TOP TWENTY THINGS THAT MAKE ME FEEL LIKE A WOMAN (SFW)

[Mara]

With bac0n's blessing, I'm going to go ahead and rip off his thread. There probably won't be anything earth-shattering here, as I lead a pretty quiet life. I also picked 20 instead of 37 because it's a nice, round number.

There are two main reasons I wanted to start this thread.

1. The male-to-female ratio at Match-Cut is ridiculous. Maybe I'll draw some of the ladies out of the woodwork. I'm not counting on it, though, so I'm going to be writing to a primarily male reader.

2. Every once in awhile, people get all philosophical and ask the equivilent of "If you could come back in another life, would you choose to be the other gender?" I'm always amazed by the number of people who say yes. I would never, ever, ever want to come back as a man. I love being a woman. Still, I'm trying to keep clear of "Why I'm Glad I'm Not a Man" posts (i.e., "Vital Bodily Organs Belong Inside the Body... Duh.") and concentrate on reasons I'm glad I'm female.

[Mara]

I should perhaps mention that a lot of tradionally girly things are not going to show up on this list, because I don't practice them. I hate shopping. I refuse to wear make-up or high heels. I don't particularly enjoy getting gussied up. I'm not vain and I don't go for pampering or (*shudder*) massages. Being complimented makes me uncomfortable.

[Mara]

20. Gender Role Hypocrisy

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/yin-yang-15470.png

The first and most primary reason that it's great to be a woman is that cultural expectations are monumentally unfair in your favor. I enjoy this far more than I should.

If a woman participates in things that are culturally associated with men; like drinking beer and watching sports and swearing, this is seen as being "cool." If a man enjoys kittens and knitting and show tunes, he's seen as being a total wuss.

Therefore, if you are a woman, you can do pretty much anything you want without it damaging your femininity. For the first time in Western history, women have more cultural freedom than men.

And it rules.

[Ezee E]

Thus far, you are correct.

[Mara]

19. Lotion

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/aveeno_daily_moisture_lotion-764522.jpg

Lotion is awesome. You smear it all over your skin, and then you get all soft and cuddly.

I really can't stand overly greasy lotions (often labeled something like "body creme") or scented lotions, which irritate my skin. I prefer something that is gentle and effective. (Aveeno, pictured, is excellent.) I rub it all over from my head to my feet, and everything feels better afterwards.

The nicest feeling is if one has just shaved one's legs (an activity which barely missed the cut on my list), and then slathered on lotion, and then put on a nice, widely-cut, filmy skirt and then one goes for a walk. The sunshine and wind on smooth, lotioned legs is lovely.

The second nicest feeling is if it's a lazy Saturday morning, and one has just taken a shower, slathered on the lotion, and then gets back into bed naked between fresh sheets and reads a book for the next couple of hours because one doesn't need to be up yet.

[DavidSeven]

The second nicest feeling is if it's a lazy Saturday morning, and one has just taken a shower, slathered on the lotion, and then gets back into bed naked[...]

This sentence has just been entered into my Top Things That Make Me Feel Like A Man list.

[Mara]

18. The Forbidden Vocabulary

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/ab_fab.jpg

I'm really not sure how men manage to be so careful about the words they do or do not say.

How do they describe things that are cute? Charming? Cuddly? Fantastic? Marvelous? Fabulous? Exquisite? Enchanting?

What do they call someone when they can't call them sweetie? Darling? Precious? Honey?

It's like men are forbidden to use words that are effusively positive. Who came up with that rule?

[Kurosawa Fan]

If a man enjoys kittens and knitting and show tunes, he's seen as being a total wuss.


:cry:

[Mara]

This sentence has just been entered into my Top Things That Make Me Feel Like A Man list.

Psh. Selective editing. ;)

And I'm not saying it's right, KF. Everyone should enjoy kittens.

[Mara]

17. Dancing Alone

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/2ff7022a2b.jpg

I've always been irked by the unspoken rule in clubs, etc. that women are allowed to go out and dance alone, and men really aren't.

But.

This post is about dancing alone alone, i.e., alone in the house with the shades drawn. I feel most like dancing when there is nobody around to criticize or judge my dancing or my preference in music. I get totally into it, screaming along with the lyrics, flipping my hair, jumping up and down.

I probably look ridiculous.

I don't care.

[Mara]

16. Corset Films

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/01433902.jpg

Call them what you like. Those who have known me long enough know how much I love this kind of film-- where people are mannered and repressed and there's lots of yearning. Many of them are based on literature (some good, some bad) or on historical events. Some of the films are absolutely awful, but stick a pretty girl in a corset, and I'll probably check it out.

For one thing, this type of film makes for great romance, when used properly. The point of a romantic film is to introduce two people and then keep them apart for two hours worth of plot, and then let them get together. One of the reasons the modern-day romantic film rarely works is because in these enlightened times, there's rarely any good reason for a couple to stay apart for that much plot time. If there is no real tension in the separation, then there is no emotional payoff when the tension is released. (Modern romantic comedies assume that being slightly peeved at a stupid falsehood or misconception is enough to drive destined lovers apart. Since when?)

However, in the good corset romance, there are obligations and reservations that played out in normal life that simply don't exist anymore. Cultural and class boundries kept people apart, as well as family obligations, arranged marriages, angry parents and (sometimes) prior spouses. All this made for couple-separation as binding as the heroine's corset, and made the untanglement all that much more fun.

[Horbgorbler]

Kittens, knitting and showtunes are three of the things that keep me alive, and I'm not slightly ashamed to admit it.

[Watashi]

Kittens, knitting and showtunes are three of the things that keep me alive, and I'm not slightly ashamed to admit it.
Aha! I always knew you were a woman!

[Mara]

15. Chivalry

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/72107213347b0f3a7bd993.jpg

Not that it happens that often-- and not that I'd be comfortable if it did-- but nothing makes you feel so feminine as when a man is suddenly chivalrous.

Sometimes it's a stranger, who suddenly opens the door for you or gives you his seat on the metro. When it's a stranger, it's often an older gentleman. There's nothing flirty or sexual about it-- it's just a higher form of courtesy, and it's nice.

I'm particularly fond of when I'm walking with an older gentleman (who is not a stranger) and he takes my arm. Sometimes, they will pat my hand that they're holding with the other hand. It's a very gentle, comforting sort of feeling.

When it's someone I know, or someone my own age, it often is flirty. Nothing wrong with that. I don't mind having someone help me with a bag or open a jar for me. Only rarely, when it's overused or insisted upon, it can cross the line into creepy.

Mostly, though, it's just nice. It's that extra bit of attention that makes you feel special and noticed.

[jenniferofthejungle]

17. Dancing Alone


This post is about dancing alone alone, i.e., alone in the house with the shades drawn. I feel most like dancing when there is nobody around to criticize or judge my dancing or my preference in music. I get totally into it, screaming along with the lyrics, flipping my hair, jumping up and down.

That feels wonderful.

[MadMan]

Some say #15 is dead. I disagree. Its just sort of gone dormaint, like 80s music and Pauly Shore's career. I sometimes do it although I feel like its kind of pointless at this point, and that some women are actually annoyed by it.

[soitgoes...]

15. Chivalry

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/72107213347b0f3a7bd993.jpg

Not that it happens that often-- and not that I'd be comfortable if it did-- but nothing makes you feel so feminine as when a man is suddenly chivalrous.

Sometimes it's a stranger, who suddenly opens the door for you or gives you his seat on the metro. When it's a stranger, it's often an older gentleman. There's nothing flirty or sexual about it-- it's just a higher form of courtesy, and it's nice.

I'm particularly fond of when I'm walking with an older gentleman (who is not a stranger) and he takes my arm. Sometimes, they will pat my hand that they're holding with the other hand. It's a very gentle, comforting sort of feeling.

When it's someone I know, or someone my own age, it often is flirty. Nothing wrong with that. I don't mind having someone help me with a bag or open a jar for me. Only rarely, when it's overused or insisted upon, it can cross the line into creepy.

Mostly, though, it's just nice. It's that extra bit of attention that makes you feel special and noticed.
This sometimes leads to one thing that pisses me off to no end. When I hold a door open for a perfect stranger, and they show absolutely no gratitude whatsoever. I feel like putting my hand smack in the middle of their face and pushing them right back through the door and slamming it shut. I understand that what I'm doing isn't expected or asked for, but show some acknowledgment that what I did was a gesture that didn't have to be made. Usually I'll snidely say "You're welcome" as if they had said thank you. This too is generally ignored.

That being said, I always open and hold the door for a lady. Open the car door first for her, etc. My mom did a good job pounding chivalry into my head.

[Philosophe_rouge]

19. Lotion

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/aveeno_daily_moisture_lotion-764522.jpg

Mmmm.... yes. I just had a shower, so lotion time! I have the same one pictured. It's like the most wonderful thing, and you feel extra clean. This list already rocks.


15. Chivalry

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/72107213347b0f3a7bd993.jpg

I've noticed in the past year or so, that this seems to be really catching on. Before then, I never remember guys opening doors for me... or anyone for that matter. Now it's almost a daily thing. I like it, and don't see why anyone should take offense frankly. I do it too, it's just common courtesy and sometimes it's those little things that can brighten someone's day. I think if we were all a little more chivalrous, the world would be at the very least slightly more pleasent.

[lovejuice]

This sometimes leads to one thing that pisses me off to no end. When I hold a door open for a perfect stranger, and they show absolutely no gratitude whatsoever.


we should not live in the same city then. what pisses me off to no end is a perfect stranger barking for gratitude from a simple act of opening a door which he freaking has to do it eventually provided he's not ellen page from X3.

i definitely say thank you if it's obvious the stranger is holding a door for me. but sometimes a person gets to the door first, that old fart opens it, the act of opening hinders him of any further movement, and someone who is right behind him walk though the door so as not to clog the traffic in a hallway. sometimes i nod my head, but when thought occupies me, i walk by. can't see why i should get verbally attacked for that. that's to me is hundred times more rude.

[MadMan]

Mmmm.... yes. I just had a shower, so lotion time! I have the same one pictured. It's like the most wonderful thing, and you feel extra clean. This list already rocks.


I've noticed in the past year or so, that this seems to be really catching on. Before then, I never remember guys opening doors for me... or anyone for that matter. Now it's almost a daily thing. I like it, and don't see why anyone should take offense frankly. I do it too, it's just common courtesy and sometimes it's those little things that can brighten someone's day. I think if we were all a little more chivalrous, the world would be at the very least slightly more pleasent.rouge the thing is some girls feel that your intruding on their freedom or something like that. I have yet to encounter that though. So I just keep on opening doors for ladies. Until one of them gets pissed and maces me in the face. Heh.

[monolith94]

Uh, can't stand lotion. I just don't like it, can't explain why. Sort of like how I don't like the feel of cotton balls. *shudder*

thumbs up to reading in bed on a lazy saturday morning though!

[Sycophant]

I used to attend Brigham Young University. The men there hold doors open for women there with such frequency and dedication, it's kind of creepy.

As it is, I hold doors for people if it's not going to put a significant cramp in my schedule or if they (woman, man, whatevs) look like they could use the help.

How do people feel about the car door thing?

Awesome list, by the way, Mara.

[Mara]

I used to attend Brigham Young University. The men there hold doors open for women there with such frequency and dedication, it's kind of creepy.


I graduated from there. And you're right.

That was the only place where a guy I knew was genuinely creepy about it, and that's because he would insist on opening your door and get angry if you opened it for yourself. Weirdo.

[Spinal]

How do people feel about the car door thing?

Seems kind of cheesy to me unless you're opening it for Grandma. It feels to me like you're drawing attention to yourself for something that isn't too hard for the average human being to manage.

[Mara]

14. The Feminine Mystique, by Betty Freidan

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/Image4.jpg

It might be one of the best and most important works of the last century. The first time I read it I was sixteen, and I talked about nothing else for days. Later, my mother and younger sister and I read it aloud the summer I turned 19 during a three-day move across the country. We discussed it endlessly. It whetted my appetite not for feminism-- which I'd been brought up with-- but for the history of feminism, which is many ways is more important.

I'm a member of the Sewell-Belmont House and just went down there last week for a lecture. I don't think I would have become interested in things like that if it wasn't for this book.

Naturally, the book could be read by a man, but I doubt the experience would be the same. As a woman, it really gets you thinking about how the culture of victimization is something that you can choose, but you can also reject. It's amazing stuff.

[ledfloyd]

I like to think I'm pretty chivalrous. I hold doors, let people in front of me when I'm driving, etc etc.

Also, I don't know if I dance alone or not. But when it's like 2 AM and I need to walk across the house, it seems more often than not i walk in an odd stylized way and enjoy the ridiculousness of it. (think monty python)

[Mara]

13. Tall Men

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/2005_the_office_season_2_tv_se ries_.jpg

Now, there's nothing wrong with short men. I'm quite short myself (5'3") so even short men are taller than I am. However, there's something about very tall men that triggers a purely feminine kind of response.

One of my best friends described it once. She is 5'10" and of somewhat solid build. She towers over me and has a strong personality, so she often physically dominates whatever room she's in. We had a conversation when she first started dating the man who would eventually become her husband, who is 6'5". I hadn't met him yet, and I asked what he was like. She went on about his hair and his charm and humor, and then she said, "He's tall." I said, "Okay." She said, "No, I mean he's tall. He makes me feel... I dunno... dainty."

I giggled at the thought of my-friend-the-amazon feeling dainty, but that's kind of what it's like. There's a biological reaction to the alpha male.

With all that said, even though tall men make me feel all shy and fluttery, they're not terribly convenient. The tallest man I ever went on a date with was to my junior homecoming, and he was 6'7". It was horrible. I came up to his elbows, which made dancing really awkward, and he was so far away that even screaming, we couldn't talk at all on the floor. He tried to kiss me at the end of the night, and it was downright embarassing, like a giraffe bending down to a hedgehog.

[soitgoes...]

we should not live in the same city then. what pisses me off to no end is a perfect stranger barking for gratitude from a simple act of opening a door which he freaking has to do it eventually provided he's not ellen page from X3.

i definitely say thank you if it's obvious the stranger is holding a door for me. but sometimes a person gets to the door first, that old fart opens it, the act of opening hinders him of any further movement, and someone who is right behind him walk though the door so as not to clog the traffic in a hallway. sometimes i nod my head, but when thought occupies me, i walk by. can't see why i should get verbally attacked for that. that's to me is hundred times more rude.
When I walk through the door and notice that someone is behind me I will pause and hold the door for them. I don't have to. I can keep walking and let the door shut, but I don't. I'm not doing it for gratitude. I'm doing it because its ingrained in me to do it. Just like it should be ingrained in everyone to say thank you when someone does something nice for you, whether expected or unexpected. It takes more effort on my part to stop and hold the door open then it takes for the person walking through to say thank you. I don't rush ahead of someone to open the door. That is not what I'm talking about. Unless of course its for someone I know (Mom, GF, grandmother, etc.).

And if you think someone saying "you're welcome" (snidely or not) is an attack then you are pretty thin-skinned.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I used to open the car door for Val when we were dating. She loved it. I still open the car door for her when we have "date night", which always brings a smile to her face.

[soitgoes...]

Seems kind of cheesy to me unless you're opening it for Grandma. It feels to me like you're drawing attention to yourself for something that isn't too hard for the average human being to manage.
I can see it being cheesy if you can unlock your car remotely. I don't do it then. But when you still have to do it all old school-like, with a key, then I still feel as if I being rude if I don't let her in first.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Seems kind of cheesy to me unless you're opening it for Grandma. It feels to me like you're drawing attention to yourself for something that isn't too hard for the average human being to manage.

Are you saying the average human being has difficulty opening a regular door? :P

[Spinal]

Are you saying the average human being has difficulty opening a regular door? :P

With a regular door, you are both going along the same path. With a car, you're going all the way over to the other side of the vehicle to open a door handle. Just get in the damn car and get moving I say. Cheesy gesture.

[Spinal]

I can see it being cheesy if you can unlock your car remotely. I don't do it then. But when you still have to do it all old school-like, with a key, then I still feel as if I being rude if I don't let her in first.

If it's raining, I guess I can see it. Otherwise, who the hell cares?

[Ezee E]

Eh, cheesy sure. But girls like cheese.

[Kurosawa Fan]

With a regular door, you are both going along the same path. With a car, you're going all the way over to the other side of the vehicle to open a door handle. Just get in the damn car and get moving I say. Cheesy gesture.


If it's raining, I guess I can see it. Otherwise, who the hell cares?

*swoons*

[Spinal]

Eh, cheesy sure. But girls like cheese.

Girls might, but they grow up into women who are significantly less impressed by empty showboating.

[Mara]

:lol:

Gentlemen, gentlemen!

I agree with both of you, to a point. Women do not like to be treated like they are incompetent, and if a polite gesture crosses the line into insult, it's obnoxious. (The strange boy I was mentioning before would open the car door for me when we got there, but would also insist on opening the door when we got out, which means I had to sit still in the car while he got out and went around the car. What was I supposed to do during that time? I felt like a toddler.)

I can see how chivilry might seem empty when applied to an able-bodied woman. (Any of us should give up our seat or hold a door for someone who really needs it, like a disabled person, or a heavily pregnant person, or a person toting small children.) But often, the fact that you are making an empty gesture does mean something, because it means you noticed someone. When KF opens the door for Katie on date nights, he's not saying, "Oh, I bet you can't open doors by yourself!" He's saying, "Even though you're my wife now, I haven't stopped courting you."

With all that said, any woman who expects chivilrous gestures as a matter of course and get offended when they are not offered is a total idiot.

[Spinal]

But often, the fact that you are making an empty gesture does mean something, because it means you noticed someone. When KF opens the door for Katie on date nights, he's not saying, "Oh, I bet you can't open doors by yourself!" He's saying, "Even though you're my wife now, I haven't stopped courting you."


I'll buy that.

EDIT: ... M'lady.

[Philosophe_rouge]

rouge the thing is some girls feel that your intruding on their freedom or something like that. I have yet to encounter that though. So I just keep on opening doors for ladies. Until one of them gets pissed and maces me in the face. Heh.
I understand the reasoning, I know people who feel this way... I just think it's stupid, and people are trying to be nice rather than creepy/infringing. A man holds a door open for a woman, he might just as easily do the same for another man. Unless it's creepy door opening, I don't see the problem. I hope you never get maced in the face btw :D

[Mara]

12. Sushi

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/sushi.jpg

Of course, men can eat sushi. Many do. According to my very dirty-minded former female co-workers, women should only date men who do.

But I have known an astonishing number of men who consider it unmanly to eat "frou frou" food. This can range from some extremist men who only consider something a real meal if it involves a large slab of meat and a potato, to somewhat finnicky men who draw the line at endive salads and creme brulees.

I, for one, enjoy eating out at shmancy places and ordering delicate things that need to be eating with overgrown toothpicks. It's delicious and tactile. I especially enjoy doing this with female friends, because it always seems like the more men we invite, the more likely someone is going to sneer at the menu and ask if they have anything cooked.

[Philosophe_rouge]

I ate sushi today <.< It was delicious, and I wish I still had some.

[MadMan]

I understand the reasoning, I know people who feel this way... I just think it's stupid, and people are trying to be nice rather than creepy/infringing. A man holds a door open for a woman, he might just as easily do the same for another man. Unless it's creepy door opening, I don't see the problem. I hope you never get maced in the face btw :DI think one should hold open the door for people simply as being nice and polite among other things. So yeah I hear what your saying.

I too hope I never get maced in the face. I hear its painful ;)

[Duncan]

I kinda went broke eating sushi freshman year.

[Mara]

11. Long, Emotion-based Talks

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/conversation.jpg

One of my former co-workers (a big, strapping Hispanic-American man who only ever called me by my last name and hated sushi) would rag on me for talking about emotion. He insisted that 1) men were logic-based, 2) women were emotion-based and 3) that the former is somehow preferable to the latter. I doubt all three of these statements.

I'm a logical person. I don't make stupid decisions very often, but when I do, I acknowledge them and move on. I'm careful with money and I try to avoid conflict.

But I'm also a very emotional person, and I consider the emotional component when I am making a decision. Emotions are signals sent to us from our brain. Anger, hate and fear are warning systems, telling us that something is wrong. Love, joy, and peace are "all is well" signals that tell us that something is going well.

If we ignore the emotional component while making decisions, we would probably all end up in financially stable relationships and jobs, but we wouldn't be very happy. Ignoring the logical component while making decisions doesn't lead to happiness either. Trust me. I used to work in foreclosures.

So, the trick is to find the balance between the two. Logic is actually pretty easy to figure out: it usually boils down to common sense and math. Emotion is trickier. You may be unhappy... but why? Figuring out what your brain is trying to tell you often takes a great deal of self-reflection.

Which is where the talking comes in. Often, a third party insight into what you are feeling can help clarify why you feel the way you do. (This is why therapy works.) When I'm emotionally conflicted, I have a very discrete list of people I call to go over it. (One mother, one sister, and two friends; all female.) Those four people call me for the same reason. At one idyllic time, I was working with one of those friends and we would go for three ten-minute walks throughout the day. Supposedly we were trying to be less sedentary, but I don't remember the calories I burned; I remember the talks we had. They are precious to me.

A post-script about my strapping male co-worker (whom I actually quite liked.) He was complaining once about how I talk about my emotions endlessly while he doesn't complain about his relationship with his marriage. I countered with a brilliant psychological insight that I'd been working on from bits and pieces he'd dropped about how he was replaying his prepubescent conflicts with his mother out with his wife. I think I was right, because later on that day he asked what I thought about couples therapy. Ha!

[lovejuice]

And if you think someone saying "you're welcome" (snidely or not) is an attack then you are pretty thin-skinned.

admittedly i think i am. it's one of my most basic believes the world will become a much better place if strangers stop "attack" one another. and yes, the enjoyment i get from a stranger doing something for me is much outweighed by the annoyance i get from the reverse situation. weird? perhaps. i live in los "crash is realistic" angeles, and sometimes the situation can get really really bad.

[bac0n]

To any man who thinks it's too manly to eat sushi, I suggest you try Uni - pureed sea urchin. A friend of mine described it's taste as kinda like that dead part of the sea you really don't want to go to. Me, I tried it and found it to taste sorta bleh.

Uni is kinda like Haggis for the Scots and Lutefisk for the Norwegians. The only reason to try it is so that you can brag that you actually had enough courage to try it. And there's nothing more manly than bragging about something you did for the sole purpose of being able to brag about it. ;)

As for the men who find it too manly to eat sushi no matter what, remember that Sonny Chiba is Japanese, which presumably means he's at least tried sushi once in his life. If that doesn't convince you, then fine. More sushi for me!

[ledfloyd]

sushi is amazing.

[D_Davis]

I eat out at Japanese food at least 2 times a week.

Right now I am addicted to nagahama maki.

I only eat rolls made with soy paper, I don't like sea weed.

[Ezee E]

Girls might, but they grow up into women who are significantly less impressed by empty showboating.

By that point they are married. No need to showboat.

[bac0n]

sushi fans, have you ever tried snow white tuna sashimi?

holy crap is that stuff good. *sobber*

[Mara]

10. Forbidden Colors

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/pink20dress20and20orange20dres s.jpg

There is an entire spectrum of colors that, by arbitrary distinction, are considered feminine or un-masculine. This is so deeply rooted that it actually affects female choices as well; I know women who won't wear pink or pale yellow because it's too "girly."

But now, I have a shameful secret to own up to: I LIKE PINK. Pale, perfect, girly pink. I'm a bleached bone sort of color, and wearing pink makes me look downright rosy. I don't go overboard, painting rooms in the color or pairing it with lace and frills, but I'm owning the pink.

[Mara]

P.S. Is it just me, or does that model have three nipples?

[Mara]

9. Beefcake Actors

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/Tom_Welling.jpg

They don't have to be smart. Or funny. They don't need to be charismatic or loyal or have a knack for crossword puzzles.

They don't even need to be good actors.

They just need to show up and look manly.

[soitgoes...]

I'm owning the pink.
I'm so stealing this line.

[Mara]

8. The Moon

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/image2006-d200-1657.jpg

Mythologically speaking, the moon is regularly associated with womanhood and femininity, while the sun is often associated with masculinity. There are several probable reasons. For one thing, women's menstrual cycles are associated with the waxing and waning of the moon. For another, the cultural stereotypes of women had them as moody and changeable, like the moon which not only has phases, but seems to alter in size and color depending on the season and weather.

As a possibly-related sidenote, both the moon and femininity are also linked to mental illness. "Looney" and "lunatic" are derived from the Latin "Luna" for moon (because of the idea that the phases of the moon affected one's lucidity) while "hysteria" is the Greek word for "womb." Women suffering from any mental disorder used to be diagnosed with a "wandering womb." I'm not clear if they thought the womb was wandering over to the spleen, or if it was believed to have slipped out during the night and was hitchhiking to Reno.

I'm not sure what kind of validity these beliefs have. All I know is that when I look at the moon, I feel more powerful and warrior-woman-like. It's both calming and strengthing... almost spiritual. I understand why it was an object of worship.

The world is too much with us; late and soon,
Getting and spending, we lay waste our powers:
Little we see in Nature that is ours;
We have given our hearts away, a sordid boon!
The Sea that bares her bosom to the moon;
The winds that will be howling at all hours,
And are up-gathered now like sleeping flowers;
For this, for everything, we are out of tune;
It moves us not.--Great God! I'd rather be
A Pagan suckled in a creed outworn;
So might I, standing on this pleasant lea,
Have glimpses that would make me less forlorn;
Have sight of Proteus rising from the sea;
Or hear old Triton blow his wreathed horn.

-William Wordsworth

[monolith94]

And also, on a less moon-positive and female positive note, I'm sure misogynists would counter with the fact that the moon does not produce any light of its own, but rather serves as a mere reflection of the sun's brilliance…

[Mara]

And also, on a less moon-positive and female positive note, I'm sure misogynists would counter with the fact that the moon does not produce any light of its own, but rather serves as a mere reflection of the sun's brilliance…



"In our world," said Eustace, "a star is a huge ball of flaming gas."
"Even in your world, my son, that is not what a star is but only what it is made of."

-C.S. Lewis, The Voyage of the Dawn Treader

;)

[Mara]

7. Singing in Public

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/girls-singing.jpg

If there's one thing about myself that I would actually criticize about being too girly, it's my voice. It's very high. When working, I have to force my voice down lower on the phone so people don't think I'm a teenager.

However, a high speaking voice makes for a nice singing voice. I love to sing, and I'm not the slightest bit embarassed about singing in front of people. I usually do it while working or doing chores (cooking, cleaning, dishes, etc.) I tend to sing very lyric, melodic songs if I'm singing without accompaniment, so there are a lot of oldies and show tunes and children's songs. I get very into it. Sometimes I serenade people.

I've lucked out with family, roommates and co-workers, since nobody's killed me yet.

A couple of offices ago I worked in a communal space called "the tank." There were about six people in there, and people were surprisingly cool with me singing all day. (I strongly suspect that part of reason for their tolerance is that I am an unholy terror when I'm in a bad mood, and singing signals a good mood.) A sweet young man I worked with loved that I sang, and would try to chime in. He was endlessly ridiculed for this. Apparently, it's a girl thing.

Then again, he would chime in while I was belting "I'm in Love with a Wonderful Guy" from South Pacific ("I'm as bright and as gay / As a daisy in May / A chiche coming true!") so maybe he was asking for it.

[monolith94]

"In our world," said Eustace, "a star is a huge ball of flaming gas."
"Even in your world, my son, that is not what a star is but only what it is made of."

-C.S. Lewis, The Voyage of the Dawn Treader
;)

Heh. Touché!

[Mara]

6. Babies

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/More/Emma.jpg

That's me holding my baby sister the day after she was born.

Yup. I like babies. I haven't actually birthed any, but I had three younger siblings and my mother did day care out of our home when I was a kid. Then, as a teenager, I worked at a large day care after school. I also babysat quite a bit. I've always been around babies and children.

I'm good with kids. I can care for and mind children. I can make a baby stop crying by picking it up and I can make a baby laugh by looking at it.

Obviously, there's the cute factor. But, really, it's more than that. Babies have astonishingly well-developed personalities. They can be calculating, flirty, astonished, or loving. Their interactions with the world are fresh and exciting. They have no guile. There's never any mistaking how a baby feels about something.

I hope to have kids of my own someday, but if I don't, it's no tragedy. I'm just proud to belong to the gender that brings them into the world, and I have a huge amount of respect for women who raise families with forethought, love, respect, and a willingness to really work at being a good mother.

[D_Davis]

9. Beefcake Actors

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/Tom_Welling.jpg


This dude is wearing more make up than most chicks I know.

That's not manly - at all.

You need a real man...

http://www.genrebusters.com/images/point1.jpg

[Mara]

This dude is wearing more make up than most chicks I know.


The point of being "beefcake" is not realism, sweetness.

[Spinal]

"Bleeding from the face" is not really a good look for anyone.

[Mara]

5. Crocheting

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/doily.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/blanket.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/angels.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/PictureorVideo310.jpg

I enjoy making crap out of yarn.

[Kurosawa Fan]

This entry wins the "Best Commentary" award. Easily.

[Mara]

This entry wins the "Best Commentary" award. Easily.

:)

If I wanted to use four pictures, I had to economize elsewhere.

[Mara]

4. Breasts

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/scarlett_johansson_bg.jpg

I'm trying to keep this thread somewhat clean, but if I left this off the list, I'd be a dirty liar.

Breasts are awesome.

I wasn't too much of a fan in the early years, when they hurt like crazy. My first training bra felt like a harness and bit into my skin. If someone accidentally elbowed you in the hallway, you hurt for days and would get nasty bruises. I had to relearn how to pull up to a table (because they get in the way.)

After a few years, however, they grew on me. (Ha! I kill.) Other girls at slumber parties would teach you excersizes that supposedly helped you grow. Breasts were the number one theme of naughty songs I learned at girls' camp. We'd put pencils under our boobs to see if we could keep it from falling. We'd try that lip gloss thing that Molly Ringwald did in The Breakfast Club. Good times.

As an adult, they are an absolute necessity to life. They make your clothes hang nicely. They garner attention, if you want them to. (Women actually have a great deal of control over how much attention they ganer, and what kind.) They completely change the experience of crossing your arms. The skin just underneath is some of the thinnest on the body, and very soft. They're nice to have around.

[megladon8]

It's funny, because breasts would probably make my list of things that make me feel like a man.

[Mara]

It's funny, because breasts would probably make my list of things that make me feel like a man.

There is no downside.

[megladon8]

There is no downside.


Well, when women wear clothes that are both tight and revealing (and oft-times see-through) and then get mad at you for looking, that's definitely a downside.

[Mara]

Well, when women wear clothes that are both tight and revealing (and oft-times see-through) and then get mad at you for looking, that's definitely a downside.

That's actually a pet peeve of mine as well. As I said in my post, it's controllable.

I once went out to dinner with a well-endowed roommate who insisted on not wearing a bra and having a very low-cut top, even though I told her to take a sweater. When the guys at the next table took a cell-phone picture of us, she burst into tears and made me leave the restaraunt before I'd finished by buffalo wings.

Worst. Roommate. Ever.

[megladon8]

That's actually a pet peeve of mine as well. As I said in my post, it's controllable.

I once went out to dinner with a well-endowed roommate who insisted on not wearing a bra and having a very low-cut top, even though I told her to take a sweater. When the guys at the next table took a cell-phone picture of us, she burst into tears and made me leave the restaraunt before I'd finished by buffalo wings.

Worst. Roommate. Ever.


Wow, between this and the guy who refused your friend sex, you've known some crappy people.

But yes, moral of the story is:

If you don't like the attention, don't make it look like you have two horny melons stuck to your chest.

[Mara]

Wow, between this and the guy who refused your friend sex, you've known some crappy people.


Yes, I have. There are stories about this woman that would turn your hair gray. One night I got a little silly and starting telling stories about this roommate to a new roommate, and I made her throw up.

[megladon8]

Yes, I have. There are stories about this woman that would turn your hair gray. One night I got a little silly and starting telling stories about this roommate to a new roommate, and I made her throw up.


She actually threw up?

[Watashi]

4. Breasts

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/scarlett_johansson_bg.jpg

I'm trying to keep this thread somewhat clean, but if I left this off the list, I'd be a dirty liar.

Breasts are awesome.

I wasn't too much of a fan in the early years, when they hurt like crazy. My first training bra felt like a harness and bit into my skin. If someone accidentally elbowed you in the hallway, you hurt for days and would get nasty bruises. I had to relearn how to pull up to a table (because they get in the way.)

After a few years, however, they grew on me. (Ha! I kill.) Other girls at slumber parties would teach you excersizes that supposedly helped you grow. Breasts were the number one theme of naughty songs I learned at girls' camp. We'd put pencils under our boobs to see if we could keep it from falling. We'd try that lip gloss thing that Molly Ringwald did in The Breakfast Club. Good times.

As an adult, they are an absolute necessity to life. They make your clothes hang nicely. They garner attention, if you want them to. (Women actually have a great deal of control over how much attention they ganer, and what kind.) They completely change the experience of crossing your arms. The skin just underneath is some of the thinnest on the body, and very soft. They're nice to have around.

Um, pics?

C'mon, I had to say it. It wouldn't be me.

[Mara]

She actually threw up?

Vomited.

[D_Davis]

"Bleeding from the face" is not really a good look for anyone.

You're a dead man. No one talks about Yen like that and lives.

[Qrazy]

we should not live in the same city then. what pisses me off to no end is a perfect stranger barking for gratitude from a simple act of opening a door which he freaking has to do it eventually provided he's not ellen page from X3.

i definitely say thank you if it's obvious the stranger is holding a door for me. but sometimes a person gets to the door first, that old fart opens it, the act of opening hinders him of any further movement, and someone who is right behind him walk though the door so as not to clog the traffic in a hallway. sometimes i nod my head, but when thought occupies me, i walk by. can't see why i should get verbally attacked for that. that's to me is hundred times more rude.

What the hell is wrong with you. ;)

[Ezee E]

::Throws fist in the air::

Whoo!

[Mara]

3. The Female Ultra-Heroine

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/starbuck.jpg

This is a heroine that shows up in visual media. She's badass. Often (but not always) she has some sort of super-power or supernatural nature.

I love these women. I've never been in a fight in my life, but for some reason I will always love fighting women. They're just so much fun to root for.

[SpaceOddity]

And also, on a less moon-positive and female positive note, I'm sure misogynists would counter with the fact that the moon does not produce any light of its own, but rather serves as a mere reflection of the sun's brilliance…

'Cept, initially the moon was considered masculine and the sun feminine.

*thwarts misogynists*

[SpaceOddity]

9. Beefcake Actors

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/Tom_Welling.jpg

They don't have to be smart. Or funny. They don't need to be charismatic or loyal or have a knack for crossword puzzles.

They don't even need to be good actors.

They just need to show up and look manly.


*distains pretty-boys*

*likes 'em old 'n' charismatic*

[Watashi]

*distains pretty-boys*

*likes 'em old 'n' charismatic*
Don't you love James Dean?

He's like the prettiest boy I've seen.

[Sven]

The fighting woman is lame lame lame. I don't mind the empowered woman, but, like, the sexy badass chick... so dumb.

[SpaceOddity]

Don't you love James Dean?

He's like the prettiest boy I've seen.

*sighs* James was beauty incarnate.
They don't have to be old, as long as they're dead.
*nods*

[Mara]

The fighting woman is lame lame lame. I don't mind the empowered woman, but, like, the sexy badass chick... so dumb.

Boo!

She's so much fun.

[monolith94]

'Cept, initially the moon was considered masculine and the sun feminine.

*thwarts misogynists*
Source?

[Qrazy]

The fighting woman is lame lame lame. I don't mind the empowered woman, but, like, the sexy badass chick... so dumb.

In terms of a female empowerment motive yes, agreed... but still so hott.

[Qrazy]

Source?

*flashes genitals*

There's your proof.

[Sycophant]

I like women.

I don't like guns.

I really like women with guns.

Oh dear.

[Sven]

In terms of a female empowerment motive yes, agreed... but still so hott.

The stupidity of the scenario prevents arousal.

[ledfloyd]

Breasts are awesome.

[Philosophe_rouge]

I'm mixed on the fighting female, because often I just feel they had a male role, and they wanted more boobs. Therefore came the action star with boobs. I approve of the boobs post though. BOOBS.

[monolith94]

*flashes genitals*

There's your proof.
Hmmm... pockmarked, pasty, dry, and bitterly cold. Just like the moon!

[Qrazy]

Hmmm... pockmarked, pasty, dry, and bitterly cold. Just like the moon!

What's this Dr. Jack of which you speaketh.

Also I got through the first 15 minutes of Walk Hard and had to shut it off before I killed myself.

[monolith94]

Dr. Jack is an excellent little short feature by none other than the great Harold Lloyd. You wouldn't like it; it's far too chirpy for your taste.

[[ETM]]

Mara, thank you for using one of the hottest images ever for "breasts". I love that picture. Makes me miss a certain someone.

[SpaceOddity]

Source?

From Wikipedia:
Solar deities are popularly thought of as male counterparts of the lunar deity (usually female); however, sun goddesses are found on every continent (e.g. Amaterasu in Japanese belief), then paired with male lunar deities. Among the earliest records of human beliefs, the early goddesses of the Egyptian pantheon carried a sun above their head as a symbol of dignity. The sun was a major aspect of egyptian symbols and hieroglyphs, all the lunar deities of that pantheon were male deities. The cobra, the lioness, the cow-the dominant symbols of the most ancient Egyptian deities-carried their relationship to the sun atop their heads; they were female and their cults remained active throughout the history of the culture. Later a sun god was established in the eighteenth dynasty on top of the other solar deities, before the "aberration" was stamped out and the old pantheon re-established. When male deities became associated with the sun in that culture, they began as the offspring of a mother. Feminist examination of some of the earliest religions of Western cultures concluded that a sun goddess, often, driving her chariot bearing it across the sky daily. Sól is the goddess after whom the sun and Sunday are named in English.

Some mythologists, such as Brian Branston, contend that sun goddesses are more common worldwide than their male counterparts. They also claim that the belief that solar deities are primarily male is linked to the fact that a few better known mythologies (such as those of late classical Greece and late Roman mythology) rarely break from this rule, although closer examination of the earlier myths of those cultures reveal a very different distribution than the contemporary popular belief. The dualism of sun/male/light and moon/female/darkness is found in many (but not all) late southern traditions in Europe that derive from Orphic and Gnostic philosophies.

In Germanic mythology the Sun is female and the Moon is male. The corresponding Old English name is Siȝel (/ˈsɪ jel/), continuing Proto-Germanic *Sôwilô or *Saewelô. The Old High German Sun goddess is Sunna. In the Norse traditions, every day, Sól rode through the sky on her chariot, pulled by two horses named Arvak and Alsvid. Sól also was called Sunna, Sunne, and Frau Sunne, from which are derived the words, sun and Sunday.

[SpaceOddity]

I should perhaps mention that a lot of tradionally girly things are not going to show up on this list, because I don't practice them. I hate shopping. I refuse to wear make-up or high heels. I don't particularly enjoy getting gussied up. I'm not vain and I don't go for pampering or (*shudder*) massages. Being complimented makes me uncomfortable.

I'm not girly, but I've a compulsion for heels on account of being a midget (five one). I utilise them in eluding the circus folk for fear they'll claim me unless I disguise my true height. I attend the beach in heels, have climbed a cliff in heels etc etc

[Qrazy]

Dr. Jack is an excellent little short feature by none other than the great Harold Lloyd. You wouldn't like it; it's far too chirpy for your taste.

Pft I'll have you know I just saw and really liked Safety Last.

[monolith94]

Well, sure, you might like Dr. Jack, but all I have to rely on is your long history of taste; I can't depend solely on the fact that you liked one universally acclaimed Lloyd film.

[Scar]

Boobies.

[Mara]

;61152']Mara, thank you for using one of the hottest images ever for "breasts". I love that picture. Makes me miss a certain someone.

Yeah, it's a good one. (I miss her too.) I was trying to decide what photo to use to still keep this thread SFW. My second choice was The Birth of Venus.

[Mara]

2. Romantic Novels

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/JaneEyre.jpg

Note: I don't mean romance novels. Those make me want to shove an ice pick in my optic cavity and wiggle it until the pain stops.

I mean serious novels where the primary conflict is one of romance. These books have gotten a bad rap over time, and that annoys me. Novels about war and honor, religion and politics are all taken very seriously, but for some reason romance is is considered lighter and less important fare.

Maybe it is.

However, some of my favorite novels of all time have been of this sort, and some of my favorite writers of all time have written in this genre.

I've never been in love. It's fair to say that romance has never worked out for me, and possibly never will. I'm okay with that. It still makes me happy to live in a world where I believe that it can and does happen for some people. I'm the Mulder of romance: I want to believe.

[SpaceOddity]

2. Romantic Novels



I mean serious novels where the primary conflict is one of romance. These books have gotten a bad rap over time, and that annoys me. Novels about war and honor, religion and politics are all taken very seriously, but for some reason romance is is considered lighter and less important fare.


*applauds*

Which are your favourites?

*clutches Heathcliff*

[SpaceOddity]

3. The Female Ultra-Heroine

I love these women. I've never been in a fight in my life, but for some reason I will always love fighting women. They're just so much fun to root for.

I wanna be Elizabeth the First when I grow up.

"I am come amongst you, as you see, at this time, not for my recreation and disport, but being resolved, in the midst and heat of the battle, to live and die amongst you all; to lay down for my God, and for my kingdom, and my people, my honour and my blood, even in the dust."

*worships*

[Kurious Jorge v3.1]

I'm betting the house that #1 is Toxic Shock Syndrome

[Lasse]

I really like this list. So, so awesome!!

Now with boobage!!!

[Mara]

*applauds*

Which are your favourites?

*clutches Heathcliff*

I have a love/hate relationship with Wuthering Heights. Catherine drives me nuts. I'm a big Jane Eyre fan, as well as The Tenant of Wildfell Hall (Anne Bronte), pretty much the entire Austen canon, but especially Persuasion, Evelina by Fanny Burney, The Female Quixote by Charlotte Lennox, A Room with a View by E. M. Forster, etc.

[monolith94]

Don't forget Tom Jones.

Also, Mara I think you'd like "Written on the Body".

[Mara]

Don't forget Tom Jones.

Also, Mara I think you'd like "Written on the Body".

Ha! I dunno, I love Tom Jones but I don't really read it for the romance. (I'm sorry, but Sophia is a twit.)

I'll check that one out... thanks!

[Scar]

Don't forget Tom Jones.


http://www.poster.net/jones-tom/jones-tom-photo-tom-jones-6230399.jpg

[SpaceOddity]

Ha! I dunno, I love Tom Jones but I don't really read it for the romance. (I'm sorry, but Sophia is a twit.)



I love how Fielding praised her for never attempting opinions or wit.

*aspires*

[SpaceOddity]

I have a love/hate relationship with Wuthering Heights. Catherine drives me nuts. I'm a big Jane Eyre fan, as well as The Tenant of Wildfell Hall (Anne Bronte), pretty much the entire Austen canon, but especially Persuasion, Evelina by Fanny Burney, The Female Quixote by Charlotte Lennox, A Room with a View by E. M. Forster, etc.

Any love for Wings of the Dove or Elizabeth Gaskell?
I've not read Evelina or The Female Quixote. Do you recommend them? I've a passionate loathing for Austen.

[monolith94]

Ha! I dunno, I love Tom Jones but I don't really read it for the romance. (I'm sorry, but Sophia is a twit.)

I'll check that one out... thanks!
Well, I suppose it may read a bit differently from a male perspective, in that regard.

[Mara]

Any love for Wings of the Dove or Elizabeth Gaskell?
I've not read Evelina or The Female Quixote. Do you recommend them? I've a passionate loathing for Austen.

I like Henry James, but I don't find him particularly romantic. I see him more as a philosopher. I think Gaskell has good plots but her style really bothers me-- I actually tend to like films made of her books more than the books themselves, because they keep the plots and throw out the prose.

Evelina is somewhere between the sweet-young-thing of Austen and the nightmare of the Brontes. It's probably more realistic to the times than either, as Fanny Burney had more life and cultural experience. I think it's funny, and quite engaging. (Short plot: a young and virtuous woman of complicated parentage ends up in London at the height of the season. She is beautiful enough to garner attention, but too poor to invite good intentions. She has to protect herself and outwit those who try to manipulate her long enough to snare the man she loves. Pretty fun.)

The Female Quixote is silly, silly fun. Arabella is a beautiful and rich young woman raised in complete seclusion, and her only knowledge of the world comes from reading overblown French romance novels. When she finally enters London society, she has completely wrong-headed ideas about how to behave and how to interperet actions, leading to misadventures. It's a laugh.

[Mara]

I love how Fielding praised her for never attempting opinions or wit.

*aspires*

Truth is, I kind of like Sophia for standing up to her father and fighting for what she wants. But she's not really a heroine. She's secondary to Tom, who is easily the most interesting and engaging character. I read Tom Jones for the humor and the intense plotting.

Just writing about it makes me want to read it again.

[SpaceOddity]

I like Henry James, but I don't find him particularly romantic. I see him more as a philosopher.

Don't find Wings of the Dove romantic? *aghast*

It's excelled only by Wuthering Heights, for me.

[Mara]

Don't find Wings of the Dove romantic? *aghast*



Maybe I should try it again. I haven't read it for thirteen years or so.

[Mara]

1. Female Friends

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v334/MissMoira/renoirwomen.jpg

As relationships, I feel that friendships are undervalued. Some of the most honorable, selfless, and loving acts I have ever seen have come from my friends.

They are my sisters and my supporters. They applaud my triumphs and kick my lazy butt into gear when I'm underperforming. They are honest and forthright with me.

As the mark of true friendship, I am almost happier and sadder for them than I am for myself. When they are joyful and find love and have children and excel at work, I am excited and cheery. When they have break-ups and financial difficulties and miscarriages, my heart breaks.

I trust their judgment more than my own. They enrich my life, and I am grateful for them.

There. Let's end on a sappy note.

[EyesWideOpen]

After reading through both threads I realized I feel alot more comfortable in yours.

[Wryan]

I hate to be a party pooper (almost), but chivalry in its purest form had little to do with women. It was almost invariably concerned with honor and duty on the battlefield and not in the courts. "Courtly love" more accurately describes what people today consider to be "chivalry" although "Courtly love is dead!" doesn't have quite the same ring. But regardless, the gist of your post about it is quite right. I hold open doors when possible and always find myself saying "sir" and "ma'am" to superiors, elders, and even to people waiting on me or serving me. I do it automatically I think. It's just the way I was brought up. Funny thing though: I don't think I do it more for women than for men. I just do it in general.

[Mara]

I hate to be a party pooper (almost), but chivalry in its purest form had little to do with women. It was almost invariably concerned with honor and duty on the battlefield and not in the courts. "Courtly love" more accurately describes what people today consider to be "chivalry" although "Courtly love is dead!" doesn't have quite the same ring. But regardless, the gist of your post about it is quite right. I hold open doors when possible and always find myself saying "sir" and "ma'am" to superiors, elders, and even to people waiting on me or serving me. I do it automatically I think. It's just the way I was brought up. Funny thing though: I don't think I do it more for women than for men. I just do it in general.

I associate "courtly love" more with shallow compliments and bad poetry. :)

You're right, though, what I'm trying to talk about is the modern-day remnants of what we would consider gentlemanly behavior.

[[ETM]]

"Courtly love is dead!"

I thought Court Cobain was dead?

[SpaceOddity]

Maybe I should try it again. I haven't read it for thirteen years or so.

Just curious, Mara, have you read Lorna Doone?

*been circling it for aeons*

[Mara]

Just curious, Mara, have you read Lorna Doone?

*been circling it for aeons*

Isn't it a cookie?

Yeah, it's totally a cookie.

Apparently, it's also a book. Looks interesting... I'll have to give it a shot.