fuck you, fuck you, you're cool.

[MadMan]

This is pretty awesome.

I4dEWOB6THEHey that made the year seem better than it actually was in terms of film quality.

A Prophet, if its counted as a 2009 release barely cracks my Top 20. If its counted as a 2010 release, then sure its a Top 10 film because this year has been so weak. A good movie, though, one that goes beyond its crime/gangster film cliches to become something far more interesting. The actor portraying the main character elevates the movie, and is someone I hope makes more movies because he clearly has a natural presence and was excellent in this.
So is the movie really about how the Arabs will eventually take over France? (The prison being a metaphor for the country, and how the Arabs end up outnumbering the Corsicians). Or how one man works his way up from the bottom to become something that he didn't want in the first place, but now is? (A drug dealing leader of a gang). I'm not really sure, and I think it deserves a second look, but the fact that I'm mediating about such questions means it was a successful movie, and even though it could have been trimed by about 35-40 minutes its a welcome addition to the old tradition of crime movies.

[Derek]

Fine, I'll say it. 2010 > 2009.

[Kurosawa Fan]

http://cdn.uptownalmanac.com/preset_3/halfbaked.jpg

Fuck you, fuck you, fuck you, you're cool.

You forgot to leave.

[Rowland]

Hey that made the year seem better than it actually was in terms of film quality. You're saying that on the basis of what, maybe two dozen 2010 releases? I may be mistaken, but I don't get the impression you've seen many movies from the last year that weren't in the multiplexes.

[Derek]

You forgot to leave.

But then I would have had to add another "fuck you" and there were only 3 posters I wanted to say that too. I'm not about to insult an innocent MatchCutter just to complete a quote, KF.

[B-side]

Any of you fine folks wanna share your KG names so I can stalk your downloading activity?

Mine is the same as it is here.

[Kurosawa Fan]

But then I would have had to add another "fuck you" and there were only 3 posters I wanted to say that too. I'm not about to insult an innocent MatchCutter just to complete a quote, KF.

Some dedication you have. Besides, you were insulting my opinion, so quote or no quote, it's time for you to go.

[Derek]

Any of you fine folks wanna share your KG names so I can stalk your downloading activity?

Mine is the same as it is here.

DSmith724


Some dedication you have. Besides, you were insulting my opinion, so quote or no quote, it's time for you to go.

You added a 1/2* to your Everyone Else rating, so I'll take back my insult.

[Kurosawa Fan]

You added a 1/2* to your Everyone Else rating, so I'll take back my insult.

Good. Now tell some random MatchCutter "Fuck you" and I'll also retract mine.

[Sycophant]

Hey, guys. What's up?

[B-side]

DSmith724

I just found you a few minutes before I asked that. Went to your profile and tried your AIM screenname.:cool:

[Kurosawa Fan]

Hey, guys. What's up?

Now's your chance, Derek! TAKE IT!!!

[Derek]

Hey, guys. What's up?

Fuck you. That's what's up!

Happy now, KF?

[Kurosawa Fan]

:cool:

[baby doll]

Any of you fine folks wanna share your KG names so I can stalk your downloading activity?

Mine is the same as it is here.UkuleleHobbyist.

[Russ]

Finally saw Trash Humpers. Didn't love it. However, trumpet-blowing dude with the gross toenails was pretty amusing. And I guess the movie, as such, has a weird kind of appeal (as does Korine in his role as the cameraman, Hervé).

[endingcredits]

Any of you fine folks wanna share your KG names so I can stalk your downloading activity?

Mine is the same as it is here.

spunion

[balmakboor]

I've never seen any Naruse. Maybe I'll start with the just announced silent Eclipse set.

[soitgoes...]

Fine, I'll say it. 2010 > 2009.2010 = 2009 = 2008

Still early, but all indications are that the last few years are about the same in quality (very good).


Any of you fine folks wanna share your KG names so I can stalk your downloading activity?

Mine is the same as it is here.soitgoes8, but maybe you knew that already?


I've never seen any Naruse. Maybe I'll start with the just announced silent Eclipse set.Awesome. Start with Every Night Dreams.

[Qrazy]

2010 = 2009 = 2008

Still early, but all indications are that the last few years are about the same in quality (very good).
.

Which are the best films? Because from where I'm sitting they're all equally weak.

[MadMan]

You're saying that on the basis of what, maybe two dozen 2010 releases? I may be mistaken, but I don't get the impression you've seen many movies from the last year that weren't in the multiplexes.Yes, because I have to see every single movie from this year to know if it was a good year or not. Give me a break. I saw the same amount of movies last year at this same time, and guess what: from that sample, I viewed two amazing films, a couple great ones, and many good ones. I also didn't know I was making such a controversial statement when so many critics and movie goers are agreeing that this is a weak year for movies.

[soitgoes...]

Which are the best films? Because from where I'm sitting they're all equally weak.

2008:
Still Walking (Hirokazu Koreeda)
Tokyo Sonata (Kiyoshi Kurosawa)
Let the Right One In (Tomas Alfredson)
Hunger (Steve McQueen)
Burn After Reading (Joel Coen)
Dear Zachary: A Letter to a Son About His Father (Kurt Kuenne)
Afterschool (Antonio Campos)
WALL-E (Andrew Stanton)
Summer Hours (Olivier Assayas)
Two Lovers (James Gray)


2009:
The White Ribbon (Michael Haneke)
Be Sure to Share (Shion Sono)
Inglourious Basterds (Quentin Tarantino)
The Bad Lieutenant: Port of Call New Orleans (Werner Herzog)
A Serious Man (Joel Coen)
Mother (Joon-ho Bong)
The Cove (Louie Psihoyos)
Moon (Duncan Jones)
Mary and Max (Adam Elliot)
Alamar (Pedro González-Rubio)


2010:
I’m Still Here (Casey Affleck)
Poetry (Chang-dong Lee)
Certified Copy (Abbas Kiarostami)
Exit Through the Gift Shop (Banksy)
Inception (Christopher Nolan)
Carlos (Olivier Assayas)
The Oath (Laura Poitras)
Greenberg (Noah Baumbach)
Four Lions (Christopher Morris)
Catfish (Henry Joost, Ariel Schulman)

I'm going by true release dates, because I'm way too lazy to check on IMDb for US dates. Basically I've landed at between 25 and 30 films that I'd label as being very good for every year since 2000. Some have more than others, (2006 was deep), some have more films that are exceptionally strong at the very top than others (2001). 2010 has 11 so far, but I still probably have 50-60 films I will end up seeing, so I see no reason why it won't end up in that same range.

[Derek]

L'Atalante (Vigo 34) ***

Baby Jesus weeps for the missing star.

[soitgoes...]

Baby Jesus weeps for the missing star.

Alamar (Gonzalez-Rubio, 2010) **½
Touché?

[Derek]

Touché?

If Alamar is your top 5 of all-time, then yes, we're even. Otherwise, I'mma gonna watch an Asian film and only sort of like it. ;)

[soitgoes...]

If Alamar is your top 5 of all-time, then yes, we're even. Otherwise, I'mma gonna watch an Asian film and only sort of like it. ;)Then it should be Mind Game (the only Asian film in, maybe only near, my top 5 of all-time). Go on. Start downloading. I'll be here waiting for your 3-star retribution.

[soitgoes...]

I do love The Decalogue. Top 10 for me. Friendsies?

[megladon8]

You know, looking at it from a purely technical standpoint, I'd be hard-pressed to think of a movie that is better made than The Shining.

That film is almost God-like in how perfectly filmed, scored and edited it is.

[Derek]

Then it should be Mind Game (the only Asian film in, maybe only near, my top 5 of all-time). Go on. Start downloading. I'll be here waiting for your 3-star retribution.

I already have that downloaded. :) How do you only have one Asian film that high...you've been misleading me all this time!

[soitgoes...]

I already have that downloaded. :) How do you only have one Asian film that high...you've been misleading me all this time!:lol:
I'm a connoisseur of all things film. "ASIAN CULT" is just one of many badges I wear. There are two in my top 10 though if that helps you sleep.

[Watashi]

March Criterions:

http://criterion-production.s3.amazonaws.com/release_images/3151/557_BD_box_348x490.jpg

http://criterion-production.s3.amazonaws.com/release_images/3169/558_BD_box_348x490.jpg

http://criterion-production.s3.amazonaws.com/release_images/3160/559_BD_box_348x490.jpg

Can't wait to see the Leigh.

[Sven]

Can't wait to see the Leigh.

On many days, I think it's his best. You'll love it.

[soitgoes...]

The coup is the upcoming Eclipse set, upping the available Region 1 Naruse films from one to six.

[Ezee E]

Gotta see Mind Game. Maybe I should sign up for KG.

[soitgoes...]

Gotta see Mind Game. Maybe I should sign up for KG.I have an invite with your name on it. PM if you desire to see the greatest Asian film of all ever.

[Sycophant]

Oh, shit, I should mail that to you, E. I've got the envelope and the disc all ready to go, I just never get to the post office.

If you still want, I'll try to get it out tomorrow.

[Ezee E]

Oh, shit, I should mail that to you, E. I've got the envelope and the disc all ready to go, I just never get to the post office.

If you still want, I'll try to get it out tomorrow.
A very merry Christmas for me! Sure, I'd love it.

[balmakboor]

Oh, shit, I should mail that to you, E. I've got the envelope and the disc all ready to go, I just never get to the post office.

If you still want, I'll try to get it out tomorrow.

Yeah, I've heard about those envelopes. ;)

[Ezee E]

First KG download: Ghosts... of the Civil Dead.

[Derek]

First KG download: Ghosts... of the Civil Dead.

Ah, thanks for reminding me to get this!

[Derek]

http://i.somethingawful.com/u/garbageday/photoshop_phriday/2010_12_10/CinnamonToastFunk_01.png

[Boner M]

Why has no one here (except Nick, seemingly) seen Momma's Man? It's real good, y'all.

[Idioteque Stalker]

Watching The Brave Little Toaster and the room number for the apartment in the city is A113--the same as the "rogue robots" code from the Axiom in Wall-E.

Maybe this is common knowledge.

[Qrazy]

On many days, I think it's his best. You'll love it.

Cheers. I think I may be inclined to agree.

[MacGuffin]

Watching The Brave Little Toaster and the room number for the apartment in the city is A113--the same as the "rogue robots" code from the Axiom in Wall-E.

Maybe this is common knowledge.

Obviously. Everyone knows that.

[baby doll]

Greenberg (Baumbach, 2010) ½Dude, what the hell?

[MacGuffin]

Dude, what the hell?

It just felt like a useless exercise in bitter, obnoxious narcissism to me. I wrote more thoughts in the 2010 thread.

[dmk]

Why has no one here (except Nick, seemingly) seen Momma's Man? It's real good, y'all.
*cough (http://filmisnothing.wordpress.com/2009/12/18/152/)*

[baby doll]

It just felt like a useless exercise in bitter, obnoxious narcissism to me. I wrote more thoughts in the 2010 thread.Whose narcissism is being exercised in the film?

[MacGuffin]

Whose narcissism is being exercised in the film?

Roger Greenberg's narcissism. And it's exercised for a grand total of 107 minutes.

[baby doll]

Roger Greenberg's narcissism. And it's exercised for a grand total of 107 minutes.Except that his image of himself is hardly validated by the film, hence the whole "What do people say about me when I'm not around?" exchange.

[MacGuffin]

Except that his image of himself is hardly validated by the film, hence the whole "What do people say about me when I'm not around?" exchange.

I don't care whether the film validates it or not, the road to the ambivalent, shallow "throw-our-hands-up-and-shrug" non-climax and other side of the character arc was unpleasant and unjustified.

[baby doll]

I don't care whether the film validates it or not, the road to the ambivalent, shallow "throw-our-hands-up-and-shrug" non-climax and other side of the character arc was unpleasant and unjustified.There's nothing ambivalent about the ending (it's very much a Hollywood ending, following Billy Wilder's rule that in the third act the protagonist has to face a decision--in this case, going to Australia or picking up his friend after her abortion--and hopefully does the right thing). And as for calling it shallow, that seems to me a pretty shallow criticism.

As for the rest of the movie being unpleasant, duh, it's about an unpleasant guy, and it's justified because that's how a person like this would behave in those situations.

[MacGuffin]

There's nothing ambivalent about the ending (it's very much a Hollywood happy ending, following Billy Wilder's rule that in the third act the protagonist has to face a decision--in this case, going to Australia or picking up his friend after her abortion--and hopefully does the right thing). And as for calling it shallow, that seems to me a pretty shallow criticism.

It's not a shallow criticism because Baumbach uses the ending as an artificial fallback. It's shallow and clearly a dead end; if Greenberg wanted to make a worthwhile ending, he'd attempt to give some sort of meaning to Greenberg, an otherwise hollow character.


As for the rest of the movie being unpleasant, duh, it's about an unpleasant guy, and it's justified because that's how a person like this would behave in those situations.

I'm not saying all unpleasant movies or characters are bad, but when you fail to attach any meaning to an otherwise empty character and center your film's focus on that character and everyone hurts, yeah it's generally unpleasant overall. And in Greenberg's case, fairly stupid too.

[baby doll]

It's not a shallow criticism because Baumbach uses the ending as an artificial fallback. It's shallow and clearly a dead end; if Greenberg wanted to make a worthwhile ending, he'd attempt to give some sort of meaning to Greenberg, an otherwise hollow character.

I'm not saying all unpleasant movies or characters are bad, but when you fail to attach any meaning to an otherwise empty character and center your film's focus on that character and everyone hurts, yeah it's generally unpleasant overall. And in Greenberg's case, fairly stupid too.What kind of meaning are you talking about?

[MacGuffin]

What kind of meaning are you talking about?

Well, to me "Greenberg" feels more of like an idea. I'm familiar with people like Greenberg, but the movie doesn't say anything interesting about them, nor does it portray their image in a particularly interesting way. Rather the movie takes the character Greenberg and the archetypical image of the failed middle-aged genius that he stands for and mocks it for almost two hours. There is really no more depth to this film than there is to Zoolander, I can assure you.

[soitgoes...]

There's nothing ambivalent about the ending (it's very much a Hollywood ending, following Billy Wilder's rule that in the third act the protagonist has to face a decision--in this case, going to Australia or picking up his friend after her abortion--and hopefully does the right thing). And as for calling it shallow, that seems to me a pretty shallow criticism.

As for the rest of the movie being unpleasant, duh, it's about an unpleasant guy, and it's justified because that's how a person like this would behave in those situations.
The thing I got most from this post is that I desperately want to see a Billy Wilder film where Jack Lemmon has to pick up his friend after her abortion. It could have been called Ace in the Hole if he hadn't used that title already.

[baby doll]

Well, to me "Greenberg" feels more of like an idea. I'm familiar with people like Greenberg, but the movie doesn't say anything interesting about them, nor does it portray their image in a particularly interesting way. Rather the movie takes the character Greenberg and the archetypical image of the failed middle-aged genius that he stands for and mocks it for almost two hours. There is really no more depth to this film than there is to Zoolander, I can assure you.I sort of like Zoolander. Anyway, you're starting to sound like Qrazy with all your talk of "meaining" and films that "say something." It's just a very old fashioned romantic comedy in the spirit of something like The Apartment.

Incidentally, I don't think Greenberg qualifies as a genius by any stretch of the imagination.

[soitgoes...]

Hey Brightside, I noticed on the other forum awhile back you mentioned you were going to watch A Summer at Grandpa's. Did that ever happen?

[Bosco B Thug]

Everyone Else is a fascinating movie. It's like a 3 Women for a heterosexual relationship, except, not to knock 3 Women, but here, endlessly subtle. Wonderful writing and general visual handling, even though I don't find Ade's directing utmost inspiring.

[soitgoes...]

Passenger is an interesting film. Director Andrzej Munk died in the middle of filming. Instead of scrapping the film or having someone step in and replace him, a group of his friends/coworkers banded together and assembled what was finished. The result is a fragment, part film part stills overlapped with narration binding the two. The voice-over in the prologue states that they didn't want to change anything that Munk had done, but present only what he had finished. In doing so they indeed did change Munk's vision. The fragmentary nature of the film surprisingly works as the story is that of an ex-SS guard remembering her time in Auschwitz.

48 films to go. Sorry Qrazy.

[Qrazy]

48 films to go. Sorry Qrazy.

Lame.

[B-side]

Hey Brightside, I noticed on the other forum awhile back you mentioned you were going to watch A Summer at Grandpa's. Did that ever happen?

I watched about 20 minutes before shutting it off. Hideous aesthetic and crappy print. Bleh.

[soitgoes...]

I watched about 20 minutes before shutting it off. Hideous aesthetic and crappy print. Bleh.
You've watched how many Ruiz films with questionable prints?

Oh well. You should start with A Time to Live and a Time to Die for an entry to his trilogy anyways methinks. If you don't like that one then the other two probably won't matter.

[B-side]

You've watched how many Ruiz films with questionable prints?

Yes, but they were technically and narratively interesting to compensate.


Oh well. You should start with A Time to Live and a Time to Die for an entry to his trilogy anyways methinks. If you don't like that one then the other two probably won't matter.

Well, obviously I don't plan on giving up on the man. Many of his films interest me.

[Boner M]

Weekend:

Blue Valentine and/or Somewhere
Seventh Heaven (Borzage)
A Married Couple (Allan King)
In Vanda's Room (Costa)
Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors (Paradjanov)
& possibly a repeat of The Headless Woman

[B-side]

Weekend:

Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors (Paradjanov)

So good. You're in for a treat.

[soitgoes...]

So good. You're in for a treat.This is true. Much better than Color of Pomegranates.

[soitgoes...]

Yes, but they were technically and narratively interesting to compensate.:lol:

[Boner M]

This is true. Much better than Color of Pomegranates.
Pomegrenates scared me away from Paradjanov for a while. Hopefully this one'll win me over.

[TripZone]

Weekend:

Blue Valentine and/or Somewhere[/b]

Hehe, same! Without the "or".

[soitgoes...]

Pomegrenates scared me away from Paradjanov for a while. Hopefully this one'll win me over.Well Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors actually is heavily symbolic, but there's a literal story to go along with it, unlike the poetic(?) one found in Pomegranates. Both are beautiful, but with Ancestors beauty comes understanding too, unless you're versed in obscure Armenian poets..

[Winston*]

Weekend

Dial M for Murder Of Time and The City

[B-side]

This is true. Much better than Color of Pomegranates.


Pomegrenates scared me away from Paradjanov for a while. Hopefully this one'll win me over.

Ridiculous. I plan on watching it rather soon. I'll be sure to litter my poorly-written response with superlatives so as to make you guys feel insecure about your opinion.

[soitgoes...]

Ridiculous. I plan on watching it rather soon. I'll be sure to litter my poorly-written response with superlatives so as to make you guys feel insecure about your opinion.Well of course you'll love it, if only for the reasons I laid out above.

[B-side]

Well of course you'll love it, if only for the reasons I laid out above.

I do have a fondness for obscure Armenian poets.

[soitgoes...]

Weekend:

The Baker's Wife
Diary of a Country Priest
The Bigamist
Shoot the Piano Player
Howl
Outrage (Kitano)

[B-side]

Also,


Foolish Wives (von Stroheim 22) ***

Agreed.

[soitgoes...]

I do have a fondness for obscure Armenian poets.
I figured that's what the guy in your av is pondering. Either that or which nation will be his new oppressor.

[B-side]

I figured that's what the guy in your av is pondering. Either that or which nation will be his new oppressor.

Likely a bit of both considering how much Tarkovsky adored Parajanaov and vice versa.:P

[soitgoes...]

Also,



Agreed.Yes! I'm not big on von Stroheim, but there's obviously something there. I wish he wasn't raped repeatedly by the studios. Then again I don't know if I want to watch 6 or 8 hours of his movies.

This reads like a Mad Man post. Instead of editing, I'm just going to roll with it.

[Sxottlan]

http://criterion-production.s3.amazonaws.com/release_images/3169/558_BD_box_348x490.jpg


Took me a second to realize you can view it upside down too.

[B-side]

Yes! I'm not big on von Stroheim, but there's obviously something there. I wish he wasn't raped repeatedly by the studios. Then again I don't know if I want to watch 6 or 8 hours of his movies.

This reads like a Mad Man post. Instead of editing, I'm just going to roll with it.

I posted a bunch of caps from that movie somewhere. Maybe in that silent film thread I made a while back for no real reason. I shall check photobucket to see if they're in there.

*checks*

They are not. You are disappointed, I'm sure.

[soitgoes...]

I posted a bunch of caps from that movie somewhere. Maybe in that silent film thread I made a while back for no real reason. I shall check photobucket to see if they're in there.

*checks*

They are not. You are disappointed, I'm sure.
:lol:

Well, I just saw it, so I can imagine your screen caps. Monochrome frame, perhaps tinted orange. Smoke. Be-monocled von Stroheim in white military attire, hip flares and all. Stoic. A cane. Fire. Fire! FIRE! Jump Count!

[B-side]

:lol:

Well, I just saw it, so I can imagine your screen caps. Monochrome frame, perhaps tinted orange. Smoke. Be-monocled von Stroheim in white military attire, hip flares and all. Stoic. A cane. Fire. Fire! FIRE! Jump Count!

They were mostly from the mansion. Some wonderful photography there.

[soitgoes...]

Guy Maddin should direct every film.

[B-side]

Guy Maddin should direct every film.

I can't disagree with that.

[soitgoes...]

I can't disagree with that.I just think it would be immensely fun to turn any random film into a Guy Maddin film.

[B-side]

I just think it would be immensely fun to turn any random film into a Guy Maddin film.

As long as that means more films utilizing silent film aesthetic, then I'm all for it.

[soitgoes...]

As long as that means more films utilizing silent film aesthetic, then I'm all for it.Fuck that. I'm just talking about inserting incest and latent homosexuality into films here. Silent film aesthetic. Pfft! Pfft I say!
;)

I've been drinking.

[B-side]

I'm definitely a fan of incest and latent homosexuality, so again, I can't disagree.

[balmakboor]

I really want to see Greenberg. Sounds like my kind of thing.

I've been reading plot summaries and noticed what might be an interesting relationship with I'm Still Here. Both movies are about unlikeable guys who are lost in life and trying to find themselves, making questionable choices along the way. This adds a layer to the scene in I'm Still Here where Stiller offers Phoenix the role of Ivan in Greenberg and Phoenix seems miffed because he's more interested in Roger Greenberg. Is it because he identifies with the character?

Of course, later, Stiller leads the way in mocking Phoenix's life choice.

[Ezee E]

Busy social weekend planned, but here's what I have on tap.

Weekend:
Ghosts... of the Civil Dead
Beloved
The Kids are All Right
The Man Who Fell To Earth

[number8]

useless exercise in bitter, obnoxious narcissism

This should be on Noah Baumbach's business card.

[Derek]

Everyone Else is a fascinating movie. It's like a 3 Women for a heterosexual relationship, except, not to knock 3 Women, but here, endlessly subtle. Wonderful writing and general visual handling, even though I don't find Ade's directing utmost inspiring.

Would you mind going into why it reminds you of 3 Women? I don't remember that one too well aside from it reminding more of Lynch than anything else.


I watched about 20 minutes before shutting it off. Hideous aesthetic and crappy print. Bleh.

Hou, crappy aesthetic?


Weekend:

In Vanda's Room (Costa)

I forget, what'd you think of Ossos?


Weekend:

Diary of a Country Priest

Is worried.

[StanleyK]

The Sacrifice is Tarkovsky channeling Bergman to predictably mesmerizing results, with the former's fluid long takes and the latter's penchant for devastating monologues. The story of the man coming to grips with his selfishness and his insignificance in the larger scheme of things is great, and complimented by the attention lavished on the bit players- every character gets their own moment, my favorite probably being the wife's breakdown- which really makes it feel a lived-in world, augmenting the main character's impotence. I'm convinced I just saw one of the best movies ever made.

[Spinal]

He didn't channel Bergman. He just stole his cinematographer.

[B-side]

Hou, crappy aesthetic?

I'm sure it's not a regular thing with him. Millennium Mambo was rather pleasing aesthetically, but that could have been the obvious Wong influence.

[Qrazy]

He didn't channel Bergman. He just stole his cinematographer.

He one upped him? Fair enough.

[Qrazy]

I'm sure it's not a regular thing with him. Millennium Mambo was rather pleasing aesthetically, but that could have been the obvious Wong influence.

Shadows of our Forgotten Ancestors is much much better than Pomegranates.

[B-side]

Shadows of our Forgotten Ancestors is much much better than Pomegranates.

Odd choice of post to quote to make your point, but we'll see. Not that this viewing of Pomegranates will mean much when it comes to this comparison considering I haven't seen Forgotten Ancestors in years.

[StanleyK]

He didn't channel Bergman. He just stole his cinematographer.

It's not very akin to a Bergman film stylistically or structurally, but the dialogue was pure Ingmar to me.

[endingcredits]

The Sacrifice is Tarkovsky channeling Bergman to predictably mesmerizing results ... I'm convinced I just saw one of the best movies ever made.

Tarkovsky channels the human condition, not other film makers.

[StanleyK]

Tarkovsky channels the human condition, not other film makers.

You know what I meant. I was just pointing out the similarities between the writing style of The Sacrifice and most Bergman movies. I'm sure Tarkovsky did it deliberately to some extent, since he shot the movie with Bergman's cinematographer, cast one of his most frequent collaborators, and set it in Fårö.

[Spinal]

Tarkovsky channels the human condition, not other film makers.

Oh, brother.

[Derek]

Oh, brother.

Come on, it's less ridiculous than saying Tarkovsky "stole" Bergman's cinematographer.

[number8]

Tarkovsky was a true original. He channeled nothing. Not even human experience.

[Qrazy]

Tarkovsky is experience itself.

[Sven]

On the eighth day, God attempted to create Tarkovsky, but the ethereal impression of awareness that would soon blossom into Tarkovsky said "No, Your Highness. Your polished tricks are impressive, but no God creates Tarkovsky." And on the ninth day, Tarkovsky was born of his own goddamn self. And God, in His glory, wept.

[Qrazy]

I feel compelled to start a new blog entitled 'WWTD?'.

[Derek]

I feel compelled to start a new blog entitled 'WWTD?'.

http://dialogues.stjohndfw.info/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/tarkovsky.jpg

"HALT! For this assumes you know for certain what I would do, which is impossible for you are a mere mortal man where I am the pure, alknowing and candescent embodiment of cinema itself."

[endingcredits]

Even if I am being mocked right now this is glorious lulz.

[Raiders]

In Soviet Russia, Tarkovsky's films watch YOU.

[Derek]

Even if I am being mocked right now this is glorious lulz.

I actually found nothing wrong with your comment, but this is MatchCut where saying this like that about Tark or Bresson are scoffed at but about Speed Racer, it's all good. :)

[Bosco B Thug]

Would you mind going into why it reminds you of 3 Women? I don't remember that one too well aside from it reminding more of Lynch than anything else. Didn't mean anything too stylistically. Mostly just story-wise: sinewy relationship between two people morphing and inverting and leading to really intense neurotic developments. Mainly they just had a really similar effect on me, of the "Ooh this is really intense interpersonal drama" variety.

[Sven]

I actually found nothing wrong with your comment, but this is MatchCut where saying this like that about Tark or Bresson are scoffed at but about Speed Racer, it's all good. :)

Saying things like that is always tacky. And even a nonja like you should know that any comments about Speed Racer's resonance to the human experience are made with an overzealous tongue in cheek.

Edited in "Speed Racer" for clarity.

[endingcredits]

I actually found nothing wrong with your comment, but this is MatchCut where saying this like that about Tark or Bresson are scoffed at but about Speed Racer, it's all good. :)

It's hard to scoff at Speed Racer.
As for Bresson, I picked up L'Argent for the weekend. I also got King Lear, and The Cranes Are Flying.

[Melville]

I agree with endingcredit's statement. And even some of the statements written in jest. And StanleyK's statement, too.

[endingcredits]

I agree with endingcredit's statement. And even some of the statements written in jest. And StanleyK's statement, too.

You? Agreeing with everybody? What's going on here?

[Melville]

You? Agreeing with everybody? What's going on here?
Irish hasn't posted yet.

[Derek]

Saying things like that is always tacky. And even a nonja like you should know that any comments about its resonance to the human experience are made with an overzealous tongue in cheek.

Please don't talk to me about saying tacky things. :)

What I meant to say was that saying things like that about Tark are often scoffed at whereas calling Speed Racer a masterpiece is not. Was not carrying the human experience, etc. stuff over.


Didn't mean anything too stylistically. Mostly just story-wise: sinewy relationship between two people morphing and inverting and leading to really intense neurotic developments. Mainly they just had a really similar effect on me, of the "Ooh this is really intense interpersonal drama" variety.

Oh, I gotcha now. Intense is a good word to describe it, though I agree with you that it's incredibly subtle, two things which are tough to pull off in the same relationship drama.


As for Bresson, I picked up L'Argent for the weekend.

My second favorite of his after Au hasard, Balthazar. It's also his densest film with the most frequent use of ellipses, so on a first viewing, it's hard not to get a little confused. Still plenty to appreciate even without connecting all the dots - the colors and editing are remarkable and it's easily B's most vicious, pointed film.

[TripZone]

But The Sacrifice was set/filmed on Faro Island as well. I think Tark's channelling of Bergman in quite undeniable.

[MadMan]

Weekend:

*Sunset Blvd (1950)
*Winter's Bone (2010)
*Tron: Legacy (weather permitting)

[Sycophant]

Weekend:

Yogi Bear

And maybe something I've got lying around that I've been wanting to get to, like Rainbow Song, Paco and the Magic Picture Book, or something by Rokuro Mochizuki or Juzo Itami. If I get bold on Sunday, I might start The Human Condition.

[Spinal]

But The Sacrifice was set/filmed on Faro Island as well. I think Tark's channelling of Bergman in quite undeniable.

My point was that it might look somewhat like a Bergman film because of Sven Nykvist, but that's where the similarities end. Bergman's dialogue and characters are typically electric. Tarkovsky's are laborious and indistinct. I prefer every Bergman film I have ever seen to The Sacrifice.

[megladon8]

I am having a love affair with The Shining right now.

I cannot think of many films that are made better than that one.

[soitgoes...]

My second favorite of his after Au hasard, Balthazar. It's also his densest film with the most frequent use of ellipses, so on a first viewing, it's hard not to get a little confused. Still plenty to appreciate even without connecting all the dots - the colors and editing are remarkable and it's easily B's most vicious, pointed film.Sweet. Since Diary of a Country Priest isn't one of your top 2 favorite Bresson films, I won't feel bad if I throw a 2 and a half star rating next to it.

[Derek]

Sweet. Since Diary of a Country Priest isn't one of your top 2 favorite Bresson films, I won't feel bad if I throw a 2 and a half star rating next to it.

This site is already overflowing with Bresson indifference. I cannot promise your safety or that of your family if you were to do such a thing.

[soitgoes...]

What a strange film Ida Lupino's The Bigamist is. I was thinking that a woman director making a film about bigamy it would be something like a feminist film 20 years before feminism took hold. Man was I wrong. How can you take a film where the lead consciously marries two women, a baby with one and wanting to adopt with the other, and expects the audience to feel sympathy for him? Yeah, I guess things were different in the 50's. Interesting to see how unwanted pregnancies are dealt with in a Hollywood film from that era.

[soitgoes...]

This site is already overflowing with Bresson indifference. I cannot promise your safety or that of your family if you were to do such a thing.I have never given a Bresson film less than 3 stars. I can't say I'm in love with him, but he's definitely above mediocre. :P

[baby doll]

My point was that it might look somewhat like a Bergman film because of Sven Nykvist, but that's where the similarities end. Bergman's dialogue and characters are typically electric. Tarkovsky's are laborious and indistinct. I prefer every Bergman film I have ever seen to The Sacrifice.The last word I'd use to describe Bergman is "electric"--especially when it comes to Scandinavian angst-fests like Through a Glass Darkly and Sarabande. I'll readily concede that Bergman was a superior dramatist (particularly in Persona, which is also his most interesting film stylistically), but Tarkovsky is doing things with sounds and images that more than compensate for his limitations as a storyteller.

[B-side]

Continued from the Random Screenshot Thread:


I would rate Local Hero the same as you.

These kinds of experiences are the reasons I hate ratings. I say this because I was in love with it by the end, but I couldn't justify how indifferent I was for the first, say, half hour. Truth be told, during this period, I assumed I was in for a bit of a chore. It was intermittently charming, but nothing worthy of the praise I'd seen lavished upon it. After a while, though, I realized I was smitten. The humor was low key and the dramatics subdued. Much to my surprise, even a few powerful shots. I was ambivalent about much of the town's characters. Their backroom dealing and theatrics insisted I not be too keen on them, but just as soon as I decided I didn't like them, they ended up charming me again. Not to mention I stepped back and realized what exactly our business team was there for. It's an environmentalist's film that isn't obnoxious or preachy.

[Sven]

Please don't talk to me about saying tacky things. :)

I don't know why you would be so dismissive of advice from someone you think is an expert.

[Qrazy]

My point was that it might look somewhat like a Bergman film because of Sven Nykvist, but that's where the similarities end. Bergman's dialogue and characters are typically electric. Tarkovsky's are laborious and indistinct. I prefer every Bergman film I have ever seen to The Sacrifice.

I don't think it does really primarily because Tark + Nykvist = better aesthetic than Bergman + Nykvist. :P

[B-side]

I don't think it does really primarily because Tark + Nykvist = better aesthetic than Bergman + Nykvist. :P

Boom, headshot.:D

[soitgoes...]

Red Hill (Hughes, 2010) **A shame. I have this, and was hoping for better (obviously). The Square disappointed. Besides The Loved Ones, which was surprisingly good, are there any other Australian films I should be keeping an eye out?

[Bosco B Thug]

Oh, I gotcha now. Intense is a good word to describe it, though I agree with you that it's incredibly subtle, two things which are tough to pull off in the same relationship drama. Really tough! It's probably precisely what most impresses me about the movie.


I don't think it does really primarily because Tark + Nykvist = better aesthetic than Bergman + Nykvist. :P The correct bottom line in this discussion is: they're both the best of the best.

Plus, this DP-sharing totally means Tarkovsky and Bergman have a respect-fueled cross-Mediterranean love connection going on between them.

And confirmed! (http://people.ucalgary.ca/~tstronds/nostalghia.com/TheTopics/IB_On_AT.html) Is there a filmmaker as loudly vocal about other filmmakers as Bergman?

[TripZone]

A shame. I have this, and was hoping for better (obviously). The Square disappointed. Besides The Loved Ones, which was surprisingly good, are there any other Australian films I should be keeping an eye out?

This (http://corrierino.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=499690#p499690 )

[B-side]

Fuck, man. Unstoppable was relentlessly thrilling. I really liked Denzel's cool, aged confidence in this. The ties to Pelham 123 and Deja Vu are there: relating to Deja Vu we have Denzel playing the sacrificial veteran attempting to stop a major crisis with the help of the modern world he seems entirely at odds with. Relating to Pelham 123 we have that same disconnect between the spectators behind the screens and on the phones attempting to micro-manage, and I think that also relates to the action in Unstoppable playing out like a spectator sport, what with crowds gathered in front of TV screens cheering their "team" on and news reporters hustling to be get the exclusive scoop so they can play narrator. The train works as a metaphor for the modern age as well as a symbol of its passé heritage's inevitable demise at our hand. Our hands and minds being the things that kick-started this crisis as well as the things that are destined to go the way of the train as technology becomes more and more futuristic and our manually-driven duties are needed less and less. Denzel's character, unlike his friends, seems to have accepted this inevitable shift, even if he isn't thrilled about it, and tests his new, younger, trust fund-enabled colleague accordingly. Mix in even more topical excessive concern for money over human safety and you've got yourself a rather good zeitgeist film, very much of its time, with an absolutely apropos sense of immediacy in its editing and camera work.

[Rowland]

Given your preemptive defense of the film, posting that Michael J. Anderson article a few weeks back, I'm not surprised you wound up digging it. That's cool though, I wish I felt it was as relentlessly thrilling and emblematic of the zeitgeist as you did, that's certainly what I was hoping for. For me, its metaphorical significance was too easy and its narrative too artificially stacked to induce much in the way of intellectual appreciation or excitement.

[Boner M]

My pre-emptive anti-defense of Unstoppable is stop clamouring to be the next Manny Farber, cinephile blogosphere, Tony Scott sux.

[B-side]

Given your preemptive defense of the film, posting that Michael J. Anderson article a few weeks back, I'm not surprised you wound up digging it. That's cool though, I wish I felt it was as relentlessly thrilling and emblematic of the zeitgeist as you did, that's certainly what I was hoping for. For me, its metaphorical significance was too easy and its narrative too artificially stacked to induce much in the way of intellectual appreciation or excitement.

Admittedly, I did develop an anticipation for it after reading a defense or two and seeing folks with tastes I admire enjoy it. I thought it looked pretty bad when I saw the trailer, but I suppose I should've known better than to put much stock in a trailer. All the grabs at the zeitgeist would've been largely for naught had it not been as genuinely captivating as it was.

[B-side]

For the 2 of you who may be interested, Mondo Vision, who has taken to releasing Zulawski's films in proper form, are releasing On the Silver Globe very soon. Not sure of an exact date, but it's listed as their next release.

[endingcredits]

For the 2 of you who may be interested, Mondo Vision, who has taken to releasing Zulawski's films in proper form, are releasing On the Silver Globe very soon. Not sure of an exact date, but it's listed as their next release.

Nice. I'd like to get some hard-copy Zulawsky. Do you know what else they have planned for him?

[B-side]

Nice. I'd like to get some hard-copy Zulawsky. Do you know what else they have planned for him?

Seems as if they plan on releasing everything of his at some point. They've already released La Femme Publique, L'amour Braque, Szamanka and That Most Important Thing: Love.

[endingcredits]

Seems as if they plan on releasing everything of his at some point. They've already released La Femme Publique, L'amour Braque, Szamanka and That Most Important Thing: Love.

Seems like they choose to go for his weaker films first. Maybe they're going for suspense in which case the ensuing progression should be: On The Silver Globe, Third Part of the Night, The Devil, and then Possession.

[MacGuffin]

Random idea, but if they ever make another Manson family movie, they really need to cast Anna Paquin as one of the baddies.

[soitgoes...]

This (http://corrierino.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=499690#p499690 )I'll keep it in mind, thanks! No way of me seeing this yet, I think.

[Yxklyx]

I found Bhutto to be not much more than a one-sided homage to Benazir Bhutto as opposed to a Documentary. It felt like a propaganda film and I was questioning all that was portrayed. I'll try to avoid Political "Documentaries" in the future.

[balmakboor]

I finally took a look at the trailer for The Tree of Life and I don't know what I think yet. It looks great, but the images just don't strike me with the originality -- or frankly the beauty -- of those in The Fountain.

[Rowland]

You know, I just discovered that The Complete Metropolis is available on Netflix Instant View, and got to thinking that since this cut of the film technically debuted this year, complete with a theatrical release, it would easily rank as the #1 on my 2010 top ten list if considered eligible. Watching it at home won't be the same as the theater, but those of you who haven't seen it yet, hurry the eff up, it's awesome.

[Rowland]

Are You Qualified to Be a Clever Film Critic? (http://www.futurama-area.de/LiH/OComics/25.gif)

[Chac Mool]

What do you guys think of the Coens' "Raising Arizona"?

I found it echoes their later work nicely: twisty plots, hilarious characters, confident mise-en-scene and editing, an ability to bring out the best in their actors, some questionable portrayals of regional stereotypes, and a definite undercurrent of pathos and seriousness.

That being said, one segment did feel out of place -- that final dream, a sudden descent into sentimentalism. But the Coens, being the Coens, manage to finish off with a final chuckle.

Utah.

[Spinal]

some questionable portrayals of regional stereotypes

I don't understand what's questionable about it. It's a farce. Caricature is an element of farce.

[transmogrifier]

Inception - 67
Somewhat hollow, with a central emotional centre that grows tiring over the course of the movie (especially given the curious similarity with Leo's last film, Shutter Island), but ultimately entertaining and well-constructed. EXCEPT: the last dream level in the ice is an impersonal bore, poorly shot and a complete waste of screen time. It almost sinks the film.

Enter the Void - 58
Way too long, going over and over again the same old ground and not having the surface action be interesting enough to cover for the thematic repetition. Has kind of evaporated from my memory, even if odd shots and sequences stand out

Boy – 63
Slight with little in the way of progression, it doesn’t really do much other than establish a pretty clear-eyed sense of time and place, with a heady mix of innocence and cynicism.

The Secret of Kells – 64
Stunningly imaginative animation with a simple story that just kind of peters out into an unsatisfactory kind of “and 20 years later, this happened” ending. But the ideas in the animation are astounding.

The Town – 67
Generic but heartfelt, with a tangible sense of community

Despicable Me - 70
Funny and inventive, taking a standard “learn a lesson” storyline and running it through Looney Tunes.

A Town Called Panic - 34
A manic mess, overbearing and annoying, and I laughed not once. Randomness substitutes for inventiveness.

The Taking of Pelham 123 (2009) - 53
Pure entertainment with some nice character moments, but adding up to bugger all.

Four Lions – 66
Admirably ballsy and funny, but the characters are almost too stupid at times, and it undercuts the satire and the absurdity of the hypocrisy on show. Most trenchant part is the relationship between the main protagonist and his wife and kid.

The Lord of the Rings (1978) – 46
Kind of interesting in the ways it inspired the Jackson versions, and not a travesty by any means, but just kind of cheap and ugly.

REWATCHES

Wild at Heart – 47
A ragged, tone-deaf trial run for the genre heroics of Lost Highway 7 years later.

The Hudsucker Proxy – 72
Still the Coen’s best comedy, a funny screwball farce that goes all the way to 11. The ending doesn’t quite work.

Fargo - 78
Strange that, while watching it, it seems kind of slight and a little condescending, but the despair starts to seep through and the final two scenes with McDormand really kick the film up a notch into the truly affecting.

Barton Fink – 66
Not as thematically interesting as I think it wants to be, but the awesome performances of Turturro and Goodman help to sell the dank, twisted atmosphere.

Alien – 82
For 50 minutes, nothing much happens. It’s awesome.

Aliens – 93
The shot of the bay door opening revealing Ripley in the loading machine is one of the most purely adrenalized in all of film history.

Alien 3 – 79
The most realistic of the series, a grimly melancholic piece that finally addresses the personal toll of fighting evil, which also works as an allegory for the spread of the AIDS virus as well. The monster effects are tosh, but everything else is gold.

Alien Resurrection – 41
A great premise squandered really. Ryder is totally miscast, and the tone is off throughout, unable to balance the grotesque imagery with the overly jokey tone.

Fellowship of the Ring (EE) – 75
Less choppy than the theatrical version, but still suffers a little from the poor musical cues in the first third where the tone of scenes change halfway through on a dime, and the odd moment of cheesiness (“you shall be the Fellowship of the Ring!”) that bloomed unchecked in the atrocious The Lovely Bones

The Two Towers (EE) – 81
Pure energy, not having to worry about starting or ending, with some of the best set-pieces of the series (especially the Ents at Isengard)

The Return of the King (EE) – 71
Rushed, probably needing at least two more passes in the editing room to make the pacing work and rescue some of the sequences that began to feel rote (eg Sam rescuing Frodo from the tower truly just feels like padding). The Shelob sequence is a big disappointment (it’s just a big spider, really), and the decision to use all those fade outs at the end is totally misbegotten (as well as shooting the reunion, which should have been the cornerstone of the epilogue, as a fucking shampoo commercial). BUT the defending of Minas Tirith is amazing.

[balmakboor]

I took another look at Peeping Tom this evening and find it infinitely fascinating. I had rewatched Blow Out recently as well and was struck by how much that film owes to Powell's. Besides both opening with long subjective tracking shots leading up to female victims and both centering around the moviemaking business and both featuring voyeuristic protagonists (Travolta's character is even referred to in dialog as a "Peeping Tom"), they both also share a similar movement. Blow Out seeks to find a perfect recorded sound of a scream to accompany the cinematic image of a screaming face. Peeping Tom seeks to find a perfect cinematic image of a screaming face to accompany the recorded sounds of women's screams.

[MadMan]

Ah trans posts-its not unique unless I disagree with many of his ratings or his opinions :P

I have yet to see Blow Out, but Peeping Tom is a fantastic horror/thriller that is better than the more reknowned and loved Psycho, released the same year.

My planed viewing of Tron was completely ruined as a result of friends not being able to go. Huzzah :|

Raising Arizona is without a doubt one of the funniest and most delightful movies I've ever seen. Its also one of their best movies, although granted I still have a good deal to view from them. I'm mostly seen their work from the 2000s, two 80s films, and only two from the 90s. Fargo and Big Lebowski being those, with Blood Simple being the other 80s viewing.

Recently I revisited William Shakesphere's Romero + Juliet (1996), and I found that my rating of it went up a few notches. The film is a lively, vibrent and wild adaptation of a classic play (one I've actually read), and the cast for it is excellent. The movie somewhat drags near the end, but I still enjoy it despite its failings, and the fact that the play's dialogue is kept intact for a modern setting is a nice touch. This time around I noticed the score, which is a combo of 90s songs that works really well, actually. I'm reminded that I should give the 1968 adaption another shot, as my younger self found it to be rather boring, but hey I was in high school and that was a different time, I suppose.

[transmogrifier]

The Coens are much better at drama (with the odd comedic touch) than flat-out comedy. To wit: their best three films are Miller's Crossing, Blood Simple and Fargo. Their worst three films are Raising Arizona, Intolerable Cruelty and The Ladykillers.

[DavidSeven]

The Coens are much better at drama (with the odd comedic touch) than flat-out comedy. To wit: their best three films are Miller's Crossing, Blood Simple and Fargo. Their worst three films are Raising Arizona, Intolerable Cruelty and The Ladykillers.

Is this even a contested point? I realize everyone loves The Big Lebowski, but Fargo, Miller's Crossing, Blood Simple and recently No Country for Old Men seem most recognized as their canonical works.

[transmogrifier]

Is this even a contested point? I realize everyone loves The Big Lebowski, but Fargo, Miller's Crossing, Blood Simple and recently No Country for Old Men seem most recognized as their canonical works.

I hope not. It'd be like contesting whether the sun was hot.

Rewatched The Big Lebowski today - same old reaction for me, some hilarious individual lines and a great supporting performance from Goodman, but the story is just too shaggy to maintain interest over the two hours, and Bridges (to me at least), comes across as a little mannered, though still enjoyable. And there are no real big standout scenes either (except perhaps the fantasy dance number), just a bunch of stuff cobbled together and saved by the witty dialogue.

As I said earlier, The Hudsucker Proxy is easily the Coen's funniest film - it has real comic timing and an inventiveness that they haven't really reproduced in their comedies.

[transmogrifier]

Oh yeah, and rewatched Twelve Monkeys today, brilliant film, possibly Gilliam's best (Brazil and The Fisher King may disagree, though). It is so seedy and grim, with its version of 1996 society so alien and scuzzy, it helps to put in sharp relief Cole's immense joy at the simple pleasure of freedom. The whole movie seems liable to collapse at any moment, skirting the line between a coherent, internally rigorous depiction of social anarchy and simply being incoherent and gauche. But it holds its nerve and lands an impressively emotional ending. Willis at his best.

[balmakboor]

Oh yeah, and rewatched Twelve Monkeys today, brilliant film, possibly Gilliam's best (Brazil and The Fisher King may disagree, though).

I agree with your praise of these three and I really really need to take a fresh look at Twelve Monkeys and The Fisher King. I also like Time Bandits a lot despite it being kind of clumsy and too noisy. And, while I hated it the first go around, I've found more to love and more to laugh about in Fear and Loathing with each of my four subsequent viewings.


Top 5 Best Movies by Bad Directors
1. When Harry Met Sally (Reiner) 94
2. Grease (Kleiser) 92
3. What's Eating Gilbert Grape? (Hallstrom) 87
4. Chasing Amy (Smith) 85
5. The Usual Suspects (Singer) 84

I actually take offense at your calling all of these guys "bad directors."

Rob Reiner has made a long list of great movies including Spinal Tap, The Sure Thing, Stand by Me, Princess Bride, When Harry..., Misery, A Few Good Men, and Flipped.

I've only seen a few movies by Randall Kleiser, but he's a guy I've been meaning to explore. Grease is a queer theory touchstone (and I think a masterpiece) and his other movies swing back and forth between overt gay themes and subversion of genre/franchise movies toward gay themes.

Lasse Hallstrom has his problems, but My Life as a Dog, Once Around, What's Eating Gilbert Grape, and Something to Talk About all contradict his being a "bad" director.

Kevin Smith, ironically considering the general acclaim for his writing, is a pretty good director, just not a very good writer. He is great with actors and his films are filled with likeable characters and strong performances. His visual style is notorious flat, but it gets the job done.

I have only seen The Usual Suspects by Singer, but it alone demonstrated that he knows a thing or two about directing. I'll reserve any real defense (or possible partial agreement with you) until after I've seen more.

[Raiders]

Is this even a contested point? I realize everyone loves The Big Lebowski, but Fargo, Miller's Crossing, Blood Simple and recently No Country for Old Men seem most recognized as their canonical works.

A Serious Man and Raising Arizona might be their two best films, so yes, it is contested.

[Pop Trash]

Raising Arizona is fucking great and better than Lebowski so take that General Consensus...if that is your real name!

[Qrazy]

Spinal and I also favor Raising Arizona to most of the Coens other films... although I still might put Fargo first.

[MacGuffin]

I think Raising Arizona is one of their worst because it's too slapstick overall. Later, they would find ways to be funny in a way that's subtler, without getting in the way of the overall framework of the movie. I think I like The Big Lebowski slightly more than Fargo as my Coen Brothers favorite, but transmogrifer's right in The Hudsucker Proxy being extremely undervalued, for its set designs if nothing else.

[Qrazy]

I think Raising Arizona is one of their worst because it's too slapstick overall. Later, they would find ways to be funny in a way that's subtler, without getting in the way of the overall framework of the movie. I think I like The Big Lebowski slightly more than Fargo as my Coen Brothers favorite, but transmogrifer's right in The Hudsucker Proxy being extremely undervalued, for its set designs if nothing else.

Strongly dislike The Hudsucker Prodcy. What's wrong with slapstick? The dogs running through the house is one of my favorite Coens set pieces.

[MacGuffin]

Strongly dislike The Hudsucker Prodcy. What's wrong with slapstick? The dogs running through the house is one of my favorite Coens set pieces.

It's usually just too overdone.

[baby doll]

Raising Arizona isn't one of my favorites, but the style at least keeps it interesting. I prefer Blood Simple, Barton Fink, Fargo, The Big Lebowski, The Man Who Wasn't There, No Country for Old Men (despite the bogus elements), Burn After Reading, and best of all, A Serious Man.

[Sven]

- it has real comic timing and an inventiveness that they haven't really reproduced in their comedies.

You know I disagree, but this is the worst thing you've ever written. "Real" comic timing?

[Sven]

I think Raising Arizona is one of their worst because it's too slapstick overall. Later, they would find ways to be funny in a way that's subtler, without getting in the way of the overall framework of the movie.

What if the framework of the film is slapstick in nature? Like with, say, Raising Arizona? In that case, the slapstick would not get in the way.

It's so frustrating defending self-evident truths.

[Chac Mool]

I don't understand what's questionable about it. It's a farce. Caricature is an element of farce.

Of course it's a farce -- but it's one directed at a specific racial/cultural group, and one that casts a somewhat derogatory light on said group.

[Sven]

Of course it's a farce -- but it's one directed at a specific racial/cultural group, and one that casts a somewhat derogatory light on said group.

You are obviously smart enough to not be brainwashed into accepting all Arizonans as yokels, so why act so offended?

I am very happy to live in a world where it's okay to laugh at Speedy Gonzalez cartoons.

[MacGuffin]

What if the framework of the film is slapstick in nature? Like with, say, Raising Arizona? In that case, the slapstick would not get in the way.

Yes, it would. There's too much of it.

[Sven]

There's too much of it.

It sounded like your beef was with the relationship to the film's framework, and I only see a fluid continuum between the two elements.

[transmogrifier]

You know I disagree, but this is the worst thing you've ever written. "Real" comic timing?

I don't think the Coen's have good comic timing in terms of setting up scenes. I think their comedic strength lies in dialogue and characterization, not in the way they shoot or edit a scene. Hudsucker is one of the exceptions to that rule though, possibly because they are hewing to such a rigid template in the screwball comedy.

[Sven]

Homeboy, the centerpiece chase sequence in Raising Arizona is the very definition of amazing comic timing.

[Spinal]

Of course it's a farce -- but it's one directed at a specific racial/cultural group, and one that casts a somewhat derogatory light on said group.

I find this to be a pretty bizarre objection. When I watch Raising Arizona, I see them having fun at the expense of a woman's need to nurture, a man's need to be a provider, a businessman's arrogance, the way in which friends can be freeloaders or cause you discomfort with their different code of morality. I don't take it as a slight on a particular cultural group. I'm not even sure what culture that would be. I don't think of myself or the Coens as above these characters. I laugh because I recognize myself in their foibles and relate to the way they take themselves so seriously while struggling to get it right.

[transmogrifier]

What if the framework of the film is slapstick in nature? Like with, say, Raising Arizona? In that case, the slapstick would not get in the way.

It's so frustrating defending self-evident truths.

Well, perhaps you just need to stop assuming that what you happen to believe is a "self-evident truth". Then I'm sure your stress levels will decrease.

I mean, it seems that you have managed to sweep away a dissatisfaction with stereotypes in Raising Arizona from Chac Mool with a "Well, YOU know that they aren't so dumb, so what's the problem?". That's one of the shallowest defenses of a film I can remember reading.

[transmogrifier]

Homeboy, the centerpiece chase sequence in Raising Arizona is the very definition of amazing comic timing.

You mean, the film that I think is the Coen's worst? No, can't see why I wouldn't appreciate the "amazing" (correct me if I'm wrong, but is this word not subjective? I forget sometimes with you) comic timing in that one.

Obviously you respond to their way of setting up comic set pieces. I do not. It's rather simple. They are much better at setting up tension.

[Spinal]

Homeboy, the centerpiece chase sequence in Raising Arizona is the very definition of amazing comic timing.

Several scenes in this movie fit that definition.

[Sven]

Well, perhaps you just need to stop assuming that what you happen to believe is a "self-evident truth". Then I'm sure your stress levels will decrease.

The self evident truth I was referring to was the fact that Raising Arizona possesses a slapstick framework. I cannot see how this can be argued against.


That's one of the shallowest defenses of a film I can remember reading.

It was a defense of stereotyping in humor, not of a film.

[Sven]

Perhaps I will continue this when I get back from work tonite. I would like to provide more satisfying responses to you, trans.

[transmogrifier]

I find this to be a pretty bizarre objection. When I watch Raising Arizona, I see them having fun at the expense of a woman's need to nurture, a man's need to be a provider, a businessman's arrogance, the way in which friends can be freeloaders or cause you discomfort with their different code of morality. I don't take it as a slight on a particular cultural group. I'm not even sure what culture that would be. I don't think of myself or the Coens as above these characters. I laugh because I recognize myself in their foibles and relate to the way they take themselves so seriously while struggling to get it right.

See, this is a defense.

I think the Coen's skirt the boundary between harmless skewering of cultural and ethnic stereotypes and simply indulging in them. Fargo, which I love for it's sense of hopelessness and emotional kick via Marge, is one of the most dubious examples.

[transmogrifier]

The self evident truth I was referring to was the fact that Raising Arizona possesses a slapstick framework. I cannot see how this can be argued against.


What is a "framework" in the way you use it here? Are you just saying that it is supposed to be a slapstick film, so disliking the slapstick doesn't make sense?

[Spinal]

See, this is a defense.

I think the Coen's skirt the boundary between harmless skewering of cultural and ethnic stereotypes and simply indulging in them. Fargo, which I love for it's sense of hopelessness and emotional kick via Marge, is one of the most dubious examples.

It's also presumably the culture the Coens themselves are most familiar with since they're a part of it. I don't see it as any different than Spike Lee's colorful exaggeration of Brooklyn in Do the Right Thing, a portrait that is affectionate above all other things.

[Ezee E]

It's definitely making fun of trailer trash in Raising Arizona. To the point that it's almost a caricature. However, it works within the world the movie is set, and I don't see how that's a problem for the movie at all. Basically every character in that movie is a caricature as mentioned by Spinal.

[balmakboor]

Raising Arizona is the only Coen Bros. film my wife likes. She just loves Cage, Hunter, and looking at babies. That would suggest it is like a Coen Bros. film for people who don't like Coen Bros. films?

I still have a special place on my shelf for Bood Simple, that and Fargo.

[Pop Trash]

How the hell is How Do You Know's budget $120 million? That's absurd.

[Ezee E]

How the hell is How Do You Know's budget $120 million? That's absurd.
Nicholson and Reese probably each came with $20-30 million payroll. So that's half of it right there. Add in the rest of the cast, probably another $20-30.

[DavidSeven]

When Harry Met Sally (Reiner) 94

Whoa. Wait, what? Admittedly, it's enjoyable enough, but a 94 for this shameless Annie Hall/Manhattan knock off?

[Henry Gale]

Nicholson and Reese probably each came with $20-30 million payroll. So that's half of it right there. Add in the rest of the cast, probably another $20-30.

Not sure you actually care too much, but I heard the real salaries worked out to $15 million for Witherspoon, $12 million for Nicholson, $10 million for Wilson and then (the main reason I bring this up) Paul Rudd got $3 million.

It's really strange when you see things like that because despite it all dealing with amounts of money most people couldn't imagining getting, and for just a couple of months of work, there doesn't seem to be any real value placed on how much any of them are featured in it. Apparently Nicholson doesn't have a very big role at all, but being who he is he gets four times what Rudd does.

And then you take into account the fact that this weekend it only made about a sixth of just the combined total of those actors' paychecks, you realize how much of a disaster it really is for the studio.

[TripZone]

Nora Ephron is so shit.

[Ezee E]

Is Nicholson even a draw anymore?

I guess... The Bucket List, Anger Management, and Something's Gotta Give all did pretty good despite being shitty movies.

I won't attribute The Departed's success to him.

[Idioteque Stalker]

Whoa. Wait, what? Admittedly, it's enjoyable enough, but a 94 for this shameless Annie Hall/Manhattan knock off?

What makes it such a knock off? Allen doesn't have a monopoly on witty romantic comedies set in NYC.

[balmakboor]

Is Nicholson even a draw anymore?

I guess... The Bucket List, Anger Management, and Something's Gotta Give all did pretty good despite being shitty movies.

I won't attribute The Departed's success to him.

Not really. The main reason I saw The Departed was the thought of Scorsese and Nicholson working together. I thought the movie nearly sucked. I haven't seen anything else you listed.

[balmakboor]

What makes it such a knock off? Allen doesn't have a monopoly on witty romantic comedies set in NYC.

Well, it does borrow a fair number of narrative ideas from Annie Hall especially, but I would also stop well short of calling it a "knock off."

[DavidSeven]

What makes it such a knock off? Allen doesn't have a monopoly on witty romantic comedies set in NYC.

Oh, you know, the wise cracking Jew/androgynous blonde romance, classic piano pieces, autumn in New York, the combo cynicism/optimism about romance, and I'm pretty sure they used font/color on the credits. Sally even wears the same over-sized hat. This seems a little too specific to be acceptable. Plus, it's not nearly as good. I saw it in its entirety a couple years ago and parts of it on cable just recently. The similarities are pretty striking. It's Annie Hall-super lite.

[DavidSeven]

http://weblogs.variety.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/04/08/anniehallmovies080414_4_560.jp g

[x]

http://www.2beerguys.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/mgd.gif

=

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_8Yv4ysEUiQc/TOtCvFDRVRI/AAAAAAAAAMc/nE_b_ZWAM9s/s1600/when-harry-met-sally-800-75.jpg

[megladon8]

When Harry Met Sally > most of Woody Allen's work.

And I'd probably give it a 6.5 or a 7 if I was feeling really generous.

[DavidSeven]

When Harry Met Sally > most of Woody Allen's work.

And I'd probably give it a 6.5 or a 7 if I was feeling really generous.

You mean when factoring in his recent output or do you actually dislike his highly regarded stuff that much?

[megladon8]

You mean when factoring in his recent output or do you actually dislike his highly regarded stuff that much?


It's not that I dislike it that much, it's that I find a lot of terribly "meh".

Annie Hall is great, as is The Purple Rose of Cairo. The rest of his filmography (that I've seen - I haven't seen much of his 2000's output) feels much to me like exercises in exploring the same themes and character relationships over and over.

Of course not all of them fall into this repetition, but there were enough that I lost interest. Similarly, watching Curse of the Jade Scorpion and Small Time Crooks eliminated much of my desire to see his newer stuff.

While I understand that many of the roles he writes for himself are meant to be seen as pathetic, whiny New York Jews, this doesn't eliminate my disdain for watching a movie about a pathetic, whiny New York Jew who I think needs a slap upside the head.

And no, I am not opening the "movie characters have to be likable" can of worms. I do not believe that you have to like a character to enjoy a movie. But I do believe that you have to be interested in them and the story, and I am quite simply not very interested in watching Woody Allen mope and whine about his dreary life.

*takes a deep breath*

But, again, Annie Hall and The Purple Rose of Cairo are the bee's knees.

[Qrazy]

It's not that I dislike it that much, it's that I find a lot of terribly "meh".

Annie Hall is great, as is The Purple Rose of Cairo. The rest of his filmography (that I've seen - I haven't seen much of his 2000's output) feels much to me like exercises in exploring the same themes and character relationships over and over.

Of course not all of them fall into this repetition, but there were enough that I lost interest. Similarly, watching Curse of the Jade Scorpion and Small Time Crooks eliminated much of my desire to see his newer stuff.

While I understand that many of the roles he writes for himself are meant to be seen as pathetic, whiny New York Jews, this doesn't eliminate my disdain for watching a movie about a pathetic, whiny New York Jew who I think needs a slap upside the head.

And no, I am not opening the "movie characters have to be likable" can of worms. I do not believe that you have to like a character to enjoy a movie. But I do believe that you have to be interested in them and the story, and I am quite simply not very interested in watching Woody Allen mope and whine about his dreary life.

*takes a deep breath*

But, again, Annie Hall and The Purple Rose of Cairo are the bee's knees.

So aside from Crooks and Scorpion which do you find meh?

[Sven]

No, can't see why I wouldn't appreciate the "amazing" (correct me if I'm wrong, but is this word not subjective? I forget sometimes with you) comic timing in that one.

I miss you when you're gone, but I don't miss your occasional condescension. Substitute "successful" or "strong", though those could still be argued as subjective. Or no adjective: "the centerpiece chase sequence in Raising Arizona is the very definition of comic timing."

Plus, why so snarky about objectivity? You were the one who introduced the term "good" to the discussion.


Obviously you respond to their way of setting up comic set pieces. I do not. It's rather simple. They are much better at setting up tension.

It is very simple, but it is also at the heart of pretty much every argument had on this board: voicing an opinion as though it is fact and people not knowing how to engage with that comment. Sure I respond to their comedy, so I can say "They are good at comedy." You do not, so you can say "They are bad at comedy." We are both right, despite having both made apparently objective comments (forgoing "I think..."). Extending this to MacGuffin's introduction of the term "framework," he was attempting to sound an objective criticism about the Coens's use of slapstick by arguing that it undermines a framework that apparently cannot handle the quantity of slapstick delivered. This is not a sound argument and I stated as such, and clarify a bit below.


What is a "framework" in the way you use it here? Are you just saying that it is supposed to be a slapstick film, so disliking the slapstick doesn't make sense?

For the sake of MacGuffin's argument, I used "self-evident" to emphasize that the film's text (ie, its "framework": what it's about and how its subject, themes, characters, and narrative are structured) is constructed as one of wild slapstick, from pretty much first minute to last. Complaining about the slapstick somehow "getting in the way" of what Raising Arizona is really about sounds like complaining that the seriousness in Hamlet really undermines its themes. Objections to the quality of comedy in the film, as you have, is much less confounding, though certainly no less inaccurate. I have commented rather truthfully to the quality of comedy in Raising Arizona, and I'm definitely all ears to arguments to the contrary. However, trying to debate that it is inferior because of the QUANTITY of humor on display is just... I dunno...

"It's a slapstick film, yeah, but there's just too much slapstick."

...wrong.

[Qrazy]

Extending this to MacGuffin's introduction of the term "framework," he was attempting to sound an objective criticism about the Coens's use of slapstick by arguing that it undermines a framework that apparently cannot handle the quantity of slapstick delivered. This is not a sound argument and I stated as such, and clarify a bit below.


I don't know it seemed to me like he was just saying he just doesn't like slapstick much in general and prefers dialogue driven humor. I asked him what's wrong with slapstick and he said there's too much of it. So when there is slapstick in a film he just prefers it to be used very sparingly. And fair enough I suppose although personally I love a well executed slapstick film.

[Sven]

I don't know it seemed to me like he was just saying he just doesn't like slapstick much in general and prefers dialogue driven humor. I asked him what's wrong with slapstick and he said there's too much of it. So when there is slapstick in a film he just prefers it to be used very sparingly. And fair enough I suppose although personally I love a well executed slapstick film.

Of course it is fair to have an opinion, and not at all bad to dislike a film for subjective tastes. But I'm holding to this "framework" thing that McG was throwing down. That shit don't fly on the subject of Raising Arizona.

[Qrazy]

Of course it is fair to have an opinion, and not at all bad to dislike a film for subjective tastes. But I'm holding to this "framework" thing that McG was throwing down. That shit don't fly on the subject of Raising Arizona.

Yeah his sentence about framework was just oddly phrased... "Later, they would find ways to be funny in a way that's subtler, without getting in the way of the overall framework of the movie." I'm not even really sure what he meant by that.

[Sven]

Yeah his sentence about framework was just oddly phrased... "Later, they would find ways to be funny in a way that's subtler, without getting in the way of the overall framework of the movie." I'm not even really sure what he meant by that.

Not to keep deconstructing McG's words without his input, but it definitely reads like he's saying that the slapstick interferes with the framework of Raising Arizona. Which, as I have put in more words than is probably warranted, I think is emphatically incorrect.

[Pop Trash]

You know what sounds good right now? A cool, refreshing MGD Light. Oh yeah.

[MacGuffin]

I probably used framework incorrectly Sven. I was really referring to the formal elements of the movie; it felt so overly slapstick (and yes, I understand and acknowledge that it is supposed to be to a certain degree) that I wasn't able to enjoy the typical Coen flourishes I usually do.

[MacGuffin]

I don't know it seemed to me like he was just saying he just doesn't like slapstick much in general and prefers dialogue driven humor. I asked him what's wrong with slapstick and he said there's too much of it. So when there is slapstick in a film he just prefers it to be used very sparingly. And fair enough I suppose although personally I love a well executed slapstick film.

And bingo was his name-o. Sorry if I wasn't clear enough, all.

[megladon8]

So aside from Crooks and Scorpion which do you find meh?


No, Small Time Crooks and Curse of the Jade Scorpion are freaking terrible, not "meh".

Woody Allen movies that are "meh"?

A Midsummer Night's Sex Comedy, Hannah and Her Sisters, Crimes and Misdemeanors, Shadows and Fog and Deconstructing Harry were all varying grades of "meh" to "really didn't like it much".

Mighty Aphrodite was all right. As was Sweet and Lowdown.

Have not seen Manhattan. Not much desire to, honestly.

Oh and I lied, I did see another 2000s one - Melinda and Melinda. It was crap.

[transmogrifier]

I miss you when you're gone, but I don't miss your occasional condescension. Substitute "successful" or "strong", though those could still be argued as subjective. Or no adjective: "the centerpiece chase sequence in Raising Arizona is the very definition of comic timing."

Plus, why so snarky about objectivity? You were the one who introduced the term "good" to the discussion.
.

I was being snarky because of your phrase "self-evident truths" when discussing comedy, which is monumentally subjective. And because I strongly dislike Raising Arizona :)

[transmogrifier]

Whoa. Wait, what? Admittedly, it's enjoyable enough, but a 94 for this shameless Annie Hall/Manhattan knock off?

Cos it's hilarious, well-structured and earns its sentimentalism. Oh, and the two leads are awesome together.


Also, I'd like to thank meg for taking the heat off me by being spectacularly wrong :)

[Sven]

I was being snarky because of your phrase "self-evident truths" when discussing comedy, which is monumentally subjective. And because I strongly dislike Raising Arizona :)

Yeah. I guess I wasn't clear enough that I wasn't talking about the movie, or comedy necessarily, but rather MacGuffin's now admittedly poor "framework" structuring. It is a rather maddening phrase.

[megladon8]

I love that probably the greatest compliment I've received on this board is that I'm wrong.

[Winston*]

I love that probably the greatest compliment I've received on this board is that I'm wrong.
What does this mean?

[megladon8]

What does this mean?



Also, I'd like to thank meg for taking the heat off me by being spectacularly wrong :)


?

[Grouchy]

Well, if you can experience Hanna and Her Sisters and Crimes and Misdemeanors and consider them "meh", then you just don't get Woody Allen, meg. Not for you. I think you should still try Manhattan, though.

[Qrazy]

No, Small Time Crooks and Curse of the Jade Scorpion are freaking terrible, not "meh".

Woody Allen movies that are "meh"?

A Midsummer Night's Sex Comedy, Hannah and Her Sisters, Crimes and Misdemeanors, Shadows and Fog and Deconstructing Harry were all varying grades of "meh" to "really didn't like it much".

Mighty Aphrodite was all right. As was Sweet and Lowdown.

Have not seen Manhattan. Not much desire to, honestly.

Oh and I lied, I did see another 2000s one - Melinda and Melinda. It was crap.

You're right about Midsummer Night's and Deconstructing Harry. Those are both pretty meh. Haven't seen Shadows. I like Hannah and Crimes quite a bit more than you do though.

Manhattan is his best film imo, even better than Annie Hall. You should really see it. You also might like his early comedies quite a bit more. Bananas, Take the Money and Run, Sleeper (seems up your alley), Zelig.

[baby doll]

The early years (1966-75): I've seen 'em all except Sleeper (I tried a few weeks ago but the disc skipped), and the only one I really like is Everything You Always Wanted to Know About Sex... But Were Afraid to Ask, which I saw in a second run theatre in Toronto in 2004. It's a bit uneven, but the Gene Wilder segment is flat-out hilarious.

Woody, the Auteur (1977-80): I loved Annie Hall the first time I saw it, but less so on subsequent viewings. I actually prefer Interiors to most actual Bergman films. I've seen Manhattan countless times, and it always moves me. And Stardust Memories looks better every time I see it.

The Mia Farrow years (1982-92): His most successful films from this period are Broadway Danny Rose (although, like Annie Hall, I don't think I could watch it over and over), Hannah and Her Sisters (just a solidly crafted picture all around), Oedipus Wrecks, and probably Husbands and Wives although I should really watch it again (my first and last viewing was on September 11, 2002). His most overrated: The Purple Rose of Cairo is mostly brilliant, but the ending kills it for me. And as for Crimes and Misdemeanors, while my favorite Allen movies are often about morality (Manhattan, Bullets Over Broadway, Match Point), this one just isn't as much fun as those. (I haven't seen A Midsummer Night's Sex Comedy or September, and I need to re-watch Radio Days.)

The Soon-Yi Years (1993-present): His best movies from this period are Manhattan Murder Mystery (which I just saw again for the first time since I was nine, and is one of his most accomplished in terms of visual storytelling), the aforementioned Bullets Over Broadway and Match Point, and You Will Meet a Tall Dark Stranger (even if nobody seems to agree with me). Also good but minor are The Curse of the Jade Scorpion and Whatever Works (again, even if nobody seems to agree with me). I should probably take another look at Sweet and Lowdown, but if nothing else, it has Sean Penn and awesome jazz music. (The only one I haven't seen from this period is Hollywood Ending.)

[transmogrifier]

Manhattan Murder Mystery is by my reckoning Allen's most underrated movie. It's one of his funniest.

[kopello]

His most overrated: The Purple Rose of Cairo is mostly brilliant, but the ending kills it for me.

What don't you like about the ending? I couldn't see it finish any other way.

[Sven]

Manhattan Murder Mystery is by my reckoning Allen's most underrated movie. It's one of his funniest.

Yeah, it's pretty singular. I am partial to rating my favorite of his films, Broadway Danny Rose, as also his most underrated, despite the high regard for it 'round here. I think Bullets Over Broadway is also highly under-appreciated.

[Qrazy]

Agree with the Broadway Danny Rose affection, not so much with the Bullets.

[Sven]

Agree with the Broadway Danny Rose affection, not so much with the Bullets.

It is annoying when Allen feels the need to really spell out his themes by making his characters talk explicitly about them. The bits with the bohemian discussions with Reiner are the worst part of the picture. But I love seeing the creation of a work and how each personality contributes to its formation. Plus, it's one of his most well-acted works, and he does some fun things with the period (though it's not as resplendently evocative as Radio Days).

[baby doll]

What don't you like about the ending? I couldn't see it finish any other way.I guess my problem with the film is largely philosophical, since Allen seems to subscribe to a rather limited (and limiting) view of both life and art, in which the former is awful (represented here by the film's grim working class milieu), and the only two options for the latter are mindless escapism (associated explicitly with Hollywood) and grim social realism (associated implicitly with Europe, as the ending is basically a rip-off of Nights of Cabiria). Allen was unusually forthcoming about this view of art in a recent interview (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/15/movies/15woody.html) in which he said that he reads Russian lit "more out of obligation than enjoyment," preferring the lowbrow pleasures of beer and a football game. The idea that social conditions could be improved, or that his heroine might get more enjoyment from a realistic European movie than a Hollywood fantasy, doesn't really fit into his view of the world.

[Qrazy]

It is annoying when Allen feels the need to really spell out his themes by making his characters talk explicitly about them. The bits with the bohemian discussions with Reiner are the worst part of the picture. But I love seeing the creation of a work and how each personality contributes to its formation. Plus, it's one of his most well-acted works, and he does some fun things with the period (though it's not as resplendently evocative as Radio Days).

Yeah I really need to get on Radio Days.

[baby doll]

It is annoying when Allen feels the need to really spell out his themes by making his characters talk explicitly about them. The bits with the bohemian discussions with Reiner are the worst part of the picture. But I love seeing the creation of a work and how each personality contributes to its formation. Plus, it's one of his most well-acted works, and he does some fun things with the period (though it's not as resplendently evocative as Radio Days).It's resplendently evocative of movies from that period--particularly, two Howard Hawks pictures: Scarface and Twentieth Century. And while Allen definitely spells out the theme here, at the same time, he does a better job of keeping the story moving than in, say, Crimes and Misdemeanors.

[Sven]

It's resplendently evocative of movies from that period--particularly, two Howard Hawks pictures: Scarface and Twentieth Century. And while Allen definitely spells out the theme here, at the same time, he does a better job of keeping the story moving than in, say, Crimes and Misdemeanors.

We agree.

[Spun Lepton]

Burton's Alice in Wonderland bleeds out every bit of charm and whimsy from Lewis Carroll's story and turns it into an over-produced mish-mash of stolen ideas. Characters intermittently sane when the story needs them to be. Depp's dance number at end pretty much topped off my dislike. It saddens me it did so well at the B.O.

[Spinal]

Burton's Alice in Wonderland bleeds out every bit of charm and whimsy from Lewis Carroll's story and turns it into an over-produced mish-mash of stolen ideas. Characters intermittently sane when the story needs them to be. Depp's dance number at end pretty much topped off my dislike. It saddens me it did so well at the B.O.

#6 on the Worldwide all-time list.

[Adam]

Dunno if anybody's posted this yet, but Jafar Panahi has been officially sentenced to 6 years in prison (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6BJ4D020101220). For the next 20 years, he is forbidden to direct/write any films, leave the country or speak to the media

[StanleyK]

Landscape in the Mist was pretty disappointing.

I was on board with the kids' journey for a while, but the fact that they never even leave Greece until the very ending drained any sense of accomplishment for them. When they're almost caught by the police, I realized that I wanted them to be caught and sent home, because the confrontation with their mother would've been much more interesting. Instead, the movie is hijacked by the boring motorcycle guy, and halfway through it just awkwardly shifts gears from overly whimsical to deadly serious and humorless.

Angelopoulos' direction is impeccable, but the film is otherwise tedious and emotionally hollow.

[megladon8]

Burton's Alice in Wonderland bleeds out every bit of charm and whimsy from Lewis Carroll's story and turns it into an over-produced mish-mash of stolen ideas. Characters intermittently sane when the story needs them to be. Depp's dance number at end pretty much topped off my dislike. It saddens me it did so well at the B.O.


What saddens me even more is the Oscar buzz surrounding it.

[Henry Gale]

What saddens me even more is the Oscar buzz surrounding it.

Well, maybe for technical awards. I wouldn't confuse a strong and persistent For Your Consideration campaign on Disney's end to mean it actually has a chance for anything major. Golden Globes yes, but they also gave Depp double nominations in Best Comedy/Musical Actor along with the The Tourist.

Alice is just such a bland movie. It seems to use up all of its inspired ideas (which still aren't very memorable) after the first half hour and then seems to send itself into big-budget fantasy movie autopilot all the way into its Narnia-like battle climax. It's simply a bad movie that was marketed very well, and I say that as someone that hasn't disliked anything Burton has done since his Apes remake.

[TripZone]

Dunno if anybody's posted this yet, but Jafar Panahi has been officially sentenced to 6 years in prison (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6BJ4D020101220). For the next 20 years, he is forbidden to direct/write any films, leave the country or speak to the media

It's unbelievable. Just miserable.

[B-side]

Landscape in the Mist was pretty disappointing.

I was on board with the kids' journey for a while, but the fact that they never even leave Greece until the very ending drained any sense of accomplishment for them. When they're almost caught by the police, I realized that I wanted them to be caught and sent home, because the confrontation with their mother would've been much more interesting. Instead, the movie is hijacked by the boring motorcycle guy, and halfway through it just awkwardly shifts gears from overly whimsical to deadly serious and humorless.

Angelopoulos' direction is impeccable, but the film is otherwise tedious and emotionally hollow.

Bah.

[MadMan]

By the end of Cyrus, I felt that I had viewed a drama about relationships with comedy thrown in, so it did kind of remind me of Wes Anderson's dramadies quite a bit, minus the quirkiness. It had Jonah Hill actually being really funny for once (he had the thankless role of playing the straight man in Get Him to the Greek), as his character displayed clingy mother love feelings and displayed actions befitting of a sociopathic human being. Meanwhile you have John C. Reilly displaying his acting abilities, which due to having been in so many comedies have been utterly overlooked and forgotten by too many people. I liked the dynamic between Marisa Tomei, Hill, and Reilly, as the movie really took a hard look at relationships, although I'm not sure the movie was completely meaningful-much of what was covered felt already done, and the film took a bit too long to get going. But the cast is talented enough to make up for that, and I liked how abrrupt the ending was. Much better effort from the Duplass Brothers than Baghead was.

[B-side]

So, yeah, Uncle Boonmee is good. How good? I don't really know. I'll admit to being intermittently bored, but it evokes a very meditative calm. The first dinner scene is played so matter-of-factly it was kinda eerie.