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  1. #101
    The Pan megladon8's Avatar
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    OoOoOo some great starts this week!

    "All-New X-Men" was pretty neat. Easy to pick up and read regardless of my lack of knowledge of previous events. Seems like an interesting story unfolding. I've always been a big fan of Beast so having him be a central character is exciting in itself.

    "Fantastic Four" was good but it's a title that I feel will be hard to judge until a few issues of both it and "FF" have come out. I do not imagine they will be able to compare to Hickman's runs on the titles, but this first issue seems to be off to a good start.

    But the one that really took Jen and I by pleasant surprise was "Thor: God of Thunder" which was just bloody fantastic. Can't wait to see where this one is going, and the use of three different styles of artwork across the three timelines was beautifully done.

  2. #102
    Administrator Ezee E's Avatar
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    X-Men Legacy... Eek. Did not like this at all. I've always thought the character of X's son was pretty dumb.

    All New X-Men - Also not sure about this. I'm kind of over time travel in the Marvel world.

    Iron Man - This was a surprise. Picked it up after good reviews here and at the comic store. It is a fun one to go with, and I'll stick with it a few more issues.

    Guess I should've tried out Thor. It was an expensive week for me.

    I Heard You Paint Houses (The Irishman) - ****
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    Doctor Sleep - ***


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  3. #103
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Remender calling Captain America an "experiment in hypercompression". I am now probably going to buy this damn thing. l.floyd and s.arts, a bit apprehensive, no?...

  4. #104
    Venusian Rubbed Moscow sevenarts's Avatar
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    Eh, Remender's never exactly a prime example of decompression. X-Force is pretty damn punchy and fast-moving, and I think a Cap with a similar sensibility could be a lot of fun. Can't be worse than Brubaker's long slide into not caring over the last year or two.

  5. #105
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Hm? Punchy/fast-moving = decompression

    Basically, hypercompression is the opposite: compressing a lot of story into a smaller space, necessitating much more crammed storytelling. More word balloons and narration.

  6. #106
    i am the great went ledfloyd's Avatar
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    i don't know, i think fraction's hawkeye is a good example of a book packing a lot of content into one issue without it feeling overly wordy. not that i'm against all wordiness, in remender i trust.

  7. #107
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    Warren Ellis is the king of one issue stories (of modern writers anyway).

    I don't think that's the same as hypercompression, though. I'm thinking that's more about treating the sequentials like a montage, showing you just enough of a scene to get what's going on, and then moving on immediately to the next, without much in the way of transitions. Grant Morrison does this A LOT, obviously. It's the exact opposite of Alan Moore and Bendis' style.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  8. #108
    Venusian Rubbed Moscow sevenarts's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting number8 (view post)
    I don't think that's the same as hypercompression, though. I'm thinking that's more about treating the sequentials like a montage, showing you just enough of a scene to get what's going on, and then moving on immediately to the next, without much in the way of transitions. Grant Morrison does this A LOT, obviously. It's the exact opposite of Alan Moore and Bendis' style.
    Yeah, I think that's more the definition of hypercompression than just having lots of text and narration. Morrison's Batman is a prime example, as is Remender's X-Force at times. I think punchy and fast-moving describes that stuff just fine; there's so much happening on every page that it has a frenetic feeling.

    Decompression on the other hand tends to feel slow-moving, with pages and pages devoted to not much happening, or stretching a conversation out across multiple pages.

  9. #109
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    I wouldn't say slow moving, just stretched out. Decompression can be fast-paced issues you can burn through in a minute, with plenty of confrontations, fights, etc. It's just that it usually has a total of two actual plot points in 22 pages, so a bunch of stuff and banter happen that makes you think the issue is packed, but at the end of it, the overall story arc has barely moved forward and you gotta wait another month to have it inch forward to the conclusion.

    It's interesting to compare the different styles of it. There's Bendis, who has a stage play sensibility to his decompression, in the way that he likes to show a conversation from beginning to end, complete with all the small talk and asides. One conversation topic that normally can all be said in one page, with Bendis' "wow"s and "I can't believe he would -- ugh!"s and "this is what I'm saying to you:"s and characters repeating each other, takes up about four.

    Alan Moore, on the other hand, has a more cinematic sensibility where he likes pacing the build-ups, and will write three wordless 9-panel pages of someone walking into his house and pouring himself tea right before one splash page of something shocking.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  10. #110
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting sevenarts (view post)
    Yeah, I think that's more the definition of hypercompression than just having lots of text and narration. Morrison's Batman is a prime example, as is Remender's X-Force at times. I think punchy and fast-moving describes that stuff just fine; there's so much happening on every page that it has a frenetic feeling.

    Decompression on the other hand tends to feel slow-moving, with pages and pages devoted to not much happening, or stretching a conversation out across multiple pages.
    I think I see what you're saying. We're talking about different things. You, the stories, me, the experience actually reading. Decompressed comics read very quickly. Lots of dramatic pauses, distended action, etc. Fewer panels with strong textual importance to tie up the reader. For me, it comes down to the idea that a fistfight in a decompressed comic can take up a whole page (or two), whereas in a compressed comic, a single panel (or two) suffices. So the decompressed fight is gonna feature more punches, which draws the story out, so it moves slower because it takes more pages (your slow-moving). But it doesn't take a lot of time to read them (my fast-moving).

    Dialogue is different, and I don't think I'd describe a stretched conversation as "decompressed comics." Not readily, anyway. Decompression describes distension of action, so it's less about extending duration, which elongated dialogue most often affects.

    Anyway, I was just ribbing you guys again about the whole words thing, which I can't seem to get over.

  11. #111
    Venusian Rubbed Moscow sevenarts's Avatar
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    This is a good discussion.

    Quote Quoting Sven (view post)
    So the decompressed fight is gonna feature more punches, which draws the story out, so it moves slower because it takes more pages (your slow-moving). But it doesn't take a lot of time to read them (my fast-moving).
    Decompression doesn't necessarily mean it's a quick read, though; it depends on the reader, and on what exactly is being decompressed. While you can certainly speed through a decompressed comic that doesn't have many words, that's hardly the only way to read it. Just because a page doesn't have many (or any) words doesn't mean you can't linger over it and "read" its action at a more leisurely pace. In fact, I find that when I encounter a wordless page of the kind that number8 described above - the Alan Moore-style page of a man preparing tea across multiple panels - I tend to slow down, encouraged by the contemplative mood of these kinds of pages to take in the details more slowly and really let each panel sink in before moving on. On the other hand, as you say, decompressed action sequences tend to read really quickly - though again, you certainly could read these scenes more slowly as well. I'd argue that decompression, at least when it's done well, is more about mood and atmosphere than action, and consequently the mood it creates tends to dictate variations in pacing.

  12. #112
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    I really hate how big Marvel prints the AR logos on their pages. Ruins the art. They should really find a better way to indicate the AR pages.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  13. #113
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting sevenarts (view post)
    Decompression doesn't necessarily mean it's a quick read, though; it depends on the reader, and on what exactly is being decompressed.
    Of course not necessarily. However, three textless pages of a guy making tea is likely always going to read quicker than three pages of a guy making tea, then discovering the body of his wife, lamenting, calling the police, fuming at their apathy, and vowing personal revenge, no matter how deliberately you pore over the details. It's not like non-decompressed pages are bereft of significant detail as well.

    I'd argue that decompression, at least when it's done well, is more about mood and atmosphere than action, and consequently the mood it creates tends to dictate variations in pacing.
    I disagree, as decompression isn't even really a factor in things like Eerie and Creepy Comics, which are as moody and atmospheric at their core as comics can be. Decompression is a fine way to dictate pacing, as you say, by making more quantifiable manipulations of time, which in turn affects mood and atmosphere. Not the other way around.

  14. #114
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting number8 (view post)
    I really hate how big Marvel prints the AR logos on their pages. Ruins the art. They should really find a better way to indicate the AR pages.
    The first time I bought one of those AR issues, I thought it was a mistake. It is quite tacky.

  15. #115
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Sven (view post)
    The first time I bought one of those AR issues, I thought it was a mistake. It is quite tacky.
    I also wish there's more tiered pricing. I hate how Marvel basically forces people to buy digital copies for $1 more.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  16. #116
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting number8 (view post)
    I also wish there's more tiered pricing. I hate how Marvel basically forces people to buy digital copies for $1 more.
    Yeah. Bunk. Have you ever done the AR thing? Is it any cool?

  17. #117
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Sven (view post)
    Yeah. Bunk. Have you ever done the AR thing? Is it any cool?
    It can be. Sometimes you get the writer providing commentary, or the page will shift to the original pencils, then inks, etc. That's super cool. The panels that turn into motion comics, or have a miniature Axel Alonzo walk onto the page to pitch stuff at you... not so much.
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  18. #118
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Remender is now also saying on Twitter that it is going to be similar to Fear Agent in its pulpiness.

    Does Fear Agent get better? I've read the first trade and was amused, but found it a rather empty experience. Mostly I couldn't get over the super excellent quality of the printing. Dark Horse's trades are terrific.

  19. #119
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Desperate to hear reactions from this board's denizens re: Captain America and I. Hulk.

  20. #120
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    I will not be checking out either, so don't wait for mine!
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  21. #121
    i am the great went ledfloyd's Avatar
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    I was kind of caught off-guard by the opening scene of Cap, and I'm still not sure what I think about it. After that, it was quite fun if, as you said regarding Fear Agent, a bit empty. He wasn't kidding about hypercompression though, it's almost disorienting how much story he tears through in this issue.

  22. #122
    Venusian Rubbed Moscow sevenarts's Avatar
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    I thought Cap was great. Exactly as Remender promised, it's pulpy and fun and crazy, taking Cap in a totally different direction than the character's been in years. Very intense and fast-moving. Remender excels at this kind of material.

    Hulk was ok. Can't say I'm too excited yet but it seems like a good concept that could be fun. The Hulk's not really a favorite though and it'd take more than this to really wow me with this character. Even if Aaron's run ultimately went nowhere much in its short span, this isn't as thrilling as the best "Stay Angry" issues.

  23. #123
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting number8 (view post)
    I will not be checking out either, so don't wait for mine!
    Genuinely not interested? Sticking it to the man?

  24. #124
    Piss off, ghost! number8's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Sven (view post)
    Genuinely not interested? Sticking it to the man?
    Genuinely not interested in Waid's premise for Hulk. Sounds kinda boring, actually.

    For Cap, I tend to be really burnt out on titles after a long, character-defining run. Same reason I opted out of Jason Aaron's Punisher despite liking him and hearing good things. Same reason I'm avoiding Fraction's FFs.

    Can't be sticking it to the man if I'm buying Thor and three Avengers books!
    Quote Quoting Donald Glover
    I was actually just reading about Matt Damon and he’s like, ‘There’s a culture of outrage.’ I’m like, ‘Well, they have a reason to be outraged.’ I think it’s a lot of dudes just being scared. They’re like, ‘What if I did something and I didn’t realize it?’ I’m like, ‘Deal with it.’
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  25. #125
    Crying Enthusiast Sven's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting number8 (view post)
    Genuinely not interested in Waid's premise for Hulk. Sounds kinda boring, actually.

    For Cap, I tend to be really burnt out on titles after a long, character-defining run. Same reason I opted out of Jason Aaron's Punisher despite liking him and hearing good things. Same reason I'm avoiding Fraction's FFs.

    Can't be sticking it to the man if I'm buying Thor and three Avengers books!
    Good call. The books you site are likely going to have just as much punch as collections down the road. And you're observation about Waid's premise is well put, though I do like the idea of Banner restoring his reputation as a super-scientist. Maybe he'll join the New Avengers down the line.

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