Black Mirror

[D_Davis]

Watched the first couple episodes of Black Mirror.

Didn't like it. It's really well made and all, but I found it too dark and cynical for my tastes these days.

[Irish]

Yeah. No. I mean, you're entitled to your opinion blah blah but your opinion is wrong. LOL .

Black Mirror is brilliant. It's a modern Twilight Zone with an acid edge. The second and third episodes are particularly well done and highly, highly fucking disturbing.

I can't think of another tv show in the last 10 years-- especially a genre show-- that comes close to its level of writing.

Edit: The Black Mirror Christmas special premieres on December 16 on Ch4 in the UK. It's three different stories, all starring Jon Hamm.

[D_Davis]

The first two episodes were just people being terrible to each other. Never got that vibe from Twilight Zone. I hear people call it a TZ for the modern era, so maybe that just means I don't jive with the modern era. That's fine.

It's Ballardian, but without the sense of wonder and fascination with humanity that Ballard had.

I'm going to watch a few more to see what else it has in store.

[Irish]

[Dead & Messed Up]

Twilight Zone did mix cruelty into its delicious soup sometimes, but I'm kinda with D, in that the overwhelming feeling I get is a deep humanism and love for people and the human spirit. Its occasional bleak circumstances didn't often match to people being equally cruel to each other, but to oppressive social groups challenging a sympathetic hero.

[Irish]

Twilight Zone had different goals depending on the episode. It ran the gamut from satire to horror to sci-fi to fantasy.

Black Mirror doesn't. It's straight sci-fi satire. It's angry and bitter, the way satire is intended to be. Almost all the episodes revolve around the effect of technology on people and social structures.

Admittedly, the focus is much more narrow than The Twilight Zone. But that doesn't make one worse than the other. There's plenty of genre and satire in Serling's show if we look around. Cf: The Monsters Are Due on Maple Street, It's Good Life, The Living Doll, Time Enough to Last, Eye of the Beholder, etc.

Those episodes didn't exhibit a "deep love of the human spirit." They were social commentaries meant to jolt the audience out of their complacency. That's what good genre work does. That's what Black Mirror does.

[[ETM]]

We got a couple of friends over and watched first episode of Black Mirror, and, while everyone recognized the quality, it was depressing enough that none of us have seen more of it yet.

[number8]

There's a persistent sneering in all Black Mirror episodes that I don't think was ever in Twilight Zone, which was more sincere with its social commentaries. Brooker's writing is just dripping with a combative sense of humor that makes me unsure if the commentary is to be taken seriously or if it's just exploiting a social aspect for laffs. Kind of like South Park a lot of times.

[D_Davis]

For me, Twilight Zone seems to be saying things about individuals, where as Black Mirror seems to be painting with a broader brush, trying to say something about all of humanity.

However, with all of this said, I actually don't think that BM is anything at all like TZ. I had heard that it was, that's why I originally mentioned the two together. Had I never heard that, after watching the first two episodes of BM, I would have never made the comparison myself.

[number8]

For me, Twilight Zone seems to be saying things about individuals

I dunno about that, at least when we're talking about the episodes that are most often cited as examples of TZ's social commentary. "I Am the Night-Color Me Black," "Maple Street," "Eye of the Beholder" and "The Shelter" seem to be more about society to me.

[D_Davis]

Like I said, just the feelings I get when watching these.

These days, I tend to be way more sensitive about things like violence and cynicism than I was when I was younger.

All I can say is that TZ is my favorite all time show, and I can watch episode after episode without ever feeling bad about humanity. BM seemed to want to paint us as a terrible species not worth a damn. I just don't have time for that kind of stuff in my life these days.

If I was all angsty, in my early 20s, I'd probably eat that shit up. My response to the show is more of a reflection of where I'm at, and less of a critique of the show itself.

[Irish]

There's a persistent sneering in all Black Mirror episodes that I don't think was ever in Twilight Zone, which was more sincere with its social commentaries. Brooker's writing is just dripping with a combative sense of humor that makes me unsure if the commentary is to be taken seriously or if it's just exploiting a social aspect for laffs. Kind of like South Park a lot of times.

Brooker doesn't feel any obligation to entertain you. He doesn't pander. He doesn't need to be liked. The first episode says all that, loudly. It's a giant fuck you to television audiences. Most American TV is deathly afraid they'll ever make anyone feel bad. Even stuff that feels edgy at times (In Living Color, South Park, The Chapelle Show) always lets the audience off the hook. Black Mirror doesn't, and I love it for that.

Having watched Weekly Wipe & read some of Brooker's commentary in The Guardian, I don't think he's exploiting anything for laughs (say, the way Jon Stewart or John Oliver do). I think he's genuinely pissed at the state of the world.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I watched the first two episodes of Black Mirror and hated them. Well produced and directed, sure, but pathetically misanthropic, with an edginess that lacks any real cut. The social commentary has all the nuance of a Hostel movie. "Let's find something to criticize. We'll start off with politicians and the royal family. Next let's criticize The X Factor and the internet age. Now think of the worst possible outcome in each episode, and there you have it!" I could see it appealing to high school kids with their bitter axe to grind. No thanks for me.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Oh, and comparing something like that to Twilight Zone is such a disservice to what Rod Serling created, I can only shake my head.

[D_Davis]

I watched the first two episodes of Black Mirror and hated them. Well produced and directed, sure, but pathetically misanthropic, with an edginess that lacks any real cut. The social commentary has all the nuance of a Hostel movie. "Let's find something to criticize. We'll start off with politicians and the royal family. Next let's criticize The X Factor and the internet age. Now think of the worst possible outcome in each episode, and there you have it!" I could see it appealing to high school kids with their bitter axe to grind. No thanks for me.

Oh, and comparing something like that to Twilight Zone is such a disservice to what Rod Serling created, I can only shake my head.

Glad I'm not alone.

[Irish]

Oh, and comparing something like that to Twilight Zone is such a disservice to what Rod Serling created, I can only shake my head.

Bear in mind the Twilight Zone had 156 episodes compared to Black Mirror's 6 (soon to be 9). Damu & number8 already pointed out it's a rough comparison, and I've already said why I think it's a comparison that still works.

What astounds me is that the harshest critics in this thread haven't even watched Black Mirror's entire run, or even half of it.

[Irish]

The social commentary has all the nuance of a Hostel movie. "Let's find something to criticize. We'll start off with politicians and the royal family. Next let's criticize The X Factor and the internet age. Now think of the worst possible outcome in each episode, and there you have it!"

I'm not sure it would be possible for someone to misread the intentions of these episodes more.

The first episode wasn't about the Royal family. The second episode wasn't about "X-Factor" style shows. Those were only the vehicles by which Brooker talked about his topics. You may think the show appeals to "high school kids with an axe to grind", but I find your take on it to be a grade-school level analysis.

And here I thought the shows were too obvious on a thematic level. But I guess they weren't. The problem with doing this stuff is that people expect (or rather: demand) to be entertained by it. And if you go too broad, they miss the point entirely (this is, I think, the issue the ultimately fucked with Dave Chappelle's head. He was doing arch satire and his fans reduced it to a catchphrase).

[Kurosawa Fan]

I'm not sure it would be possible for someone to misread the intentions of these episodes more.

The first episode wasn't about the Royal family. The second episode wasn't about "X-Factor" style shows. Those were only the vehicles by which Brooker talked about his topics. You may think the show appeals to "high school kids with an axe to grind", but I find your take on it to be a grade-school level analysis.

And here I thought the shows were too obvious on a thematic level. But I guess they weren't. The problem with doing this stuff is that people expect (or rather: demand) to be entertained by it. And if you go too broad, they miss the point entirely (this is, I think, the issue the ultimately fucked with Dave Chappelle's head. He was doing arch satire and his fans reduced it to a catchphrase).

It was a lighthearted stab, Irish. I'm well aware that the royal family wasn't the target, but they were certainly criticized in the piece (with the queen herself stopping by to ask the Prime Minister to fuck the pig). Same goes with The X Factor. Not the target, but certainly heavily criticized. It has nothing to do with any level of entertainment or catchphrases or anything of the sort. I don't remember mentioning or asking for anything along that line, so I'm not sure why you would include that in your response.

I'm constantly amazed by how personally you seem to take differences of opinion, Irish. I disagree with the effectiveness and the method of the show's satirization of humanity. I'm not insulting you for liking the show (or 8 or Winston*). I wasn't calling you a high schooler for finding the show effective. That's just my personal view of the sophistication of the satire. I'm sorry if you felt that way. Yet you feel it necessary to cherry pick a one paragraph rant for a few choice bits, act as though my rant was any form of serious analysis, and then call it grade school.

[EyesWideOpen]

How is it 2015 and I can't legally watch the Black Mirror Christmas special?

[number8]

How is it 2015 and I can't legally watch the Black Mirror Christmas special?

You can. They put it up on YouTube.

[EyesWideOpen]

You can. They put it up on YouTube.

Just watched it. Episode was fantastic but the quality was lacking. Besides the small little box that Black Mirror puts their youtube videos up in it was fine for the first half or so but then the sound cut out 3 or 4 times for 30 seconds or so each and then the sound got out of sync for the last half which was annoying.

[Grouchy]

Wow, the Christmas episode is excellent.

[number8]

I recently marathoned all the episodes again because my roommate hadn't seen it, and I told her that she should start with "The Entire History of You" instead of the first two episodes, and that got her hooked to see the rest. I think that was a good decision. I still think it's unfortunate that the show's first two episodes are what I consider its two worst. Well, maybe tied with the Waldo one.

[number8]

Come to think of it, I like the show best when its critique on society serves more as a backdrop to a personal story, like in "Entire History of You," "Be Right Back," and the Christmas episode. Less so the other way around, which is what the other episodes did.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Just watched the first episode. Some real tension and dread. I didn't buy some of the more minor touches, like the idea that people would watch 60 minutes of a man fucking a pig, even a PM. The ticking clock element was pretty effective given that it seemed a foregone conclusion that the guy was gonna fuck the pig. The tech stuff was more useful as a means of raising the stakes than as meaningful commentary on our relationship with gadgets. The more interesting idea, that a fundamentally useless relic of old government captures the public fascination more than a bureaucratic but truly powerful prime minister, is more subdued but a little more fresh of a subject. Fine acting from the lead. Looks like it was shot by David Fincher's first assistant director.

Fascinating moment by moment but a little vaporous as an experience. Irony being that I'll remember mostly as that one where a guy fucked a pig, when it seemed judgmental of our interest in shocking images. Hypocrisy or provocation? Who knows. I'm gonna mix me a White Russian and watch the next one.

Criminal that the tag at the end wasn't the PM and the pig smoking cigarettes in bed.