View Poll Results: ZOOTOPIA

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Thread: Zootopia (Byron Howard, Rich Moore)

  1. #1
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    Zootopia (Byron Howard, Rich Moore)

    Last 11 things I really enjoyed:

    Speed Racer (Wachowski/Wachowski, 2008)
    Safe (Haynes, 1995)
    South Park: Bigger, Longer & Uncut (Parker, 1999)
    Beastie Boys Story (Jonze, 2020)
    Bad Trip (Sakurai, 2020)
    What's Up Doc? (Bogdanovich, 1972)
    Diva (Beineix, 1981)
    Delicatessen (Caro/Jeunet, 1991)
    The Hunger (Scott, 1983)
    Pineapple Express (Green, 2008)
    Chungking Express (Wong, 1994)

  2. #2
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    OK. First I'll just say I don't think I'd put Zootopia on the tier of the super-impressive and very rewatchable Tangled, Wreck-It Ralph, or Big Hero 6 in terms of this recent era of Walt Disney Animation (with Frozen obviously an unimpeachable juggernaut at this point that as much as I feel has its moments, is still very much on the clunky/hollow side overall), BUT this movie is kind of stunning for even existing, and not just for its fantastic animation, boundless and gorgeous design, its voice cast's performances, and so on (and to all those things I'm not sure I have a single caveat), BUT because the core of its story has some huge thematic subtext that slowly bubbles to the surface as it moves along that plunges the whole thing into an allegory I was never expecting in the best and most blindsiding of ways.

    The only way to delve further is to go into spoilers just past its visible third act break, and since the movie is still something of a old-school buddy detective story where things/identities only get revealed and then twisted upon from there it's obvious major players aren't going to be who they seem, but let's just say that the plot of the movie that heavily plays into the usual, bigger, "be anything you want" Disney themes here involves [
    ] that all made my mouth go kind of agape and made me feel weirdly proud of Disney(?!) for letting it all swirl together into this still-very-crowd-pleasing narrative that just happens to go in pretty dark, beautifully uncomfortable and challenging places. And really, here of all places.

    I know this has been in various states of development for years, but how did a big Disney animated release (a March one, no less) manage to torpedo itself so amazingly (and even somewhat cathartically) into such a currently perfect social and political zeitgeist to hold a mirror to? Even if it isn't a perfect and essential movie in the grander scheme of things, it's a pretty remarkably poignant one for the moment.

    ....

    It's also about talking animals.
    Last edited by Henry Gale; 02-26-2016 at 06:58 AM.
    Last 11 things I really enjoyed:

    Speed Racer (Wachowski/Wachowski, 2008)
    Safe (Haynes, 1995)
    South Park: Bigger, Longer & Uncut (Parker, 1999)
    Beastie Boys Story (Jonze, 2020)
    Bad Trip (Sakurai, 2020)
    What's Up Doc? (Bogdanovich, 1972)
    Diva (Beineix, 1981)
    Delicatessen (Caro/Jeunet, 1991)
    The Hunger (Scott, 1983)
    Pineapple Express (Green, 2008)
    Chungking Express (Wong, 1994)

  3. #3
    Kung Fu Hippie Watashi's Avatar
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    Wreck-It Ralph is a terrible, terrible film. I tried to give it another chance earlier this year and nope... still sucks.
    Sure why not?

    STAR WARS: THE LAST JEDI (Rian Johnson) - 9
    STRONGER (David Gordon Green) - 6
    THE DISASTER ARTIST (James Franco) - 7
    THE FLORIDA PROJECT (Sean Baker) - 9
    LADY BIRD (Greta Gerwig) - 8


    "Hitchcock is really bad at suspense."
    - Stay Puft

  4. #4
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Watashi (view post)
    Wreck-It Ralph is a terrible, terrible film. I tried to give it another chance earlier this year and nope... still sucks.


    [
    ]
    Last edited by Henry Gale; 02-26-2016 at 05:57 PM.
    Last 11 things I really enjoyed:

    Speed Racer (Wachowski/Wachowski, 2008)
    Safe (Haynes, 1995)
    South Park: Bigger, Longer & Uncut (Parker, 1999)
    Beastie Boys Story (Jonze, 2020)
    Bad Trip (Sakurai, 2020)
    What's Up Doc? (Bogdanovich, 1972)
    Diva (Beineix, 1981)
    Delicatessen (Caro/Jeunet, 1991)
    The Hunger (Scott, 1983)
    Pineapple Express (Green, 2008)
    Chungking Express (Wong, 1994)

  5. #5
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    Scott Mendelson sums it up pretty well in a less spoilery way, and while loving it considerably more than myself.
    Last 11 things I really enjoyed:

    Speed Racer (Wachowski/Wachowski, 2008)
    Safe (Haynes, 1995)
    South Park: Bigger, Longer & Uncut (Parker, 1999)
    Beastie Boys Story (Jonze, 2020)
    Bad Trip (Sakurai, 2020)
    What's Up Doc? (Bogdanovich, 1972)
    Diva (Beineix, 1981)
    Delicatessen (Caro/Jeunet, 1991)
    The Hunger (Scott, 1983)
    Pineapple Express (Green, 2008)
    Chungking Express (Wong, 1994)

  6. #6
    Moderator TGM's Avatar
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    Oh my god, this is way way WAY better than either Wreck-it Ralph or Big Hero 6. Like, they're not even comparable. The sheer amount of modern day social and political issues this movie so seamlessly tackles is absolutely astounding! This movie was just completely BRILLIANT, and no hyperbole, may well be one of the most important movies released in this day and age. Love love LOVED it! Possibly my favorite non-musical Disney animated film. This is an absolute MUST see feature film!

  7. #7
    Moderator TGM's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Henry Gale (view post)
    that all made my mouth go kind of agape and made me feel weirdly proud of Disney(?!) for letting it all swirl together into this still-very-crowd-pleasing narrative that just happens to go in pretty dark, beautifully uncomfortable and challenging places. And really, here of all places.
    Definitely agree here, though. I was watching this thing just wide-eyed with amazement that this movie was actually going there. In fact, on the drive back home, I had to fight back tears from just thinking about the sheer sincerity and brilliance on display in this movie.

  8. #8
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    Seamlessly? There is that one big pause of a muddled metaphor about biology that totally takes me out of the film for a bit. And a few other things.

    Agree though that the themes are pretty advanced, and it's lively enough. I must say, though, that I still found the dramatic parts in Disney's second renaissance films somewhat lacking, WRECK-IT RALPH and TANGLED asides (because the former's joyous world/tone rarely slows down the speed for gooey-ness, and the latter is their real 90s musical throwback, completely in execution, not just elements). They are kind of obvious and pandering, with loud drama signifiers and little nuance. Maybe I'm just spoiled by Pixar and Ghibli's approaches, where there is a little bit more real-world feeling to the interactions and dramas of characters.
    Last edited by Peng; 03-05-2016 at 04:13 AM.
    Midnight Run (1988) - 9
    The Smiling Lieutenant (1931) - 8.5
    The Adventures of Robinhood (1938) - 8
    Sisters (1973) - 6.5
    Shin Godzilla (2016) - 7.5

  9. #9
    Moderator TGM's Avatar
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    What was muddled about it? It's not like it came out of nowhere, it had been organically integrated in the story from the very beginning, and had been well established on a number of occasions as a mindset that had been brought on by her upbringing.

  10. #10
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    Not in term of story, but in term of the film trying to tie this biology stuff to the real world themes.

    After my initial post I have read some reviews from critics I followed, and Alison Willmore happened to put it best about my huge pause moment:

    Zootopia never tries to be that neat, though there is a point at which its metaphors get a little too messy. When a movie that references relevant topics of racial discussion then flips into a plot about the nefarious triggering of uncontrollable biological instincts in unwilling Zootopian citizens, it's a briefly uncomfortable turn. Animals have inarguable biological differences that they've been able to mostly put behind them in Zootopia, but humans being divided up the same way is the stuff of pseudo-scientific racism, no matter how unintended the parallel.
    Midnight Run (1988) - 9
    The Smiling Lieutenant (1931) - 8.5
    The Adventures of Robinhood (1938) - 8
    Sisters (1973) - 6.5
    Shin Godzilla (2016) - 7.5

  11. #11
    The Pan Spinal's Avatar
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    "So what's the new Disney cartoon about?"
    "A rookie female cop gets fed up with the blatant sexism of police culture and goes renegade, teaming up with a known criminal before exposing her own deep-seeded racism during a high-profile case and leading her city into a prolonged culture war. You know ... for kids!"
    Coming to America (Landis, 1988) **
    The Beach Bum (Korine, 2019) *1/2
    Us (Peele, 2019) ***1/2
    Fugue (Smoczynska, 2018) ***1/2
    Prisoners (Villeneuve, 2013) ***1/2
    Shadow (Zhang, 2018) ***
    Oslo, August 31st (J. Trier, 2011) ****
    Climax (Noé, 2018) **1/2
    Fighting With My Family (Merchant, 2019) **
    Upstream Color (Carruth, 2013) ***

  12. #12
    Moderator TGM's Avatar
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    Well, why not for kids?

  13. #13
    Kung Fu Hippie Watashi's Avatar
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    Man, I'm not jelling with this new Disney renaissance. This was okay. The themes are all over the place. I think the filmmakers definitely bit off more than they can chew. The emotional beats don't hit. The pop culture references are lame and offensive. The animation and world-building is nice. I don't know... Tangled was amazing. Big Hero 6 is very good, but I think Disney is trying to go more "BIG IDEAS" rather than just focus on simple storytelling.
    Sure why not?

    STAR WARS: THE LAST JEDI (Rian Johnson) - 9
    STRONGER (David Gordon Green) - 6
    THE DISASTER ARTIST (James Franco) - 7
    THE FLORIDA PROJECT (Sean Baker) - 9
    LADY BIRD (Greta Gerwig) - 8


    "Hitchcock is really bad at suspense."
    - Stay Puft

  14. #14
    The Pan Spinal's Avatar
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    Yeah, I liked it all right. But I couldn't shake the feeling that it was a conscious effort to repackage the zeitgeist and sell it back to us. Whereas others seem to be astonished that a Disney film would cover this territory, I think it only seems inevitable. Like when corporations flatter your sense of activism while they are selling their products. "Our products our cruelty-free, environmentally conscious and we are happy to have gay dads as customers ... etc."
    Coming to America (Landis, 1988) **
    The Beach Bum (Korine, 2019) *1/2
    Us (Peele, 2019) ***1/2
    Fugue (Smoczynska, 2018) ***1/2
    Prisoners (Villeneuve, 2013) ***1/2
    Shadow (Zhang, 2018) ***
    Oslo, August 31st (J. Trier, 2011) ****
    Climax (Noé, 2018) **1/2
    Fighting With My Family (Merchant, 2019) **
    Upstream Color (Carruth, 2013) ***

  15. #15
    The Pan Spinal's Avatar
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    Oh, and to save you the time:

    Mr Big > Spinal
    Coming to America (Landis, 1988) **
    The Beach Bum (Korine, 2019) *1/2
    Us (Peele, 2019) ***1/2
    Fugue (Smoczynska, 2018) ***1/2
    Prisoners (Villeneuve, 2013) ***1/2
    Shadow (Zhang, 2018) ***
    Oslo, August 31st (J. Trier, 2011) ****
    Climax (Noé, 2018) **1/2
    Fighting With My Family (Merchant, 2019) **
    Upstream Color (Carruth, 2013) ***

  16. #16
    Kung Fu Hippie Watashi's Avatar
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    The scene with the weasel selling bootlegs of Zootopia-fied Disney movies and upcoming Disney movies is one of the worst instances of Disney sucking their own dick I've seen in a long time.
    Sure why not?

    STAR WARS: THE LAST JEDI (Rian Johnson) - 9
    STRONGER (David Gordon Green) - 6
    THE DISASTER ARTIST (James Franco) - 7
    THE FLORIDA PROJECT (Sean Baker) - 9
    LADY BIRD (Greta Gerwig) - 8


    "Hitchcock is really bad at suspense."
    - Stay Puft

  17. #17
    the maker of my own evil Ivan Drago's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Watashi (view post)
    The scene with the weasel selling bootlegs of Zootopia-fied Disney movies and upcoming Disney movies is one of the worst instances of Disney sucking their own dick I've seen in a long time.
    That sounds about on-par with this line from Tomorrowland: "Well, zip-a-dee-doo to you."

    I'm excited to see this, but waiting for less crowds.
    Last Five Films I've Seen (Out of 5)

    Tetsuo: The Iron Man (Tsukamoto, 1989) WTF
    The Wolf Man (Waggner, 1941) 4
    The Exterminating Angel (Buñuel, 1962) 4.5
    Maniac (Lustig, 1980) 4.5
    Friday The 13th Part V: A New Beginning (Steinmann, 1985) 2
    Friday The 13th Part VIII: Jason Takes Manhattan (Hedden, 1989) 3
    Friday The 13th Part VII: The New Blood (Buechler, 1988) 4
    Lone Wolf and Cub: Sword of Vengeance (Misumi, 1972) 4.5

    The last movie I saw in a theater before the apocalypse was Cats.

    Let that sink in.

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  18. #18
    cat people KK2.0's Avatar
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    Surpassing Big Hero 6 isn't much of an effort but reading about this alleged "dark themes" had my curiosity, now i have to watch this in theaters.

  19. #19
    This was good enough. Gorgeous animation and fleet enough (I liked that it was pretty much a buddy-cop mystery piece), but weak on the comedy front and overbearing on the thematic front. Guessed who was behind it all very early on too (though it was really just a guess, not based on anything the film did or did not do).
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  20. #20
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    This is ok. Pleasant enough. Animation was gorgeous.

    If anything, it seems to exist as a collection of unconnected scenes that are then collapsed onto one another. The whole sloth business is probably the most egregious. While the first scene made for a great trailer, it's inevitable that his character would end up back in the film again, and so the coda was undone by that sense of a forgone conclusion. And the Shakira business at the end felt needless--where the film's analogy and symbolism overrides narrative cohesion simply because she agreed to be in the film.

    I rather like the central cast -- Goodwin and Bateman -- but the plot felt too expansive and kept going past my interest points.
    Ant-Man and the Wasp - 5
    Hereditary - 7
    Won't You Be My Neighbor? - 7.5
    The Tale - 8

  21. #21
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    I mean, I like that it went deeper with the racism than just your standard look-past-your-appearances message (though it's kinda weirdly specified to urban American communities, no? Or am I projecting because of where I live? It certainly crossed my mind how these themes played in more homogeneous parts of the world), but really, the reason why I dug it so much is not that, despite me liking the idea of a Disney cartoon that teaches kids how cops are not immune from racism. What really sold me on the movie throughout is how much this feels like an old post-war RKO script that someone dusted up and decided to change into about animals. It's a near perfect cribbing of that kind of movie that hits all the tropes, including the inclusion of racial tension, and I got a massive kick out of that.
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    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  22. #22
    Cya all later MadMan's Avatar
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    Marvelous and funny movie that did surprise me with its themes. The trailers didn't give any of that away. I also laughed when the bunny parents told Judy to give up on her dreams. Also Jason Bateman as a fox is pretty spot on casting.

  23. #23
    Cya all later MadMan's Avatar
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    Also I laughed at the bootleg movies scene. This film is much better than the merely good at best Big Hero 6.

  24. #24
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    You can call her Judy. Call her cutie and you die, though.

    Zootopia.
    Byron Howard, Rich Moore and Jared Bush, 2016.

    A few thoughts:

    - Sexism! Racism! Cops can be racist! Everyone can be prejudiced! This is like Crash, but with animals and it isn't a piece of shit. It's in fact really, really good. What I like the most of it is that it does show it's themes in a clear, accessible way without being preachy while trusting it's audience, which would've been easy since this is supposed to be a "kid's movie".

    - Animation is great, let's move on.

    - Shakira as Gazelle. Perfect casting.

    - They should've cast Bryan Cranston as the chemist making the toxin. Huge, huge, huge missed opportunity.

    - The sloths were way funnier than I thought they would be.

    - Couldn't understand possum Vito Corleone very much.

    - I thought the part of the bootlegged Disney movies was pretty funny.

    - Not really a criticism, but I miss the Disney that made great, amazing, memorable villains. Not much of a fan of the more recent approach of trying to trick the audience with a surprise villain. This is not their stuff.

    - On the other hand, Disney is getting better at drawing their main protagonists and give them an actual arc unlike, well, most of the princesses.

    - Zootopia > Frozen > Tangled > Big Hero 6 > Wreck It Ralph. Yeah, I stand by this.

    Here's looking at you, carrots: I don't think I have shipped anyone as hard in a Disney movie as I ship Judy and Nick (I have a problem when it comes to shipping animated characters), which is a testament to the gigantic chemistry between Ginnifer Goodwin and Jason Bateman. I wanna see a Zootopia 2 just to see those two bounce of each other more and more.

    Final thoughts: Seriously, Judy and Nick. Make it happen, but for realz!!!!

    So yeah, I loved this movie.

  25. #25

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