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Thread: The Book Discussion Thread

  1. #4451
    Too much responsibility Kurosawa Fan's Avatar
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    Man. Frankenstein is an absolute CHORE.

  2. #4452
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Kurosawa Fan (view post)
    Man. Frankenstein is an absolute CHORE.
    There are people who adore it and get really hurt when I express feelings like this. But I agree completely.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  3. #4453
    What is best in life? D_Davis's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Kurosawa Fan (view post)
    Man. Frankenstein is an absolute CHORE.
    Yeah. I can think of about a thousand better examples of the genre. Don't get this one's "classic" status beyond it simply being old. It's past time to retire some of these old standby's, and pick some newer books for required reading.

  4. #4454
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    You know what book is even worse, although in a similar way? Tarzan of the Apes. At least it's not considered a classic, but I can't figure out how that silly, silly book ever grabbed the public attention and led to so many adaptations.

    I will admit that Frankenstein is a pretty impressive achievement for an 18-year-old. But, still, classic? I just don't see it.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  5. #4455
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    According to author Rudyard Kipling (who himself wrote stories of a feral child, The Jungle Book's Mogli), Burroughs wrote Tarzan of the Apes just so that he could "find out how bad a book he could write and get away with it."
    Ah ha ha ha.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  6. #4456
    Screenwriter Duncan's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting dreamdead (view post)
    I agree that the climax fails, quite badly, but I actually found the first half quite gripping, even the squash match (after Netherland and O'Neill's cricket descriptions, maybe I'm more tolerant of sports passages even when I don't understand the game). That said, I feel the politics here offer something very of-the-moment, which I'm thankful of. I fear that you dismiss the book when it acts as testimony of that transitional moment, when a populace was ready to be swayed to either side of the war on Iraq debate, if only solid evidence could be granted. I like it for that engagement, as it's one of the few books to take this perspective (DeLillo and O'Neill, for example, don't, and so I feel that McEwan tackles a new angle here).

    Most of the Baxter business, however, fails to amount to anything. A great opening with Perowne gazing out into the night, but as the plane fades from the narrative, so too does McEwan's ability to make anything of the characters.

    Still kinda want to read Amsterdam at some point. One positive and one middling book means I want that to be the decider.
    I think the of-the-moment nature of its politics are exactly what I disliked. I felt like characters were spouting op-eds from a few years ago at me. The daughter, especially. And I was left wondering what the point was while I was reading it. Because I was there. I read those op-eds. I'm not learning anything, and I'm not feeling anything because the storytelling is contrived. It's strongest quality is probably how these larger events filter down into our everyday lives. There are moments, like the opening, that you read and think, yes, I know that feeling.

    But again, to me, the politics are just one problem among many.
    Wishful thinking, perhaps; but that is just another possible definition of the featherless biped.

  7. #4457
    Quote Quoting Mara (view post)
    I adore this book, and I can never manage to get anyone to read it on my recommendation, because it's a measly ten thousand pages long.
    ritch:

    I love Stange&Norrell too. Skitch has my copy since 2009, I don't know if he's ever read it ...

  8. #4458
    A Platypus Grouchy's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Kurosawa Fan (view post)
    Man. Frankenstein is an absolute CHORE.
    What? It's a great book. You guys are crazy.

  9. #4459
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    Hey KF, what classes are you taking this semester? I ask because the Kafka and Conrad feel like a short story survey, whereas the other two seem like a Victorian British lit survey... in brief, what's the reading lists for you this semester?

    In this third teaching of the "Experience of fiction" class, I'm using Cather's A Lost Lady, Fitzgerald's The Great Gatsby, Ibuse's Black Rain, DeLillo's Mao II, Schwartz's The Writing on the Wall, Foer's Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close, Krauss's The History of Love, and Thompson's Blankets. The Krauss and Ibuse will be new reads for me...
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

  10. #4460
    Scott of the Antarctic Milky Joe's Avatar
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    The History of Love is really wonderful. A good choice given the theme of the class.
    ‎The severed arm perfectly acquitted itself, because of the simplicity of its wishes and its total lack of doubt.

  11. #4461
    Too much responsibility Kurosawa Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting dreamdead (view post)
    Hey KF, what classes are you taking this semester? I ask because the Kafka and Conrad feel like a short story survey, whereas the other two seem like a Victorian British lit survey... in brief, what's the reading lists for you this semester?
    The Kafka was on my own before the semester began. I'm taking an English 313 course studying British and American literature from 1865 to present day. We read the Conrad and Shaw (as well as a bunch of poetry and essays from various authors), and just started James' The Portrait of a Lady. Other notable works we're reading are Light in August, Huck Finn, A Room of One's Own, The Waste Land, and The Crucible. I'm also taking 301 at the same time, in which we're reading Olyphant's The Library Window, Conrad's The Secret Agent, various Sherlock Holmes stories, and Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.

    On top of that, I have a history course in which we're reading Frankenstein (finished by this Thursday) and All Quiet on the Western Front.

  12. #4462
    What is best in life? D_Davis's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Kurosawa Fan (view post)
    All Quiet on the Western Front.
    No that's a good book.

  13. #4463
    Scott of the Antarctic Milky Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting D_Davis (view post)
    No that's a good book.
    Yes, yes it is.
    ‎The severed arm perfectly acquitted itself, because of the simplicity of its wishes and its total lack of doubt.

  14. #4464
    What is best in life? D_Davis's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Milky Joe (view post)
    Yes, yes it is.
    D'oh.

    Should be Now that's a good book.


  15. #4465
    Whole Sick Crew Benny Profane's Avatar
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    The first Luisa Rey mystery in Cloud Atlas....holy tits.
    Now reading: The Master Switch by Tim Wu

  16. #4466
    i am the great went ledfloyd's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Benny Profane (view post)
    The first Luisa Rey mystery in Cloud Atlas....holy tits.
    yesss. this seems to be a divisive chapter but i love it.

  17. #4467
    Whole Sick Crew Benny Profane's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting ledfloyd (view post)
    yesss. this seems to be a divisive chapter but i love it.
    I would like to hear the case for the other side of the divide.
    Now reading: The Master Switch by Tim Wu

  18. #4468
    Best Boy Chac Mool's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Benny Profane (view post)
    I would like to hear the case for the other side of the divide.
    Me too.

    My favorite chapters are in the second half -- and of those, my favorites are about Frobischer and Sonmi-451 -- but really, the whole thing is wonderful.

  19. #4469
    I'm in the milk... Mara's Avatar
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    I'm slipping over here to post my thoughts on "The Library Window," since I don't want to derail the top ten thread.

    Overall, a very interesting piece. I'm frustrated with the ending... from the "wave" until the conclusion, because it felt a little bit like it fell apart. I would respect a non-conclusion, but instead I felt like we were given a half-conclusion, which is annoying.

    What the story did very well was the mounting obsession and monomania and paranoia. That was great-- and reminded me strongly of one of my favorite short stories from that period, "The Yellow Wallpaper" by Charlotte Perkins Gilman. In fact, there are strong similaries-- they both deal with Victorian women becoming obsessed after staring at a stationary object for too long. But while "The Yellow Wallpaper" really dove into issues of feminism and mental illness, I wasn't sure where "The Library Window" really wanted to go.

    Still, very interesting.
    ...and the milk's in me.

  20. #4470
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Kurosawa Fan (view post)
    The Kafka was on my own before the semester began. I'm taking an English 313 course studying British and American literature from 1865 to present day. We read the Conrad and Shaw (as well as a bunch of poetry and essays from various authors), and just started James' The Portrait of a Lady. Other notable works we're reading are Light in August, Huck Finn, A Room of One's Own, The Waste Land, and The Crucible.
    Weird that a survey course claiming to go from 1865-present would not go beyond the mid-1950s. Frustrating to people like me who wholly believe in teaching truly contemporary literature, and like to regularly have 1-2 books from the 90s and 00s assigned. I've always been told that Light in August is Faulkner's best, so I hope you enjoy it. I really don't see you and James jiving well together, though.

    140 pages into 1919, Dos Passos's second part of his U.S.A. trilogy. I like the liminal exploration of gender here, as we're moving away from the rigid hatred of women as property that was prevalent in The 42nd Parallel, and gay and lesbian desire is slowly being introduced as alternative pathways of gender. Very appreciable, as I have a soft spot for this kind of proletarian fiction.

    Teaching Gatsby right now is simultaneously rewarding and frustrating--I fear that I could have used a far more atypical and unassigned book to explain and analyze the era (Dos Passos, West), but I feel happy that the students are seeing new ideas in a book that they've typically only read one way. I'm happy to move onto Ibuse's Black Rain next week, though, as that promises to be new terrain for both myself and the students.
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

  21. #4471
    Too much responsibility Kurosawa Fan's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Mara (view post)
    I'm slipping over here to post my thoughts on "The Library Window," since I don't want to derail the top ten thread.

    Overall, a very interesting piece. I'm frustrated with the ending... from the "wave" until the conclusion, because it felt a little bit like it fell apart. I would respect a non-conclusion, but instead I felt like we were given a half-conclusion, which is annoying.

    What the story did very well was the mounting obsession and monomania and paranoia. That was great-- and reminded me strongly of one of my favorite short stories from that period, "The Yellow Wallpaper" by Charlotte Perkins Gilman. In fact, there are strong similaries-- they both deal with Victorian women becoming obsessed after staring at a stationary object for too long. But while "The Yellow Wallpaper" really dove into issues of feminism and mental illness, I wasn't sure where "The Library Window" really wanted to go.

    Still, very interesting.
    Mara, I'll respond to this tomorrow night when I have a bit more time. I'm glad you enjoyed it, at least.

    Quote Quoting dreamdead (view post)
    Weird that a survey course claiming to go from 1865-present would not go beyond the mid-1950s. Frustrating to people like me who wholly believe in teaching truly contemporary literature, and like to regularly have 1-2 books from the 90s and 00s assigned. I've always been told that Light in August is Faulkner's best, so I hope you enjoy it. I really don't see you and James jiving well together, though.
    Yeah, I was hoping for the same, though the last time that happened, The Kite Runner was one of those contemporary novels, and it ranks among the worst I've ever read. Still, I was hoping for at least one selection from the past 20 years.

    As for James, I'm really enjoying him thus far, about 144 pages through. His has great attention to detail, at times near to a fault, but the way he stretches out a metaphor is fascinating, and at times it's pretty mesmerizing.


    EDIT: Oh, and I finished Frankenstein. What a frustrating novel. Filled with interesting allegories, but hampered by incredibly poor writing. I'll expound on that when I have more time tomorrow night as well.

  22. #4472
    Zeeba Neighba Hugh_Grant's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting dreamdead (view post)
    Weird that a survey course claiming to go from 1865-present would not go beyond the mid-1950s. Frustrating to people like me who wholly believe in teaching truly contemporary literature, and like to regularly have 1-2 books from the 90s and 00s assigned.
    Same here.

    Speaking of frustrating, I haven't been able to read that much lately, aside from what my job requires me to read, like piles of student papers. I've been having some issues with vertigo. Bah. I did manage to get through The Lost City of Z, but mostly via audio book.

  23. #4473
    Whole Sick Crew Benny Profane's Avatar
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    Link to very rare Cormac McCarthy short story within. Wow, is all I can say.

    http://biblioklept.org/2011/02/02/wa...thy/#more-7814
    Now reading: The Master Switch by Tim Wu

  24. #4474
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    Finished out Dos Passos's 1919, which ends with an appropriately bitter condemnation of the political uses of the Unknown Soldier from WW1. This text, after the earlier The 42nd Parallel in the USA trilogy, resonated stronger in my mind, as it more directly deals with counterarguments to the war and the way that profiteering and political lies ended up being how the lower class viewed the war. It will be some time before I finish out the trilogy, but I'm still finding the journey worthwhile--just need to get back to academic reading for my schoolwork.

    As such, starting Ibuse's Black Rain next. I'm hoping the hype proves deserving.
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

  25. #4475
    Super Moderator dreamdead's Avatar
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    Picked up Chandler's The Big Sleep on a whim and blazed through it. Not the deepest read or anything of '30s culture, but beneath the sexism and homophobia (do these qualities ease off throughout the Marlowe series?), there is a pretty solid and sustained interrogation of politics and wealth as weapons that mask the rich's true debauchery. Four or five moments where the prose was just perfect.
    The Boat People - 9
    The Power of the Dog - 7.5
    The King of Pigs - 7

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