Rogue One: A Star Wars Story (Gareth Edwards)

[Dukefrukem]

[Fezzik]

Don't want to post anything remotely spoilerish, but i think this is the best Star Wars film since 'Empire' and its not remotely close.

The third act is fucking aces.

[Henry Gale]

Kinda miraculous just how little the first act or so did for me and then how much I found myself loving it by the end.

Edwards' best movie. Where it falls under the Star Wars umbrella, I will decide later on..

The best prequel! (And I did really like III at the time.)

[Mal]

This movie made me depressed. Its great. But

more thoughts:
The editing in the beginning is a bit of a problem. It could have taken a minute or two to breathe with these characters as we get to know them a little better- understand more of their purpose in this weird take on the universe. I'm ok with not having flashbacks since this is not an origin story, but even if this was 2 1/2 hrs, it still would have been decent. Once the film gets beyond [

Show Spoiler

Galen's death

], it hits the right groove.

The action and visual scale are the only aspects that exceed The Force Awakens for me. It's a fun, risk-taking and a little messy - probably better than ROTJ.

[[ETM]]

Wow, really? This is not even better than Godzilla.

[Henry Gale]

Wow, really? This is not even better than Godzilla.

I guess I should clarify I really don't like Godzilla. Anything without Binoche, Cranston, or Watanabe is more or less dead weight for me. The stunning visual here and there is obviously great too, but.. not a fan.

I will say for the first half of Rogue One, I kept thinking about Edwards, "Man, has there ever been a director better at making incredible establishing shots, who then opts for the most boringly angled shot-reverse-shot conversations to cut to after them?" Like, some truly jaw-dropping stuff showing where you are, and then you're stuck with these drab, gray, medium close-ups carrying mostly expositional dialogue. That first scene with Luna's character looked atrocious to me.

Luckily, it turned things around from being able to bore me into such thoughts early on to genuinely thrilling me later. All weak cliches (and decidedly spoiler-y stuff) aside.

[[ETM]]

I guess I should clarify I really don't like Godzilla. Anything without Binoche, Cranston, or Watanabe is more or less dead weight for me. The stunning visual here and there is obviously great too, but.. not a fan.

I thought he did infinitely better with the large scale battle and monster action scenes. It's the same with Rogue One, except I thought the monster fights were much better than anything here. Glitzy and loaded with memberberries, sure, but kind of dumb once you think of it even for one second. I don't want to talk spoilers yet, but the... logistics of everything in the final third are completely off and strained.

[Watashi]

I... did not like this. The whole film looks fucking spectacular, but the story is a mess. The third act is indeed a lot of fun, but the tension feels so manufactured. Outside of Donnie Yen's blind assassin, I didn't have any weight into these characters and didn't really care about their fate.

Also, I had no idea what Forest Whitaker was trying to do with his performance, but it was awful. Mendelsohn was wasted. He was nowhere near menacing enough.

[Scar]

Donnie Yen was awesome.
Loved the big droid.
Giggled and cheered for Vader.

With that said, I'm not sure if I liked it or not. I'll need to see it again, preferably after a proper nights sleep.

[Dukefrukem]

Not using spoiler tags here.

[ETM]'s post yesterday I thought was really off the mark. This was wonderful in almost all aspects. It's better than Godzilla by a large margin. It's better than Force Awakens. It's better than all of the prequels. It's on Jedi level for me. (more on that later) It's very obvious this is a darker take on Star Wars. There's no witty banter. There's no back and forth on ANY level. But maybe that is apt for the time period of Star Wars? The Empire is growing and what's left of the Republic is desperately trying to survive. Trying to piece together information of impending doom. Then the Rebels actually witness a test fire of the weapon and all hope is lost. Or is it? The second half of movie revolving around hope is perfect for this plot. We see it from the speech Jyn Erso gives at the Rebel base. And we get it as the final word spoken in the movie from Princess Leia. Love it.

The fan service stuff isn't shoehorned. The view from inside the Rebel base on Yavin IV. The guy in the tower. The Death Star plans from the 1979. The Death Star technicians. Bail Organa. Mon Mothma, 3PO and R2D2. Tarkin. "You may fire when ready" (BTW, I made that the poll option before I knew that line would be in the movie)

This film has three villains. Vadar. Tarkin. and Orson Krennic perfectly paced, all used where they were needed. It really gives the film a sense of dread. In fact, Vadar is probably in his most menacing role in the entire series. Super threatening. And boy that finale. Wow.

Why is this on par with Jedi? Oh man. I loved the fucking ensemble "journey" aspect. It reeked of Jedi. One group is needed to infiltrate the Scarif to get the plans. (Btw, LOL @ storing the plans on hard media that needs to be accessed by a tape deck.. I mean, you have ships faster than light speed and your'e using HDDs?? or whatever?) You have one group holding down the ship in order to broadcast the plans. And then you have a super satisfying space battle / dog fights above the shield. (I know I know another "we gotta take down the shield generator" fight... but it's fine). The RotJedi space battle is some of my favorite Star Wars and I you can tell Edwards wanted to replicate a little bit of that.

Where it's off the mark: The editing and score. The score is totally distracting. Aside from a few "Empire" themes it was very obvious this was not John Williams. And the editing. Jeesh. Too many cuts. Too quickly going back and forth between the groups tasks. Let the scenes play out a bit more.

I want Edwards to do another Star Wars. He gets it. He understands scale better than any director I've seen. The attention to detail in the cities and on the beach and around every stage was wonderful.

Side Notes:

1. The CGI Tarkin and Leia were a little bit distracting and unfinished. Not sure what was going on there. But for some reason CGI Schwarzenegger and CGI Michael Douglass looked so much better.

2. The ending does not perfectly align with the beginning of A New Hope.
"Darth Vader. Only you could be so bold. The Imperial Senate will not sit still for this. When they hear you've attacked a diplomatic..."
Darth Vader: Don't act so surprised, Your Highness. You weren't on any mercy mission this time. Several transmissions were beamed to this ship by rebel spies. I want to know what happened to the plans they sent you."
"I don't know what you're talking about. I am a member of the Imperial Senate on a diplomatic mission to Alderaan"
Darth Vader: "Oh really bitch? I didn't just board your rebel ship and see you take off? I believe it was your people that attacked our space station. Were you going to Alderaan afterwards? TAKE HER AWAY"

3. Needed more Donnie Yen

4. Needed much more Forest Whitaker.

5.

1. Jedi
2. Empire & Rogue
4. Hope
5. Force Awakens
6. Phantom
7. Revenge
8. Clones

[Mal]

(Btw, LOL @ storing the plans on hard media that needs to be accessed by a tape deck.. I mean, you have ships faster than light speed and your'e using HDDs?? or whatever?)

lmao I work in IT sales... there's a saying that goes in the backup industry... "tape will never die" - and I was seriously amazed at the tape library size

[Dukefrukem]

lmao I work in IT sales... there's a saying that goes in the backup industry... "tape will never die" - and I was seriously amazed at the tape library size

This is actually quite true. The reason for this is because the cost to store something on tape could be 1000x cheaper than to store something on a more modern connected cloud hardware (electricity, space in a data center, cooling etc)- Why would the Empire store something on tape? To save cost? Probably not when you're building a space station that can blow up a planet.



I convinced myself it's more likely it's stored on a system that is not connected to the central computer- thus making it vulnerable to hacking. Still, that doesn't explain the joystick prize picker mechanic to retrieve the tape/HDD.

[Mal]

I convinced myself it's more likely it's stored on a system that is not connected to the central computer- thus making it vulnerable to hacking. Still, that doesn't explain the joystick prize picker mechanic to retrieve the tape/HDD.

well in a galaxy far, far away... they keep it old school.

[Dukefrukem]

Odds we see a CGIed younger Han Solo / Luke / Leia? (in the same vein as Terminator / Tron / Ant-Man)

100%

"This is a rebellion isn't it? I rebel."

I actually rolled my eyes at that one.

I hope it's just poorly cut together.

Happy this line was not in the film.

Fuck it, let's do this. What should we bet on that Luke is not related to Rey at all?

$100

[Dukefrukem]

Couple of other scenes that were in the trailer and NOT in the movie. Intentional?

[

Show Spoiler

]

[Wryan]

I had a good bit of fun. The relationship between Rey and Finn was better than just about anything in this movie character-wise, but it has its strengths. Was rather shocked with Tarkin's wide use. Thought his effects were successful enough, especially compared to good-god-what's-happening-with-Leia. The score was not a raging triumph. It felt like a middle school band trying to ape Star Wars after watching it once or twice. "This is what it sounds like, right? Like Baaaaaa-DUM-bum-boop-beeeeeee-zzzzzzzz-chunk...yeah?"

Mostly I'm looking forward to more universe storytelling. I'm sure there's just incredible opportunities for some good tales waiting to be told and realized. Hopefully they continue to get a little more daring with each entry.

EDIT: The guy doing Tarkin did a creditable job.

[TGM]

I know this isn't going to be a popular opinion at all, but I thought this movie sucked. Spoilers variously abound, though I'll try to tag most of them.

Structurally, this movie is clumsy as hell, particularly at the beginning as it's trying to introduce us to the characters we'll be following, and just sorta bombards us in the clunkiest way imaginable with a shitload of information and poorly developed characters all at once, never really taking the time to really give us a feel for either them or their situation. Like, the first half of this movie was just jarringly executed, and the only other movie this year to do an even worse job of executing this aspect was Suicide Squad. And again near the end, when it just becomes a full blown war film, outside of a handful of neat split-second shots, the action just becomes a mind numbing chore to sit through, and was quite frankly generic and boring as hell.

Speaking on characters though, this movie suddenly gives me a huge appreciate for Abrams' character work in The Force Awakens, because my god, there are no characters in this movie. Just a collection of one-note cardboard cutouts. After Force Awakens, I felt like I knew the new cast inside and out. I know who Rey is, despite all the mystery surrounding her. I know Finn on a deeper level, and have a great grasp on his personality and who he is as a person, and the struggles that brought him there. I can understand Kylo Ren, even if I can't directly relate to his dilemma. Here though? I don't know shit about any of these characters. Hell, I don't even remember any of their fucking names! And this is a fucking Star Wars movie, how do you make characters so unremarkable that even their names don't stick with you?

There comes a point near the end when Robot turns to Main Female Protagonist and tells her that her actions never cease to amaze him. And all I could think was, what do you mean? Why wouldn't you be surprised by what she does? After all, she only ever acts however the plot explicitly requires her to at any given moment, and in the most lifeless and blandest manner at that. She doesn't have a fucking character in order to be able to get a grasp on her personality and what she may or may not do at any given moment. She has a backstory, sure, but none of that clumsy exposition matters in the least if the current version of this character we're following in the movie fails to ever actually truly come to life on the screen.

It's like the movie is populated entirely by Aaron Taylor-Johnson's character from Godzilla, who was bland and lifeless and nobody really liked. Now take him, and expand that to our whole cast, and that's what we have left. But hell, at least that movie had Bryan Cranston, as brief as his time may have been. Rogue One really coulda done with a whole lot more Bryan Cranstons running around.

So needless to say, [

Show Spoiler

once they all begin to die one by one at the end, I didn't feel a god damn thing for any of it. In fact, it reached a point where, by the time Big Gun Shooter Guy kicked the bucket, I was literally rolling my eyes.

] This movie was so desperate to tug at our heart strings, yet forgot to give us a god damn reason along the way to give a fucking shit about any of it, so really, the only thing I was even feeling this entire time was boredom and annoyance.

But even beyond just the characters, I just overall found myself struggling to find any reason to give a damn about this movie. Like, why did we need this? It feels like filler. Like, why did this story have to be presented in this manner? A comic or a novel or a video game would have more than sufficed. A movie, though? This just feels needlessly excessive, and doesn't give me any greater appreciation for the Star Wars lore or canon than I already had going into it. It feels pointless, basically, and it didn't have to, if, as I said, they actually included a reason for us to give a damn about a single thing happening.

[

Show Spoiler

Also, and there may be a legit answer to this, but did anyone else find it curious how the Death Star's weakness was explicitly built into it, yet the Starkiller Base in Episode VII was able to be taken out in a fairly similar manner and pretty much just as easily as well? Soooo... did the engineers who built Starkiller Base just especially suck at their jobs, seeing as how it now turns out the Death Star wasn't supposed to be nearly so vulnerable? Mind you, Episode VII just came out last year, and yet they decided to bring this revelation regarding the Death Star's weakness to light for us only a year later.

]

[

Show Spoiler

Also, I guess Interstellar is the next Nolan flick we're gonna borrow visually from in Hollywood? Cause the slow-motion exploding planet scene was so ripped straight out of the mountain-sized waves scene in Interstellar. The only difference being, why the hell was the planet exploding in slow-motion anyways? Hell, when they're back in space aboard the ship and Main Protagonist Female is questioned by Main Protagonist Male why she didn't take her father's message with her, she says it's because "everything happened so fast", and I was like, uh, no, it literally didn't though. That was just a bizarre choice to go with, especially since they repeat it later in the movie. I mean, planet-sized explosions have always been pretty instantaneous in this universe up to this point, so this especially stood out as bizarre and out of place here.

]

I will say this, at least it wasn't as obnoxious as The Force Awakens as it regards the callbacks, but the few that were still in there were still very groan-inducing.

If I were to point out things that I liked, I guess the direct lead-in to Episode IV was kinda cool, and [

Show Spoiler

the last shot of Main Protagonist Female and Main Protagonist Male on the beach being engulfed by the slow-motion explosion was pretty.

] But honestly, I got nothing else out of this movie. It feels like an empty void of a movie, something desperate to be a moving spectacle of a motion picture, yet it's completely devoid of any of the proper ingredients that actually make such a movie genuinely stirring.

But I dunno, I'm not even sure where the blame lies for why this movie didn't work at all, whether it was because it was just poorly written, or if perhaps a better director could have executed this whole thing better, or if the re-shoots had anything to do with it. But whatever it was, as is often the case when we hear news of studios interfering to re-shoot a lot of the film, there was a pretty big mess left behind, and it absolutely showed. Flat out, this is the worst Star Wars movie I've seen so far.

[Dukefrukem]

I know this isn't going to be a popular opinion at all, but I thought this movie sucked. Spoilers variously abound, though I'll try to tag most of them.

Structurally, this movie is clumsy as hell, particularly at the beginning as it's trying to introduce us to the characters we'll be following, and just sorta bombards us in the clunkiest way imaginable with a shitload of information and poorly developed characters all at once, never really taking the time to really give us a feel for either them or their situation. Like, the first half of this movie was just jarringly executed, and the only other movie this year to do an even worse job of executing this aspect was Suicide Squad. And again near the end, when it just becomes a full blown war film, outside of a handful of neat split-second shots, the action just becomes a mind numbing chore to sit through, and was quite frankly generic and boring as hell.

Speaking on characters though, this movie suddenly gives me a huge appreciate for Abrams' character work in The Force Awakens, because my god, there are no characters in this movie. Just a collection of one-note cardboard cutouts. After Force Awakens, I felt like I knew the new cast inside and out. I know who Rey is, despite all the mystery surrounding her. I know Finn on a deeper level, and have a great grasp on his personality and who he is as a person, and the struggles that brought him there. I can understand Kylo Ren, even if I can't directly relate to his dilemma. Here though? I don't know shit about any of these characters. Hell, I don't even remember any of their fucking names! And this is a fucking Star Wars movie, how do you make characters so unremarkable that even their names don't stick with you?

There comes a point near the end when Robot turns to Main Female Protagonist and tells her that her actions never cease to amaze him. And all I could think was, what do you mean? Why wouldn't you be surprised by what she does? After all, she only ever acts however the plot explicitly requires her to at any given moment, and in the most lifeless and blandest manner at that. She doesn't have a fucking character in order to be able to get a grasp on her personality and what she may or may not do at any given moment. She has a backstory, sure, but none of that clumsy exposition matters in the least if the current version of this character we're following in the movie fails to ever actually truly come to life on the screen.

It's like the movie is populated entirely by Aaron Taylor-Johnson's character from Godzilla, who was bland and lifeless and nobody really liked. Now take him, and expand that to our whole cast, and that's what we have left. But hell, at least that movie had Bryan Cranston, as brief as his time may have been. Rogue One really coulda done with a whole lot more Bryan Cranstons running around.

So needless to say, [

Show Spoiler

once they all begin to die one by one at the end, I didn't feel a god damn thing for any of it. In fact, it reached a point where, by the time Big Gun Shooter Guy kicked the bucket, I was literally rolling my eyes.

] This movie was so desperate to tug at our heart strings, yet forgot to give us a god damn reason along the way to give a fucking shit about any of it, so really, the only thing I was even feeling this entire time was boredom and annoyance.

But even beyond just the characters, I just overall found myself struggling to find any reason to give a damn about this movie. Like, why did we need this? It feels like filler. Like, why did this story have to be presented in this manner? A comic or a novel or a video game would have more than sufficed. A movie, though? This just feels needlessly excessive, and doesn't give me any greater appreciation for the Star Wars lore or canon than I already had going into it. It feels pointless, basically, and it didn't have to, if, as I said, they actually included a reason for us to give a damn about a single thing happening.

I dont disagree that there were character development issues with the movie- but it's a prequel to a movie that makes it pretty obvious [

Show Spoiler

they were all going to die anyway.

] I think that takes away from the impact of impending doom. In other words, the depth of the characters isn't necessarily critical to the plot as say, a three movie trilogy. In fact, I'd argue that characters all played off a dark and dismal time period. Donnie Yen is the shinning example of positivity where others act as if the glass is half empty.

And aside from Rey and Fin in the Force Awakens, you were THAT impressed with what Abrams did with say... Poe? Or Kylo Ren? or Maz Kanata? They were all terrible;y developed.

[

Show Spoiler

Also, and there may be a legit answer to this, but did anyone else find it curious how the Death Star's weakness was explicitly built into it, yet the Starkiller Base in Episode VII was able to be taken out in a fairly similar manner and pretty much just as easily as well? Soooo... did the engineers who built Starkiller Base just especially suck at their jobs, seeing as how it now turns out the Death Star wasn't supposed to be nearly so vulnerable? Mind you, Episode VII just came out last year, and yet they decided to bring this revelation regarding the Death Star's weakness to light for us only a year later.

]

This is just adding to how poorly thought out of a movie Force Awakens is. Everything surrounding Starkiller Base is dumb and unnecessary to the plot.

[

Show Spoiler

Also, I guess Interstellar is the next Nolan flick we're gonna borrow visually from in Hollywood? Cause the slow-motion exploding planet scene was so ripped straight out of the mountain-sized waves scene in Interstellar. The only difference being, why the hell was the planet exploding in slow-motion anyways? Hell, when they're back in space aboard the ship and Main Protagonist Female is questioned by Main Protagonist Male why she didn't take her father's message with her, she says it's because "everything happened so fast", and I was like, uh, no, it literally didn't though. That was just a bizarre choice to go with, especially since they repeat it later in the movie. I mean, planet-sized explosions have always been pretty instantaneous in this universe up to this point, so this especially stood out as bizarre and out of place here.

]

Pretty sure that was just the wave approaching from miles and miles away. Same deal with the mushroom cloud at the very end which you liked.

I will say this, at least it wasn't as obnoxious as The Force Awakens as it regards the callbacks, but the few that were still in there were still very groan-inducing.

Which ones specifically? I thought they were all very tame with the exception of maybe R2 and 3PO which i told myself were only in the movie so they could continue to say they are the only characters who appear in every Star Wars movie.

[TGM]

I dont disagree that there were character development issues with the movie- but it's a prequel to a movie that makes it pretty obvious [

Show Spoiler

they were all going to die anyway.

] I think that takes away from the impact of impending doom. In other words, the depth of the characters isn't necessarily critical to the plot as say, a three movie trilogy. In fact, I'd argue that characters all played off a dark and dismal time period. Donnie Yen is the shinning example of positivity where others act as if the glass is half empty.

It's almost fitting that Donnie Yen's character (note how we keep referring to him by the actor's name and not the character's name) repeats the same thing over and over again, because that's pretty much all any of these characters are. They're all one-note tropes, with not a lick of depth to them. So, even going in [

Show Spoiler

knowing they're all gonna die

], I still need a reason to actually care about those pivotal moments once they occur in the movie. Otherwise, what's the point? To show their united sacrifice? But what does that sacrifice mean if I don't actually feel anything about it?

I get that the movie was going for a darker and more dour tone, but you can still do that while presenting genuinely compelling characters that I grow to care about, and this movie completely failed in that regard. You say that the depth of characters isn't as pivotal to the plot, except that the plot itself is pretty paper thin, and presenting us with a ensemble of characters who we could actually latch onto would not only make that fact more forgivable, but make us actually care about their paper thin mission of a plot. Instead, the lack of character depth makes the paper thin plot all the more obvious, and makes the whole ordeal feel all the more pointless of a movie.

And aside from Rey and Fin in the Force Awakens, you were THAT impressed with what Abrams did with say... Poe? Or Kylo Ren? or Maz Kanata? They were all terrible;y developed.

The thing about Joe is that, while he doesn't have a lot of screen time, he still left a lasting and memorable impression regardless, and that really comes down to the charm and charisma of the way his character was played, not too dissimilar from how Harrison Ford originally portrayed Han Solo. And as for Kylo Ren, sure, there's things about his character that I think are a bit questionable, particularly his motivations, which don't make a whole lotta sense. However, his unique stance in this universe makes him particularly interesting, and an example of a character who I'm very interested in learning more about. WHY did he become this way, and what direction will his character arc take? His misguidance is genuinely intriguing, and it leaves me with plenty to think about after the movie's over.

I'll give you Maz Katana, sure. She was meh, but she also wasn't exactly part of the main cast, either. The whole main roster delivered in that movie, where as that very much wasn't the case at all in Rogue One. But point being, at the time, aside from Rey and Finn, I wouldn't say I was particularly impressed with Abrams' work, no. However, looking at Rogue One as a comparison, then yeah, it just makes me appreciate his work on that movie all the more. As I said, it's been a year since I've seen The Force Awakens, and I can still fondly recall Rey, Finn, Poe, Kylo Ren, etc. Yet, not even 24 hours since watching Rogue One, I sincerely can't even remember a single character's name.

Pretty sure that was just the wave approaching from miles and miles away. Same deal with the mushroom cloud at the very end which you liked.

Well no, even when they were flying away and it was directly over them, it was still moving in slow motion. And as to that last shot, I just thought the shot itself was a particularly beautiful shot. The effect in question was still just as stupid in that scene, though.

Which ones specifically? I thought they were all very tame with the exception of maybe R2 and 3PO which i told myself were only in the movie so they could continue to say they are the only characters who appear in every Star Wars movie.

Some of them were nods in dialogue, which I admittedly can't even recall at the moment, but stood out at the time. But otherwise, the two from the cantina on Tatooine randomly running into our gang stands out to me, which, in hindsight, doesn't make too much sense for them to be there, seeing as they weren't on Tatooine in that scene, and later on that same day, that planet got destroyed, while meanwhile, in A New Hope, what, a day later? They're in the cantina there. I guess they also just happened to hop off that planet just in time, too.

[Dukefrukem]

It's almost fitting that Donnie Yen's character (note how we keep referring to him by the actor's name and not the character's name) repeats the same thing over and over again, because that's pretty much all any of these characters are. They're all one-note tropes, with not a lick of depth to them. So, even going in [

Show Spoiler

knowing they're all gonna die

], I still need a reason to actually care about those pivotal moments once they occur in the movie. Otherwise, what's the point? To show their united sacrifice? But what does that sacrifice mean if I don't actually feel anything about it?

What tropes?

The thing about Joe is that, while he doesn't have a lot of screen time, he still left a lasting and memorable impression regardless, and that really comes down to the charm and charisma of the way his character was played, not too dissimilar from how Harrison Ford originally portrayed Han Solo. And as for Kylo Ren, sure, there's things about his character that I think are a bit questionable, particularly his motivations, which don't make a whole lotta sense. However, his unique stance in this universe makes him particularly interesting, and an example of a character who I'm very interested in learning more about. WHY did he become this way, and what direction will his character arc take? His misguidance is genuinely intriguing, and it leaves me with plenty to think about after the movie's over.

Stick anyone in Poe's character and the movie is exactly same. We didn't care about him. How about Gwendoline Christie? What a waste of a casting.

Well no, even when they were flying away and it was directly over them, it was still moving in slow motion. And as to that last shot, I just thought the shot itself was a particularly beautiful shot. The effect in question was still just as stupid in that scene, though.

Not really.

Some of them were nods in dialogue, which I admittedly can't even recall at the moment, but stood out at the time. But otherwise, the two from the cantina on Tatooine randomly running into our gang stands out to me, which, in hindsight, doesn't make too much sense for them to be there, seeing as they weren't on Tatooine in that scene, and later on that same day, that planet got destroyed, while meanwhile, in A New Hope, what, a day later? They're in the cantina there. I guess they also just happened to hop off that planet just in time, too.

Ha. I forgot about them. Super subtle though.

[TGM]

What tropes?

Maybe I'm using the wrong word or misusing the word, but basically, they all had their one cliche characteristic, and that was it. The all serious all the time gunner, the grumpy male protagonist, the quirky technician, the peaceful blind man who can take everyone out despite his limitations, etc. And that was all there was to each character, it really didn't go anything beyond just their one specific characteristic of choice. They didn't feel like three-dimension people, they felt like lifeless chess pieces who each had their specific role to play.

Stick anyone in Poe's character and the movie is exactly same. We didn't care about him. How about Gwendoline Christie? What a waste of a casting.

I'm not even gonna disagree with you here. I'm not going to try and present an argument that Poe was a super deep and well written character. That said, Oscar Isaac took a character who didn't really have a whole lot going on with him on the page and did a hell of a lot with him purely on a performance level, hence them re-writing his role late in the game to bring him back near the end. And he's become somewhat of a fan favorite, so I'll be interested to see how they do flesh out his character in future movies.

And yes, Gwendoline Christie was wasted. Hell, I'm not even sure if she's supposed to be confirmed dead or not, to see if she'll also have a chance to return and redeem herself later on. But as it stands now, I agree with you here.

My main point was in regards to our main cast we follow, though, Rey, Finn, and Kylo Ren, who all were extremely well handled, and felt like fully fleshed out three dimension characters who we could really connect to. And that's precisely what Rogue One was missing. Even if only the main two protagonists filled this role, that could've been enough to suffice, but we didn't even get that much.

Not really.

I dunno, I see your gif there (though it's loading a bit choppy for me atm), but yet I still recall it still looking like it was moving in slow-mo during the actual movie. *shrug*

[Morris Schæffer]

Assorted thoughts (spoilers):



- I liked the movie a lot, the sheer sense of spectacle won me over. This was my first IMAX 3D screening with Dolby Atmos to boot and it was sort of revelatory. Never knew I could have 3D with a stunningly bright screen at the same time. Right before the movie started I realized that the whole IMAX screen wasn't going to be used since Rogue One probably wasn't filmed like that, but nevertheless the size of the screen + bright 3D kicked ass. Purely on a visual level, one of the most immersive experiences I've had in quite some time despite the 75 minute drive to Brussels. It would appear I have found my movie screen for Avatar 2,3 and 4.

- CGI characters very weird. Duke made the comparison to Schwarzenegger, but those were dimly-lit scenes from what I recall with the T-800 emoting even less than Steven Seagal which possibly reduced uncanny valley. Cushing was front and center, sneering, the face was very detailed, but again, bad choice methinks. Why not stick with face seen in the window reflection instead? I mean, the voice is already there as well so having the face reflected in the window is a very nice touch and leaves no doubt it's Tarkin. Would be cool if 4D allowed us to smell his foul stench. Or perhaps not. CGI Leia was a very brief scene, but bad choice as well. How bout the doors zoom open and we simply see her from behind, fade to black? Anything but this full frontal close-up. Still, 1977 CGI Leia looked more real than 2015 real Leia.

- Damu has said a few posts above that Edwards "demonstrates an incredible sense of scale and tactility. I loved that the space battle is resolved by treating the spaceships as objects instead of laser-shooters. One spaceship pushes another one, which collides into another, which collapses onto the shield."

This was a really cool sequence, but can we say the same about the AT-AT walkers? The scale was there and they looked fearsome in IMAX 3D except they were cannon fodder period. Remember how they were taken down in Empire Strikes Back? First by tow cable, then by Luke using a sort of graple hook, so ingenious, turning these hulking beasts into sort of mini movies within the movie itself. And that was needed too because 1980 Luke says they're too strong for their lasers and they need to use harpoons instead. These thing brake in half like they're literally melting apart. So either the AT-AT's have gotten more advanced or X-Wings are more advanced than snow speeders at taking these hulks down. And if we're talking about a general lack of hopelesness and opposition during the final 30 minutes, then perhaps this is why. Shit blows up all too easily. The sort of shit that really should put up a bigger fight. They're like the Raiders of the Lost Ark swordsman.

- So yeah, main characters die, which is in line with the sort of movie it is, and which I did appreciate, but I don't think I'm gonna equate that with this mission being soaked in misery and "it-couldn't-possibly-succeed" veneer which they kinda say it is when Jynn meets Andor's rag tag team of Cosmic Dirty Dozen. It's definitely more climactic than the final mission in The Force Awakens if not quite Saving Private Ryan's levels. Chirrut walking casually up to that big old lever which seems to scream "PULL ME!!!" while mumbling something about the Force (again!) was sort of indicative of that. It's facile and means the writers can foregoe the need to actually craft something genuinely thrilling and moving involving the need for a lever to be pulled. At least K-2SO, who is Rogue One's Boromir, took it like a man in a great scene. When his eyes extinguish I knew I had found the most powerful scene in the entire movie. Not sure that is really praise with so many humans in it too.

- This movie moves too fast and is a bit too noisy. The score especially is incessant. What happened to introspection, what happened to quietly engaging talky scenes in the Star Wars universe? Remember that scene in Saving Private Ryan in the church when they're just reminiscing about folks with bombs going off in the distant horizon? That creates camaraderie, familiarity, chemistry between players. Rogue One moves blindingly fast. Do they not trust moviegoers to stay awake during a Star Wars movie? Is that the difference between a 145 and a 150 million opening weekend? It is possibly just a little too action-packed for my tastes.

[Spinal]

This was actually pretty darn good. I liked it more than Force Awakens. I liked the tight focus on a single objective. I liked that it was a film about sacrifice and that is was willing to show us the consequences of defiance in the face of growing evil. I loved Felicity Jones in the lead role. Whereas Daisy Ridley's character often felt like a franchise trying a little too hard to make up for the deficiencies of past female characters, Jyn felt authentic and lived-in. What a wonderful, captivating face Jones has. The film even has a comic relief droid character that is actually funny!

I thought Forest Whitaker and Donnie Yen characters were weak points, although not necessarily due to the performances.

It's funny how you can tell that there's someone different in the Vader suit, even when he's just walking. But boy, that scene towards the end of the film was awfully cool. It elevated our understanding of the character, whereas the prequel films did precisely the opposite.

I may be willing to get on board with Fezzik's declaration that this is the best of the series since Empire.

[Peng]

The longer I let this film sink in, the more I like it, huge flaws and all. If this has a more stable first half, and has managed the same character build-up and identification of The Force Awakens, we might be looking at one of the best Star Wars entries ever.

Gareth Edwards' sense of scale and spectacle from a ground-level human of point of view are still as awe-inspiring as in Godzilla, but since this has no giant monster(s) as the increasing focus, his lack of skill in characters are more apparent. The first half is simultaneously rushed in events and sluggish in feel, as the attempts to pile on a lot of exposition, while hurriedly introduce so many characters without sufficiently establishing their humanity or inner life, fail to make all this truly involving.

Once the group becomes part of a larger whole (both in term of plot mechanics and among battle cinematography) though, whoo boy. Again, if this has managed the same character identification as in TFA (which makes me still prefer that one), I would have been a mess during certain sections in the final battle. The combination of breathless ferocity of the fighting, its sense of immense scale both on ground level and high above, and a growing feeling of heart-in-throat doom is really quite something. Hyperbole incoming, but it might be one of the best endings ever to a Star Wars film, on par and possibly even exceeding The Empire Strikes Back and Revenge of the Sith.

And maybe even the most touching as well. I might give the film a look again because the ending is the kind that reverberates positively back on the whole film, and might make me even more receptive on rewatch. The narrative initially taking the characters too rushed and only through their tasks turns me off, but in the second half I've come to appreciate how dogged and determined they are, realizing but wholeheartedly embracing being small cogs for the next step in the grand scheme of things. It's one of the main touches that make the climatic battle so satisfying, and that carries into the epilogue as well. One battle may be done, but the fight is still not over yet, and another scramble for the next blow against the enemy is just around the corner. That desperate but determined gesture of trying the damnedest to pass on the hope to fight, in the face of formidable evil, really moves me. 7.5/10

[Peng]

Ranking:

1. The Empire Stirkes Back
2. A New Hope
3. Revenge of the Sith
4. The Force Awakens
5. Rogue One
6. Return of the Jedi
7. The Phantom Menace
8. Attack of the Clones