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Thread: Girls (Season 2)

  1. #26
    I think I was intrigued by this episode more than I actually enjoyed it. Patrick Wilson was a perfect and unexpected choice, though.
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  2. #27
    Shocking Seductive Spiral Thirdmango's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting DavidSeven (view post)
    I think I was intrigued by this episode more than I actually enjoyed it. Patrick Wilson was a perfect and unexpected choice, though.
    This. I found myself equal parts liking it and hating it.

    Also I know Dunham has made mention of the usage of her own nudity but it has been a part of every episode so far.

  3. #28
    Supporting Actor slqrick's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Thirdmango (view post)
    Also I know Dunham has made mention of the usage of her own nudity but it has been a part of every episode so far.
    I feel like its really forced at times, too. Like, "hey guys I know this is HBO and you want to see supermodel boobs, but I'm gonna make sure all you see is mine, because I'm not conventionally attractive so I gotta make sure everyone realizes how empowering this is." I get it, I just don't need it to be so obvious. I will say that the internet responses to these scenes does shed some light on the double standards of female nudity, as I've seen a disturbing amount of "ain't no one wanna see Lena Dunham's fatass on screen yo" comments.

    Essentially, this is what makes me still go back and forth on this show. I really loved how this episode was shot and directed, and the bottled aspect of it. It felt a lot like an episode of Louie. However, I have to spend the entire episode with Hannah who continues to be awful. It was just hard at all to connect in any way with her or Dunham's acting during her big emotional scene, although I did enjoy Patrick Wilson's casting. The one thing I did buy though was that this dude would be lonely enough to have this fling, especially since he's much older, and living in a neighborhood that he feels alienated by. I was moved by the ending though, and I thought the last shot was simple but perfect.

    Basically, I keep watching the show even though there is so much of it I don't like because of episodes like last week at Hannah's party, and because I do like when the show branches out to show what characters like Ray and Shoshana are up to. It just becomes problematic to me when the show goes back to being all around Hannah.

  4. #29
    Producer Lucky's Avatar
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    Did anyone else notice that it sounded like Dunham was yawning throughout the entirety of her crying sequence?

  5. #30
    i am the great went ledfloyd's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting slqrick (view post)
    I feel like its really forced at times, too. Like, "hey guys I know this is HBO and you want to see supermodel boobs, but I'm gonna make sure all you see is mine, because I'm not conventionally attractive so I gotta make sure everyone realizes how empowering this is." I get it, I just don't need it to be so obvious. I will say that the internet responses to these scenes does shed some light on the double standards of female nudity, as I've seen a disturbing amount of "ain't no one wanna see Lena Dunham's fatass on screen yo" comments.
    I've never really gotten this perceived subtext. Maybe it's because I find her relatively attractive, I mean she looks like an average girl.

    It did feel a lot like an episode of Louie. I would like to see the inverse episode of Louie where an attractive 20-something shows up at his house.

  6. #31
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    Quote Quoting ledfloyd (view post)
    I've never really gotten this perceived subtext. Maybe it's because I find her relatively attractive, I mean she looks like an average girl.

    It did feel a lot like an episode of Louie. I would like to see the inverse episode of Louie where an attractive 20-something shows up at his house.
    Oh god, if either show lasted long enough and the networks allowed it I could definitely see them doing cross over eps.
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  7. #32
    Shocking Seductive Spiral Thirdmango's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting ledfloyd (view post)
    I've never really gotten this perceived subtext.
    Well I remember an interview with her about season 1 where she said the nudity was empowering because it wasn't all supermodel types like a lot of other shows which just want to have some random girls with nudity. But the nice thing about season 1 was that when it was used they justified it and they didn't over do it. This season I don't think there's a single episode we haven't seen Dunham specifically naked in.

  8. #33
    Whole Sick Crew Benny Profane's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting slqrick (view post)
    I feel like its really forced at times, too. Like, "hey guys I know this is HBO and you want to see supermodel boobs, but I'm gonna make sure all you see is mine, because I'm not conventionally attractive so I gotta make sure everyone realizes how empowering this is." I get it, I just don't need it to be so obvious. I will say that the internet responses to these scenes does shed some light on the double standards of female nudity, as I've seen a disturbing amount of "ain't no one wanna see Lena Dunham's fatass on screen yo" comments.
    She is physically repulsive and I'd rather not see her naked body. I realize by saying this that I'm probably proving some point she's trying to make, but so what.

    She's not the ugliest girl in world but she's probably the ugliest girl I've seen naked more than once. So congrats to her?

    That aside, I kinda liked this episode.
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  9. #34
    i am the great went ledfloyd's Avatar
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    http://www.vulture.com/2013/02/attra...ck-wilson.html

    Matt Zoller Seitz pretty clearly evokes the feelings I had while watching this episode.

  10. #35
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    The night before last I caught up on the last three episodes back-to-back, only to see how much I'd miss quality-wise and in terms of confusing, all-internet-consuming controversy. "One Man's Trash" might be my favourite episode of this show to date, and the two before it were among the funniest half hours I've seen in a long time.

    The issues people are taking with the latest episode are just preposterous to me. This might be the strongest show airing at the moment, and while terrible shows glide by on horrible caricatures and stereotypes passing as characters to massive audiences week after week, Girls gets pulled through the ringer for daring to have worldview that dares to allow for Patrick Wilson to have a something of a human, sexual connection with Lena Dunham? Pay no attention to how lonely each of their characters clearly are in their own ways or how beautifully crafted the episode is in making it completely understandable as to where each of them are in their lives on that particular day, looking to escape from their norms, even if their personalities and day-to-day lives eventually show up to remind them how they might not gel with as much ease beyond that weekend. Forget all that, because apparently Wilson is way more attractive than Dunham and therefore he would never be the sort of person that would give her the time of day! Nice try, Lena! Dumb show!

    If it was Allison Williams character walking up to, say, John C. Reilly's brownstone, people would suddenly find a whole different angle to tear this episode apart. But even in that situation of looks, I fear most guys' juvenile reaction would be "Who could blame him! Good on you dude!"

    I haven't actually looked at how many reviews of this episode, glowing or scathing, were actually written by women, but I do think it's a bigger problem that people are just so locked into conventions of male-designed television that an episode like this, as much as the relationship it depicts isn't anything shocking in relative, is still somehow a brick to the face in terms of what the medium usually allows for. Luckily, some seem to be appreciating the wake-up call.
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  11. #36
    i am the great went ledfloyd's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Henry Gale (view post)
    Forget all that, because apparently Wilson is way more attractive than Dunham and therefore he would never be the sort of person that would give her the time of day! Nice try, Lena! Dumb show!
    Yeah, it's almost as if people never sleep with people that are more or less attractive than them in real life.

    btw, Emily Nussbaum wrote a fantastic review of the episode for The New Yorker, it's worth seeking out.

  12. #37
    I'm not really plugged into the internet milieu surrounding the show, so I don't know this, but were the people complaining about the Dunham/Wilson hook-up also complaining about Alison Williams making out with the SNL guy in the season 1 finale? I don't remember too many complaints about that, though I personally thought it stretched believability. Dunham/Wilson, I didn't have a problem with.
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  13. #38
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    I dunno. Ladies love Jorma.

    Or maybe they just generally love Lonely Island but have decided to target their affection most towards him out of the three. Either way I've heard girls vocalize it multiple times.
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  14. #39
    Quote Quoting Henry Gale (view post)
    I dunno. Ladies love Jorma.

    Or maybe they just generally love Lonely Island but have decided to target their affection most towards him out of the three. Either way I've heard girls vocalize it multiple times.
    I was actually talking about the other SNLer she made out with (Moynihan).

    I get the appeal of Jorma's character in terms of how he's written, and he's not a bad looking guy.
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  15. #40
    Supporting Actor slqrick's Avatar
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    This was just a flat out great ep. Again, I think this show works so much better when it's giving everyone in the ensemble some scenes. A lot of hilarious dialogue, and the Ray/Adam stuff reaffirmed that the male characters are written really well on this show. "You're 'out'?"

  16. #41
    In the belly of a whale Henry Gale's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting DavidSeven (view post)
    I was actually talking about the other SNLer she made out with (Moynihan).
    Oh right, I'd almost forgot about that. Then yes, that's a better comparison. Maybe if they'd devoted an entire episode to that people would've gotten more up in arms about it, but again I doubt it since it's still a double standard that's consistently perpetuated in American culture at the very least by whichever gorgeous actress is cast as Schlubby Actor X's girlfriend/wife in any given sitcom or theatrical comedy.

    Instead, we still have people talking about Bar Rafaeli and "nerdy extra from every movie ever" making out two weeks after the Superbowl because who's he to suddenly do that?! He wasn't even Paul Blart or anything!
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  17. #42
    Last episode was directed by Claudia Weill, who made the overlooked 1978 film Girlfriends, which all fans of the show should watch immediately.

  18. #43
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    I got behind and just watched ep 5 and 6, but I did hear about the controversy surrounding "One Man's Trash." After finally watching the ep, it was definitely a whole load of nothing. I agree that a lot of the reactions seem to miss the disconnect that happened between Hannah and Patrick Wilson.

    Quote Quoting Qrazy (view post)
    Meh. I can't stand her. Episode seemed like self-aware wish fulfillment to me, basically a female rendition of a Woody Allen scenario.
    Quote Quoting ledfloyd (view post)
    It did feel a lot like an episode of Louie. I would like to see the inverse episode of Louie where an attractive 20-something shows up at his house.
    I did have this thought, that we've already seen this same scenario plenty of times before, but always with the age and/or gender reversed. Male comedians have been writing themselves into these kinds of situations for decades. I'm not sure I'm willing to credit Dunham enough to think it's intentional, but this ep is an interesting experiment in exposing how the public rarely question this trope, and the specific backlash that it received is more than enough proof that there is a problem with it both in terms of its creative use and the audience perception of what's acceptable.

    Quote Quoting slqrick (view post)
    I feel like its really forced at times, too. Like, "hey guys I know this is HBO and you want to see supermodel boobs, but I'm gonna make sure all you see is mine, because I'm not conventionally attractive so I gotta make sure everyone realizes how empowering this is." I get it, I just don't need it to be so obvious. I will say that the internet responses to these scenes does shed some light on the double standards of female nudity, as I've seen a disturbing amount of "ain't no one wanna see Lena Dunham's fatass on screen yo" comments.
    I think in this episode, it was much less about that and really just a lot more about a refreshing sense realism, which I appreciated. A lot of people hang around the house naked or in their underwear, after all. If it's warm and I'm doing nothing all day but have sex and play ping pong, I wouldn't bother with clothes either, and most girls I know wouldn't, especially when they're with people who've seen them naked already. This is actually interestingly contrasted in the next ep where Marnie does the annoyingly TV thing of covering her naked body with a blanket to go to the bathroom despite the fact that no one else was there other than the guy she just had sex with.

    Quote Quoting Benny Profane (view post)
    She is physically repulsive and I'd rather not see her naked body. I realize by saying this that I'm probably proving some point she's trying to make, but so what.

    She's not the ugliest girl in world but she's probably the ugliest girl I've seen naked more than once. So congrats to her?
    As for this, I think the more important point being made isn't that "conventionally hot women get to be naked on TV, so why can't her?" Obviously most people prefer watching beautiful people, that's why our movie stars and pop idols are all attractive people.

    I'm willing to bet, though, especially with comedians, that you've seen physically unfit male actors in similar states of nudity shown by Dunham, be it Ken Jeong or Seth Rogen or Philip Seymour Hoffman or Tony Shalhoub or whoever (maybe not as frequently, but that's because there are more of them doing it, whereas I can't think of any contemporaries to Dunham at the moment), and while you and others who think like you may be similarly repulsed by seeing those guys naked, there's never really been a "who do they think they are"/"what narcissists"/"stop shoving an agenda down our throats" reaction to them that we're seeing being thrown at Dunham.
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  19. #44
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    Quote Quoting ledfloyd (view post)
    btw, Emily Nussbaum wrote a fantastic review of the episode for The New Yorker, it's worth seeking out.
    Just read it. This is terrific.

    http://www.newyorker.com/online/blog...#ixzz2KiGZYwTM
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  20. #45
    Montage, s'il vous plait? Raiders's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting number8 (view post)
    This is actually interestingly contrasted in the next ep where Marnie does the annoyingly TV thing of covering her naked body with a blanket to go to the bathroom despite the fact that no one else was there other than the guy she just had sex with.
    Among the people I know, and the small few I have actually seen naked, it is more common in my case to find casual nudity awkward and to cover up. Both my wife and I are very private about our bodies unless in the act of sex. It's a strange phenomenon for sure, but I don't think this is strictly a weird TV-specific thing.
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  21. #46
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    I wasn't that sold on this most recent ep. I would like to see just one episode where no one gets naked, no one has sex and no one excretes anything. At a certain point it's no longer an 'honest' portrayal, it's just a titillating crutch.
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  22. #47
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    By the way, I very much sympathize with Ray regarding Staten Island.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  23. #48
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    Quote Quoting Qrazy (view post)
    I wasn't that sold on this most recent ep. I would like to see just one episode where no one gets naked, no one has sex and no one excretes anything. At a certain point it's no longer an 'honest' portrayal, it's just a titillating crutch.
    I kinda liked the callback to the UTI.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  24. #49
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    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  25. #50
    The Pan Qrazy's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting number8 (view post)
    I kinda liked the callback to the UTI.
    Still, does the episode need to begin and end with public urination?
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