HBO's A Game of Thrones

[MadMan]

Except the other people killed in the first season weren't nearly as central as characters. Ned was literally in the middle of most of the major events of the first season and his death was a major cause of much of what has happened since. It's kinda like being 2/3 into Psycho and wondering where Janet Leigh is.

Comparing a movie with only a handful of characters to a show where even some random whore gets screen time isn't the same thing. And the only reason I didn't recognize Ned Stark's name is because Irish or whoever posted Edd Stark. I only remembered Ned. And yes I know he was killed, and yes people I know what the fuck is going on. But whatever

You said Robb is ignoring the negative consequences of his war. So you would have him do what instead? Call off the war? He just said last episode that he wanted all of the wounded properly treated, so there you go he is not ignoring the consequences of his war.

His war isn't achieving anything, and has just resulted in Winterfall being taken since it was left defenseless. I would say that he is really more focused on revenge at this point, although granted he did consider going back to take Winterfall, only for one of the lords forcing him to reconsider.

[Derek]

Comparing a movie with only a handful of characters to a show where even some random whore gets screen time isn't the same thing. And the only reason I didn't recognize Ned Stark's name is because Irish or whoever posted Edd Stark. I only remembered Ned. And yes I know he was killed, and yes people I know what the fuck is going on. But whatever

Well, I don't think I see any random whores on the Season 1 DVD cover:



But I hear ya, it can get mighty confusing with all the names. You said "Edd Stark was good" which implied you knew who he was, but yes, it's Eddard Stark, nickname Ned.

His war isn't achieving anything, and has just resulted in Winterfall being taken since it was left defenseless. I would say that he is really more focused on revenge at this point, although granted he did consider going back to take Winterfall, only for one of the lords forcing him to reconsider.

But his war is accomplishing a lot. Read the last page of the thread - there have been several mentions of Robb the wolf winning impressive battles by different characters. Though as I said, the show doesn't make it clear enough just how well Robb is doing at this point.

[Qrazy]

Comparing a movie with only a handful of characters to a show where even some random whore gets screen time isn't the same thing. And the only reason I didn't recognize Ned Stark's name is because Irish or whoever posted Edd Stark. I only remembered Ned. And yes I know he was killed, and yes people I know what the fuck is going on. But whatever

His war isn't achieving anything, and has just resulted in Winterfall being taken since it was left defenseless. I would say that he is really more focused on revenge at this point, although granted he did consider going back to take Winterfall, only for one of the lords forcing him to reconsider.

The goal of the war is to dethrone Joffrey and the Lannisters in general. Also when you are in a war you can't just say alright, didn't realize some innocent people would suffer, I'll just call it off now.

[[ETM]]

His war isn't achieving anything, and has just resulted in Winterfall being taken since it was left defenseless. I would say that he is really more focused on revenge at this point, although granted he did consider going back to take Winterfall, only for one of the lords forcing him to reconsider.

The Lannisters have killed Robb's father, and as far as the Starks know, are basically holding his two sisters hostage. Robb has proclaimed himself "King in the North", effectively rebelling against the Iron Throne, which he doesn't want. But to be recognized, he has to defeat the Lannisters and carefully deal with whoever sits on the throne next. His one major mistake in the war was trusting Theon Greyjoy, which is why Winterfell... fell.

Remember, Robb rallied the reluctant Stark bannermen against the wealthiest family in Westeros, and their much larger, well equipped and trained army. He's winning because he's a good tactician and a charismatic leader, and it's been abundantly made clear so far.

[TGM]

Unlike his sisters, he really doesn't have a personal story of his own. (This was also John Snow's problem, but at least Snow was placed in an interesting setting. Given Martin's tendency to introduce drama like a club to the head, it's not surprising that both Robb and John both recently got quasi-girlfriends).

Film and television often depict unimportant details and events offscreen. By choosing never to show Robb bravehearting around the Riverlands, they actually undercut him as a character in the audience's mind. They're telling us about his great strategies and numerous victories, without showing us.

Little as Robb is showcased in the show, I'm still glad we're even getting that much. Robb literally has only a single scene in book 2, at the very beginning, when he's trying on his crown for the first time (funnily enough, his only scene in the entire book didn't actually get adapted into the show).

Robb was one of my favorite characters in book 1, so to see him get shafted so badly in book 2 was pretty disappointing. We only merely heard of his accolades, but never got to see or experience any of them for ourselves. So I'm just glad that the show's actually showing us even this little bit.

[Irish]

Great post, TGM. Thanks for the heads up! I had no idea the books played it that way. While it explains the approach taken by the show, I still find it curious, bordering on bizarre.

(Almost tempted to finish reading the second book now).

[Morris Schæffer]

So I don't wanna read out of fear of getting spoiled, but season two is on par with one? Or better? Or worse?

[[ETM]]

So I don't wanna read out of fear of getting spoiled, but season two is on par with one? Or better? Or worse?

Much more focused and just plain more fun.

[[ETM]]

[ledfloyd]

"why are the gods such vicious cunts? where is the god of tits and wine?"

[Irish]

2 good scenes, a lot of bad scenes. Frustrating episode. There wasn't much that mattered at all. Huge chunks of this felt like retreads from the past 3-4 weeks (Tyrion and Cersei trade barbs, the increasingly annoying Mother of Dragons enunciates clearly & emphatically to anyone nearby, Robb and his mother have harsh words, blah, blah).

Glad we finally got to see The Kingslayer get into a rowboat, though. That was epic television.

[Raiders]

2 good scenes, a lot of bad scenes. Frustrating episode. There wasn't much that mattered at all. Huge chunks of this felt like retreads from the past 3-4 weeks (Tyrion and Cersei trade barbs, the increasingly annoying Mother of Dragons enunciates clearly & emphatically to anyone nearby, Robb and his mother have harsh words, blah, blah).

Yeah, though Robb and his mother's scene was not the same as before; he turned her into a prisoner here. Arya's scenes and Theon and his sister were probably my favorite scenes. Tyrion and Shae's scene was well done, too. Daenerys's scenes are becoming almost unbearable and redundant.

Glad we finally got to see The Kingslayer get into a rowboat, though. That was epic television.

It was even weider that his character continues to be reduced to an arrogant swordsman and nothing more. Even at this stage in the books I think Martin conveyed more than just this one side of him. It's getting harder for them to convincingly show his full characterization if they don't start soon.

[Watashi]

That scene with Jamie and Brienne is how the third book opens. I guess they're just sticking it here so they can have more of his character this season since he has a huge role in the third book.

This is a weak episode. It's mostly filler and build-up to the massive penultimate episode next week.

I agree that Dany's scenes are annoying, but Ian Glenn's amazing presence keeps me from hating it too much.

[Raiders]

Well, I guess since Robb has gone and returned from the Crag and no mention of Jeyne has taken place, the series is sticking with Talisa. My guess would be much like changing "the Others" and "Asha" to "Yara", when we may finally be introduced to Jeyne Poole they wanted to keep it simple. Doesn't really matter, though it is strange that they have linked her to a triarch from Volantis.

[ledfloyd]

i thought there was enough this week to carry it. that amazing Tyrion quote, Robb's scene with Catelyn, naked Oona Chaplin, Jamie and Brienne in a canoe (i coincidentally spent most of yesterday in a canoe), Arya and Theon panicking, NAKED OONA CHAPLIN.

but yeah, there's no denying they're basically putting things in place for the next two weeks. i wish they would do something interesting with Jon and Dany. they were two of my favorite characters last season. at least the trip into House of the Undying should be fun.

[Irish]

YArya's scenes and Theon and his sister were probably my favorite scenes.

Theon's scene slipped my mind, but I agree that it's a good one. My second pick after Arya's scene was the one with Tyrion -- when Cersai calls out to bring out "his whore," his look of horror sliding into absolutely relief was just fantastic.

I agree that Dany's scenes are annoying, but Ian Glenn's amazing presence keeps me from hating it too much.

Well, it took awhile but we've finally found common ground. :P

I love that guy. He was great in Downton Abbey too.

[Lucky]

Who was the second person Arya named to the assassin guy? Did I miss that, or did that happen offscreen? Don't remember from the book, either, so I'm assuming it wasn't that important.

[Derek]

Who was the second person Arya named to the assassin guy? Did I miss that, or did that happen offscreen? Don't remember from the book, either, so I'm assuming it wasn't that important.

The guard who was going to tell Tywin about her. He got hit with a poisoned arrow and died right at Tywin's door.

Don't remember who the second person she named in the books though.

[Qrazy]

It was even weider that his character continues to be reduced to an arrogant swordsman and nothing more. Even at this stage in the books I think Martin conveyed more than just this one side of him. It's getting harder for them to convincingly show his full characterization if they don't start soon.

Nah, he was insulting Brien at this point in the books as well.

[

Show Spoiler

Soon they will have their fight and he will tell her the story of the death of the mad king and people will care about him.

]

[number8]

[youtube]25KABvPbq-U[/youtube]

[Watashi]

Is that Tenacious D?

[number8]

Ha, no.

[Qrazy]

I'm reading the fourth book now and I just came in to say that Martin is absolute shit at describing food. They had a serving of the bloody oranges, the blood beef, the bloody apricots. My god it's awful.

[[ETM]]

Was I the only one to lose it laughing at Tyrion/Bronn/Varys, as well as at "Un-name me. - No. - Please?"? Definitely setting up things, but as an episode, I found it as fun as the rest of the season. I really like how much better the writers are at keeping the plot threads active this season as opposed to the first.

[number8]

I thought it was a fun episode, too. Certainly not as eventful, but keeps up the momentum well.

"We should sail there immediately."