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Thread: 28 Film Discussion Threads Later

  1. #71701
    collecting tapes Skitch's Avatar
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    Star Trek: TMP is the best Star Trek film.

  2. #71702
    Quote Quoting megladon8 (view post)
    What we've watched the last couple of nights...

    Star Trek: The Motion Picture
    This is really good and I don't get why it is so polarizing. It feels as truly Star Trek as you can get - hard sci fi with big ideas. It wears its inspirations on its sleeve (2001, Forbidden Planet), and does cool new things with effects and visuals. And man, that musical score is legendary. Incredible stuff.
    Sorry; I'm something of a Trekkie, but I still felt TMP was a pretty dull first movie for the series, since it kind of feels to me the way I imagine the people who think 2001 is boring feel about that, you know?

  3. #71703
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    I get it, I just don't agree. I don't find it boring at all.

    Same with 2001. When someone says they think 2001 is boring, I expect their top 10 favorite movies to include a lot of stuff by Michael Bay and McG.
    "All right, that's too hot. Anything we can do about that heat?"

    "Rick...it's a flamethrower."

  4. #71704
    Quote Quoting megladon8 (view post)
    I get it, I just don't agree. I don't find it boring at all.

    Same with 2001. When someone says they think 2001 is boring, I expect their top 10 favorite movies to include a lot of stuff by Michael Bay and McG.
    Eh, for me Undiscovered Country has always been the best Trek (out of the ones I've seen, at least), since it did the best job of balancing the underlying optimism of Rodenberry's vision with the more popcorn-y thrills needed to entertain the non-Trekkies out there.

  5. #71705

    Lord Of The Rings: The Return Of The King (Jackson, '03)



    For Frodo.


    [
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    Final Score: 9

    [
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    Last edited by StuSmallz; 02-24-2022 at 09:10 AM.

  6. #71706
    I'm the problem it's me DFA1979's Avatar
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    I'm too lazy to look for the thread or whatever but The King's Man was a mess and definitely is (so far) the worst movie I've seen from 2021. That and Eternals which bored the ever living hell out of me for most of it's run time.
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  7. #71707
    collecting tapes Skitch's Avatar
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    Yeah the Eternals was a chore to get through. And at the end once all was revealed, I asked myself, "but do you care?"

    No. The answer was no. I did not.

  8. #71708

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  10. #71710
    The Pan megladon8's Avatar
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    Revisited Serpico last night.
    Did Lumet ever do any films that had anything interesting going on visually or stylistically? I've seen several and they all seem based around dynamite scripts and performances, but with incredibly boring visual direction.
    "All right, that's too hot. Anything we can do about that heat?"

    "Rick...it's a flamethrower."

  11. #71711
    collecting tapes Skitch's Avatar
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    Interesting question. Looking over his filmography, 1. I'm ashamed I havent seen more because Ive really liked everything I've seen, but 2. it seems like he has a talent/knack/choice of selecting work that is primarily set in singular locations? Maybe I'm wrong.

  12. #71712
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    Quote Quoting Skitch (view post)
    Interesting question. Looking over his filmography, 1. I'm ashamed I havent seen more because Ive really liked everything I've seen, but 2. it seems like he has a talent/knack/choice of selecting work that is primarily set in singular locations? Maybe I'm wrong.
    You may be right, Skitch. I think he did quite a bit of work with stage as well as adapting stage works to screen. So that would make sense.

    His visual direction seems to be purely functional. Which is...fine. But not really what I personally go to movies for.

    It reminds me of an interview I saw with Peter Bogdanovich on TCM, where he was discussing his favorite films. I forget the exact context of the comment, but at one point he said, "...and to this day, that's all that movies really are. Just people talking."

    And I remember thinking, "gotta disagree with you there, bud."

    The idea of reducing such an incredible visual medium like film down to "it's just people talking" has always felt asinine to me.

    Anyways, my point being, I wonder if Lumet came from a similar school of thought.
    "All right, that's too hot. Anything we can do about that heat?"

    "Rick...it's a flamethrower."

  13. #71713
    collecting tapes Skitch's Avatar
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    I can't disagree with your opinion...but I am fascinated by movies that are originated by plays. Noises Off! is brilliant

  14. #71714
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    Quote Quoting Skitch (view post)
    I can't disagree with your opinion...but I am fascinated by movies that are originated by plays. Noises Off! is brilliant
    I agree 100% and I love them, too.

    I'm just saying to reduce the entire art form and medium down to "it's people talking" doesn't make sense to me.
    "All right, that's too hot. Anything we can do about that heat?"

    "Rick...it's a flamethrower."

  15. #71715
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    "All right, that's too hot. Anything we can do about that heat?"

    "Rick...it's a flamethrower."

  16. #71716
    Quote Quoting megladon8 (view post)
    You may be right, Skitch. I think he did quite a bit of work with stage as well as adapting stage works to screen. So that would make sense.

    His visual direction seems to be purely functional. Which is...fine. But not really what I personally go to movies for.

    It reminds me of an interview I saw with Peter Bogdanovich on TCM, where he was discussing his favorite films. I forget the exact context of the comment, but at one point he said, "...and to this day, that's all that movies really are. Just people talking."

    And I remember thinking, "gotta disagree with you there, bud."

    The idea of reducing such an incredible visual medium like film down to "it's just people talking" has always felt asinine to me.

    Anyways, my point being, I wonder if Lumet came from a similar school of thought.
    Films of people talking aren't inherently less "cinematic" than films consisting mainly of physical action; there are lots of ways to film people talking, some more dynamic than others. His Girl Friday is one of the talkiest films ever made but Hawks keeps his actors in constant motion, whereas contemporary action movies--e.g., any film by Peter Jackson or Christopher Nolan--tend toward visual monotony: static scenes of expository dialogue punctuated by illegible action scenes. Bodganovich's films seem to me more impressive visually than Lumet's, as the former was trying to revive a classical tradition that Lumet--especially in his earlier, more visually emphatic films, such as The Pawnbroker--helped to kill off before calming down somewhat in his later films, but both are largely at the mercy of their scripts. My favourite Bodganovich films are currently The Last Picture Show, Saint Jack, and The Cat's Meow; my favourite Lumets are Dog Day Afternoon, Find Me Guilty, and Before the Devil Knows You're Dead, but there's still a lot I haven't seen by both directors.
    Last edited by baby doll; 03-02-2022 at 12:18 AM.
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  17. #71717
    I'm the problem it's me DFA1979's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting Skitch (view post)
    Yeah the Eternals was a chore to get through. And at the end once all was revealed, I asked myself, "but do you care?"

    No. The answer was no. I did not.
    It is literally what people accuse MCU films of all being haha. I now know how they feel. Plus contrasting it with Shang Chai which is just tons of fun.
    Blog!

    And it's happened once again
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  18. #71718
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    Quote Quoting baby doll (view post)
    Films of people talking aren't inherently less "cinematic" than films consisting mainly of physical action; there are lots of ways to film people talking, some more dynamic than others. His Girl Friday is one of the talkiest films ever made but Hawks keeps his actors in constant motion, whereas contemporary action movies--e.g., any film by Peter Jackson or Christopher Nolan--tend toward visual monotony: static scenes of expository dialogue punctuated by illegible action scenes. Bodganovich's films seem to me more impressive visually than Lumet's, as the former was trying to revive a classical tradition that Lumet--especially in his earlier, more visually emphatic films, such as The Pawnbroker--helped to kill off before calming down somewhat in his later films, but both are largely at the mercy of their scripts. My favourite Bodganovich films are currently The Last Picture Show, Saint Jack, and The Cat's Meow; my favourite Lumets are Dog Day Afternoon, Find Me Guilty, and Before the Devil Knows You're Dead, but there's still a lot I haven't seen by both directors.

    It's not physical action I'm talking about, though. Lumet doesn't do anything interesting with the camera. Close and medium shots, stock angles, no real visual style.

    His films are vehicles for the scripts and performances with zero flare.
    "All right, that's too hot. Anything we can do about that heat?"

    "Rick...it's a flamethrower."

  19. #71719
    Quote Quoting megladon8 (view post)
    It's not physical action I'm talking about, though. Lumet doesn't do anything interesting with the camera. Close and medium shots, stock angles, no real visual style.

    His films are vehicles for the scripts and performances with zero flare.
    Considering how overbearing Lumet's style in his early films, it's probably for the best he toned it down in his later work, where (notwithstanding the flashy transitions in Before the Devil Knows You're Dead, to cite only the first example that comes to mind) he seems to concentrate his creative efforts more on the films' mise en scène than the camera: e.g., the highly purposeful colour-coding in Before the Devil Knows You're Dead. I wouldn't make any great claims for Lumet as a director, but his stylistic choices strike me as far more thought out and purposeful than most of the Hollywood directors who've followed in his wake. Incidentally his book Making Movies is very much worth a read.
    Last edited by baby doll; 03-02-2022 at 03:47 AM.
    Just because...
    The Fabelmans (Steven Spielberg, 2022) mild
    Petite maman (Céline Sciamma, 2021) mild
    The Banshees of Inisherin (Martin McDonagh, 2022) mild

    The last book I read was...
    The Complete Short Stories by Mark Twain


    The (New) World

  20. #71720
    I'm the problem it's me DFA1979's Avatar
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    I've liked all of what I've seem from Lumet so far. Some of his movies are dialogue driven which is fine with me. Dog Day Afternoon is probably one of the best bank heist hostage flicks I've ever seen and I love 12 Angry Men.
    Blog!

    And it's happened once again
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    And sees through the master plan
    But everybody's gone
    And I've been here for too long
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    Well, I guess this is growing up

  21. #71721
    collecting tapes Skitch's Avatar
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    Quote Quoting DFA1979 (view post)
    It is literally what people accuse MCU films of all being haha. I now know how they feel. Plus contrasting it with Shang Chai which is just tons of fun.
    Yeah I had fun with Shang Chai! And I knew nothing about either that or Eternals going in.

  22. #71722
    collecting tapes Skitch's Avatar
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    I hate when I'm scrolling around and 12 Angry Men is on because whether theres 90 minutes left or 10, I have to watch it. It's nearly a rain man situation. Wonper! Wopner!
    Last edited by Skitch; 03-02-2022 at 10:59 PM.

  23. #71723
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    Yeah Skitch can never say no to 12 Angry Men.
    "All right, that's too hot. Anything we can do about that heat?"

    "Rick...it's a flamethrower."

  24. #71724
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    Lol pwned
    "All right, that's too hot. Anything we can do about that heat?"

    "Rick...it's a flamethrower."

  25. #71725
    Quote Quoting megladon8 (view post)
    Revisited Serpico last night.
    Did Lumet ever do any films that had anything interesting going on visually or stylistically? I've seen several and they all seem based around dynamite scripts and performances, but with incredibly boring visual direction.
    What about 12 Angry Men, where, according to this...

    At the beginning of the film, the cameras are positioned above eye level and mounted with wide-angle lenses, to give the appearance of greater depth between subjects, but as the film progresses the focal length of the lenses is gradually increased. By the end of the film, nearly everyone is shown in closeup, using telephoto lenses from a lower angle, which decreases or "shortens" depth of field. Lumet stated that his intention in using these techniques with cinematographer Boris Kaufman was to create a nearly palpable claustrophobia.

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