The DC/WB Superhero Movies Thread

[Wryan]

I don't have love for Heard, but the young bros of the internet were super quick to pile on her as soon as some of those details came out, like their relief that their dear Johnny "didn't do anything wrong" was transformed into an even purer, more crystallized hatred for her. From what I've seen and read, he's hardly clean on this. Those text messages sent to Paul Bettany, if true, are for me a little too far past the "Oh he's just upset and lashing out" line. Shit about drowning her, burning her and fucking her burnt corpse. I do believe that she was an abuser here tho. But the whole thing is pretty crazy and hard to parse in full.

[Skitch]

Yeah I don't know anything about anything but from what little I've seen they both seem like psychos.

[Irish]

Depp appeared in ~13 features over the last 5 years. He has an estimated net worth of $200 million. He, his kids, his grandkids, his great-grand-kids and everyone they meet will never need work a day in their lives.

He was far from cancelled unless you count the freakshow voices hovering around reddit and fortran threads.

I admit it's good celeb gossip but otoh .. why stan for this guy? otooh, who cares?

[transmogrifier]

Is it just that easy to slander someone without providing anything factual that warrants such a stab in the back?

I don't really care about the particulars of this specific case - hated the movie, don't care about the director, know nothing about the actor except he was in a terrible movie - but I would argue that it is not easy at all for an up-and-coming actor (I assume) to stand up against more powerful players in the industry. I know that is not what you specifically meant by "easy to slander", but it got me thinking....

[megladon8]

Depp seems like quite an asshike as well, no argument from me there.

But it's troublesome that Heard seems to have gotten off scott free.

That's fucked up.

[megladon8]

Depp appeared in ~13 features over the last 5 years. He has an estimated net worth of $200 million. He, his kids, his grandkids, his great-grand-kids and everyone they meet will never need work a day in their lives.

He was far from cancelled unless you count the freakshow voices hovering around reddit and fortran threads.

I admit it's good celeb gossip but otoh .. why stan for this guy? otooh, who cares?

Not so much standing for Depp, as wanting some kind of consequences for Heard.

[Irish]

Not so much standing for Depp, as wanting some kind of consequences for Heard.

Depp filed a $50 million defamation suit against her. If he wins, she'll be bankrupt several times over.

[Skitch]

Depp seems like quite an asshike as well, no argument from me there.

But it's troublesome that Heard seems to have gotten off scott free.

That's fucked up.

Has she? I've seen multiple articles about recasting her role in future DC movies. Maybe I havent seen other stuff shes done since Aquaman.

[megladon8]

I see her in Loreal commercials multiple times a day.

[[ETM]]

Alan Tudyk tweeted that he has known Whedon for 17 years and can't imagine him being capable of abusing an actor. Didn't take a side, didn't presume anything, just a take. The twitterverse nearly lynched him. I suspect that the Snyder cultists with Whedon effigies are fueling it, because it's like a vague accusation with zero details so far means Whedon is 100% a monster.

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[Skitch]

Alan Tudyk tweeted that he has known Whedon for 17 years and can't imagine him being capable of abusing an actor. Didn't take a side, didn't presume anything, just a take. The twitterverse nearly lynched him. I suspect that the Snyder cultists with Whedon effigies are fueling it, because it's like a vague accusation with zero details so far means Whedon is 100% a monster.

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Thats normal twitter. They did same for Nolan and chairs.

[Dukefrukem]

Alan Tudyk tweeted that he has known Whedon for 17 years and can't imagine him being capable of abusing an actor. Didn't take a side, didn't presume anything, just a take. The twitterverse nearly lynched him. I suspect that the Snyder cultists with Whedon effigies are fueling it, because it's like a vague accusation with zero details so far means Whedon is 100% a monster.

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Yup. It's the internet at it's worst.

[Grouchy]

I seem to be coming from a more extreme school of thought than you guys. I believe laws exist to arbiter work-related and all sorts of human conflicts. The law is not always perfect, of course, which is why it's allowed to evolve and change.

Outside of the law, unfounded internet "call-outs" like these are slander.

[Skitch]

I seem to be coming from a more extreme school of thought than you guys. I believe laws exist to arbiter work-related and all sorts of human conflicts. The law is not always perfect, of course, which is why it's allowed to evolve and change.

Outside of the law, unfounded internet "call-outs" like these are slander.

But...I've been called an asshole on the internet plenty of times, by people I've never met. Should I sue?

They've actually worked together, and this isn't the first time someone has talked shit about Whedon. I'm not defending Fisher, maybe they just didn't get along one day and hes exaggerating, what the hell do I know. But a pattern of behavior gains traction.

[Grouchy]

But...I've been called an asshole on the internet plenty of times, by people I've never met. Should I sue?

They've actually worked together, and this isn't the first time someone has talked shit about Whedon. I'm not defending Fisher, maybe they just didn't get along one day and hes exaggerating, what the hell do I know. But a pattern of behavior gains traction.

I assume you've been called that by people engaging on an argument with you. That's different. It's not someone using their fame and followers to discredit you.

I remembered the other thing about Whedon and I looked it up to refresh my memory - it was ridiculous. It was his ex-wife accusing him of being a hypocrite for being a feminist and cheating on her. That's just stupid and nonsensical.

I'm not a huge fan of Whedon, it's not like he's my idol and that's my reason to defend him. I just think stuff like this doesn't belong on the public sphere. Deciding to become a writer, filmmaker or actor shouldn't mean that you forfeit the right to have a private life, no matter how much money you end up making. The only one who looks like a shitty person for me here is Ray Fisher.

[Irish]

Stunt people on set backed Fisher, tho.

Tudyk's "he was always nice to me" argument is pretty dumb.

I don;t know shit about Fisher but anyone who says Whedon is a dickhead prolly has a point. Whedon has a long history of behind a dickhead (and for longer than 17 years, too).

[Skitch]

Tudyk's "he was always nice to me" argument is pretty dumb.

My gut reaction to his comments were "that was a Whedon passion project. JL was a corporate disaster he took for the cash."

Edit: I don't blame him for taking the cash, either. Any of us would.

[Skitch]

I'm not a huge fan of Whedon, it's not like he's my idol and that's my reason to defend him. I just think stuff like this doesn't belong on the public sphere. Deciding to become a writer, filmmaker or actor shouldn't mean that you forfeit the right to have a private life, no matter how much money you end up making. The only one who looks like a shitty person for me here is Ray Fisher.

Okay, forget money, lets bring it down to working person level. You go to work in a factory. Your supervisor is an asshole [mistreatment level reserved to until we find out what exactly Fisher is meaning]. You think a person shouldn't be allowed to say so on social media? Obviously his social is bigger than a normal person, but if we're taking money out of the picture we have to accept the common man's lower reach as well.

[Grouchy]

Okay, forget money, lets bring it down to working person level. You go to work in a factory. Your supervisor is an asshole [mistreatment level reserved to until we find out what exactly Fisher is meaning]. You think a person shouldn't be allowed to say so on social media? Obviously his social is bigger than a normal person, but if we're taking money out of the picture we have to accept the common man's lower reach as well.

That's not really a valid comparison. Work exploitation can be brutal and a regular worker's need of holding on to the job is far greater than Fisher's, who could arguably even try to break his contract.

Even in those cases, though, that's why unions exist. Not social media.

[megladon8]

Being a dickhead =/= abuse.

I've had several bosses who were dickheads. I've never been abused by a boss.

If the tech people are backing up Fisher then yeah, let's look into this and see where it goes.

My only point this whole time has been that...

Person A: Person B abused me!

Society (see - the internet, and possibly exploding from there): DESTROY THEM!!!

...is ludicrous.

If I were to just come in here one day and say "Irish has been harassing me with inappropriate messages and dick pics", that people here would at least investigate before jumping to RUIN IRISH'S LIFE!!

[Irish]

I've had several bosses who were dickheads. I've never been abused by a boss.

Umm...

My only point this whole time has been that...

Person A: Person B abused me!

Society (see - the internet, and possibly exploding from there): DESTROY THEM!!!

...is ludicrous.

Yeah but it's weird the accuser never quite gets the benefit of the doubt, right? And where's the tipping point?

By this example, you're automatically on the side of Bryan Singer and Kevin Spacey.

If I were to just come in here one day and say "Irish has been harassing me with inappropriate messages and dick pics", that people here would at least investigate before jumping to RUIN IRISH'S LIFE!!

I told you before! Those pics were meant for Skitch! HOW DARE YOU

[Grouchy]

Yeah but it's weird the accuser never quite gets the benefit of the doubt, right? And where's the tipping point?

By this example, you're automatically on the side of Bryan Singer and Kevin Spacey.

Ugh, no. Singer and Spacey are rapists. They have legal accusations leveled against them. That's the only "cancellation" that actually counts in my book.

[megladon8]

It goes against the entire basis of the American legal system to say that the accuser should get the benefit of the doubt.

If an accusation is made it should be investigated.

It's quite frightening that we are so willing to eliminate due process for this particular subset of crime.

And of course I'm not on Spacey and Singer's sides. Because there were: multiple accusers with similar stories over the span of their whole careers, previous complaints against both on record, and then there was even hard proof (at least against Spacey).

[Skitch]

That's not really a valid comparison. Work exploitation can be brutal and a regular worker's need of holding on to the job is far greater than Fisher's, who could arguably even try to break his contract.

Didn't you say it doesn't matter how much they're paid? (maybe it was someone else.)

I would like someone to tell me if I was applying for a job with a guy that was an asshole. I don't understand why you think its bad of any employee to say "hey that guy is an asshole". (obviously Fisher's comments haven't been explained yet, I know)

[Irish]

It goes against the entire basis of the American legal system to say that the accuser should get the benefit of the doubt.

If an accusation is made it should be investigated.

It's quite frightening that we are so willing to eliminate due process for this particular subset of crime.

This assumes the legal system is available to everyone equally when it very obviously isn't.

And of course I'm not on Spacey and Singer's sides. Because there were: multiple accusers with similar stories over the span of their whole careers, previous complaints against both on record, and then there was even hard proof (at least against Spacey).

Charges against Spacey were dropped and lawsuits against him dismissed, tho. I mean, he's walking around free right now just like Amber Heard.

So why do you find those complaints credible but not the ones against Whedon? (Insert any name here, attached to a multitude of alleged offenses: Matt Lauer, Charlie Rose, Louis CK, Mel Gibson, Warren Ellis, Chris D’Elia, James Franco...)