Prioritize my viewing

[Derek]

Edited in the last few films from the thread's conclusion today. Still working through the second season of Twin Peaks, so I'll get to the film at some point next year.

I feel like I need to view Eyes Wide Shut again since I remember appreciating it, but perhaps not to this degree. Showgirls' placement makes me giddily happy, but they're still likely overrating it. And Underground looks quite fascinating even though I can't remember too many people here talking about it. Lastly, I love the Malick choice as number one, though that makes me question which film of his is his "masterpiece"...

I somehow missed Underground on your list. An absolute masterpiece - hilarious, disturbing and tragic. Definitely one of the best films of the 90s.

[kopello]

Set aside a rainy, depressing Saturday and watch Sátántangó.

[soitgoes...]

A Brighter Summer Day is the best film of the bunch, but the only transfer out there is awful, so it might be best to wait for a proper transfer whenever that might be.

[Spinal]

Crash and Taste of Cherry in the top 10? Oh, Slant, you are silly.

[DavidSeven]

Showgirls and Starship Troopers in the top 20.

K.

[B-side]

Crash and Taste of Cherry in the top 10? Oh, Slant, you are silly.

Really? You're picking on those two films -- which are both great, btw -- out of that entire list?:|

[Boner M]

Forget it B-Side, it's Spinaltown.

[Spinal]

Really? You're picking on those two films -- which are both great, btw -- out of that entire list?:|

I only read the top 10.

[Qrazy]

Crash is an utter piece of shit. Taste of Cherry I like.

[Bosco B Thug]

97. Santa Sangre
84. Gremlins 2: The New Batch
78. La Belle Noiseuse
44. Histoire(s) du Cinéma
42. The Lovers on the Bridge
6. Sátántangó

Histoire(s) is the only one I feel effusively about. But you can't ignore Satantango, it's Satantango. Santa Sangre is the least of these films.

Showgirls and Starship Troopers in the top 20.

K.

Seriously. Chuck out those Kiarostamis (and the Tarr) and make some Top 10 room!

[Russ]

I don't understand the lack of love for Santa Sangre (not just you Bosco, but throughout the thread). I simply refuse to accept the notion that it's a lesser film than Gremlins 2: The New Batch.

I mean, c'mon. Really?

[Bosco B Thug]

I don't understand the lack of love for Santa Sangre (not just you Bosco, but throughout the thread). I simply refuse to accept the notion that it's a lesser film than Gremlins 2: The New Batch.

I mean, c'mon. Really?

It's been years since I've seen Gremlins 2. I support that people support it, though. But I've never gotten the love for Santa Sangre. The Holy Mountain seems more up my alley, though I only caught the opening 15 minutes of that.

[TripZone]

Sante Sangre sucks balls. Gremlins 2, masterpiece.

Eww Crash/Taste of Cherry/Showgirls/Starship Troopers. WHAT SHIT

god this place is the fucking worst

[Russ]

* YAWN *

Trolls make me sleepy

[transmogrifier]

I don't understand the lack of love for Santa Sangre (not just you Bosco, but throughout the thread). I simply refuse to accept the notion that it's a lesser film than Gremlins 2: The New Batch.

I mean, c'mon. Really?

I don't know, is there something inherent to gremlins as a subject matter that precludes them from being taken seriously when compared to any other random movie?

I'm seriously asking, because I haven't seen Santa Sangre, but I wonder what rule we are operating by as movie fans where we can simply look at the premise and establish the entire worth of a film. I think this is the crux of that ridiculous best/favourite distinction that some people like to make; that somewhere, somehow, some have decided that certain content and approaches to that content are inherently, objectively better, almost independent of execution.

[Dead & Messed Up]

The thing that makes me happy here is that we all recognize how wonderful Gremlins 2 is.

[Bosco B Thug]

I don't know, is there something inherent to gremlins as a subject matter that precludes them from being taken seriously when compared to any other random movie?

I'm seriously asking, because I haven't seen Santa Sangre, but I wonder what rule we are operating by as movie fans where we can simply look at the premise and establish the entire worth of a film. I think this is the crux of that ridiculous best/favourite distinction that some people like to make; that somewhere, somehow, some have decided that certain content and approaches to that content are inherently, objectively better, almost independent of execution.

Well, there's that. Then there's execution, or the filmmaker, as you mention. But pursuing your question, there's then the idea of "seriousness as art." Santa Sangre is a serious-minded flick with grand aesthetic ambitions, and for that reason, I don't rate it down without a good fight. Gremlins 2 doesn't quite have that advantage (ostensibly).

[Russ]

I'm seriously asking, because I haven't seen Santa Sangre, but I wonder what rule we are operating by as movie fans where we can simply look at the premise and establish the entire worth of a film. I think this is the crux of that ridiculous best/favourite distinction that some people like to make; that somewhere, somehow, some have decided that certain content and approaches to that content are inherently, objectively better, almost independent of execution.

No rule, really. And I'm not suggesting that people make value judgments based solely on a film's premise. I'm talking about the film's content. I found Gremlins 2 to be an exercise in familiarity and, frankly, little more than an excuse to find inventive ways for Gremlins to raise hell for an hour and forty minutes. The film quickly devolves into a fast-moving sequence of gags, some funny, some inspired, some neither. Just not enough meat on those bones to keep my interest for very long. I prefer the original by a pretty wide margin.

On the other hand, I found Santa Sangre to be intelligent, well-told, thoroughly entertaining and full of surprises. I think it's Jodorowsky's most successful attempt at wrapping his disparate influences (ie, religion, pantomime, the circus) into what is essentially a genre film in the form of a psychological thriller, but with the usual surreal and grotesque trimmings. It's suspenseful use of a doppelganger is the best of its kind since Psycho. The art direction, color scheme, costumes, etc are all superb. All that, and then on top of it, to have a scene in the middle of the film as touching as the elephant's funeral procession was, well it was just an example of bravura filmmaking. Much prefer this one to the Gremlins sequel, but hey, to each their own.

[transmogrifier]

My mistake. I assumed you were talking from a theoretical stance, having not seen Gremlins 2. But since you have, just ignore my query.

Though liking the original more raises more unsettling questions.

[Russ]

Though liking the original more raises more unsettling questions.

Touché.

[Pop Trash]

Based on the two films of his I've seen, Kiarostami might get my vote for most overrated living filmmaker (at least of the swoony film festival variety). I'm totally on Team Ebert about Taste of Cherry. Along with Identity, it probably has the stupidest ending to an otherwise decent (if visually uncompelling) film I can think of. Apparently even Kiarostami rightfully second guessed that choice and lopped it off for the Italian release.

And speaking of Jordorowsky, he did it before and better with the ending of The Holy Mountain, which made much more contextual thematic sense. And we're talking about fuckin' Jordorowsky here. Making sense isn't exactly his forte.

That said, I would like to see Close-Up but I'll keep my expectations in check.

[Qrazy]

Based on the two films of his I've seen, Kiarostami might get my vote for most overrated living filmmaker (at least of the swoony film festival variety). I'm totally on Team Ebert about Taste of Cherry. Along with Identity, it probably has the stupidest ending to an otherwise decent (if visually uncompelling) film I can think of. Apparently even Kiarostami rightfully second guessed that choice and lopped it off for the Italian release.

And speaking of Jordorowsky, he did it before and better with the ending of The Holy Mountain, which made much more contextual thematic sense. And we're talking about fuckin' Jordorowsky here. Making sense isn't exactly his forte.

That said, I would like to see Close-Up but I'll keep my expectations in check.

Close-up is not that great. It's placement on sight and sound's list baffles me. Which ending are you referring to? The filmmakers milling around?

[Pop Trash]

Close-up is not that great. It's placement on sight and sound's list baffles me. Which ending are you referring to? The filmmakers milling around?

Right, the behind-the-scenes footage. It's just a weird movie to have that kind of thing in. It would be like if Umberto D had some goofy blooper reel at the end.

[Qrazy]

Right, the behind-the-scenes footage. It's just a weird movie to have that kind of thing in. It would be like if Umberto D had some goofy blooper reel at the end.

I think it makes sense, affirmation of life and what not but yeah I agree with you that the film would be better off without it.

It's an Iranian New Wave thing though. They're all obsessed with revealing the fictional aspect of their filmmaking. They take Brecht way too much to heart.

[soitgoes...]

Based on the two films of his I've seen, Kiarostami might get my vote for most overrated living filmmaker (at least of the swoony film festival variety).

You should probably watch some of his good Iranian films (of which there are many, and of which Taste of Cherry is not a part) before passing judgment.