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Thread: Hannibal (Season 2)

  1. #26
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    AH HELL YEAH.

    This was the one I was most worried about. I would have been SO PISSED if it was cancelled.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  2. #27
    Director Scar's Avatar
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    Huzzah!
    I have a very busy head. I have inside voices that I have learned to contain.

  3. #28
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    Phew, the one glimmer of great TV news today.

    If this was gone too, I'm not sure what I'd even be watching from the big four American networks other than late night stuff.
    Cold War (Pawlikowski, 2018) - **** / 9.3
    Minding the Gap (Liu, 2018) - **** / 9.0
    Green Book (Farrelly, 2018) - ** / 5.8
    Mandy (Cosmatos, 2018) - **** / 8.9
    The Lego Movie 2: The Second Part (Mitchell, 2019) - *** / 7.7
    Alita: Battle Angel (Rodriguez, 2019) - ** / 5.9
    Bohemian Rhapsody ("Singer", 2018) - ** / 4.1
    Spider-Man: Into The Spider-Verse (Persichetti/Ramsey/Rothman, 2018) - **** / 9.2
    Vice (McKay, 2018) - ** / 5.6
    The Favourite (Lanthimos, 2018) - **** / 9.3

  4. #29
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Mara (view post)
    I have no idea what Margot wanted.
    Oh.

    This episode was really upsetting for me, actually. Some pretty messed up stuff going on.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  5. #30
    It's all in the caffeine EvilShoe's Avatar
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    I'm liking the different energy Pitt is bringing to the show.
    Last movies seen
    Frank: Good
    Mistaken for Strangers: Good
    Guardians of the Galaxy: Good


    Last TV seasons watched

    Treme (S04): Good
    The Legend of Korra (S03): Good

    Currently reading
    This Side of Paradise - F. Scott Fitzgerald

  6. #31
    Mason Verger is really loathsome. Michael Pitt's obnoxious voice and mannerisms made him immediately unlikeable, and he's clearly becoming more odious with each passing episode.

    Hannibal and Will's conversation about Abigail was one of the most fascinating scenes of the season. It's disarming whenever Hannibal demonstrates any shade of compunction. Also, after nearly two seasons of having him only obliquely refer to his darker side, it was interesting to see him discuss this with more candour. I like that Abigail hasn't been forgotten and that she still haunts and (in Will's case) motivates these two characters.

    Given Hannibal's remarks about Will redirecting his compassion for Abigail toward his unborn child (a bizarre twist, but one that seems at home in a show that is so brazenly strange) and his apparent sympathy for Margot, I didn't expect him to toss all of that aside in favour of another manipulative ploy. This is what has been consistently frustrating and disturbing about the character. We receive certain gradations and nuances throughout the episodes, which ostensibly complicate a simplistic definition of Hannibal as evil incarnate, but then we're hit with scenes that remind us of the primacy of that simplistic definition. Hannibal is fundamentally a lucid and self-possessed monster who is never legitimately burdened by his pretensions to compassion and guilt. Right before her death, Abigail questioned Hannibal about some of his actions. I remember being really struck by the horrifying simplicity of his explanation: "I was curious."

    These latest developments may be motivated by more than morbid curiosity, but they similarly adumbrate Hannibal's monstrosity. Hannibal despises Verger so he arranges to have him killed. While perusing another discussion, I noticed someone mention that Hannibal can't do this himself since the Chesapeake Ripper has been "caught" and a low profile is now necessary (is this a sound explanation, though?). So, as an alternative, he goads Will into killing Verger. From Hannibal's twisted perspective, Margot's hysterectomy becomes a "necessary" catalyst for this scenario (just as he deemed Abigail's death tragic but unavoidable). If Hannibal was solely interested in getting rid of Verger, surely there were other alternatives that would have left Margot unscathed. That's one of the really troubling things, of course... the gruesome details of this scenario (Margot's victimization, Will's reprisal) seem like the sort of specifics that would appeal to Hannibal's twisted sense of curiosity and mischief. There were surely simpler, less messy ways of removing Verger but, to Hannibal, such methods would be less interesting. It's not even clear whether Hannibal dislikes Verger more because of what he has done to Margot, or simply because he's turned off by the fact that he is such a deeply gauche and arrogant prick.

    In other words, as Will clearly realizes, Hannibal and Verger's comeuppance is really overdue.

  7. #32
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    Damn. Never anticipated and dreaded a major character development so much all at once.

    Knowing Verger's character history, I knew it was coming and looked forward to how the show would handle it. Then once it came, I was happy that even with my usual adjusted display settings for the show that it was lit pretty ominously. Not to mention any time such dark humour is injected into something that morbid, it always managed to hit a little harder for me.

    But for those that want to see how it looked on set and in the make-up chair, Fuller posted these on Twitter:

    []

    Also just a generally excellent episode. Everything's just coming together beautifully, and I love how even Hannibal potentially being caught still won't be a tight and easy thing that will necessarily break his hold or influence in his forced evolution of Will's psyche and capacity for violence.

    Couldn't be looking forward to the finale more. Since I actually watched it live last night, I saw next week's preview, and even it was beautifully put together. Commercials really ruin the mood of this show though.
    Cold War (Pawlikowski, 2018) - **** / 9.3
    Minding the Gap (Liu, 2018) - **** / 9.0
    Green Book (Farrelly, 2018) - ** / 5.8
    Mandy (Cosmatos, 2018) - **** / 8.9
    The Lego Movie 2: The Second Part (Mitchell, 2019) - *** / 7.7
    Alita: Battle Angel (Rodriguez, 2019) - ** / 5.9
    Bohemian Rhapsody ("Singer", 2018) - ** / 4.1
    Spider-Man: Into The Spider-Verse (Persichetti/Ramsey/Rothman, 2018) - **** / 9.2
    Vice (McKay, 2018) - ** / 5.6
    The Favourite (Lanthimos, 2018) - **** / 9.3

  8. #33
    If you need a palate cleanser after viewing those gruesome images, here is a nice photograph of Will's canine companions (although, given the events of this latest episode, I guess this would conjure up some gruesome memories, too... on that note, I found it sad/moving that Winston was stationed on the porch when Will got home, suggesting that even he was perturbed/disturbed by what was happening inside).

    []

    I don't think this show has traded in a lot of gratuitous, sexual objectification (I may be forgetting something), so our first glimpse of Margot this episode really stood out and seemed to be in poor taste. They essentially imbricated a moment of wounded vulnerability and blunt objectification by lingering on her scars and then, inexplicably, offering us a long shot of her in her underwear. Given where her storyline left off, this seemed like a really odd moment to decide to offer us a provocative shot of Katherine Isabelle. Of course, the context negates this, but the ostensible intention is still suspect and crass.

    Otherwise, the episode was characteristically involving and featured more of the inventive visual style that distinguishes Hannibal (notably, the scene where Hannibal drugs Verger). The show certainly seems well-poised for a spectacular finale.

  9. #34
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    Seriously, I cannot believe the level of gruesome on this show. And on a network, too. I had to cover my eyes or the screen a few different times.

    But I cannot deny that this show has me on the hook. The ways that they're mixing up the canon (which I don't know extensively, but I do know some things) still manage to shock.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  10. #35
    Jones Barty's Avatar
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    Mother of god that finale.

  11. #36
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    Holy fucking shit on fire.

    Just...

    I am broken. Words no work right now.

    [
    ]

    Aaaaagh.

    EDIT: I guess I should clarify these are somehow as positive thoughts as I can articulate right now. But seriously: Gatdamn!
    Cold War (Pawlikowski, 2018) - **** / 9.3
    Minding the Gap (Liu, 2018) - **** / 9.0
    Green Book (Farrelly, 2018) - ** / 5.8
    Mandy (Cosmatos, 2018) - **** / 8.9
    The Lego Movie 2: The Second Part (Mitchell, 2019) - *** / 7.7
    Alita: Battle Angel (Rodriguez, 2019) - ** / 5.9
    Bohemian Rhapsody ("Singer", 2018) - ** / 4.1
    Spider-Man: Into The Spider-Verse (Persichetti/Ramsey/Rothman, 2018) - **** / 9.2
    Vice (McKay, 2018) - ** / 5.6
    The Favourite (Lanthimos, 2018) - **** / 9.3

  12. #37
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    This show has always been visually arresting and dream-like, but this episode really went bananas. Half the scenes I am unclear if they really happened, or were just inside someone's head... not that it especially matters.

    And I respect a show willing to yank around viewers, but even so, that ending was really cruel.

    [
    ]

    Also, Bedelia Du Maurier, you scamp.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  13. #38
    Breaking Bad spoiler:

    []

  14. #39
    Anyway, as expected, it was a riveting finale, with no shortage of the show's usual florid excesses. I feel that they misfired a bit during the teaser, with the merging of the two separate frames to unnecessarily adumbrate Will's muddled loyalties. Then again, this formal self-indulgence is part of the fun, so maybe it's unfair to qualify this as a misfire instead of accepting it as part of the wider tapestry of unpredictable artistic choices. After all, the fascinating distinction of Hannibal is the elasticity of its aesthetic and narrative 'parameters,' which enables an assortment of aesthetic and narrative gambits, some of which are bound to be less interesting than others. The resulting phantasmagoria of pronounced idiosyncrasy and strangeness is still one of the best spectatorial pleasures that Hannibal offers.

    I had a few reservations, though. I was hoping that the specific catalyst for Jack attacking Hannibal might be little bit more interesting. During the premiere, when we got our first glimpse of this confrontation, I assumed that some cataclysmic or revelatory event must have cleared away all of Jack's doubts. Instead, Jack submitted to the the increasing plausibility and logic of Will's accusations against Hannibal about five or six episodes ago (on that note, it seems that some believe that this change of heart wasn't addressed with enough depth, as I've noticed others argue that Jack's switch seemed perfunctory -- i.e., he didn't believe Will and then, suddenly, he did; I don't think the change was quite so brisk, however, but more of a gradual acceptance of an increasingly persuasive theory).

    I also do not think that bringing Abigail back was a great idea, especially since it seems to deflate one of the series' most memorable moments. I'm referring to Hannibal's tearful reaction in front of Bedelia, whose interesting and affective power relies on Abigail actually having been murdered by Hannibal (I can't recall all of the specifics, so I guess his reaction might also have to do with his betrayal of Will, but I initially read it as having a lot to do with the loss of Abigail, which was interesting). Also, it's not great when writers seem so reluctant to commit to characters' dramatic conclusions. I would rather not have a scenario where a lot of characters' deaths are surrounded by scare quotes, leaving us to wonder if they're just waiting in the wings, awaiting their deployment in the next shocking plot-twist. Admittedly, bringing Abigail back did allow for some devastating dramatic rewards, even while it mollified some of what had already come to pass. For instance, I like what Bryan Fuller had to say (warning: I haven't made my way through it all yet, so there may be some spoilers concerning the third season in that link) about Hannibal withdrawing the "gift" of Abigail and how he likens it to a petulant gesture:

    Yes, and it's also the act of a heartbroken man. You know, it is the very ugly breakup, where you didn't want it. He didn't want any of this, so, “I'm destroying all of it and everything that we were supposed to have, I'm going to raze the Earth.” It such an almost adolescent reaction. “I'm taking my ball and going home!” or “I'm deflating the ball and going home.” But it's also, I think, an indicator of just how deeply Will Graham got through to Hannibal Lecter on an emotional, connective level, and the hurt of the betrayal.
    Still, these ideas could have been communicated in other ways. Having Abigail brought back and then summarily killed in this really gruesome fashion just felt wrong in so many ways. Was it really necessary to have her return only to twist the knife a little deeper, as it were? Will was already haunted by Abigail's death and clearly resented Hannibal for it. Everything about her return seemed gratuitous and manipulative. I understand that it was also a nightmarish recapitulation of the first episode's traumatic conclusion, but this in no way warrants Abigail's return. Her story was tragic and haunting, and I liked how she continued to affect Will and Hannibal in different and complicated ways... this will continue, of course, but her return just adds a level of unnecessary gratuity and shock value to the storyline.

    On another note, I liked the way that Hannibal gutting Will was this violent embrace...like a strange, lovelorn gesture of betrayal.

    Anyway, this has been a great season. I'm kind of astounded, and greatly relieved, that we're getting a third season. I'm looking forward to the changes of the new season, which will inevitably be pretty considerable. Also, given the pedigree of this show, Hannibal and Bedelia's sojourn to Europe should yield some beautiful episodes.

  15. #40
    Supporting Actor slqrick's Avatar
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    Incredible finale. That was seriously better and more riveting than a lot of movies I've seen the past few years. Mads is definitely the definitive Hannibal in my mind after this season.

  16. #41
    I miss this show already.








  17. #42
    https://twitter.com/BryanFuller/stat...12274870566912

    question mark over chilton has to be a mistake

  18. #43
    Not a praying man Melville's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Acapelli (view post)
    https://twitter.com/BryanFuller/stat...12274870566912

    question mark over chilton has to be a mistake
    [
    ]
    I am impatient of all misery in others that is not mad. Thou should'st go mad, blacksmith; say, why dost thou not go mad? How can'st thou endure without being mad? Do the heavens yet hate thee, that thou can'st not go mad?

    lists and reviews

  19. #44
    Bark! Go away Russ's Avatar
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    I'm only just now catching up on Season 2 with the blu-ray release. I binge-watched the first four episodes last night, and I just gotta say: this has got to be the best show that so few people (outside of matchcut) watch or talk about. I am AMAZED with some of the material that NBC agrees to broadcast on network television. The levels of gore and artful gruesomeness are astonishing.

    Anyway, Episode 4 ended with Beverly Katz's basement confrontation. I can't wait to finish the season. I heard the finale is unreal.

    I absolutely love this show. Season 1 was really, really good. Season 2 is a noticeable step up. The Lynchian elements (the imagery and especially the sound design) is insanely on-point.

    And it looks like my prayers have been answered: Gillian Anderson joins the cast full-time for Season3.

    Spring 2015. Hell yeah.
    "We eventually managed to find them near Biskupin, where demonstrations of prehistoric farming are organized. These oxen couldn't be transported to anywhere else, so we had to built the entire studio around them. A scene that lasted twenty-something seconds took us a year and a half to prepare."

  20. #45
    Too much responsibility Kurosawa Fan's Avatar
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    I've just started season one, so I'm posting and running here. Not reading anything in the fear of spoiling myself. Just gotta say, after two episodes, I'm completely hooked. Looking forward to burning through more episodes this weekend.

  21. #46
    Director Scar's Avatar
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    Enjoy!
    I have a very busy head. I have inside voices that I have learned to contain.

  22. #47
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Kurosawa Fan (view post)
    I've just started season one, so I'm posting and running here. Not reading anything in the fear of spoiling myself. Just gotta say, after two episodes, I'm completely hooked. Looking forward to burning through more episodes this weekend.
    I was pretty hooked the first time I watched it, but a rewatch of season 1 made me a little obsessive. Make sure you find episode 4 "Oeuf", which was not shown on television.
    ...and the milk's in me.

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