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megladon8
10-20-2017, 08:49 PM
There’s no way I’m the only one here watching this...

Irish
10-20-2017, 09:11 PM
I binged it last weekend :D

It's good, albeit a little repetitive. The cast is ace and I kept watching for them, for their chemistry, and to see how certain subplots would play out.

number8
10-20-2017, 10:04 PM
Yeah, it's better than I expected. Actually, it's not at all what I expected. I wasn't even interested when I saw the trailers, and started it on a lark because I was home sick. Ended up watching the whole season. Lots of cliches abound, and the investigation episodes are just souped up (cabled up?) Criminal Minds, but what I liked:

- It's worth mentioning that it's unique how it has practically zero on-screen violence. Considering the unsavory subject, I believe this made it much easier to binge than it would have been otherwise. It manages to be extremely creepy in parts without being grotesque.

- Pleasantly surprised by how much it talks about how this type of crime are typically unique to ideas of masculinity. I got a chuckle out of him having to explain to a classroom of kids that statistically only boys become disturbed individuals. And it's funny that there's a whole significant subplot about whether or not it's ok to use the word "cunt."

- Groff is terrific in this. I thought I knew what his character type is (the off-kilter, intellectual cop pursuing beyond procedure), but seeing the way he subtly morphs throughout the season is fantastic. I knew the "I can't let these guys rub off on me" line early on would be foreshadowing, I just didn't expect it to be handled so smartly. To tie it to my previous two points, I think this is a result of centering the show on misogyny, rather than violent acts. A lesser show would just have him become more violent or sociopathic, rather than just crass and contemptuous.

Irish
10-20-2017, 10:25 PM
Also -- per creepiness and exploitation -- I liked how they contrasted the whole school principal subplot against everything else that was going on, and kept that going for a few episodes.

That whole thing made my skin crawl and I kept thinking about it and none of it is exploitative.

Dukefrukem
10-21-2017, 12:35 PM
Ok, I'll add it to my queue.

Ezee E
10-21-2017, 02:23 PM
First episode. So far so good.

Scaled down Fincher still looks good.

megladon8
10-22-2017, 07:16 PM
Finished this last night.

Incredible stuff from start to finish.

The cast is incredible across the board. The two leads have such great chemistry.

I want season 2 now.

Also, we all know who Dennis is, right?

Ezee E
10-22-2017, 08:55 PM
First episode. So far so good.

Scaled down Fincher still looks good.

Second episode. Now I'm totally in. The scenes with Edmund Kemper... What an actor. I seeked out info on Kemper afterward, and it's scary how some of the dialog is lifted straight from the interview, and how well the actor mirrored Kemper.

megladon8
10-22-2017, 09:15 PM
Yeah, Kemper was the show stealer for me.

The other interviews are great too but he was just incredible.

D_Davis
10-23-2017, 04:45 PM
Watched the first three episodes last night. Fantastic. Love the affected dialog. It's weird how the show seems to drift in and out of the hardboiled detective genre and a more straight forward crime-drama piece. Really liking it so far.

Ezee E
10-24-2017, 04:59 AM
4 and 5.

This will be the first Netflix show I finish an entire season of, I believe.

Literally got goosebumps at the end of the fifth episode.

Irish
10-26-2017, 01:05 PM
https://vimeo.com/239193453

^ "Breakdown reel showcasing David Fincher's invisible visual effects in the Netflix Original Series Mindhunter."

Milky Joe
10-26-2017, 07:56 PM
The first episode of this was so bad we couldn't continue.

Irish
10-26-2017, 10:03 PM
The first episode of this was so bad we couldn't continue.

What did you find unwatchable? I've seen this reaction---couldn't get past the first episode---from a few people so I'm curious.

Ezee E
10-26-2017, 10:21 PM
Only subplot I'm not digging happens around episode 7 with the teacher deal. Kind of eyeroll worthy. Hoping it's a one episode deal.

megladon8
10-26-2017, 11:09 PM
Only subplot I'm not digging happens around episode 7 with the teacher deal. Kind of eyeroll worthy. Hoping it's a one episode deal.

Agree that it was a bit off kilter to the rest of the show, but it has payoff.

megladon8
10-27-2017, 12:16 AM
The first episode of this was so bad we couldn't continue.

I don’t understand.

number8
10-27-2017, 02:29 AM
???? The school subplot is fucking great. Like Irish said, it's deeply unsettling. What.

Milky Joe
10-27-2017, 03:35 AM
What did you find unwatchable? I've seen this reaction---couldn't get past the first episode---from a few people so I'm curious.

It was the horrendous dialogue and terrible acting from everybody involved, mostly, but the episode also felt so meandering and pointless overall that I didn't have one iota of desire to see where it went.

megladon8
10-27-2017, 03:42 AM
I still just don’t understand.

The dialogue is great and the acting is top notch start to finish.

D_Davis
10-27-2017, 04:06 AM
It was the horrendous dialogue and terrible acting from everybody involved, mostly, but the episode also felt so meandering and pointless overall that I didn't have one iota of desire to see where it went.

the dialog and acting switches between the crime-drama genre and hard boiled detective genre. It's almost Mametesque sometimes in its cadence and rhythm, especially in the bar in the first episode. While watching that scene I told my wife that I couldn't quite figure out if it was bad or an affected stylistic choice. Turns out is the later and this becomes readily apparent in the series.

D_Davis
10-27-2017, 04:07 AM
I love Tench. The actor is incredible.

Ezee E
10-27-2017, 12:51 PM
Welp, finished it all. The final episode comes across pretty "TV-ish" with some subplots that try to wrap themselves up faster than it needed to be. There's a lot of convenient things that just come out of nowhere here, but the rest of the show was so damn good that I don't want to harmonize on it much.

Plus, the Kansas killer simply being an opener and closer for the show without ever being mentioned is a device that I can't think has ever been used.

number8
10-27-2017, 02:06 PM
Yeah, BTK's inclusion is really effective in selling the atmosphere, but it is a bit bizarre. Given that the guy wasn't caught until the 21st century, it's unlikely to lead anywhere. I'm not sure what the intent was, but I dug it.

number8
10-27-2017, 02:13 PM
I love Tench. The actor is incredible.

Holt McCallany is great, but this character does nothing for me. He has what I thought was the worse scene on the show, the "You want me to bring my work home?" scene. I get that it's yet another examination of masculinity that's supposed to be in contrast to Holden's dynamic with his home life, but it's such a dumb cliche.

D_Davis
10-27-2017, 02:35 PM
His facial expressions and demeanor when his just looking at something, or in the background are incredible.

Don't mind the crime-drama cliche, because the entire show is pastiche of different crime genres.

megladon8
10-27-2017, 06:03 PM
I love Tench. The actor is incredible.


Can’t believe he’s the goggles rapist from Alien 3.

Milky Joe
10-27-2017, 06:40 PM
He's also the His name was Robert Paulsen guy from Fight Club.


the dialog and acting switches between the crime-drama genre and hard boiled detective genre. It's almost Mametesque sometimes in its cadence and rhythm, especially in the bar in the first episode. While watching that scene I told my wife that I couldn't quite figure out if it was bad or an affected stylistic choice. Turns out is the later and this becomes readily apparent in the series.

I hear the Mamet-esque-ness you speak of in that bar scene, maybe my least favorite scene in the episode next to his date with the anti-establishment woman, but nobody does Mamet-esque dialogue well unless they're Mamet. It was not done well, and the actors are not up to snuff, especially the guy who plays Holden (awful, stupid name btw) who really seems like he just walked off the street. He sucked, and dragged everyone else down with him.

megladon8
10-27-2017, 06:56 PM
I feel like you’re watching a different show from what I did.

Holden is freaking incredible, and the way his character progresses and kind of degenerates through the season is brilliant.

Irish
10-27-2017, 09:24 PM
Yeah, BTK's inclusion is really effective in selling the atmosphere, but it is a bit bizarre. Given that the guy wasn't caught until the 21st century, it's unlikely to lead anywhere. I'm not sure what the intent was, but I dug it.

BTK is there as a refutation of everything the FBI does, because the show includes several implicit criticism of "Behavioral Sciences." I really like this aspect of it.

BTK killed people over a 30 year span and repeatedly dared the cops to catch him. They couldn't. Guys like BTK, Son of Sam, and Joel Rifkin weren't brought to justice because of police work or profiles. They were caught because of parking tickets and traffic stops---ie, dumb mistakes on the part of the killer.

I think the whole feet-tickler thing ties into the same criticism. Holden goes to talk to school kids about psychotic tendencies, like setting fires and hurting animals. He still thinks there's a way to predict killers and never considers the ethics or legality of his viewpoints (there's a short hop from basic forensics and criminal profiles to Stasi-like databases of the general population).

Then he gets frustrated at small, insignificant behaviors that are awkward but not illegal, at social friction that has no obvious solution. His training, education, and fieldwork are meaningless. What happens doesn't satisfy him and doesn't feel like justice to the audience.

The entire subplot portrays a low-stakes drama that illustrates a much larger, thornier problem.

number8
10-27-2017, 09:36 PM
I liked that aspect, too, that this is essentially a serial killer show that criticizes the mechanics of serial killer fiction. One can even say that it's the exact opposite of Wisdom of the Crowd.

Irish
10-27-2017, 09:40 PM
Wisdom of the Crowd.

You bastard.

;)

megladon8
10-27-2017, 10:12 PM
There’s also the idea that Holden and Bill’s work is all in trying to establish patterns of early behaviour in order to develop preventative measures.

But BTK’s life was completely normal. No horrible childhood, no rap sheet up to that point. He would never have been picked up by their methods. His existence is an anomaly.

D_Davis
11-03-2017, 06:41 PM
Do you guys thing Holden actually saw the principal outside the grocery store, or was it his paranoia creeping in?

That last episode was something else.

megladon8
11-03-2017, 09:20 PM
Yeah, he saw.

Ezee E
11-03-2017, 10:13 PM
The show never did anything to make it seem like characters would hallucinations would have effect to the audience. He saw him.

D_Davis
11-03-2017, 10:22 PM
I don't know. I think the show definitely plays with his reliability with his breakdown and his auditory episode in the last episode. I wondered about his mental state after that, especially with the way he became a complete asshole as the series went on.

Philip J. Fry
11-05-2017, 03:23 AM
I'm just gonna repeat everyone else here: give the guy playing Ed Kemper all the awards.

Wryan
11-15-2017, 06:26 PM
Felt sure they would do something to resolve Principal Tickle-Feet's subplot, especially given the blink-and-you'll-miss-it attention paid to his use of the word "covenant," which felt like it was going to lead to grooming/abuse couched in religion.

Wryan
11-15-2017, 06:29 PM
Also, I watched this and then first season of True Detective right afterwards, which was an interesting transition to say the least. My god, TD is just glacial by comparison, but handily a better show overall.

megladon8
11-16-2017, 11:16 AM
I'm just gonna repeat everyone else here: give the guy playing Ed Kemper all the awards.

Right!?

I was captivated by him. When they moved onto other killers I was bummed out.

Philip J. Fry
11-19-2017, 06:49 PM
Right!?
I was captivated by him. When they moved onto other killers I was bummed out.So was I. :D

Philip J. Fry
11-19-2017, 06:50 PM
https://vimeo.com/239193453

Philip J. Fry
11-19-2017, 06:59 PM
HOW NETFLIX'S 'MINDHUNTER' FOUND ITS (SERIAL) KILLER CAST (http://www.newsweek.com/mindhunter-netflix-david-fincher-cast-689791)

Morris Schæffer
11-20-2017, 09:02 PM
On to episode 5. I don't find this show all too intriguing or tense, but it's well made, I like the 70's setting a lot and Tench and Ford are a fun team.

That being said, I'm waiting for something to happen, a hook of some kind. There's a certain rut to how things play out. They get in the car, start driving, meet some wackjobs, and one can always count on Tench lighting up a cigarette.

Grouchy
01-05-2018, 12:55 PM
Finished this last night. Absolutely awesome. Love all the little Fincher-isms. Back in the days of Fight Club and Panic Room it's amazing how few of us realized that he was discovering a style that was uniquely his own and it's one he applies equally to an expensive blockbuster with big stars and to this low-key show about criminal investigation.

Anyway, the characters are great (love that Trench functions as an enabler but also an anchor to Holden's most outrageous ideas) and the structure of the episodes was kind of novel, specially how they end on dramatic moments that are not necessarily cliffhangers.

By the way, I was reading about the BTK Killer after the show and it turns out he often called his daughter to ask her if she had checked the oil in her car, which is something Holden's girlfriend says her father often does. If I recall correctly she says her parents are divorced, right?