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Thread: The Book Discussion Thread

  1. #6401
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    I tried to read The Knife of Never Letting Go and I found it incredibly frustrating. I felt like he was building the entire story around secrets that were obvious and, frankly, not very shocking. I liked his style, but not the plot. For me, More Than This (although, yes, definitely has things in common with The Matrix) resounded a little bit more.

    I think I will check out A Monster Calls, though.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  2. #6402
    Producer Lucky's Avatar
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    Finished McCarthy's The Road. Bleak. A bit draining. Appreciated the writing style.

    Decided to give Gaiman another shot and am halfway through The Ocean at the End of the Lane. Good so far, we'll see if it can resolve into something worthwhile.

  3. #6403
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    Hey ledfloyd,

    I'm halfway through George Saunders' Tenth of December and was curious what you think of the collection (I believe you mentioned elsewhere that you'd grabbed it up at some point). It's my first exposure to Saunders' short stories, and there's some really interesting playfulness going on with language and theme, but I'm interested in what stories here you found the best...
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

  4. #6404
    What is best in life? D_Davis's Avatar
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    So I'm sure a lot of you are aware of how much I love Michael Cisco - IMO, he's by far the best writing working within the realms of literary horror today. Since his first novel, The Divinity Student, he's positioned himself to be the modern Kafka, and is an unparalleled master of mood and atmosphere, of the surreal and the bizarre.

    If you'd like to experience his work, his aforementioned first novel has been serialized online, free to read:

    http://weirdfictionreview.com/2013/0...dent-part-one/

    And it mostly (only) gets better from there.

  5. #6405
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    I'm coming down as very ambivalent about Don Quixote. I really liked the first half, which was warm and dream-like in its examination of idealism, adventure, and romance. Still, I couldn't shake an uneasiness that at heart, this is a book about a mentally ill old man getting the crap kicked out of him every other page. He's spitting out teeth, and I get the feeling we're supposed to think it's funny.

    The second half has been much more problematic. In the first half, the parts that were funny and charming worked because it was about a man who mistook everyday life for an adventure, and also managed to slowly ensnare those around him into the same way of thinking.

    But the second half has been focusing mostly on this rich Duke and Duchess who think it's funny to deliberately set up adventures for Don Quixote, and then laughing at him when he falls for it. And it's not harmless stuff-- both Quixote and Panza have been physically hurt (one might almost say, tortured), terrified, humiliated, starved, and mocked. These people are seriously assholes. Am I supposed to think it's funny, or am supposed to be rooting that they get trampled by horses? It's just so endlessly awful.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  6. #6406
    A Platypus Grouchy's Avatar
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    Well... It is a comedic book. It's a satire of chivalric literature. So yes, that Quijote and Sancho get their asses kicked is part of the satire. They're anti-heroes.

    But also, it's a novel that strikes various tones. While Quijote's misadventures are funny, the characters they encounter and the stories-within-the-story they get to hear often have a lot of dramatic depth to them. It's an inmense book. Even if you don't share Cervantes sense of humor there's more to it than that. Besides, they get hurt, sure, but they're a bit like Looney Tunes characters in that sense - they're always back in the saddle for the next chapter.

    I would add something else... but I don't want to spoil the ending.

  7. #6407
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    The stories within the stories have been great.

    I guess I'd be more comfortable if there was a sense that these people who are mocking/torturing Quixote are going to be confronted with their bad behavior.

  8. #6408
    A Platypus Grouchy's Avatar
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    Well, you also gotta realize, Cervantes had a pretty rough life. He was made a prisoner of war and imprisoned and tortured for five years. His captors asked the Duke of Sessa for ransom money, but the noble man didn't think the life of Cervantes was worth all that dough. His optimism and belief in divine justice might have taken a bit of a blow as a result.

    Anyway, I'm just glad you're reading it! Everybody should read that book at least once.

  9. #6409
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    Finished Rainbow Rowell's Eleanor and Park, which I listened to on drives to and from Tulsa this past week and a half. Really wonderful and evocative in a YA temperament, with full-fledged characters across the board (though I'm bewildered how Park's mother retains no Korean-influenced culture beyond dropped words--no cuisine or nothing), and powerful in its study of attraction and peace found in relationships. A lot of the relational/sexual longing that Park and Eleanor experience--the way that language hyperbolizes every act when done in the company of another--felt incredibly true. The biggest sadness came in the final moments, when Eleanor has successfully fled her family background and determines that the separation between she and Park warrants a full separation. In turn, that ending line is killer, reawakening the kernel of romance.

    Definitely will get to Fangirl sometime this year now. Thanks for the praise, Mara--doubt I'd have listened to it otherwise.

    Next up is a study of some of Alice Munro's short stories, this one The Moons of Jupiter collection.
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

  10. #6410
    Producer Lucky's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Lucky (view post)
    Decided to give Gaiman another shot and am halfway through The Ocean at the End of the Lane. Good so far, we'll see if it can resolve into something worthwhile.
    This is the first Gaiman that I enjoyed throughout. I wish he would branch out away from the fantasy realm in a future work, because I'm on board with his writing style but often find myself disconnected and a bit lost when he loosens the grip on reality. Fortunately, it kind of works to his advantage and fits the themes of this novel, which makes it easy for me not to dwell on the negative. My favorite passages were the expertly crafted expositions of comfort at the Hempstock house--took me back to my own childhood memories of my grandmother's. And now I wonder how much I've embellished those in my head.

  11. #6411
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting dreamdead (view post)
    Finished Rainbow Rowell's Eleanor and Park, which I listened to on drives to and from Tulsa this past week and a half. Really wonderful and evocative in a YA temperament, with full-fledged characters across the board (though I'm bewildered how Park's mother retains no Korean-influenced culture beyond dropped words--no cuisine or nothing), and powerful in its study of attraction and peace found in relationships. A lot of the relational/sexual longing that Park and Eleanor experience--the way that language hyperbolizes every act when done in the company of another--felt incredibly true. The biggest sadness came in the final moments, when Eleanor has successfully fled her family background and determines that the separation between she and Park warrants a full separation. In turn, that ending line is killer, reawakening the kernel of romance.
    I'm so glad you liked it. I agree that Park's mother is a little problematic, but that was a footnote to how much I loved the characters. I'm probably showing my age, but I wanted so badly to take Eleanor home and take care of her forever. Poor baby.

    Regarding Don Quixote, I've moved beyond the Duke and the Duchess, who were never confronted with what horrible people they were, and are never criticized by the text. However, I found myself enjoying the book again more with them out of the picture, and came across this passage:

    "... jests that give pain are no jests, and no sport is worth anything if it hurts another."

    Thanks for that.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  12. #6412
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Mara (view post)
    I'm so glad you liked it. I agree that Park's mother is a little problematic, but that was a footnote to how much I loved the characters. I'm probably showing my age, but I wanted so badly to take Eleanor home and take care of her forever. Poor baby.
    Indeed. Eleanor was so well conceived, and any flaws she exhibited felt so attuned to her environmental surroundings. I realized after the fact that Rowell never really grapples with how Eleanor's mother deals with her daughter's letter (and the indictment of Richie that it contains). That element feels strangely unwrapped up--though the mother is certainly tied to Richie in many ways, I'm a little taken aback that the text doesn't record any fallout between the mother and Richie on that front. Still, a remarkably well written and developed book.
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

  13. #6413
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    Annnnnnnnd, finished Rowell's Fangirl in a day. I'm not overly interested in the New Adult genre as a whole, but I could stay in Rowells's worlds for a long time. Her writing and emotional understanding are impeccable. And now the wait for her 2014 book begins.
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

  14. #6414
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting dreamdead (view post)
    Annnnnnnnd, finished Rowell's Fangirl in a day. I'm not overly interested in the New Adult genre as a whole, but I could stay in Rowells's worlds for a long time. Her writing and emotional understanding are impeccable. And now the wait for her 2014 book begins.
    Love it. I just think that she and I should be friends, you know? Like, I read her writing and I want to know her personally.

    I did read her only book written specifically for an adult audience (The Attachments) and it was solid, but her weakest. Character and emotional truth are her strengths, and they were there, but the premise was... well, creepy.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  15. #6415
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    Finished up Don Quixote and my final reaction is positive. The horrible Duke and Duchess were reintroduced, and we were given a small concession moment, sort of "Who is the greater fool?"

    I must say that my favorite part of the book was Panza. What could have been a silly, throwaway character was instead compassionate, intelligent, shrewd, and extremely funny. He was really the most human person in the book.

    On to Atwood's Maddadam.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  16. #6416
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    I also read all of Elizabeth Smart's My Story last night, and NIGHTMARES. NIGHTMARES ALL FREAKING NIGHT. HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE NIGHTMARES.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  17. #6417
    Too much responsibility Kurosawa Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting dreamdead (view post)
    Finished Rainbow Rowell's Eleanor and Park, which I listened to on drives to and from Tulsa this past week and a half. Really wonderful and evocative in a YA temperament, with full-fledged characters across the board (though I'm bewildered how Park's mother retains no Korean-influenced culture beyond dropped words--no cuisine or nothing), and powerful in its study of attraction and peace found in relationships. A lot of the relational/sexual longing that Park and Eleanor experience--the way that language hyperbolizes every act when done in the company of another--felt incredibly true. The biggest sadness came in the final moments, when Eleanor has successfully fled her family background and determines that the separation between she and Park warrants a full separation. In turn, that ending line is killer, reawakening the kernel of romance.
    Started Eleanor & Park last night around 6:00. Finished it about a half hour ago. That alone speaks to the quality of the story Rowell has crafted. I do have some reservations. At times, I think Rowell stooped to cartoonish archetypes rather than the full-fledged characters you experienced, particularly in regards to Park's mother, Eleanor's mother, but most egregiously in regards to the step-father. It's another in a long line of evil step-parent narratives, which cheapens the experience. I think Rowell created two characters and an emotional link between them that was strong enough not to warrant cheap tricks to pull emotional strings. I'm all for broken family and emotional distress as an impediment for young lovers, but I would have liked to see it portrayed with a bit more care. I'm also troubled by the assertion the novel seems to imply that there is a true love out there for people (this seems heavily implied by Park on the trip to Minnesota when thinking back on his own parents and their meeting). Maybe it can be chalked up to the naiveté and youth of Park, rather than any motivation on the part of Rowell, but it rubbed me the wrong way. It's a poor message to convey to young readers. I know that Rowell is modernizing the fairy tale here, and so there are going to be corollaries, but I wish that message had been left behind.

    Reservations aside, Rowell absolutely nails that feeling of first love while also creating a harrowing, desperate situation for her protagonists to overcome. I'm in complete agreement about the conclusion of the book. Equal parts heartbreaking and uplifting as I consumed the final lines.

  18. #6418
    Winston* Classic Winston*'s Avatar
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    Holy shit @ the Namibia chapter of V.

  19. #6419
    Producer Lucky's Avatar
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    The Reason I Jump is a curious walk in unfamiliar shoes, and I imagine it's a godsend for those in daily contact with an autistic person. Even if you're not, it's a worthy quick read. A few of the passages are affecting and relative to any human being. The majority of the novel is a Q&A with a 13 year old Japanese autistic boy, but it sprinkles a few of his brief stories--near parables--in as well. There's one in particular about a dancer that I found pretty profound for a teenager.

  20. #6420
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    Weird-- I just started very book for my book group.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  21. #6421
    Producer Lucky's Avatar
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    Jon Stewart recently made a hooplah over it on his show. It's probably less of a coincidence than you imagine.

  22. #6422
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    I've forgotten how mesmerizing quality short stories can be. George Saunders's recent collection was generally solid, and the Alice Munro collection The Moons of Jupiter is slow-going, but thoroughly worth it. Her study of the small detail is excellent, and the character developments that accrue through small revelations are astounding. Can't wait to dig into more of the collection.
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

  23. #6423
    What is best in life? D_Davis's Avatar
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    Anyone read or interested in reading S?

    I'm usually very skeptical of these kinds of big, multi-media (stop with the book trailers already!), cross-over hype books, but S looks and sounds fascinating. I've also been meaning to check out The Surf Guru from the main author.

    Anyhow, have it on order and it should be arriving tomorrow.

  24. #6424
    What is best in life? D_Davis's Avatar
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  25. #6425
    Zeeba Neighba Hugh_Grant's Avatar
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    S was brought up in the keynote speech at a recent conference. I research genre theory and multimodal compositions, so on that level I'm interested. A friend/colleague is having her students put together book trailers.

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