View Poll Results: Star Trek Beyond

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Thread: Star Trek Beyond (Justin Lin)

  1. #26

  2. #27
    Kung Fu Hippie Watashi's Avatar
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    Not as bad as Star Trek Into Darkness, but very dull and boring. I still think Trek 09 holds up, but this film was a bunch of noise and flying objects. There's some fun quips and each member of the crew gets their trademark spotlight to shine in, but there's no meat on this film. The initial attack on the Enterprise has zero stakes. Despite the Enterprise being torn apart, I never felt real danger or was worried any harm would happen. Anytime something worse would happen to the ship, Scottie or Chekov would pipe in that there is some back-up generator whatnot to get them out. The new female warrior member is a non-entity. I think Scottie calls her "lassie" more than anyone refers her to her actual name. We don't get a sense of who she is or her family. She just has nifty tricks and somehow that's character development.

    The little nod to the old TOS crew at the end made me wish for a more faithful Trek film in the true Rodenberry spirit. It's a shame that Star Wars and Star Trek have become inseparable.

    Oh well, there's always Discovery coming up.
    Sure why not?

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  3. #28
    Since 1929 Morris Schæffer's Avatar
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    Yay for me, but huge reservations. I mean, after all the uproar with Into Darkness and how it didn't have an original bone in its body, Paramount (and writers) has had the staggering audacity to [
    ]

    True, he's not genetically engineered, but fuck fuck fuck. What's more, the whole mining thing I'm sure is straight out of 2009 Star Trek, but my memory is hazy on that one. Wasn't Nero's ship The Harada a mining vessel?

    Edit: Nay for me. Not a total loss, but too similar to what came before. I just don't feel anything anymore when the Enterprise gets cut in half for the millionth time. Indeed, rebuilding her is literally shown as a time-lapse sequence.
    Last edited by Morris Schæffer; 08-18-2016 at 07:31 PM.
    MOVIES

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    • Son of Saul (Nemes, 2015) ✦✦✦ [+]
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    • Hudson Hawk (Lehmann, 1991) [+]
    • Extraction (Hargrave, 2020) ✦✦½ [-]
    • Underwater (Eubank, 2020) ✦✦✦ [-]
    • Leviathan (Cosmatos, 1989) ✦✦ [-] -- rewatch
    • The Remains of the Day (Ivory, 1993) ✦✦✦½ [-]
    • The Call of the Wild (Sanders, 2020) ✦✦ [+]
    • Saving Mr. Banks (Hancock, 2013) ✦✦½ [-]
    • The Princess Bride (Reiner, 1987) ✦✦ [+]
    • Hunt for the Wilderpeople (Waititi, 2016) ✦✦✦ [+]
    • The Invisible Man (Whannell, 2020) ✦✦✦✦

    TV

    • Ozark (S1) ✦✦✦½ [-] / Killing Eve (S3) ✦✦ [+] / Orange is the New Black (S7) ✦✦✦ [-]
    • Orange is the New Black (S6) ✦✦½ [+] / The Man in the High Castle (S4) ✦✦✦½ [+] / Orange is the New Black (S5) ✦½ [+]

    ====================
    LAST THINGS BOUGHT

    • Patriot Games / Clear and Present Danger (Noyce, 1992/1994) -- 4K Ultra HD / Paramount Pictures
    • E.T. The Extra-Terrestrial (Spielberg, 1982) -- 4K Ultra HD / Universal Studios
    • Schindler's List (Spielberg, 1993) -- 4K Ultra HD / Universal Studios
    • Saving Private Ryan (Spielberg, 1998) -- 4K Ultra HD / Paramount Pictures
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  4. #29
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    Huh? None of that happened to Khan. He wasn't employed, or stranded and abandoned. The Starfleet officer thing was a cover story. He was a hostage.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  5. #30
    Since 1929 Morris Schæffer's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting number8 (view post)
    Huh? None of that happened to Khan. He wasn't employed, or stranded and abandoned. The Starfleet officer thing was a cover story. He was a hostage.
    Ok i forgot about that. Anyway, still another revenge story. But i liked at least the revelation about Krall because for the longest time i was wondering where his story was going. That took too long as others have said.
    MOVIES

    [+] closer to next rating / [-] closer to previous rating

    • Son of Saul (Nemes, 2015) ✦✦✦ [+]
    • Cast Away (Zemeckis, 2000) ✦✦✦✦ -- rewatch
    • Hudson Hawk (Lehmann, 1991) [+]
    • Extraction (Hargrave, 2020) ✦✦½ [-]
    • Underwater (Eubank, 2020) ✦✦✦ [-]
    • Leviathan (Cosmatos, 1989) ✦✦ [-] -- rewatch
    • The Remains of the Day (Ivory, 1993) ✦✦✦½ [-]
    • The Call of the Wild (Sanders, 2020) ✦✦ [+]
    • Saving Mr. Banks (Hancock, 2013) ✦✦½ [-]
    • The Princess Bride (Reiner, 1987) ✦✦ [+]
    • Hunt for the Wilderpeople (Waititi, 2016) ✦✦✦ [+]
    • The Invisible Man (Whannell, 2020) ✦✦✦✦

    TV

    • Ozark (S1) ✦✦✦½ [-] / Killing Eve (S3) ✦✦ [+] / Orange is the New Black (S7) ✦✦✦ [-]
    • Orange is the New Black (S6) ✦✦½ [+] / The Man in the High Castle (S4) ✦✦✦½ [+] / Orange is the New Black (S5) ✦½ [+]

    ====================
    LAST THINGS BOUGHT

    • Patriot Games / Clear and Present Danger (Noyce, 1992/1994) -- 4K Ultra HD / Paramount Pictures
    • E.T. The Extra-Terrestrial (Spielberg, 1982) -- 4K Ultra HD / Universal Studios
    • Schindler's List (Spielberg, 1993) -- 4K Ultra HD / Universal Studios
    • Saving Private Ryan (Spielberg, 1998) -- 4K Ultra HD / Paramount Pictures
    • Spider-Man 2 (Raimi, 2004) -- 4K Ultra HD / Sony Pictures


  6. #31
    Replacing Luck Since 1984 Dukefrukem's Avatar
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    The Nays here are baffling me.

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  7. #32
    Bark! Go away Russ's Avatar
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    It was like a box of cereal, with some colorful designs on the outside of the box.

    But make no mistake, that was one empty box of cereal.
    Last edited by Russ; 08-18-2016 at 11:04 PM.

  8. #33
    Quote Quoting Russ (view post)
    It was like a box of cereal, with some colorful designs on the outside of the box.

    But make no mistake, that was one empty box of cereal.
    It's somewhat empty, but I'll take that over the overstuffed MCU, which mistakes cameos and call backs for depth and complexity. But the world building here is leagues above that of the MCU, which always just seems like a stack of individual origin stories flung together and then swirled around a bit for the Avengers and latest Captain America, rather than a tangible universe with its own culture, technology, point of view. The space station is a much more impressive setting than anything I can remember in any MCU movie, which is just a bunch of generic places where shit has to go down, rather than something that seems organic and designed.

    Having said that, what will it take for these types of movies to break away from the McGuffin + secret weapon nonsense that so often drives the plots? Why can't it be more like a war movie, where the threat is tangible and clear and already there, and the movie is just about tactically outmaneuvering it? Why does so much time have to be taken up with tiresome searches for some generic plot piece and the impending doom of a one-off strike weapon?
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  9. #34
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Morris Schæffer (view post)
    Ok i forgot about that. Anyway, still another revenge story. But i liked at least the revelation about Krall because for the longest time i was wondering where his story was going. That took too long as others have said.
    This isn't so much a defense but the last time I rewatched TOS I did notice how many of the episodes were about Starfleet captains going crazy and wanting to kill everyone because of something or other.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  10. #35
    Generic sci-fantasy adventure. Change up the uniforms and logos, call it the League of Planets and Galactic Command, does it make any difference? Nope. Because this sure as shit ain't Star Trek.
    Last edited by Irish; 10-09-2016 at 04:57 AM.

  11. #36
    Since 1929 Morris Schæffer's Avatar
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    Yeah, basically all that Irish. In their defense, all the shit with switching directors may have harmed the movie. Although I don't doubt for a second all Paramount wants is action action action. It's like they got so burned with some of the older movies that they're afraid to go back to something with 20% action.
    MOVIES

    [+] closer to next rating / [-] closer to previous rating

    • Son of Saul (Nemes, 2015) ✦✦✦ [+]
    • Cast Away (Zemeckis, 2000) ✦✦✦✦ -- rewatch
    • Hudson Hawk (Lehmann, 1991) [+]
    • Extraction (Hargrave, 2020) ✦✦½ [-]
    • Underwater (Eubank, 2020) ✦✦✦ [-]
    • Leviathan (Cosmatos, 1989) ✦✦ [-] -- rewatch
    • The Remains of the Day (Ivory, 1993) ✦✦✦½ [-]
    • The Call of the Wild (Sanders, 2020) ✦✦ [+]
    • Saving Mr. Banks (Hancock, 2013) ✦✦½ [-]
    • The Princess Bride (Reiner, 1987) ✦✦ [+]
    • Hunt for the Wilderpeople (Waititi, 2016) ✦✦✦ [+]
    • The Invisible Man (Whannell, 2020) ✦✦✦✦

    TV

    • Ozark (S1) ✦✦✦½ [-] / Killing Eve (S3) ✦✦ [+] / Orange is the New Black (S7) ✦✦✦ [-]
    • Orange is the New Black (S6) ✦✦½ [+] / The Man in the High Castle (S4) ✦✦✦½ [+] / Orange is the New Black (S5) ✦½ [+]

    ====================
    LAST THINGS BOUGHT

    • Patriot Games / Clear and Present Danger (Noyce, 1992/1994) -- 4K Ultra HD / Paramount Pictures
    • E.T. The Extra-Terrestrial (Spielberg, 1982) -- 4K Ultra HD / Universal Studios
    • Schindler's List (Spielberg, 1993) -- 4K Ultra HD / Universal Studios
    • Saving Private Ryan (Spielberg, 1998) -- 4K Ultra HD / Paramount Pictures
    • Spider-Man 2 (Raimi, 2004) -- 4K Ultra HD / Sony Pictures


  12. #37
    ............... Skitch's Avatar
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    Hmmm, I wouldn't say that you are wrong Irish, but maybe my expectations for a Star Trek picture are far lower than yours. After all, this is a series that time travelled with whales for crying out loud. I know ST is revered as the smart and hopeful future, but theres an assload of mindboggingly dumb stuff its heralded since it began. Tribbles.

  13. #38
    Replacing Luck Since 1984 Dukefrukem's Avatar
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    Wow. Irish and my's (me's? I's?- why can't i think of how to write this?) interest seems to diverging in complete opposite direction. But I loved this Trek. So much that it will be the only one out of the three new ones that I own.

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  14. #39
    Quote Quoting Skitch (view post)
    Hmmm, I wouldn't say that you are wrong Irish, but maybe my expectations for a Star Trek picture are far lower than yours. After all, this is a series that time travelled with whales for crying out loud. I know ST is revered as the smart and hopeful future, but theres an assload of mindboggingly dumb stuff its heralded since it began. Tribbles.
    Voyage Home was a caper movie wrapped in sci-fi, but even that managed to present more genuine ideas than Beyond. (And shit, it more or less did that in about 20 minutes of screentime compared to Beyond's 2 hours.)

    I don't mind silly elements if they help the story get going or they're tonally consistent with what a show is trying to do.

    But I do get annoyed when writers base their stories on coincidence, McGuffins, and stock villains. Too much of the writing here was either trite or awkward.

    I get what you're saying about nitpicky criticisms (and Star Trek is always an easy mark) -- but Beyond was much more of a big, dumb blockbuster than it was a Star Trek movie.

    Sometimes I can dig that, but this time I couldn't.

  15. #40
    Since 1929 Morris Schæffer's Avatar
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    Time-traveling whales sounds somewhat silly, but in the end those are just 3 words. I think the movie wrapped around it simply works and is a bit lighter than usual while still offering an entirely captivating what if scenario. There's an undercurrent too in The Voyage Home about protecting the environment and its ecosystem, so it never played out as silly. Though never on the nose either.

    I think 80's era San Francisco beats the new planet in Beyond. Which is crazy.

    Same with Tribbles. That's not dumb (insofar as I remember it right). That's playful. Trials and Tribble-ations is one of the top 5 Trek TV episodes of all time, but admittedly far more resonating than the original Tribble episode.
    MOVIES

    [+] closer to next rating / [-] closer to previous rating

    • Son of Saul (Nemes, 2015) ✦✦✦ [+]
    • Cast Away (Zemeckis, 2000) ✦✦✦✦ -- rewatch
    • Hudson Hawk (Lehmann, 1991) [+]
    • Extraction (Hargrave, 2020) ✦✦½ [-]
    • Underwater (Eubank, 2020) ✦✦✦ [-]
    • Leviathan (Cosmatos, 1989) ✦✦ [-] -- rewatch
    • The Remains of the Day (Ivory, 1993) ✦✦✦½ [-]
    • The Call of the Wild (Sanders, 2020) ✦✦ [+]
    • Saving Mr. Banks (Hancock, 2013) ✦✦½ [-]
    • The Princess Bride (Reiner, 1987) ✦✦ [+]
    • Hunt for the Wilderpeople (Waititi, 2016) ✦✦✦ [+]
    • The Invisible Man (Whannell, 2020) ✦✦✦✦

    TV

    • Ozark (S1) ✦✦✦½ [-] / Killing Eve (S3) ✦✦ [+] / Orange is the New Black (S7) ✦✦✦ [-]
    • Orange is the New Black (S6) ✦✦½ [+] / The Man in the High Castle (S4) ✦✦✦½ [+] / Orange is the New Black (S5) ✦½ [+]

    ====================
    LAST THINGS BOUGHT

    • Patriot Games / Clear and Present Danger (Noyce, 1992/1994) -- 4K Ultra HD / Paramount Pictures
    • E.T. The Extra-Terrestrial (Spielberg, 1982) -- 4K Ultra HD / Universal Studios
    • Schindler's List (Spielberg, 1993) -- 4K Ultra HD / Universal Studios
    • Saving Private Ryan (Spielberg, 1998) -- 4K Ultra HD / Paramount Pictures
    • Spider-Man 2 (Raimi, 2004) -- 4K Ultra HD / Sony Pictures


  16. #41
    ............... Skitch's Avatar
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    Guys I havent met the Star Trek I dont like. Im a fan. But sometimes its ridiculous. Thats all Im saying.

  17. #42
    Replacing Luck Since 1984 Dukefrukem's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Irish (view post)
    Voyage Home was a caper movie wrapped in sci-fi, but even that managed to present more genuine ideas than Beyond. (And shit, it more or less did that in about 20 minutes of screentime compared to Beyond's 2 hours.)
    Well for me a Star Trek movie doesn't need to be all that thought provoking. And honestly the time travel element in Voyage Home felt more of a cop out to me than any other Star Trek we've seen.

    Script Writer: "What can we have them use in the past that will be silly... I know, let's have them speak into a mouse"

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  18. #43
    I get that; I'm saying there's a difference between "dumb" and "ridiculous," if you'll let me parse things that finely.

    Time travel, AI, clones, all this modern day sci-fi shit is ridiculous. Whether it's dumb is in the presentation. (eg: The Island was dumb, Moon was not.)

    Voyage Home had a premise based on man's place in the universe and a plot that had no villain. When was the last time you saw those kind of ideas in a big studio movie? I mean, sure, "time traveling whales" might be silly on the face of it, but there was some real cleverness around how that was executed.

    Then look at Beyond. Forget Star Trek for a minute. Forget science fiction. This wasn't even a good blockbuster movie. The whole project felt warmed over.

    No wonder audiences turned away from shit like this, X-Men, and Ghostbusters. They were all the same. Totally perfunctory.

  19. #44
    Second star to the right [ETM]'s Avatar
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    "Audiences turned away" and none of the above actually bombed?

  20. #45
    Moderator TGM's Avatar
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    No, but they did underperform. Though then again, most movies this year underperformed it seems, so...

  21. #46
    All the movies I mentioned (and let's throw Independence Day: Resurgence onto the pile, too) were released in 4,000 theaters across the U.S. All of them had similar budgets (and presumably a similar P&A spend).

    None of them made back their budget at the domestic box office.

    Star Trek: Beyond -- $185MM budget ($158MM domestic)
    Ghostbusters -- $144 ($127)
    X-Men: Apocalypse -- $178 ($155)
    Independence Day: Resurgence -- $165 ($103)

    Tack on another $50-100MM for prints & advertising, which means the studios spent anywhere from $200MM to $250MM each on these titles.

    All of them had a similar foreign return (with the exception of X-Men, which fared a little better). Studios aren't looking for such a thin margin on these movies. They're looking for big box office, which they didn't get.

    Tepid domestic box office is an indication that these movies did not have return business or good word of mouth. Everybody saw the ads. The movies played at a theater nearby. They didn't give a shit. The mass audience simply wasn't interested. Or, to put it another way: The audience turned away from these movies.

    There were a ton of articles about this summer's slump.

    - Summer 2016 Box Office: Are Sequels, The Critics Or Bad Movies To Blame?

    - Most of 2016’s movies have been soulless, noisy, and dull

    - Summer Box Office: Feast or Famine as Blockbusters Either Hit Big or Flop Spectacularly

    - The summer of our discontent: When franchise overload killed movie originality

    - Why Audiences Keep Choking On A Diet Of Sequels

    And on a wider scale, the same thing happened in China.

    - China Box Office Slumping, Official Numbers Show

    - What's Behind China's Sudden Box-Office Slump?

    - China's Box-Office Slump Deepens After Drought of Summer Hits

    - After years of steady growth, China's movie-ticket sales cooled this summer for the first time in nine years. Here's why.

    So. I didn't use the word, but how do you define "bomb"?
    Last edited by Irish; 10-01-2016 at 04:55 AM.

  22. #47

  23. #48
    Replacing Luck Since 1984 Dukefrukem's Avatar
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    Fuck. Yeh, that was what pissed me off with Into Darkness. Now I hate this movie.

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  24. #49
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    I had a lot of fun with the first two, but this was bad.

    Worst villain I've seen in any film in a long time. What exactly was his motivation? "I'm a soldier, and peace is boring!"

    Bad bad bad. Action scenes weren't even good, and some horrible effects. That shot of Kirk and Layla or whatever her name was on the motorcycle together was shameful.

  25. #50
    Moderator Dead & Messed Up's Avatar
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    I'm on the train that says this is the best of the reboot series. It's a fun, self-contained adventure that overdoes the bombast-spectacular at times but has a deft, loving touch.

    The film effectively splits up the cast and gives the character stories the right amount of time, so they feel light but also true. In all, the character story is basically, "Should we still be doing this?... (movie) ... yep." But Lin directs action more effectively than Abrams - the piece-by-piece dismantling of the Enterprise by the swarm keeps a clear geography and sense of escalation (it recalls that Spielbergian Indy spirit of out of the frying pan, into the fire, into the furnace), and he somehow keeps the MC Escher climax comprehensible, if not quite as thrilling as it could have been, because...

    like others also, I agree that Krall's motivations should've been introduced earlier and developed further. It's all a little abstract by the end, and what poignancy there is comes from Elba's playing of the role. It also would've been nice if Boutella's Jaala (sic) had some more involvement with the climax re: facing Krall. After all, she's experienced the "frontier" as well and makes the choice to trust and engage with the Federation, and her story revolves around Krall destroying her family.

    [That late-reveal villain motivation is a current pox on pop cinema; crazily, it was the same problem with, of all things, Zootopia. I feel like, in most cases, the sooner we know what a villain is after and why, the sooner we can truly invest in the conflict. There's this weird mass confusion among Hollywood that it's better to be clever than it is to be clear. Think of how it takes three-quarters of BvS for us to learn that Luthor wants Superman dead because he threw his daddy issues into a fascist reading of Epicurus.]

    The nod with the original photograph of the crew made me feel feelings. It didn't play as just some retro nod, because the film genuinely believes in the camaraderie of its heroes. When the ending closes with the "Space, the final frontier" dialogue, and it's read by all members of the crew, closing with Uhura, it's a reminder that Lin - in his very best moments - carries a bit of the spirit of Hawks. Not his mastery, by no means, but his enthusiasm and genuine interest in the good faith and trust of "the team." This is the guy who turned the Fast series into a billion-dollar saga about car crashes that truly believes it's all about "family." He was a good choice to helm this entry, which is never deep, never great, but almost always entertaining.

    It's a bit of a bummer that this series seems destined for the summer blockbuster mentality, but if the continuing series can carry this one's coherence and enthusiasm, I can't beef. The whole attitude is summed up by Kirk rejecting an admiral position at the end by saying, "Where's the fun in that?"

    Sidebar: the use of Beastie Boys during the climax is introduced in such a laborious way that it circles back to being funny. The second they need to find a way to "jam" the enemy craft, you know what's coming. And then there's two or three more scenes of them working their way up to the moment.

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