Annnnnnd Rose McGowan just called Ben Affleck a liar.
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Annnnnnd Rose McGowan just called Ben Affleck a liar.
My boy's wicked phohny.
Apart from everything else, how did I not know Asia Argento was dating Anthony Bourdain?
Also, whoa, Scarlet Diva was inspired by her encounter with Weinstein? Might have to give that one another look.
Third thing: I approve of anything that exposes Ben Affleck's rampant douchery.
Harvey should go down. No question.
That said, the head-hunting of every celebrity/politician he's ever been associated with (women and men alike) makes me uneasy. Apparently, silence is guilt, but statements are picked apart. You have a guy who essentially ran the entire "high-brow, awards-worthy" industry. I imagine it couldn't have been easy for anyone to say negative things about him openly, victims or those who just heard the "talk." On social media, it's become really easy to take a position of moral superiority, and I think people feed on that feeling these days. There's always more nuance than that. Some people involved probably did behave disgustingly. Others may have just found themselves in a really tough spot and reacted in a normal, fearful, human way. It's easy to tear down famous people, but they're just "people." Nothing makes them uniquely better or worse as a class of individuals. They have complicated feelings and reactions, like anyone else.
No we must convict every person ever associated or ever conversed with anyone who said anything inappropriate ever. Guilty before innocent is what I say!Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidSeven
And yet ... it's fucked up that a guys like Seth Rogen and Kevin Smith demonstrated more basic humanity in 140 characters than a lot of "A-listers" did in 600 words.
It's fucked up that "they're just people" who may have some moral culpability in sticking with Harvey despite probably knowing what they knew.
Harvey's wife is out.
For what it's worth, the journalist, who worked on the 2004 Weinstein story that Damon and Crowe allegedly helped kill, says she endorses Damon's response and that he did not know about her investigation into Harvey when he talked to her:
Despite the above, I imagine the 24-hour cycle of character assassination will likely stick to Damon forever.
Nope he's a liar. Let's kill the beast.
His answer was trash no matter who endorsed it.
So you're using media to demonstrate media bias? How does that work?
Damon doesn't need help to stick his foot in his mouth and look like an ass. He's plenty good at doing that all by himself.
DavidSeven said it better than I ever could.
Weinstein is disgusting and deserves everything he gets.
But the internet is so full of unchecked, misdirected anger. Treating every person who ever interacted with Weinstein as if they were right there in the room(s) with him assaulting these women is terrible.
There is irony in you being the one to call out a celeb for not being tactful enough in a response.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish
Sometimes our words don't come out how we mean them to. I was more interested in whether Damon was being honest in his response. The Wrap writer, who presumably is the only one who would know, says he is. This alone does not make him a hero or villain or whatever to me. The veracity of his response was called into question earlier, so I posted a related tweet.
No need to make it personal -- beyond that, this is a helluva silly reach. C'mon dude.Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidSeven
Here's a selection of the many times Damon has put his foot in his mouth:
- Matt Damon explains diversity to a black producer on "Project Greenlight"
- Matt Damon tries to hand wave away whitewashing controversy around "Great Wall"
- Matt Damon suggest actors "gay or straight" shouldn't be public about their sexuality
See the trend yet? Dude is kinda an ass.
If one believes McGown, then it follows that Damon knew about Weinstein, too. (Unless one thinks that, somehow, Affleck and Damon nevvvvvvver had a conversation about their pal Harvey.)
If one doesn't believe McGowan, then I'd be curious why.
ETA: I was a huge fan of this entire crowd up until a few years ago. Weinstein and Miramax were independent film in the 90s. They were like a combined A24 / Blumhouse / Anapurna. They imported Hong Kong movies and released them into American theaters. They were everywhere and all of it was terrific.
My friends and I saw a lot of Weinstein productions on their theatrical debut -- like "Clerks," "Pulp Fiction," "El Mariachi," "Swingers." We wanted to be those guys behind the camera, writing and directing our own stuff.
One of the reasons I'm so pissed about this --- beyond the pure horror of it --- is I feel like they've taken a giant shit on everything I loved when I was a kid, and I can't go back to it now. Part of me idolized them and they turns out to be really, really sleazy. If not directly then yes, by association.
There's no way I can rationalize watching any Miramax / TWC movie anymore.
Has Tarantino said anything yet?
I got a bad feeling about Tarantino in all this.
Tarantino hasn't said a word and neither has Rodriguez.
I'd be surprised if they did before they had a film to promote and some brave soul corners them during an interview.
And yeah, props to Kevin Smith for straightaway saying how fucked this is and how he sides with the women.
The weird thing is I figured his comments would be the duh obvious slam-dunk response to all of this.
Yeah to be clear I was calling trash on Damon specifically. I'm not endorsing dragging everyone who's ever worked under Miramax and TWC. This dude is just historically awful at addressing people's concerns. He actually played the "I have daughters" card here, which I don't get why men still think is an appropriate statement to say when talking about sexual assault. It makes you seem worse.
Irish I don't feel like anyone is saying you're wrong to feel that way, but...i don't know...i also worked with people for a decade, a decade ago. I also wasn't so close with them that it's not impossible they could've been entirely scumbags that I wouldn't have noticed. It's not discounting the females story one iota, but to immediately lump them in as complicit parties that is weird.
It's not a fan take at all, and more inclined to damn Affleck because of mccowns comments! But I'm less inclined to damn people who knew people just because...what? I haven't seen an outcry to destroy the many MANY people that continue to work with Polanski for dozens of years. Certainly not justifingy those actions, but now damning because they didn't immediately hold a press conference to condemn people they worked with years ago? If they willfully ignored wrong doing, sure, but how can anyone know that?
It's sota speculative at this point, and their time frame of speaking out it's automatically condemning.
I'm not defending anyone beyond we don't know without evidence. But I'm a little weirded out by "fuck this guy for not speaking out in hour 27 vs hour 14!" Without more evidence of wrong doing or overlooking.
Miramax/TWC facilitated Harvey's behavior for ~30 years. The company was fine with him as long as the money rolled in and the Oscars racked up. But I try not to patronize businesses that actively cause harm. I can't rationalize watching those movies after knowing what Weinstein did to Arquette and Argento.
We're talking about a company that turned a blind eye to their president/CEO raping young women. It sucks for me as a fan, but I can't give these assholes money and attention and just sorta shrug because this shit is in the past, or who really knows what happened, or this detail or that detail is unclear. I read the stories. I listened to the tape. I can't go back now.
As for Damon and Affleck: Either you believe McGowan or you don't. As a former fan of a lot of the people involved, I choose to believe her, not them. I don't see a lot of wiggle room there.
You guys draw your own lines and I'll draw mine.
Oh come on, you are going to erase Pulp Fiction from your life because the producer is a scumbag?Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish
I mean, you're free to do it, of course, I just think it's ridiculous.
Arquette is in that movie.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grouchy
As for "ridiculous" -- why do you think my own entertainment/enjoyment of some pop culture bullshit is more important that the lives of these women?
If I'm a fan of these actresses, why would I support the person that abused them?
Because that's what I think I'd really be telling myself by engaging with Miramax/TWC. "Who cares! This is a good movie." Well, fuck the movies. I'm sick of this shit.
But her acting in that movie isn't what damaged her career. It was her personal interactions with the producer.
I don't know, man. Same way that I think abolishing slavery in the US is a good thing despite Lincoln himself being a hypocrite. Or public education in Argentina is something I'm proud of, but Sarmiento (who fought for it) was straight up racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish