The Comic Book Discussion Thread

[Sven]

also, another image title that's gonna have a perfect jumping on point soon is haunt. kirkman, mcfarlane, et al. have left the book and joe casey and nathan fox are gonna be the new creative team

Sometime between 2005 and 2006, I'm convinced that Casey must've taken some really excellent acid, because while he's been great in the past, nearly everything from the last five or six years has been a revelation. You can see the change happen halfway through his GI Joe Elite series.

[megladon8]

Any particularly strong Casey recommendations, Sven?

[Sven]

Any particularly strong Casey recommendations, Sven?

My favorites are listed on my 51 list, but right now he's up to issue 2 on a new miniseries called Vengeance, which you should pick up. Also I really liked the Final Crisis series he did Dance, although the artwork is blerghy. Also, there's an incredible one-shot he did with Chris Burnham called Officer Downe (http://wednesdaysheroes.com/friday-favorites-officer-downe/). Seek it out. You will not be disappointed.

[Acapelli]

vengeance is great. i love it

[Sven]

vengeance is great. i love it

One of those rare artifacts that is, so far, completely unpredictable.

[number8]

Indeed. I had no idea what to expect when I picked it up, and was left even more lost, but intrigued, when I finished #1.

[Sven]

Current read: Daredevil, the Man Without Fear. Miller/Romita Jr. So good. I'm telling ya, Miller is one of the best. It's easy to focus on the negative, but for parsing thought and action and joining them in dramatic, dynamic sequence, I don't know if there's a better comics writer out there.

[ledfloyd]

All of those ABC characters are so underrated. People rave about LoEG and Promethea (deservedly so), but man, Top 10, Tom Strong, Jack B. Quick, Terra Obscura, Cobweb, Greyshirt were all so great.
the more i read from ABC the more i think it's the best period in moore's career (yes, better than the 80s). promethea and league are both masterpieces, top 10 was exceptionally solid and tom strong isn't looking to be any different. i guess i should check out tomorrow stories next.

the only major moore works i have left are swamp thing, 1963 and supreme.

[ledfloyd]

Current read: Daredevil, the Man Without Fear. Miller/Romita Jr. So good. I'm telling ya, Miller is one of the best. It's easy to focus on the negative, but for parsing thought and action and joining them in dramatic, dynamic sequence, I don't know if there's a better comics writer out there.
i think that's the last great thing he did. not to say i haven't been able to find enjoyment in his work since then, i just think it's of a far lower caliber than the batman/daredevil stuff he was doing in the late 80s/early 90s.

[number8]

the more i read from ABC the more i think it's the best period in moore's career (yes, better than the 80s). promethea and league are both masterpieces, top 10 was exceptionally solid and tom strong isn't looking to be any different. i guess i should check out tomorrow stories next.

the only major moore works i have left are swamp thing, 1963 and supreme.

Supreme is definitely up there. One of my favorites of his. It shares some themes with his Miracleman, but I prefer Supreme because its metafiction is much more vast than Miracleman's deconstruction.

[megladon8]

Is there much of a chance of "Supreme" getting a re-printing sometime (soon)?


Just read Jonathan Hickman's "Red Mass For Mars".

Without any hyperbole, I think it's one of the best things I've ever read.

Hickman's words Bodenheim's images are a stunning combination.

[ledfloyd]

Supreme is definitely up there. One of my favorites of his. It shares some themes with his Miracleman, but I prefer Supreme because its metafiction is much more vast than Miracleman's deconstruction.
i admire miracleman but it feels like embryonic alan moore. it covers a lot of the same themes as watchmen but in a far less formally interesting and consistent way. the birthing issue is really something though.

[number8]

i admire miracleman but it feels like embryonic alan moore. it covers a lot of the same themes as watchmen but in a far less formally interesting and consistent way. the birthing issue is really something though.

Sure. At the time, though, I'm sure it was incredibly fresh. It's just that now that realistic violence and superhero deconstruction have become the norm in mainstream comics, it feels less special.

[megladon8]

Can't get "Red Mass for Mars" out of my head.

What an incredible work.

[Sven]

What an incredible work.

I feel responsible for this. :) Always happy to spread awareness, even as far behind as I am.

[number8]

Heads up, Morrison fans. The new WE3 hardcover that came out today is a "director's cut" version with 10 extra pages previously unpublished.

Guessss what I'mmm buyiiinggg after wooork.

[megladon8]

I feel responsible for this. :) Always happy to spread awareness, even as far behind as I am.


Well you are definitely responsible :)

I am going to read "Pax Romana" tonight.

[number8]

God, I love We3.

[Sven]

God, I love We3.

Yup, got it yesterday. It has turned into my Ran, a film that I have purchased four times now.

[number8]

Yup, got it yesterday. It has turned into my Ran, a film that I have purchased four times now.

I wish they'd stuck to the original plan of re-releasing it on Absolute, though. I don't know why they scaled it down to Deluxe size, but I reaaaaally wanted this art to be oversized. Oh well.

[number8]

Snyder vomited this out on his Twitter last night:


I love how badass Bruce is. There are all these moments in the cowl when he’s flat out scary as fuck. Silent moments too, moments when Dick would’ve said something confrontational or even darkly witty. Bruce has this intimidation factor that you can feel. Not that he doesn’t have some good one-liners, especially in narration. It’s just very exciting to feel how different they are, but the idea is that whether Bruce has been Batman for 5 years 20 years or a hundred years, Gotham is a city that dates back to colonial days. It’s much much older. And so what if it really hasn’t even been paying attention to him. What if just now, it turns this big stone eye to him, and decides it’s time to crush him and the bat-family once and for all? What if Gotham doesn’t belong to the bat? What if -maybe- it belongs to something else? And has for a long time. It’s like our Long Halloween or Hush. And I promise there’ll be big revelations about the history of the Wayne family, the Grayson family things hidden in the architecture of Gotham, the history… I’m really excited about it. Hope you all will tell me what you think! Because for me, that’s one of Bruce’s big achilles heels in some ways. His confidence in his knowledge of the city. There couldn’t be something big & dark he doesn’t know about, because he’s him. but if there were… hidden, it’d sure be a battle for him (in all ways), as though it were a weakness. Go for the throat, attack the thing you love the most about them. With Dick, in TEC, it was his optimism, his sense of empathy, compassion, his relationships with allies. The city tries to convince him that is a weakness. If he’s going to survive, he needs to fight to disprove that with everything he’s got. For Bruce, here, for me, what I love most is his confidence. He’s one of the few superheroes with resources, not powers. He’s got something that coudl actually be put to good use, bestowed on others. But he chooses to do this crazy, pathological, wonderful thing. It’s all he has, being the guardian of Gotham. The best there is. So what if the city he depends on -it’s always given him the demons he’s asked for, right? – suddenly reveals itself as a stranger.

[Sven]

Ooooooo, intriguing.

Thirdmango is asleep on my couch, so I used this slow morning of waiting for his rising to re-read We3. Loved it all over again. Am I wrong in recognizing the woman doctor's scene in her apartment with her parrot as the only new stuff? A nice scene, and it means something, but it doesn't seem revelatory enough to use as a marketing draw...

[megladon8]

Are the hardcover and softcover of the new "We3" edition both the same?

I'll probably get the softcover, because it's half the price and comes out first.

[Sven]

Are the hardcover and softcover of the new "We3" edition both the same?

I'll probably get the softcover, because it's half the price and comes out first.

I am not aware of a paperback version of the deluxe edition, but I am also not abreast of the book market in Canada. The hardcover deluxe version has a few more pages and supplemental material in the back, including some awesome concept sketches from Quitely.

[megladon8]

I am not aware of a paperback version of the deluxe edition, but I am also not abreast of the book market in Canada. The hardcover deluxe version has a few more pages and supplemental material in the back, including some awesome concept sketches from Quitely.


Amazon.ca has the hardcover and softcover both listed at 144 pages.

But the softcover is $17.55 and released on the 23rd, whereas the hardcover is $30.81 and released on the 26th.

[number8]

Ooooooo, intriguing.

Thirdmango is asleep on my couch, so I used this slow morning of waiting for his rising to re-read We3. Loved it all over again. Am I wrong in recognizing the woman doctor's scene in her apartment with her parrot as the only new stuff? A nice scene, and it means something, but it doesn't seem revelatory enough to use as a marketing draw...

The rabbit's fight with the rhino is like 4 pages longer.

[megladon8]

Read half of "Pax Romana" last night and it was quite good.

I'm thinking Hickman was a lot of surprises in store for the second half.

[megladon8]

"Pax Romana" was good, if a little predictable. The overall concept is something that's not really new to me, so a lot of it rested on Hickman's execution of the ideas, which was fresh, original and interesting throughout.

I know it seems to be the unpopular opinion (at least on here) but I actually liked "Red Mass for Mars" a great deal more.

The character work was wonderful. I can't wait to move onto "The Nightly News", and then "Trans-Human".

How is his work on mainstream superhero comics, like "Fantastic Four"? To be honest, I've never read an "FF" title before. They never really interested me.

[Sven]

How is his work on mainstream superhero comics, like "Fantastic Four"? To be honest, I've never read an "FF" title before. They never really interested me.

Haven't read it, but people here have recommended this and Secret Warriors. Do a forum search and you will find positive words.

[number8]

The rabbit's fight with the rhino is like 4 pages longer.

What the hell? Why did I say rhino? I meant bulldog.

Anyway, pretty sure the new stuff are 4 pages of #1 (the parrot scene), 2 pages in #2 and 4 pages in #3, both of those fight scenes.

[Sven]

What the hell? Why did I say rhino? I meant bulldog.

I assumed you were being cute. I always assume you're being cute.


Anyway, pretty sure the new stuff are 4 pages of #1 (the parrot scene), 2 pages in #2 and 4 pages in #3, both of those fight scenes.

Aside from the parrot scene, it all seemed pretty seamless. Cool.

[megladon8]

Going to get started on "Planetary" pretty soon.

[number8]

Once again, Criminal was the jizztacularest thing on my pull list this week.

[megladon8]

Bendis' "Daredevil" run is so damn awesome.

Maleev's art style is very unique, and I almost feel with much of it that he does something similar to rotoscoping - the lines and proportions of his characters' faces look just too real. As if they were painted over photographs, or based directly on photographs or live models, similar to what Alex Ross does.

[EyesWideOpen]

Bendis' "Daredevil" run is so damn awesome.

Maleev's art style is very unique, and I almost feel with much of it that he does something similar to rotoscoping - the lines and proportions of his characters' faces look just too real. As if they were painted over photographs, or based directly on photographs or live models, similar to what Alex Ross does.

Yes. I prefer it immensely to Miller's run.

[megladon8]

Yes. I prefer it immensely to Miller's run.


I love how it continues to up the ante, but remains a street-level crime story.

Daredevil really suits this approach.

The confrontation with Bullseye - :eek:

[megladon8]

I thought this was neat...

http://img807.imageshack.us/img807/9665/germanbatwoman.jpg


Supposedly drawn in 1892, by "an unknown German artist".

[ledfloyd]

Maleev's art style is very unique, and I almost feel with much of it that he does something similar to rotoscoping - the lines and proportions of his characters' faces look just too real. As if they were painted over photographs, or based directly on photographs or live models, similar to what Alex Ross does.
he uses a lot of photo reference.

[megladon8]

I really hate how quickly stuff goes out of print.

There are a couple of trades I want that were published in 2009, but are now OOP and cost more than $100 for a copy.

[Sven]

I really hate how quickly stuff goes out of print.

There are a couple of trades I want that were published in 2009, but are now OOP and cost more than $100 for a copy.

This is a complaint that no longer gets my sympathy. Most of the time, you can still pick up the issues for a pittance.

[megladon8]

This is a complaint that no longer gets my sympathy. Most of the time, you can still pick up the issues for a pittance.


I wanted to get the first omnibus of the Brubaker run on "Daredevil", but it's OOP and now very, very pricey.

It's still available in individual trades, though.

[megladon8]

Any other fans of James Robinson's "Starman" here?

[Thirdmango]

I think prices tend to vary based on how many good comic book stores you have in your area.

[EyesWideOpen]

I think prices tend to vary based on how many good comic book stores you have in your area.

I don't think you understood what meg is talking about. The majority of trade paperbacks especially big collections like omnibuses are printed in small quantities and not reprinted. So once they've been out for a year and all that original stock is gone the secondary market starts selling them for huge markups. In the case of let's say that Captain America Ed Brubaker Omnibus most comic book stores because of the price got in maybe 2 copies. So once those are sold that's it. They are produced in such a limited quantity that if you didn't jump on them early you don't get them. That's why you see them after they are out of stock selling for $300-400. It has nothing to do with good comic book stores.

[megladon8]

Exactly, EWO.

So I can basically buy all of the trades for the Brubaker "Daredevil" run and spend about $100 or so, or buy the omnibus second-hand for $150+.


I'm really pissed at myself for not having bought the "Jack Kirby's Fourth World" omnibuses while they were available as hardcovers. I only have the first in hardcover. They're getting paperback reprints, which I'll definitely buy, but you know, I'm OCD with collecting stuff.

[ledfloyd]

Any other fans of James Robinson's "Starman" here?
it's something i've always wanted to read.


i just started terry moore's echo. has anyone else read this? i'm only six issues in but i'm really liking it. dude has a knack for storytelling and characterization. makes me wonder why i even bother with marvel/dc books.

[EyesWideOpen]

And to answer Meg's question I have read Starman. I read it for the first time when the omnibuses came out (so recently) and it's in my top 3 books ever. The omnibuses also contain some of the best extras I've ever read. James Robinson writes an afterword specifically for the omnibuses in every volume which is basically a diary of what was going on during that time with some very personal stuff included (friendships he ruined in the industry, mistakes he made, etc) and includes a paragraph or two on every issue in each omnibus.

It also includes all of his Starman stories in order including all the one-shots etc that were never collected in Starman trades.

[Thirdmango]

Sven and I went to this great comics sale and I picked up a pack which had 23 of the 24 Amalgam comics. I'm so happy.

[bac0n]

So, what do you guys think about the upcoming Justice League Dark title? Myself, I normally don't get into occult type things (HP Lovecraft aside) but Deadman is part of the team, and I really liked him in Brightest Day.

[Sven]

So, what do you guys think about the upcoming Justice League Dark title? Myself, I normally don't get into occult type things (HP Lovecraft aside) but Deadman is part of the team, and I really liked him in Brightest Day.

Deadman is awesome. The first arc of the new DC Presents series is a Deadman story by Paul Jenkins which I am anticipating highly. As for Justice League Dark, I, too, am not very interested in occulty stuff. Magic bores me most of the time. But Mikel Janin, the artist, is cool. And it's Peter Milligan, who is my favorite writer, so I am naturally quite excited for it. I'm all about Shade. Milligan is also writing the Red Lantern series, which you, being a Lantern fan, may be interested in.

[Acapelli]

what bothers me about justice league dark is that it's so obvious that janin is tracing over poser models in his art. his panels look like screenshots from a videogame

[Thirdmango]

I don't think you understood what meg is talking about.

Nah I got ya, what I was meaning was, I have a number of trades and such which if I had gotten them online would have cost me quite a bit but since I lived in Boston at the time I was able to find them in used book stores with comic book sections for like 6-8 dollars. In bigger cities you have a lot more of a possibility of finding books that are now hard to find.

Where as living in Utah I can't find anything.

[number8]

I don't know why exactly, but I kinda like how Morrison clearly loves Batman, yet every time he's doing interviews about Superman, he would always shit talk Batman. I think I like it partly because it's well-deserved.

He's been saying the same thing for years now, too. That Superman spent his youth bailing hay and then becomes a tireless working-class hero, and people don't like him. While Batman sleeps til noon, puts on a rubber suit and then punch poor people at night, and everyone thinks he's the coolest motherfucker on earth.

[number8]

“The New DC comics stuff looks so much like stuff I would never read that it oddly fills me with hope that they are targetting the core audience they want. If a 43-year-old man looks at most of this promo stuff and goes meh, then that’s very probably a good sign for them. Best of luck to Dan D, Jim L et all for the imminent relaunch.”

It's... a compliment?

[Sven]

EWO, Atomic Comics...? Closed? Did you shop there?

[Sven]

The guy at the comic store that had this crazy sale this last weekend convinced me to pick up the Astonishing Spider-Man & Wolverine issues by Jason Aaron. I was way hesitant, but I'm happy he did, because it's excellent. I'm realizing that these are the first interiors I've encountered from Adam Kubert, who has a terrific talent for composition.

[Acapelli]

that's a fantastic series

[number8]

Speaking of, I'm planning on dropping Aaron's Wolverine after the current arc. It's been pretty fun, but I realized that I really can't muster up enough shit to care about Wolverine anymore. Especially all by himself.

[number8]

Great Morrison interview:

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/grant-morrison-on-the-death-of-comics-20110822


There have been histories of comic books, but your book Supergods is all superheroes. It's a counter-narrative to the idea that comics need to outgrow this superhero stuff.
I can appreciate someone like Chris Ware for his artistry, which I think is beautiful, but I think his attitude stinks, it just seems to be the attitude of somebody really privileged, and honestly, try living here, try living on an Indian reservation and shut up, and really seeing all that nihilistic stuff, it really makes me angry, it's unhelpful to all of us, and it's coming from people who have money and success to talk like that and bring those aspects of the way we live in favor of all the others, and it's indefensible.

[megladon8]

Finally, someone else who doesn't like Chris Ware.

Yet another reason to love Morrison.

[number8]

http://i.newsarama.com/images/DC_New52_logos_1sheet_R2.jpg

[Winston*]

Maybe a dumb question but, when they've got all these Batman comics running at the same time in the same continuity, how does it work? Do they all tie together into a bigger narrative?

[EyesWideOpen]

EWO, Atomic Comics...? Closed? Did you shop there?

I haven't been reading comics for about six months now and I was getting my comics from DCBS for a year so I haven't gone there weekly for a little while but yeah one of the locations was the store I went to every week for like 5 years. I was very surprised by the news because they were one of the biggest comic stores in the country. They had a ton of big names there: Geoff Johns, Ed Brubaker, Jason Aaron, Warren Ellis, Mark Waid, Brian Azarello, Brian Michael Bendis to name a few.

The Phoenix area has a plethora of comic book stores though. Even without the four Atomic Comics stores, there is probably another ten comic book stores within 30-45 minutes of me.

[megladon8]

Anyone here read any of "Supreme Power" from a few years back?

I'm about halfway through the first trade collection (of the two) and like it but feel it doesn't really do enough in originality.

I get it that the overall premise is "what if Superman had been raised by the US government?" but to have the other heroes be straight-up rips of the Justice League seems quite pointless and lazy.


I'm getting a little bit tired of the re-use of ideas in superhero comics. Why does every new superhero team have to have their own versions of Superman, Batman, Aquaman, The Flash and Wonder Woman?

I love the established heroes, but I wish more of the new ones were actually new and original.

[number8]

They're not new characters. They're a gritty reboot of Squadron Supreme. The SS have been around since the 70's, and Marvel initially created them as parodies of rival DC.

[megladon8]

They're not new characters. They're a gritty reboot of Squadron Supreme. The SS have been around since the 70's, and Marvel initially created them as parodies of rival DC.


Ah, well, nevermind then :D

What did you think of "Supreme Power"?

[Grouchy]

Maybe a dumb question but, when they've got all these Batman comics running at the same time in the same continuity, how does it work? Do they all tie together into a bigger narrative?
Short answer is yes.

[number8]

Ah, well, nevermind then :D

What did you think of "Supreme Power"?

OK.

[number8]

Short answer is yes.

But the real answer is not really.

[megladon8]

OK.

Well talk about an abrupt answer!

Edit: Did your reply get cut off or something? Or did you really just answer with "OK"?

[megladon8]

???

Ok then.

So, comics. They're cool.

[megladon8]

So I'm going to check out some more Alan Moore stuff.

Haven't really read much of his "Tom Strong" work, and I got a great deal on vol. 1 of the omnibus.

[megladon8]

I'm not sure how to take the foreword to Jonathan Hickman's "Transhuman".

It's written by a guy from Princeton, who says that the book is terrible and recommends readers to not read it, then says "it's not every day you get smarter by not reading a book."

I can't tell if it was written sarcastically, or if it was included ironically.

[megladon8]

Do I have B.O. or something?

[ledfloyd]

it's coming from people who have money and success to talk like that and bring those aspects of the way we live in favor of all the others, and it's indefensible.

i really have no idea what this means.

[number8]

Well talk about an abrupt answer!

Edit: Did your reply get cut off or something? Or did you really just answer with "OK"?

Huh?

[Sven]

I think I may like Remender's Punisher more than Ennis's. Don't get me wrong: I have all the Ennis trades on my shelf and I look at them with awe, perplexed and inspired at the ability for any artist to create a massive work of such staggering, consistent quality.

But Remender's got monsters, for which I have serious love. Rather, I think the combination of the Punisher's intensely world-bound impetus meshes strangely, alluringly, with the fabulous realms of high fantasy. I think that Ennis's Marvel Knights Punisher is better than his MAX for this reason. Giant squids and run-ins with the Hulk, etc.

Thankfully, I can have them all.

[megladon8]

Huh?


I asked you what you thought of "Supreme Power" and your reply was simply "OK".

That was kind of odd.

[number8]

I thought the series was just okay.

[megladon8]

I'm finding more and more that Alan Moore really does live up to his monumental reputation, I just don't feel it's for the titles he usually gets the acclaim for.

I'll take "Top 10" over "Watchmen" any day of the week. "Swamp Thing" over "League of Extraordinary Gentlemen", "What Ever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow" over "The Killing Joke", etc.

[ledfloyd]

I'm finding more and more that Alan Moore really does live up to his monumental reputation, I just don't feel it's for the titles he usually gets the acclaim for.

I'll take "Top 10" over "Watchmen" any day of the week. "Swamp Thing" over "League of Extraordinary Gentlemen", "What Ever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow" over "The Killing Joke", etc.
for me it doesn't get better than promethea and from hell, but i still have swamp thing to read. i am not a huge fan of his superman and batman stories.

[number8]

Pfth. "For the Man Who Has Everything" > "Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow."

[BuffaloWilder]

Speaking of Swamp Thing, down at my LCS they had almost a third of his entire run in the dollar boxes, all perfectly preserved. Also a bunch of The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, Vol. 2.

*snatch*

I think that's going to be my goal, this year - to try and pick up most of Alan Moore's writing in their individual issues. I've got most of the second printing of V For Vendetta by DC in 1988, and a couple of the black and white installments that ran in Warrior Magazine in 1982. A few issues of Watchmen lying here or there, including the first issue - I'd have thought it would've ran for more, but I picked it up for $3.50 in a regular back issue bin. Huh.

[Sven]

I'm partial to the pleasures of 1963 and Tomorrow Stories myself. Frankly, I cannot abide Moore bashing since nobody has ever demonstrated genuine absence of purpose or skill in his works. The only Moore dissers I've ever encountered have made it clear that they either have a point to make with their negative position or have just not read much of it.

Though perhaps I'm just saying this now because there's this new guy at my work that was tearing into Moore tonite. He wasn't making any sense.

[megladon8]

I really want to check out "1963" but I can't seem to track it down anywhere. And personally, I'm not fond of reading a comic on a computer screen.

[megladon8]

"Punisher" #2 was good. Writing is nothing too special at this time but the art is great. Evocative and stylish. Very cohesive in its layout.

[ledfloyd]

the way everything comes together in 1963 is pretty impressive, it's a shame the special wrapping everything up never got made.

[megladon8]

So, I'm a big fan of Cap, and I'm a big fan of Jack Kirby.

Logic would dictate that the Jack Kirby Cap omnibus is amazing.

Is logic correct?

[Sven]

So, I'm a big fan of Cap, and I'm a big fan of Jack Kirby.

Logic would dictate that the Jack Kirby Cap omnibus is amazing.

Is logic correct?

I don't even know why you'd doubt it.

[EyesWideOpen]

I don't know what's going on with me and comic books right now. In the last year I've sold off almost 500 trades/hardcovers. I haven't read a single issue in like 6 months now. I've tried a couple times to read stuff and can't even make it through a few pages before getting bored. I just got the Gene Colan Batman hardcover in the mail and made it past the first story and stopped. It's almost like I've lost all interest in them. I'd much rather play a videogame or watch a movie/tv series.

[Sven]

It's called burnout. Or growing up.

[EyesWideOpen]

I haven't even started to get rid of my single issues and I have over 20 short boxes of those.

[megladon8]

"Supreme Power" was pretty good. I actually quite like JMS, but I certainly wouldn't say this ranks among his best work. Too many instances of lazy, on the nose analogies, and it did not seem at all necessary for it to be a MAX title. All the nudity and swearing felt terribly tacked on, there to make it a mature title, rather than it being part of the story inherently.

The story itself was interesting and I like Hyperion.

[ledfloyd]

I don't know what's going on with me and comic books right now. In the last year I've sold off almost 500 trades/hardcovers. I haven't read a single issue in like 6 months now. I've tried a couple times to read stuff and can't even make it through a few pages before getting bored. I just got the Gene Colan Batman hardcover in the mail and made it past the first story and stopped. It's almost like I've lost all interest in them. I'd much rather play a videogame or watch a movie/tv series.
as i get older i find myself having less and less patience for superhero books and their convoluted mythologies and continuities. there are still a few writers i follow but... eh.

the day i don't feel excited opening up the latest volume of acme novelty library though... that will be a sad day indeed.

[megladon8]

It's called burnout. Or growing up.


That's very sad.

If "growing up" entails no longer liking comic books and cartoons, I'm more than happy to be immature forever.

[Thirdmango]

I would like to contend it may have a big thing to do with living situation or even where you live. When I lived in Boston I bought more comics because I had a better selection and could find cheaper books, plus I had a job in which reading comic books was a valuable way to pass the time. Now I don't have as much selection and not really any great reading spots so I read a lot less almost to the point of not at all.

[number8]

So I guess Future Foundation will continue even with Fantastic Four restarting, both with Hickman writing. Oh good. One more title I have to buy. :|

[megladon8]

Is Jonathan Hickman's run on "Fantastic Four" a good place to start for someone who has never read any "FF" before?

[Acapelli]

Is Jonathan Hickman's run on "Fantastic Four" a good place to start for someone who has never read any "FF" before?
absolutely

[number8]

It's a bit dense if you're unfamiliar with FF, but I think it's pretty new reader friendly in its own way.

It's definitely awesome.

http://i.imgur.com/4wU4O.jpg

[Sven]

Oooo, nice.

[number8]

Yeah, Hickman said he wrote that issue as a manifesto of how he was going to write the FF, and it's certainly true. He seems to be the first in a long while to treat them as pioneers of the unknown. Too many writers treat Reed as just ambiguously sciencey--"oh he's working in his lab" (doing what?) "only Reed knows!" They're afraid of really getting into it, in other words. It's easier to tell the readers that someone's smart than to show how that person's smart. I love the direction Hickman took because he doesn't shy from the smart conversations at all. You WANT an FF writer like him.

[megladon8]

I've never had much of an interest at all in the FF, so I'm hoping to change that.

[Thirdmango]

Curse you Sven, I read this thread now and all I can think of when people say Jonathan Hickman is Luke Hickman. This is your doing.

[Sven]

Was at Half Price today and they had a slew of Kirby Omnibi. Was tempted to pick them up, even though I have many of them, just to sit on them for the resale value. Then it hit me: no. Don't do that.

Sorry, meg. The only ones they didn't have were the Fourth World tomes, otherwise I totally would've picked one up for you.

[Sven]

Curse you Sven, I read this thread now and all I can think of when people say Jonathan Hickman is Luke Hickman. This is your doing.

Yeah, this is tricky business even for me still.

[megladon8]

Was at Half Price today and they had a slew of Kirby Omnibi. Was tempted to pick them up, even though I have many of them, just to sit on them for the resale value. Then it hit me: no. Don't do that.

Sorry, meg. The only ones they didn't have were the Fourth World tomes, otherwise I totally would've picked one up for you.


Hey Sven, would you mind going and picking up the Fourth World ominbu---

Oh, OK :lol:

Thanks for thinking of me, dude!

[megladon8]

God I love "WE3".

I think I've read it 4 times now, and it hasn't lost any of its power.

[number8]

Did anybody go to a midnight launch last night?

[Sven]

Did anybody go to a midnight launch last night?

Not me. Did you?

[number8]

Not me. Did you?

I'm not even gonna pick that title up, so no.

[number8]

First meeting of Batman and Superman in JUSTICE LEAGUE #2.

http://dcu.blog.dccomics.com/files/2011/08/justiceleagueinks.jpg

[Acapelli]

jH3W1gQYiD4

[dreamdead]

I am kinda impressed with the background in the Lee image there; I remember a lot of his earlier work having less than fleshed out cityscapes. That said, nothing about that series interests me.

I am intrigued enough by Snyder on Swamp Thing (still need to read the first AV collection, though), and Morrison on AC to pick those up, beyond the obvious Batwoman and JL: Dark...

[megladon8]

I am so getting the "Kamandi: The Last Boy on Earth" omnibus in October.

[number8]

http://0.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/27/62/ecfa37273200f365fcbc03441fec5d 00.jpg

[Ezee E]

Have you guys started reading them yet?

[ledfloyd]

i've been reading through morrison's run on JLA, i think one of the things that keeps me from fully embracing morrison's work is that i often feel like i'm wrestling so hard with trying to keep track of what's going on and make sense of everything that i rarely get a chance to sit back and just enjoy what he's doing. it feels like a strange complaint to me because in literary fiction i tend to prefer challenging works. but i think people like alan moore can do challenging things with a bit more elan than morrison. their storytelling is a bit clearer. that's not to say i don't love books like the filth, we3 and seaguy, i think they're brilliant but there's something that keeps me at a slight remove from them.

in this instance it could be my unfamiliarity with the greater DCU and the new gods in particular. it's probably telling that his run on new x-men is probably my favorite of his work on corporate characters. but i still need to go back and reread batman when it's finished.

i've also given 100 bullets a second chance, and while i still found the first two arcs pretty dismal shortly after that it started picking up and i'm quite into it at this point (halfway through the run). it's a nice respite from wrestling with morrison.

[megladon8]

I'm working on a bunch of stuff by Ennis right now.

I'm at about issue 18 of his "Punisher MAX" run, and about issue 3 of "Hitman".

[megladon8]

"Planetary" may be one of my favorite series' of all time.

[Sven]

Have you guys started reading them yet?

I have read Justice League #1. I hate to say that it is mediocre. Some promising elements, but it was mostly just a set-up issue for another set-up issue, which will probably set up another issue. Sigh. Origin stories can be such a drag. Lee's art is good, though. Johns's dialogue is boring.

[megladon8]

I would really love some opinions on two fairly classic Marvel runs, that are now collected in omnibus form:

"Thor" by Walter Simonson

"Fantastic Four" by John Byrne

[Sven]

Simonson's Thor is the bomb, but I wouldn't get the nasty-ass recolored omnibus stuff. The Marvel Legends TPBs of Simonson's Thor are ideal.

Haven't read Byrne's FF, but it's not much of a priority.

Just finished 100 Bullets. Immense. While credit is due to Azzarello, the book belongs to Risso. What an achievement.

[ledfloyd]

"Planetary" may be one of my favorite series' of all time.
i feel like the second half is weaker than the first but it's still an impressive piece of work. the 'adventure of the month' issues are much stronger to me than when it focuses on the 'mythology' for lack of better terms. it would still be in my top 25 or 30 comics read.


Just finished 100 Bullets. Immense. While credit is due to Azzarello, the book belongs to Risso. What an achievement.
i'm right around issue 60 and loving it. it's weird, i read the first trade 5 years or so ago and thought it was kind of lame. something inspired me to give it another chance and i'm hooked.

i finished JLA, so, for fun:

1. Flex Mentallo
2. The Filth
3. Seaguy
4. New X-Men
5. All-Star Superman
6. Batman
7. We3
8. Animal Man
9. Doom Patrol
10. Kill Your Boyfriend
11. Arkham Asylum
12. Joe the Barbarian
13. JLA

the invisibles and seven soldiers being my big blind spots at the moment. i might pick up invisibles after i finish 100 bullets.

[Sven]

I find many people have a bifurcated experience with 100 Bullets. And it's about a 50/50 split over which of the book's personalities people love/hate.

[Sven]

Looks like you just finished my favorite arc (Wylie in New Orleans) as well as just read my favorite issue of the series: the introduction of Vic told simultaneous to the history of the Minutemen/Trust. Both are in trade #8.

[ledfloyd]

Looks like you just finished my favorite arc (Wylie in New Orleans) as well as just read my favorite issue of the series: the introduction of Vic told simultaneous to the history of the Minutemen/Trust. Both are in trade #8.
yeah, i just finished trade 8. that's probably my favorite arc as well thus far, it's either that or the counterfifth detective. i wasn't quite as hot on issue 50, i thought the formation of the trust was kind of rote. it was kind of gimmicky but i really liked the dimaggio issue's take on the kennedy assassination. as i was reading it i was wondering 'how had nobody thought of this before!?'

[megladon8]

I don't understand why volume 2 of "The Invisibles" is so hard to get. It seems like it is the only volume that is out of print. You can get a copy for a decent price on the Amazon marketplace sometimes, but it seems to be permanently out of stock in stores.


Sven - the "Thor" omnibus is recolored? Or just on "the wrong stock"? I've never really been bothered by the latter.

[number8]

I have read Justice League #1. I hate to say that it is mediocre. Some promising elements, but it was mostly just a set-up issue for another set-up issue, which will probably set up another issue. Sigh. Origin stories can be such a drag. Lee's art is good, though. Johns's dialogue is boring.

There's not a false sentence in this.

Johns is one of my least favorite writers. He puts me to sleep.

[number8]

By the way, wow what a waste of goddamn time Flashpoint was. I hung out at my LCS yesterday and people were just coming in to bitch to the owner about Flashpoint.

[megladon8]

Despite liking some (and loving a select few) of Ennis' works, I can't help but feel that he is very inconsistent, and really nothing special.

I just don't get the adoration he receives from so many. "Preacher" aside, even his best works are nothing more than entertaining yarns. Which is great, but I don't get what's so special.

And maybe it's blasphemy since "Preacher" is almost universally considered his best, but "Hitman" is probably my favorite.

[Sven]

Sven - the "Thor" omnibus is recolored? Or just on "the wrong stock"? I've never really been bothered by the latter.

It is recolored. Not the greatest example, but it was the first one I found online:
http://nozama.typepad.com/.a/6a00e54ed05fc28833014e6111f72e 970c-800wi

The natural shades and lighting gradients nerf the fantastic vision. Not impressed.

[Sven]

By the way, wow what a waste of goddamn time Flashpoint was. I hung out at my LCS yesterday and people were just coming in to bitch to the owner about Flashpoint.

It ended up being little more than an Elseworlds exercise, which I didn't mind. But even with just the announcement of a new Universe, the stakes were already deflated. Then issue five wraps everything up, too quickly and without involvement with any of the other stories. Ultimately, a limp event as such, but thankfully a few good books came out of it, and it is one of Kubert's best-looking books.

[megladon8]

Yuck.

Thanks for the warning, Sven.

I've loved the Kirby omnibuses by DC as they've retained his original art. Just got the "O.M.A.C." one yesterday. Gorgeous.

[ledfloyd]

Despite liking some (and loving a select few) of Ennis' works, I can't help but feel that he is very inconsistent, and really nothing special.

I just don't get the adoration he receives from so many. "Preacher" aside, even his best works are nothing more than entertaining yarns. Which is great, but I don't get what's so special.

And maybe it's blasphemy since "Preacher" is almost universally considered his best, but "Hitman" is probably my favorite.
yeah, i pretty much agree. preacher is the only one of his books i ever bothered to finish. i gave a few others a shot, he's just not for me.

[Thirdmango]

Eventually when I have the money I'll finish buying 100 Bullets and read it. I stopped reading it purely for the fact that when I started reading it the books weren't finished and if I put the book down and picked it back up three weeks later I had literally forgotten everything and couldn't follow it. So when I do buy it I need to marathon it but because it's been like 2 years since I last read it, it's hard to make buying five more books a priority.

[megladon8]

yeah, i pretty much agree. preacher is the only one of his books i ever bothered to finish. i gave a few others a shot, he's just not for me.


Yeah, and I get that his whole over-the-top macho posturing with his characters is meant ironically, but the schtick gets old.

"Fury" is honestly one of the worst things I've ever read.

[EyesWideOpen]

His Hellblazer, Punisher work? Battlefields is one of the best war series I've read.

[megladon8]

His Hellblazer, Punisher work? Battlefields is one of the best war series I've read.


Like I said, he's inconsistent.

His "Punisher: MAX" run is good fun, and "Hitman" is glorious, but he's written a lot of crap, too.

From my experience with him so far, it's almost a 50:50 ratio.

[number8]

Let's see...

GOOD

Punisher
Punisher: Born
Punisher MAX
Preacher
Hellblazer
Hitman
Hitman/JLA
Chronicles of Wormwood
Judge Dredd
Unknown Soldier
Battlefields
The Pro
The Authority: Kev Trilogy

BAD

303
Ghost Rider
Thor: Viking
The Darkness
Crossed
Jennifer Blood
Midnighter
Fury

Up in the air: The Boys

Doesn't really mean anything, though. It's about on par with the legacy of the great comic book writers who've been working for over two decades. Better than most, even.

[Sven]

BAD

Thor: Viking

Ummm... no.


Midnighter

Yes on this, though. Easily the worst thing of his I've read. Sadly, given the talent involved and how gnarly the Midnighter is.

So Aaron is writing a team-up with Fat Cobra in his Wolverine book. I may have to dip in.

[Sven]

Details on Fury? I have a hard time believing it is bad. His Nick Fury in Punisher Max is written so well. Funny and hard, seems like a perfect match for Ennis.

[megladon8]

Details on Fury? I have a hard time believing it is bad. His Nick Fury in Punisher Max is written so well. Funny and hard, seems like a perfect match for Ennis.


Instead of being witty, funny or smart, it's very dumb. Fury is not a clever strategist, he's juat a brute who kils and fucks his way to the end of the book.

He has a nephew who is a skinny nerd who desperately wants to be like him, and Fury mocks and insults him through the book.

It's really terrible stuff.

[number8]

Details on Fury? I have a hard time believing it is bad. His Nick Fury in Punisher Max is written so well. Funny and hard, seems like a perfect match for Ennis.

It's actually pretty similar in tone and themes to his Barracuda mini, except not as funny.

[ledfloyd]

was there ever an agreed upon reading order established in regards to batman and robin, the return of bruce wayne and batman #700-702?

[Sven]

Went a little crazy today:

Wolverine: Adamantium Men
Ultimate Armor Wars
Ultimate Captain America
Ultimate Fantastic Four Vol 1
Unknown Soldier Vol 1
24/7 Vol 2
Wisdom

All for under thirty bucks. A fine splurge. I'm totally convinced about Jason Aaron.

[number8]

You are going to LOVE Wisdom.

[Sven]

Oops, not Ultimate FF, just regular. Hickman.


was there ever an agreed upon reading order established in regards to batman and robin, the return of bruce wayne and batman #700-702?

I just read them in the order they came out and it was revelatory. But for chronological purposes, 700 stands outside of the continuum and 701 & 702 come right after RIP. Return of Bruce Wayne happens simultaneous to Morrison's Batman and Robin issues.

[ledfloyd]

I just read them in the order they came out and it was revelatory. But for chronological purposes, 700 stands outside of the continuum and 701 & 702 come right after RIP. Return of Bruce Wayne happens simultaneous to Morrison's Batman and Robin issues.
yeah, but reading 701 and 702 i feel like they're supposed to be read later. there's a few references that i'm not sure would be completely clear at that time.

i reread the "second chapter" of morrison's batsaga this weekend and i feel like each chapter has had diminishing returns for me. the initial story from batman & son through batman RIP might be my favorite thing he's ever written. batman and robin/return of bruce wayne is nearly as good, but it becomes so haywire by the end and the darkseid stuff loses me a bit. it's probably too early to judge batman inc/batman leviathan, but so far it's easily my least favorite of the three, which isn't to say it's not one of my favorite comics coming out these days.

also, as for jason aaron, have you read scalped yet? also of note is the other side, cameron stewart is always a fun read.

[Sven]

but it becomes so haywire by the end and the darkseid stuff loses me a bit.

See, this is where it gets stratospheric for me. The rest of the stuff is well-written, creative action comics, but all the meta-realmy stuff threaded through the Final Crisis narrative takes it to another level. Esoteric, absolutely, but for me it's the opposite of diminishing returns.


it's probably too early to judge batman inc/batman leviathan, but so far it's easily my least favorite of the three

I can relate with this. I gather a strong sense of compromise, compounded by the book's rotating artwork, obvious condensing, and delayed production. It just doesn't have that agonizing, electric tension that I felt in RIP and the climactic arc of Batman and Robin. It's fun, but every issue is so disconnected from the last that I'm not getting a larger picture. Admittedly, the reboot confusion isn't helping, but I mean an artistic vision as well as a narrative one.

But yes, from issue to issue, it is definitely fantastic.


also, as for jason aaron, have you read scalped yet? also of note is the other side, cameron stewart is always a fun read.

I'm finishing up the second trade, but I'm going to wait to read more, because I just read 100 Bullets and I think I need a break from comics that have lots of guns and blood and "fuck"s. That said, it's impressive. But yeah, Aaron... The violent slowburn and unbearable emotions of his first arc of PunisherMax, Kingpin, has been imprinted on my fragile psyche. And, of course, the Spider-Man/Wolverine thing reminded me of the pleasure of comics silliness, though it is not without its weighty considerations. He is most excellent.

I'm excited to jump onto his Hulk title. I know Silvestri's art represents a lot of negative things to a lot of folks, but my favorite New X-Men story was drawn by him, so I give leeway.

[ledfloyd]

See, this is where it gets stratospheric for me. The rest of the stuff is well-written, creative action comics, but all the meta-realmy stuff threaded through the Final Crisis narrative takes it to another level. Esoteric, absolutely, but for me it's the opposite of diminishing returns.
perhaps i need to actually read final crisis then. i remember reading dc universe #0 back when it came out and being completely lost at sea and deciding it probably wasn't for me.

[Sven]

perhaps i need to actually read final crisis then. i remember reading dc universe #0 back when it came out and being completely lost at sea and deciding it probably wasn't for me.

It has very little to do with Batman, specifically, but it definitely develops Morrison's perspective and what he's trying to do with the DCU.

[megladon8]

OoOoOo...an "Xstatix" omnibus coming this fall!

[megladon8]

"Wisdom" does sound very cool. I'll have to check that one out.



Last night I read probably the best story so far in Ennis' "Punisher MAX" run, "The Slavers". Emotionally resonant and tightly written.

I also read the "Hitman" story "Zombie Night at the Gotham Aquarium". Great stuff. Hope I'm not alone in thinking this series is Ennis at his very best.

[number8]

Pretty sure I've been saying that in this thread for years now.

[ledfloyd]

OoOoOo...an "Xstatix" omnibus coming this fall!
man, if i had the money (or space) to buy omnibuses i would be all over that.

[megladon8]

Was any of the post-Ennis "Punisher MAX" stuff any good?

[Acapelli]

aaron's run is great

[number8]

What the fuck. (http://blog.newsarama.com/2011/09/06/st-louis-area-comic-fans-be-on-alert-for-stolen-superman-items/)

[Acapelli]

everyone buy action comics #1

OUT TODAY!

[Sven]

everyone buy action comics #1

OUT TODAY!

Meh. 'S all about OMAC. j/k, but I am getting that one. Didiowurst, I know, but I cannot pass up Giffen-doing-Kirby.

I'm also anticipating Stormwatch. I'm halfway through Wisdom and I'm loving Cornell. He's so British. Maybe my favorite writer of comics dialogue...?

[Acapelli]

you have to check out his captain britain and the mi-13. one of my favorite comics ever

[Sven]

As for Punisher Max, meg, yes. I say yes to all of it but maybe Charlie Huston's contributions, which are quite small. Laurence Campbell, in particular, illustrates a fantastic arc in Mexico, as well as several recommendable one-shots.

[Sven]

you have to check out his captain britain and the mi-13. one of my favorite comics ever

Got this at the crazy sale that ThirdMango mentioned a week or so ago, as a bundle, for very cheap. Look forward to it.

[number8]

Yeah, Cornell is tops. I knew you'd love Wisdom.

I don't think I've seen anything by him I didn't like. His Action Comics run was inspired. His short Batman & Robin arc was great. Knight & Squire was hilarious. Even the two Doctor Who episodes he wrote were brilliant.

[megladon8]

"Barracuda" was a good story.

[megladon8]

As for Punisher Max, meg, yes. I say yes to all of it but maybe Charlie Huston's contributions, which are quite small. Laurence Campbell, in particular, illustrates a fantastic arc in Mexico, as well as several recommendable one-shots.


Cool, thanks for replying :)

That's too bad to hear that Huston's contributions aren't great. I actually really love Charlie Huston. His series of vampire noir novels were fantastic, and I liked his work on "Moon Knight" a great deal.

[Sven]

Well, you may like Huston's more than I did. His two stories, a one-shot and a short compiled in issue 75, are very schlocky, owing to B-cinema more than comics. I've never read anything else by him, but they were both a bit disconnected.

[number8]

The Punishermobile vs biker gang one was his, right? I have that one. What was his other one?

[Sven]

The Punishermobile vs biker gang one was his, right? I have that one. What was his other one?

Yeah, Punishermobile, and then he has a short with Ken Lashley called The Smallest Bit of This in issue 75 that I just re-read to make sure I don't like it. It's like a bad stream-of-conscious thing as Punisher murders some dudes and reflects on his origin. Blurgh.

[megladon8]

Everyone - top five favorite writers, and top five favorite artists! Go!

[number8]

Ah, okay.

Meg, Huston actually objects to his novels being called "noir." He prefers "pulp," which definitely fits them better.

[megladon8]

Ah, okay.

Meg, Huston actually objects to his novels being called "noir." He prefers "pulp," which definitely fits them better.


Hmmm...I can see and understand that. I guess I'm thinking of the, well, "pulp noir" stuff of the '20s and '30s when I relate them to those crime stories. I just chose to wrong word in "pulp noir" to describe them :)

Have you read (any of) them, 8?

[number8]

Yeah, I have the Joe Pitt novels and his Hank Thompson trilogy.

[megladon8]

Yeah, I have the Joe Pitt novels and his Hank Thompson trilogy.


How have you liked his comic book works? For example, his run on "Moon Knight"?

I thought that stuff was great, but I haven't really read much else by him in the comic book world.

[Sven]

Everyone - top five favorite writers, and top five favorite artists! Go!

I love how "everyone" is, like, three people. I'll bite:

Writers:
1 Peter Milligan
2 Grant Morrison
3 Joe Casey
4 Joe Kelly
5 Rick Veitch

Illustrators:
1 Doug Mahnke
2 Igor Kordey
3 Jack Kirby
4 Cameron Stewart
5 I'm gonna throw a weird one out there... Kelley Jones

Edit: spelling

[Sven]

New 52 quickies:

Justice League - Exactly half bad. Too much macho and entirely straightforward. Fourth world intro is boss, though. We'll see, but it's already the weakest of the books I've read. - **

Men of War - Surprisingly good. Starts off with weak military office room exposition, but climaxes with promise. The Vankin/Winslade piece is better, though. - ***

Green Arrow - The opposite reaction. Begins well, but the last third is limp. George Perez's inks look great over Jurgens, though. - **1/2

Hawk and Dove - Anyone else think it's weird that they would release a comic this week that features an airplane crashing into a national building? The avatar of war is disconcertingly cavalier about its destruction, and the avatar of peace is cavorting with a dead guy. - ***

Detective Comics - Few opinions have landed me more ridicule than that of my approval of Daniel's Batman. The writing here is strange, but the plot blossoms with a classic feel and its adequately grimy. Gotham looks fantastic. - ***

Animal Man - Still unimpressed with Lemire. Foreman's work is cool when it's wiggy, but he doesn't do domestic well at all, and Animal Man is all about domesticity. - **

Action Comics - Okay, this is badass. Morrison cruises at a caffeinated clip, Rags gets the pacing and scope right, and it offers an already brilliant take on the meaning of the conflict between Luthor and Supes. "There's something past the orbit of Neptune, getting closer..." - ****

Stormwatch - Can tell this is going to develop into something excellent. Sepulveda's figures are sometimes twisted, but the fx processing is some of the best I've seen. Spike chin? - ***1/2

OMAC - Oh, Didio hurts, but this has some seriously crazy panels. I even chuckled a couple of times, so I'm not dissuaded yet. It's hard to be with so much Kirby krackle. - **1/2

Swamp Thing - Nails it. Paquette is on, Snyder pitching an assured balance of mood, narrative, and character. - ****

[megladon8]

Awesome write-ups, Sven :)

I have the #1's of "Detective Comics", "Action Comics" and "Swamp Thing" waiting for me. I'll pick them up tomorrow on my lunch break.

[EyesWideOpen]

Everyone - top five favorite writers, and top five favorite artists! Go!

Writers:
1. Ed Brubaker
2. Brian K. Vaughan
3. Greg Rucka
4. Jason Aaron
5. Brian Michael Bendis

Illustrators:
1. Darwyn Cooke
2. Leinil Francis Yu
3. Dustin Nguyen
4. Charles Burns
5. Jason

[megladon8]

Ennis' "Punisher MAX" continues to get better and better with each story arc.

"The Widowmaker" was haunting stuff.

[ledfloyd]

Writers:
Chris Ware
Daniel Clowes
Joe Sacco
Alan Moore
Brian K. Vaughan
(Ed Brubaker)
(Grant Morrison)

Artists:
Chris Ware
JH Williams III
Darwyn Cooke
Charles Burns
Daniel Clowes
(David Mazzuchelli)

so what's up with superman's eyes?

[megladon8]

Oh. My. God.

The "Cat-Signal".

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: :lol:

[number8]

None of the #1s I picked up were really that great to me. Good build ups, all, but none that are satisfying issues on their own. They all feel decompressed somehow.

Action Comics #1 is easily the best, but we all knew that was going to be the case. I love the emphasis of Superman as a beatnik champion of the people, living in squalor with artists and activists. I think Morrison is setting up the conflict of Luthor being an Ayn Randian industrialist rich guy and Superman as the ultimate socialist fighting for the poor. That is a really wild take on these two.

Batgirl #1 has Simone's usual combination of the twisted and the cute, and I'm definitely sticking with it, but reverting Barbara to a state where she's still traumatized by the Joker shooting leaves a sour taste in my mouth. I mean, previously, this is a character who beat the Joker hand-to-hand WHILE IN A WHEELCHAIR. So this just kinda sucks as a status quo thing. Should be a good story, but depressing.

Animal Man #1 feels slight. That new costume is horrible and the hospital hostage stuff to make him monologue about how much he's afraid for his family to get hurt is so convenient and trite, but I like the things set up in the opening interview (him being the Che Guevara for PETA activists and vegans rather than a traditional superhero), and the last few pages are creepy enough for me to want to know more.

Stormwatch #1 feels really big and sci-fi and full of ideas, so melikey, and it looks like it's doing the exact opposite of Justice League's slow-meet, by rapidly introducing every character and every potential threat in one issue. But yikes, the new Midnighter costume is just. Fucking. Awful.

Didn't get it, but read some of Detective Comics #1. Yawnsville. Gory serial killers and mutilations, that's it? Joker being all slaughtery instead of clever, tricky and funny. Not my thing.

Wish I'd picked up JLI #1 and Swamp Thing #1. I might go back to the shop tomorrow and pick up those two.

[ledfloyd]

so i've read everything i picked up this week. action comics was about as awesome as could be expected. swamp thing was really good. i wasn't as sour on animal man as sven, but i don't feel like lemire completely gets the characters yet and i could see the art becoming an issue.

[number8]

Oh, forgot to mention: I also love how Cornell can have his own mini crossovers, by having the Eminence of Blades be a member of both Stormwatch and Demon Knights, in two time periods. That's going to be fun. I only have Demon Knights on my list and I just picked up Stormwatch #1 to give it a try, but now I think I'll add it too.

[Sven]

Animal Man #1 feels slight. That new costume is horrible and the hospital hostage stuff to make him monologue about how much he's afraid for his family to get hurt is so convenient and trite, but I like the things set up in the opening interview (him being the Che Guevara for PETA activists and vegans rather than a traditional superhero), and the last few pages are creepy enough for me to want to know more.

Oh yeah, totally forgot about the new costume. Blech.

One of the big moments that the comic lost me, because it's a significant moment, is when you see the gunman fire the two bullets within the same panel at Buddy. Then, on the next page, he does the whole "Which animal will help me beat the bullets? Dog? No. Cat? No. Rhino!" Firstly, the two gunshots within the same panel suggest that the bullets have already connected with Buddy's human flesh. Secondly, a guy whose been at it this long, who then subsequently latches onto his favorite superhero cocktail, would already be on guard with bulletproof rhino skin.

Anyway, it wasn't awful, but we'll see.


But yikes, the new Midnighter costume is just. Fucking. Awful.

Really don't know what they were smoking.


Swamp Thing #1

Yeah, you'll like this.

[Sven]

Googling around, it appears that one of the constants is a surprising love for OMAC. I'm happy about that.

[Ezee E]

Detective Comics, Action Comics, Swamp Thing, and everything that I considered a possible read was sold out at two comic book shops. The rest are quite a far away, minus one shop. I'll try that tomorrow.

Good for D.C., but bad for me. One of those shops is closing down.

Comic book stores all smell bad. Can't explain it either.

Workers were talking about how "generic people" were all coming in to read the new ones, expecting greatness. Whatevs...

[number8]

You can buy them digital, too, if you don't mind that.

[number8]

Apparently Hawk & Dove sold out. What the fuck?

[Sven]

You can buy them digital, too, if you don't mind that.

Hmmm, it's almost as if that was his plan (http://match-cut.org/showpost.php?p=367595&postcount=3497) all along.

[megladon8]

Picked up issue 1's of:

Action Comics
Batgirl
Detective Comics
Justice League
Swamp Thing


Hoping to read 'em tonight!

[ledfloyd]

i just finished the second trade of moore's swamp thing. i don't even have to hesitate before i agree with meg and say, yes, this is better than watchmen. it's really not even close. i feel the same sense of bliss reading it i did when reading my favorite moore works (from hell and promethea). it reminds me more than a little of the sandman and it's kind of crazy to think how influential it must have been. from the adult storytelling that would shape vertigo for the next 20 years to the inventive panelling that was clearly an influence on guys like JH Williams III it's influence is everywhere. unless it gets worse (and i can't imagine that happening with veitch and constantine showing up) this is going to end up in my top 20 comics.

[megladon8]

Glad you're enjoying it so much, ledfloyd :)

IMO it's Moore's very best work (that I've read so far, of course).

[Ezee E]

Hmmm, it's almost as if that was his plan (http://match-cut.org/showpost.php?p=367595&postcount=3497) all along.
Twas. Let's see how much they cost... Standby.

[Ezee E]

Twas. Let's see how much they cost... Standby.
Same cost as the comic itself. Not bad.

Went with Action Comics, Detective Comics, and Swamp Thing.

[Ezee E]

Read Action Comics and Detective Comics. Swamp Thing for tomorrow.

I've never been a fan of Superman before. Found him boring to talk about, but I think there might be something here in Action Comics. Seems younger, and more concerned about being noticed. Lex Luthor also seems like an ideal villain. Look forward to more of those.

Detective Comics is what I'd expect out of a first foray into Batman. Nothing exceptional I guess, but the setting is pretty neat as Sven mentioned.

The online approach is alright. It'll save me from having to trash paper, and I can always have them on file if I need to reference. Trying to decide if I'll go forward with some more.

[Ezee E]

Meh on Swamp Thing.

[Ezee E]

Surely the last image of Detective Comics got a rise out of you all? Probably the best thing, and a sure thing to get me into the next issue.

And while I can't complain about any of the artwork thus far in the three I've read, this is the one that actually caught my attention:

http://www.popmatters.com/images/reviews_art/1/105_revtecno1splash.jpg

[megladon8]

Oh man. "Swamp Thing". :eek:

[megladon8]

I really wasn't too thrilled with "Action Comics" too be honest. An interesting moment or piece of dialogue here and there, but it felt very slight to me. I certainly hope it's building up to something bigger and better.

[ledfloyd]

Surely the last image of Detective Comics got a rise out of you all? Probably the best thing, and a sure thing to get me into the next issue.
it more or less guaranteed i wouldn't be reading issue two.

[megladon8]

it more or less guaranteed i wouldn't be reading issue two.


Huh? Why?

[ledfloyd]

Huh? Why?
it just seemed like an empty attempt to shock and be 'gritty'. i thought the whole comic had that mid-90s image feel to it and that just sealed the deal for me.

i finished 100 bullets. what a wonderful final page. i love how all the disparate plot lines come together in the end and build to something wonderful and tragic. really looking forward to azzarello and risso's spaceman now.

[megladon8]

When I think of a Batman story that aped the mid-90s Image feel, the first thing to come to mind is "City of Crime".

What a horrid wreck that one was. I don't get why it has so many devoted fans. Much of the writing is laughably bad.

[Acapelli]

it seems like a poor man's http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z98/TheJoker138/j001.jpg

[Sven]

I've bit off the last of the new ones:

Batwing - Okay. Kind of Africa for Dummies. A little clipped. A few good ideas. **1/2

Batgirl - This is my first Batgirl comic and it reads like gangbusters. Terrific, kinetic action, and charm. A surprise. ***1/2

Static Shock - A bigger surprise, the biggest of the bunch. I've never liked McDaniel, but Static's battle with an orb of electricity made me believe. Character resonates. ***1/2

Justice League International - Easily the worst book so far. Transitions that don't make sense, chatty, headlong sequences that are a wincing echo of the inimitable tone of Giffen/DeMatteis's JL run. With two limp Justice League titles, hopefully that doesn't bode poorly for Dark. *1/2

All in all, I'm actually quite impressed so far.

[number8]

Have you read any of Simone's other stuff? Secret Six, Birds of Prey?

[Sven]

Have you read any of Simone's other stuff? Secret Six, Birds of Prey?

Not really, though I understand that I oughtta. I know a lot about her stuff from reading about it, though, and talking about it with people who come into the shop.

One thing I'm hoping for is a little less similarity among the remaining titles. More than a handful read exactly the same way. Action scene, character at home, villain trickles in, action scene, cliffhanger threatening new status quo. The publishers have clearly factored out formal innovation thus far. The ones that are strong are so because they are excellent examples of formula. Though there are a few exceptions: Swamp Thing, Animal Man, and Men of War, at least, aren't such numbingly obvious FIRST ISSUES.

[Ezee E]

Not really, though I understand that I oughtta. I know a lot about her stuff from reading about it, though, and talking about it with people who come into the shop.

One thing I'm hoping for is a little less similarity among the remaining titles. More than a handful read exactly the same way. Action scene, character at home, villain trickles in, action scene, cliffhanger threatening new status quo. The publishers have clearly factored out formal innovation thus far. The ones that are strong are so because they are excellent examples of formula. Though there are a few exceptions: Swamp Thing, Animal Man, and Men of War, at least, aren't such numbingly obvious FIRST ISSUES.
Well, Action Comics kind of starts off with a bang right off the getgo, with Lex watching via camera.........

Looks like I should at least check out Batgirl and Animal Man.

[megladon8]

I really like Gail Simone.

[megladon8]

The "Punisher MAX" story "Valley Forge, Valley Forge" may be one of the best things I've ever read.

Really great stuff.

[Sven]

10 issues into Starman confirms its reputation. I can't see how The Shade is not just the best character of all time.

[Ezee E]

Read Batgirl. That's the best one I've read out of the new 52 thus far. Quite easily too.

[megladon8]

10 issues into Starman confirms its reputation. I can't see how The Shade is not just the best character of all time.


Yes. You win the internet.

[number8]

10 issues into Starman confirms its reputation. I can't see how The Shade is not just the best character of all time.

The Shade mini is coming, dude. Get it. The artists lined up are tits.

[megladon8]

Did Robinson really do much of note afterwards?

I see his name pop up once in a while, but never with the acclaim attached to it that "Starman" had.

[EyesWideOpen]

Did Robinson really do much of note afterwards?

I see his name pop up once in a while, but never with the acclaim attached to it that "Starman" had.

He did the "Face the Face" storyline right after one year later that is one of my favorite batman stories. He also did alot of JSA, Hawkman, Legends of the Dark Knight and Superman stories that were all well received.

The only series I can recall where he had a negative reaction was his recent JLA stuff.

[number8]

With good reason. Cry for Justice was awwwwfulll.

[EyesWideOpen]

With good reason. Cry for Justice was awwwwfulll.

I know I'm in the minority but I liked it.

[ledfloyd]

dammit, now i'm tempted to give ennis another shot with punisher MAX.

[megladon8]

I'd forgotten that Robinson wrote "Face the Face".

I liked that one, but I don't remember it being very well received, at least critically.

[Sven]

Guys, Major Bummer is out this week. Please to be getting.

[number8]

Batwoman #1 is all that matters today.

[dreamdead]

Batwoman #1 is all that matters today.

Hells to the yeah.

Williams' reveal of the spread (p. 16 and 17) over at his site (http://www.jhwilliams3.com/archives/450) is stunning...

[ledfloyd]

having a monthly book with williams art in it is almost too much to handle.

[Ezee E]

Batman & Robin is a sure thing.

Batwoman and Grifter were maybes.

[number8]

What the fuck did they do to Amanda Waller in the new Suicide Squad? Argh.

[Sven]

More New52 blurbies -

Superboy - So bad. Characters lurch between thoughts and emotions contradictorily and without reason, and the blocking is boring. This exemplifies the flat-minded execution that people were fearing with the relaunch. Thankfully, the rest of this week's (save maybe one) are considerably better. *

Resurrection Man - I am an A&L skeptic, those workhorses' greatest virtue is their consistency of emission. Still, the premise, though undone majorly by clipping that could've read like a dream instead reading like a commercial, is strong and the artwork is largely moody and dramatic. **1/2

Red Lanterns - I wish I wasn't such a Milliganiac, so that my endorsement of this title wouldn't read like so much more whoring. Unafraid to fold real pain, and the pleasure of it, into this fantasy, Milligan (whose combo of poetic and blunt language still evokes an uncanny emotional space) and Benes (whose space monsters and landscapes are wholly satisfying) lay the foundation for a promising parable. ****

Batman and Robin - A bit of a let-down, I'm afraid, but Gleason offers some exceptional panels, my favorite in particular being a wide shot of B&R in the sewers looking up through a street grate on Crime Alley, the lamppost light illuminating a halo around Bats. The villain moments were cool (and sad, though... I liked The Bear), but the writing here is very pedestrian. Hm. **1/2

Demon Knights - Doesn't tarnish my opinion of Cornell's dialogue a skosh, and Neves is perfect for this ye olde English countryside fantasy stuff. Delightful entertainment. ****

Mister Terrific - Pretty terrific, though there is one hideous page that doesn't make any damn sense. Still, this one achieves exactly what the reboot set out to do: reinvigorate legacies to generate new fans. I don't know anything about Mr. Terrific, but if it's as sprightly and colorful as this current one's delirious sci-fi vision, I'm there. ***

Suicide Squad - New biggest surprise for me. Great structure, fantastic illustration, enticing premise. Agree about Waller, though. That was a triple take if ever I did one. ***1/2

Frankenstein - I always dig atypical illustration, but Lemire's characterization of Frankenstein is unsatisfying, and everything else is purely functional. No personality, just a boring story with cool monsters. **

Deathstroke - Well, I give it props for having the best pg 2-3 spread so far (save Batwoman's). Bennett's artwork is cool, but Higgins is kind of standard, not writing too interestingly an uninteresting story. Seems like a "fans only" title. Will still gawk at the Biz's covers. **

Legion Lost - I had to read this twice to get it. Buncha mumbo jumbo with a lot of poorly-defined characters spouting pseudoscience and spelling out details poorly. Is slightly better when it cuts to Alastor, but even still... would probably be the worst title if Woods's pencils didn't look so great. *1/2

Green Lantern - Will definitely stay on this one. Sequence where Jordan attempts the window rescue is classic Mahnke excellence, and the penultimate page, the lightning crack signaling the nadir of Hal's new Earthbound existence, is one of my favorites of the new 52 so far. ***1/2

Grifter - A dramatically satisfying first chapter that definitely could go either way at the moment. CAFU is neato, Edmonson wielding confident pace, but I worry that it's not unique enough, and it lacks a compelling raison d'etre. ***

Batwoman - Oooooo. It's easy to be tempted to express ambivalence about the title, just to even out the praise and anticipation, but facts are facts and this is a damn fine comic. Don't really have to explain why. You guys know how JH3 rolls. ****

Again, I'm quite pleased with the outcome. I say kudos to DC on a successful launch, both business-wise and product-wise.

[Sven]

Deathstroke - Well, I give it props for having the best pg 2-3 spread so far (save Batwoman's).

I just checked. Detective's splash of Batman running across the cloud-swept night sky, Suicide Squads moody bird's eye of a torture chamber, and (if you count) Swamp Things montage of DC heroes befuddled at the death of their avatar animals are all probably better as well. The Deathstroke one is pretty conventional by comparison, but its rendering of the Russian skyline, the dynamic shades, the incongruous emphasis on his armor scales, and the fact that it utilizes every square inch of the spread give it quite a lovely depth. Too often with splashes (as with the Red Lanterns), it ends up looking like a boring old picture magnified to fill up space.

[ledfloyd]

batwoman is fucking good. i'm afraid to say frankenstein was trying my patience by page 9 or 10.

that's the second glowing review of demon knights i've read. perhaps i should pick it up. despite milligan i can't say i'm much interested in red lanterns. i've never been able to get into the green lantern mythos.

[Sven]

that's the second glowing review of demon knights i've read. perhaps i should pick it up. despite milligan i can't say i'm much interested in red lanterns. i've never been able to get into the green lantern mythos.

I'm not too into the GL stuff either. My devotion to it is entirely talent-based, so Mahnke (being my favorite illustrator as noted pages back) and Milligan (being my favorite writer as noted pages back) definitely have me reading. You really don't need to know anything about Lantern mythology to get what's going on. And knowing Milligan, I doubt he'll incorporate too much DCU detail.

One of these times, I wanna sit down and try an actual review for comics. I've still only been able to keep it at blurb levels of engagement.

[number8]

HAHAAA I was turning the pages with glee at Demon Knights. So fucking awesome.

Agree with Sven. This, Red Lanterns and Batwoman are the best of the bunch this week, but that's if we were to ignore that the conclusion to Criminal was also out this week.

I got Ultimate Spider-Man #1 too. Haven't read yet. I wanted to come here immediately to express my joy at Demon Knights.

[ledfloyd]

One of these times, I wanna sit down and try an actual review for comics. I've still only been able to keep it at blurb levels of engagement.
same here, which probably does disservice to my love for the medium.

perhaps i'll snag red lanterns if i go back for demon knights. one issue can't hurt. but i'm infinitely more interested in justice league dark.

[megladon8]

I think "Batwoman" may be my favorite of all the new 52 so far.

And "Frankenstein: Agent of S.H.A.D.E." was great fun. What a brilliant concept.

[dreamdead]

Re: Batwoman #1. Gorgeous artwork by Williams throughout (love the compression of the entire Elegy narrative and artstyles in the reflection spread), and it seems as though he and Blackman have a good grasp of her clipped vocal trends, which I'm excited to see after Rucka left.

Still a little confused about the nipplege action in Batwoman's costume (shouldn't the bra mask this?), and some of the art layouts with her and Bette seemed a bit cheesecakey by Williams's standards, but the cinematic realism achieved in the action scenes is just wonderful.

[number8]

Good article that summarizes the current zeitgeist of the medium. Please all read and let's discuss.

http://www.popmatters.com/pm/column/146865-the-comics-writer-and-the-fall-of-the-superpowers

[Sven]

The climate is interesting for me, particularly because I'm so new to the scene. I wasn't interested in comics until the last few years, and now that I'm invested, I'm being told it's to a near-corpse.

I don't know if I have too much to say about the subject. I haven't developed industry concerns, except where it comes to me keeping my LCS job, as I find that there is a vast and rewarding history of publications just waiting to be rediscovered. But I do agree that DC should have focused on completely new, rather than revamp. And I do wish that the article had factored in the trends of comics journalism.

[megladon8]

Arrrgh. My LCS oversold "Red Lanterns" and "Demon Knights" by one issue and I was the very last person to pre-order, so I have to wait hopefully for a subsequent printing(s).

Ultimate frowny face.

[number8]

Do you have Hastings up in Canada? (http://www.bleedingcool.com/forums/showthread.php?47178-Want-DC-Relaunch-First-Prints-Head-To-Hastings)

[megladon8]

Nope.

[ledfloyd]

a very different take on red lanterns (http://thinkinginpanels.blogspot.com/2011/09/dcs-new-52-week-2-september-14-2011.html)

[ledfloyd]

in regards to that article i tend to agree with this statement: "But the truth seems to be that new ideas come most from new writers, and the best of them come from people who, like Moore, are fundamentally and unarguably free in their own imagination."

most of my favorite work is coming from outside of DC and Marvel. and even the stuff i like most that's being published by them is mostly coming from Icon and Vertigo. even most of my favorite "mainstream" creators seem to do their best work on their creator-owned properties; Brubaker's Criminal, Azzarello's 100 Bullets, Aaron's Scalped, Kirkman's Walking Dead, to use an example that isn't a crime comic. sure there are exceptions (Miller did his best work on Daredevil and Batman), and Grant Morrison is an outright outlier. but i think (despite some promising titles in this reboot) DC and Marvel are struggling because of creative bankruptcy. and at least for me, i'm finding the majority of my pleasures elsewhere. the only huge downside i see in this is the havoc it's wreaking on LCS's.

[ledfloyd]

and, forgive the triple post, but i've finished swamp thing. i'm not sure it maintained the great energy it had early on through the entire run but it's certainly an impressive piece of work. pretty easily my favorite thing moore did in the 80s. the issue with him on the blue planet completely killed me. really something.

my next endeavor will be milligan's shade the changing man.

[Sven]

and, forgive the triple post, but i've finished swamp thing. i'm not sure it maintained the great energy it had early on through the entire run but it's certainly an impressive piece of work. pretty easily my favorite thing moore did in the 80s. the issue with him on the blue planet completely killed me. really something.

my next endeavor will be milligan's shade the changing man.

Nice. I made mention of the Blue Planet issue on my 51 list. So good. And Shade is immense. I'm definitely happy he's come back in vogue. I've been reading the original Ditko series and loving it deeply, and his recent cameo in Hellblazer is easily my favorite Constantine stuff to date. Have you got all the issues?

And if I had to apologize for all the triple posts I've made in this thread, nearly a third of my posts would be apologies.

[Melville]

I'm about to move to the UK, and the company I'm shipping my books with warned me not to send any pornographic material containing children—which seems like a simple thing to avoid, but now I don't know what to do with my copy of Lost Girls. Damn Alan Moore.

[ledfloyd]

Have you got all the issues?
i obtained them of dubious means, as that seems to be the only way to get them these days.

[Sven]

i obtained them of dubious means, as that seems to be the only way to get them these days.

Not to discourage your dubiousness, but mycomicshop.com has all the issues for around a buck a piece (some of the later issues get a bit pricier):

http://www.mycomicshop.com/search?TID=109921

[Acapelli]

or get them from midtown: http://www.midtowncomics.com/store/search.asp?q=Shade+The+Changin g+Man&sh=100&reld=1/1/1900&reld2=1/1/1900&furl=pl=16@@q=Shade+The+Changi ng+Man

they've also got a 25% off coupon off all dc back issues if you choose to go that route

edit: they all seem to be 23-24% off already anyway, so it really wouldn't help much

[Ezee E]

Batman & Robin....

Ewwww.