Jessica Jones (Season 2)

[TGM]

This released on Netflix a couple of days ago, and I've literally not seen a single person talking about it anywhere online. That's just... a little bizarre for one of these shows, right? o.O

Anyways, just starting it myself tonight (though technically I'm behind on these shows, as I still haven't gotten around to The Punisher yet. >.> )

[Irish]

I saw a couple of links here and there, I think? Maybe on twitter.

But yeah. The reaction is muted. I dunno if that's because of other things---Netflix has had big genre releases every week for the past month---or because the new season kinda sucks.

[Dukefrukem]

YEh I've been without power the last weekends and in Germany for the other two. Hopefully starting this on Friday.

[Skitch]

I've watched 4 or 5 eps so far. Really enjoy it. Pacing myself.

[TGM]

I'm three episodes in, and I'm finding it really hard to find the motivation to keep going. The pacing is especially awful this season, a single episode feels like it's 2 hours in length, when in reality it's only a little over 50 minutes, and this season's plot is really not hooking me in any way like the first season did. There was a lot of intrigue right off the bat in S1 with Jessica's history with Kilgrave, and Luke Cage's involvement. Not to mention, I can't recall the special effects being nearly so cheesy in S1. That Whizzer speeding effect was just embarrassing, and the way they shoot people jumping large distances feels shockingly low budget. I dunno, hopefully it improves. I am still early, but then again, I've also already invested 3 hours into this season, yet I'm still waiting for something interesting to happen. :\

[[ETM]]

I liked it. It does get better as it goes along, unusually so for a Netflix Marvel show.

[Irish]

I dunno, hopefully it improves. I am still early, but then again, I've also already invested 3 hours into this season, yet I'm still waiting for something interesting to happen. :\

I've started using ~3 hours as my cutoff---I figure if a showrunner can't do anything interesting by the third episode---roughly the runtime of "The Godfather" or "Lawrence of Arabia"---then they never will.

There's so much stuff to watch now that even if I'm just trying to kill an evening, there's always an alternative. No reason to stick with a bum show.

(I fell asleep half way through the first episode.)

[TGM]

I've started using ~3 hours as my cutoff---I figure if a showrunner can't do anything interesting by the third episode---roughly the runtime of "The Godfather" or "Lawrence of Arabia"---then they never will.

There's so much stuff to watch now that even if I'm just trying to kill an evening, there's always an alternative. No reason to stick with a bum show.

(I fell asleep half way through the first episode.)

That's sorta where I'm at as well. 3 episodes may not sound like much, but 3 hours is more than enough time to really kick things into gear and build some genuine intrigue. Like you said, it's the length of a typical epic movie. Otherwise, what are you even doing with that time?

As is, this is currently the first show on Netflix where my reaction after an episode's ended hasn't been to immediately start the next one. Rather, after each one, I've just sorta sat there stunned and annoyed that it's only been one episode, while it's felt like I've sat through at least 2. And then I shut Netflix off, because fuck sitting through another one with that pacing.

I might give this show one more episode to really hook me, but if it doesn't, I dunno, but my time is really far too valuable to waste on this sorta shit. :\

[Skitch]

I'm on episode 10 and I still dig it. Damn it, where is Arya?

[TGM]

I've been wondering what happened to him, too.

[[ETM]]

I dunno, we shut off the Punisher after one episode because that was enough of that crap. Depens on what you expect to get, I guess.

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[Irish]

Damn it, where is Arya?

I've been wondering what happened to him, too.

I genuinely miss that dude.

[Dukefrukem]

Now you guys have me worried. Dude hasn't been on the site that he owns in 3 weeks. Twitter is constantly active.

[Skitch]

Now you guys have me worried. Dude hasn't been on the site that he owns in 3 weeks. Twitter is constantly active.

Everyone needs a break sometime.

[Irish]

Everyone needs a break sometime.

True, but he was the most active user (30,527 posts) and he hasn't said anything in over a month. So that's an unusually long break.

I wish he'd come back.

[[ETM]]

I think he's in... Guatemala? For a wedding or something. I'm sure that contributed to the hiatus.

[TGM]

Okay, so by the fourth episode, it actually does finally pick up and start to get interesting. That, and I've also sorta been taking short breaks about halfway into each episode now, which honestly fixes a lot of my issues with this particular show's pacing. Perhaps it shoulda just been a half-hour long format rather than hour long episodes?

[TGM]

Finished this last night. Hell of a rough start, but it does wind up getting quite better from there. It's a steep decline from the first season, and this was never more evident than the episode when Kilgrave returned. Holy shit, the first moment he came back, clapping his hands behind Jessica, literally sent shivers down my spine. Such a compelling villain, which this season is sorely missing in.

I do take some issue with some of the character arcs. Most notably Trish, who has just become an absolutely horrible human being all of a sudden this season. Seriously, I don't recall her being nearly so detestable in season one, but fuck her in this season. Also, as the season progressed, Jessica's actions became more and more frustrating to watch, though there was at least some good compelling complications that can kind of justify some of her actions, or at least make you understand the dilemma she must have been experiencing.

In addition to the episode mentioned in my spoiler tag, the best episode was easily the flashback episode. They accomplished more at adding depth to all of these characters in that one episode than they have in, well, most of the rest of the season. Because while it may have gotten better after the first three episodes, it still felt quite dragged out, and could have easily been more condensed and tightly packaged. Still though, not a bad season all in all. Though at this point, it almost feels silly that this series is at all connected to The Defenders, which feels so tonally corny in comparison to the ultra serious vibe of this series.

Jessica Jones S1
Daredevil S1
Luke Cage
Jessica Jones S2
Iron Fist
The Defenders
Daredevil S2

[Grouchy]

Watched up to the second episode last night. I'm disappointed as hell that they killed Nuke (Will Simpson) without once giving him the visual look he has in the comics. Netflix has a weird kind of costume-phobia around these characters.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/12/Nuke_%28Marvel_Comics_characte r%29.png

[[ETM]]

That's horrendously wacky.

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[Irish]

Netflix has a weird kind of costume-phobia around these characters.

It's not just Netflix. It's everybody. Superhero costumes look great on the page but pretty silly in real life. The only exception is Batman and maaaaybe Spider-man.

They're aiming for mainstream appeal. You put actors in comic-booky costumes and they won't look like superheroes. They'll look like pro-wrestlers.

(eg: Go back and look at any of the "Captain America" or "Avengers" movies and you'll notice how rarely Cap is wearing his full costume, with helmet. That's not an accident.)

[TGM]

It's not just Netflix. It's everybody.

Netflix appears to be more opposed to it than everyone else, though. Daredevil aside, they've gone out of their way to openly mock the costumed looks from the comics for just about every other character in these series, to the point where it's clear that they're both embarrassed and ashamed to go there, and it totally reeks of insecurity on their end. As a result, however, it just stands out all the more when they all team together, and, oh wait, these all just look like regular people off the street...

...

... and Daredevil. :p

[Grouchy]

It's not just Netflix. It's everybody. Superhero costumes look great on the page but pretty silly in real life. The only exception is Batman and maaaaybe Spider-man.

They're aiming for mainstream appeal. You put actors in comic-booky costumes and they won't look like superheroes. They'll look like pro-wrestlers.

(eg: Go back and look at any of the "Captain America" or "Avengers" movies and you'll notice how rarely Cap is wearing his full costume, with helmet. That's not an accident.)
Eh, the problem with masks is that they don't allow the actors to emote. It makes sense that they'd save it for the action scenes in Captain America's case. Tony Stark spends most of his time not fighting out of the armor in the comics for logical reasons. The only significant change they did to the costumes is removing Hawkeye's mask.

I agree with TGM's points, it's Netflix in particular that seems to be embarassed of costumes and go out of its way to make fun of them. The MCU and the CW shows seem to have found a better compromise. I personally wouldn't have minded seeing Luke Cage suit up (perhaps with toned down colors) and I actually think Iron Fist's suit would have definitively improved that show.

[TGM]

Iron Fist is the most inexcusable for not wearing a costume. Danny Rand is already a pretty cheesy dude on that show anyways, and he has the excuse that whatever he'd be wearing was what he wore during his time in Kun Lun. No reason for him to be fighting in street clothes.

[Grouchy]

Plus he has a very good reason for hiding his identity. He's practically Bruce Wayne.

[Grouchy]

Three more episodes. *shrug* Still the best Netflix Marvel show. Don't see all that much to complain about here.

Also, gotta appreciate any showrunner that takes the effort to hire people (Cubans) who can actually speak Spanish to play Spanish-speaking characters. In Breaking Bad it was jarring as hell whenever someone from the cartel tried it.

[Irish]

Eh, the problem with masks is that they don't allow the actors to emote.

Yeah. I said as much (http://matchcut.artboiled.com/showthread.php?3275-Dredd&p=301912&viewfull=1#post301912) eight years ago. Welcome to the party.


It makes sense that they'd save it for the action scenes in Captain America's case. Tony Stark spends most of his time not fighting out of the armor in the comics for logical reasons. The only significant change they did to the costumes is removing Hawkeye's mask.

Huh? Cap's mask doesn't hide his eyes or even most of his face. So that doesn't make sense.

As for Stark, I'd wager more than half the shots are close-ups of RDJ, the interior of the suit, and the HUD.


it's Netflix in particular that seems to be embarassed of costumes and go out of its way to make fun of them.

I guess? In the very first "X-Men" movie, Wolverine makes a snide comment about how stupid the costumes look.

You're right that the CW shows more costumes, mostly on the act breaks / fight scenes. But holy hell those costumes are terrible. (The Flash looks laughably bad, and the producers know it. The way that show is structured and shot, it's like they want to avoid showing him suited up and wearing the mask.)

All I'm saying, ffs, is that this isn't a new problem or a new response.

[Grouchy]

I guess? In the very first "X-Men" movie, Wolverine makes a snide comment about how stupid the costumes look.
And I hated those Matrix-like costumes and the Wolverine diss back when I saw X-Men on theaters... 18 years ago. Welcome to MY party.

I don't know why you get so anal about this, considering we're both saying more or less the same thing. Yes, it's difficult translating colorful superhero costumes to the screen... and there are different responses to it. The one found in Netflix shows seems to be to forego them completely and dress everyone in some variation of urban clothing. It doesn't work for me and it deprives us of great visuals like Nuke's US face tattoo which isn't even a mask.

Nolan's approach of turning everything "realistic" was also pretty awful.

[Grouchy]

Watched until episode 8. Yeah, I like this show.

Love the subtle references to the comic, like Jessica's mom looking like comic-book Jessica and the neighbour's painting style being reminiscent of Alias covers.

And the lawyer played by Carrie-Ann Moss is a MUCH, MUCH more compelling crossover character than Rosario Dawson's.

[Skitch]

Finished it last night. Good stuff. I think I prefer the first season, but this one still has a lot to unpack.

[Grouchy]

Yeah, great season. The last four episodes were unbelievably intense.

The cast is uniformly excellent, but man, David Tennant has the whole "slimy Brit villain" thing down to a t. His single appearance as a ghost is so creepy and his teasing of Jessica so wickedly hilarious.