When first reading this, my first reaction was well at least Duke will be happy they didn't land Bay. Oops.Quoting Watashi (view post)
A steal on the Dodgers part. They keep both Kemp and Ethier. They gave up next to nothing and received a solid bat that'll help them get into the playoffs and lose in the first round. An outfield including Juan Pierre and Manny isn't too enviable though.
So is Andruw Jones officially the dumbest signing of the year?
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:frustrated:
Bad deal for the Pirates. That's probably something Pirate fans are used to hearing. Maybe Moss develops into a nice player. He's show skill in his brief stint with the Sox. But how do you not get more out of the Dodgers for helping them get this deal done?
The moment the ink dried on his contract.
9 mil (or whatever) to be a 5th outfielder.
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CUBS SWEEP!
Last Five Films I've Seen (Out of 5)
The Boy, The Mole, The Fox and the Horse (Mackesy, 2022) 4.5
Puss In Boots: The Last Wish (Crawford, 2022) 4
Confess, Fletch (Mottola, 2022) 3.5
M3GAN (Johnstone, 2023) 3.5
Turning Red (Shi, 2022) 4.5
Tokyo Story (Ozu, 1953) 5
615 Film
Letterboxd
That Cubs sweep is utterly sick. I love it.
To me the Red Sox actually come out well in that trade. They got rid of a man who really was killing club house chemistry, wasn't very good at playing outfield defense, and really didn't hustle in terms of base running. For a guy who's what, 7 or so years younger, actually plays defense, and has a decent amount of upside? The Dodgers may see Manny leave if they don't pay him the dough he wants, but for now he's going to give them some pop in the outfield. But that's about it. I can't help but agree that the Pirates (for now anyways) got the raw end of the deal.
Ken Griffey Jr. clearly wants a last shot at a ring. But why does he have to go to the demonic White Sox to get a shot at it? Bah.
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Even if Manny bolts after the season the Dodgers will get two sandwich picks, which may or may not turn out better than what they gave up for his two months worth of Dodger-dom. Well worth it, if you ask me.
i'm not a pirates fan but i'm from pittsburgh. i have no idea what they were thinking. they should've at least got kemp out of that. moss should help them, and hansen might do better in the NL. but damn. i think they fucked up in not getting more from LA. laroche and morris for manny? they stole him.
the nady trade doesn't make a whole lot of sense either.
as a red sox fan, i've never been more saddened by a trade. when manny said at the beginning of the season he wanted the sox to pick up his two options and then sign him for another for years so he could retire in boston i was elated.
while he's not always easy to defend, and frankly, at times shouldn't be defended. he's been my favorite player since he was in cleveland. i watched him play alot at the jake and i've never had more fun watching anyone in baseball. he's a technician at the plate and his goofball antics are hysterical. cutting off damon, falling onto a fly he dove for and missed, the high five earlier this year, sneaking into the green monster, rubbing tavarez' head. lots of fond memories even if at the time i was thinking "what the hell are you doing?" i can look back on them and laugh.
having manny on the sox for 7 and a half years was great fun, i'm just upset we couldn't watch him hit 600 and retire here.
and i can't see how bay is anywhere near manny. do you think yankee pitchers are going to be nervous when bay steps up to the plate? not really. with manny, absofuckinglutely. he was a sure-thing first ballot hall-of-famer and if you consider his power numbers along with his average/ability to hit doubles. i think he's top 20 all-around hitters all-time. if not higher. even on the decline, he's proved, especially in the postseason last year, he can still produce when it matters.
Yeah, I'm not big on Jason Bay either. I think the Dodgers are the only team to benefit from this trade. The Red Sox gave up too much for too little, as did the Pirates. I know the Sox felt like they needed to get this done, but how many years in a row did Manny call people out and act like he wanted to be traded, only to not be traded and completely change his tune? That's where "Manny being Manny" originated. The Sox should have kept him through the end of the season and then let him walk instead of trading him for 50 cents on the dollar.
The BoSox made it so it would be acceptable to their fans for them to cut bait on him...very savvy by Theo & Co. It helps when you OWN your own network (NESN) and have essential partial ownership in another (ESPN) w/ Peter Gammons whose been on their payroll since the 70s when he was with the Boston Globe.
They basically paid 7 million to downgrade their offense.
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i wonder if this isn't the case. they did similar things with pedro, nomar, damon, mo vaughn, etc...
Seems to me like they know when to cut their losses.
Yeah, I still don't see this being that bad of a trade for the Red Sox. It was a trade out of necessity. Manny would be gone next year. They weren't going to extend his stay another year after him dragging the Sox down in print. They get a good/great player for next year on the "cheap." They would've got at the most two draft picks for losing Manny to free agency. (Is this still true if they would turn down his option?) Bay, chances are, will be much better than either two players they'd pick.
Manny brought this upon the Red Sox fans, it wasn't the Red Sox front office. Go whining about your company in the press and see how long you keep your job.
Player A
(2005): .327 EqA, 10.6 WARP3, 150 OPS+
(2006): .316 EqA, 10.6 WARP3, 138 OPS+
(2007): .269 EqA, 3.5 WARP3, 93 OPS+
(2008): .327 EqA, 6.7 WARP3, 137 OPS+
Player B
(2005): .327 EqA, 7.3 WARP3, 153 OPS+
(2006): .343 EqA, 6.4 WARP3, 165 OPS+
(2007): .303 EqA, 5.7 WARP3, 126 OPS+
(2008): .319 EqA, 7.6 WARP3, 140 OPS+
These are not dissimilar players (both have been worth ~30 wins above replacement over the last four years). To suggest that Boston made a poor trade is to succumb to name recognition.
Also, Andy LaRoche is a blue chip prospect who was inexplicably buried by an incompetent GM and manager. That Pittsburgh landed three back-end roster fillers in addition is just icing on the cake.
All three teams came ahead in this deal. At worst, Boston made a lateral move, sparing themselves an unneeded distraction in the process.
with a couple days to let this settle in i'm alot more at peace with this situation. manny is my favorite player. i would've loved to have him in boston for the next six years and had him retire there. despite his off-field antics i've never had more fun watching anyone play.
EqA is a metric that is going to favor Bay since Manny isn't a great baserunner. i still don't really trust win statistics.
Jason Bay is an average All-Star. he's really really good. but Manny had a rare talent for hitting. he's one of the best all around hitters to ever play the game. top ten in career OPS. he's going to be the 8th person to have 500 doubles and 500 home runs, joining ted williams, babe ruth, willie mays, barry bonds and hank aaron. he not only hits for power but he hits for average and he racks up a ton of doubles. he's a hitting savant. Jason Bay may well fill the gap sufficiently. but he will never be Manny Ramirez. and that's why i'm sad to see him go. it's not name recognition.
Career stats don't help your argument. Career stats won't help the Dodgers win the division. That being said, I definitely think the Red Sox downgraded.
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I didn't even realize that the Dodgers had traded for Casey Blake. Heh.
Why Jones was in the starting lineup instead of Ethier is beyond me. His defense does not make up for his complete offensive sucktitude right now.
Contagion (Soderbergh, 2011) - 6.5
The Descendants (Payne, 2011) - 7.5
Midnight in Paris (Allen, 2011) - 5
Margin Call (Chandor, 2011) - 6.5
The Ides of March (Clooney, 2011) - 5
Nice piece on Bill James on 60 minutes just now.
Anyone catch it?
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Carlos Lee: out 6-8 weeks
Carl Crawford: 15 day DL
Damn you, E, and your prophetic curse!
Totally agree. I was also pissed with the nomar trade, and look how that turned out.
I should sig that.
But only if you end up in second place by the end of the year. That would be awesome.
Once again the Cardinals won the battle but lost the war. The Cubs shouldn't have lost that first series against them, either. Dempster is the man at home.
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And everybody wants to be special here
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The Diamondbacks just acquired Adam Dunn from the Reds for three prospects.
Sure why not?
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