Doctor Strange (Scott Derrickson)

[Peng]

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-7sNpH28eA-8/V5VqnljIFdI/AAAAAAAAB5U/M6j8LaUNTjc7FcSqfUllNbh7MkCs_J SLwCK4B/s1600/Doctor_Strange_Wallpaper_3_HD_ MarvelSpoilerOficial%25C2%25A9 2016.png

[Peng]

Assorted thoughts:

- Really middling origin story, which seems like it boringly rushes way fast past Strange's story nuance and characterization to get to the training montages (which are goofy in a good way, almost manga-like) and trippy, amazing visuals. At least those images force the action to be more focused, so the fight scenes are both eye-poppingly thrilling and dazzingly disorienting. I could almost come back for the visuals alone.

- Tilda Swinton is so awesome. Her smile or sereneness rarely wavers, but for 90% of her screentime with Strange you can almost hear "I'm ancient, fuck you and your petty shit" going on in there. Her fixed expression, while impatiently rolling things in her hands, at waiting from Strange to finish one job has me laughing real hard.

- Yeah, the conception of his character maybe forces Mads to be too typically villain stoic, although that does plays off really well with the Doctor's fluster in a few scenes.

- Even if Rachel McAdams isn't utilized that much, I appreciate how her character's absence is integrated into the story. She has her own separate life saving people to be much concerned with Strange becoming a superhero (I loved the way she pauses before just dismissing magical stuff out of hand a couple of times, like "I'm too busy to be agape"), so she doesn't need to be a damsel in distress (and even subverts the trope one time).

- As for the credit scenes, I will wait for you guys to see it, because they confused me in two different ways; the middle one has me wondering about the timeline of it in relation toThor's story. And the last one confuses me if it's Loki or some comic stuff I don't get.

[Peng]

The usual ranking time!

Captain America: Civil War (2016) - 8.5/10
The Avengers (2012) - 8.5/10
Avengers: Age of Ultron (2015) - 8/10
Guardians of the Galaxy (2014) - 8/10
Captain America: The Winter Soldier (2014) - 7.5/10
Thor (2011) - 7.5/10
Iron Man 3 (2013) - 7.5/10
Iron Man (2008) - 7.5/10
Doctor Strange (2016) - 7/10
Captain America: The First Avenger (2011) - 7/10
Iron Man 2 (2010) - 6.5/10
Ant-Man (2015) - 6/10
The Incredible Hulk (2008) - 6/10
Thor: The Dark World (2013) - 5.5/10

Hesitating a bit on whether to put Captain or Strange first. CA1's wonderful first half is better than Doctor Strange, but it ends so meh for me that, for now at least, I prefer the escalation of Strange's visuals throughout the film.

[TGM]

So I thought this was just sort of okay. Very middle of the road Marvel fare, hitting all the usual tropes, and honestly playing it far safer than I was hoping it would, as it felt like we were walking on all too familiar ground with this movie. The movie also feels quite rushed, where as I would have loved to have spent more time really diving into all of the logistics of these powers and multiple universes and what have you.

The action sequences also underwhelmed, as the movie never gets any more visually imaginative than what's shown in the trailers, and there's far too much sparks flashing at the screen, so much so that I can only imagine this movie being a nauseating experience to see in 3D.

I would say that I really enjoyed the music here, particularly during the ending credits. And it was worth it just to see Benedict Cumberbatch's spot-on impersonation of House throughout.

(And on a particularly nerdy note, I did enjoy how Doctor Strange went all Itachi during the last act. If any of you follow Naruto at all, you'll know what I mean. :p )

Ranking the films...

Guardians of the Galaxy
Captain America: Civil War
Iron Man 3
The Avengers
Captain America: The First Avenger
Thor: The Dark World
Iron Man
Doctor Strange
The Incredible Hulk
Thor
Avengers: Age of Ultron
Captain America: The Winter Soldier
Ant-Man
Iron Man 2

[TGM]

- As for the credit scenes, I will wait for you guys to see it, because they confused me in two different ways; the middle one has me wondering about the timeline of it in relation toThor's story. And the last one confuses me if it's Loki or some comic stuff I don't get.

I'm assuming it's after The Dark World? Loki was in NY in Avengers, sure, but Odin wasn't missing at the time, whereas TDW ended with Loki replacing Odin on the throne. Mind you, it ended on a note where Thor wouldn't have known this yet, so if this takes place after TDW, then I assume Thor 3 is either picking up after Thor's found Loki out, or perhaps will start prior, and catch back up with this stinger during the course of the movie?

As for the last one, beats me. *shrug*

[Henry Gale]

A lot of the usual Marvel routine (Strange's arc is basically a hybrid of Thor's and Stark's ones from their first movies), but when it strays, it really strays in sublime and spectacular ways.

I'm just gonna say there are some massive images in this that are among the most stunning I've ever seen from a film of this visual magnitude, and in its own class of ambition. I love just how much they kept out of the trailers. There are also some images I didn't like and thought looked supremely goofy, like some of the more obviously CG bodies floating around. Not to mention for the majority of the movie I thought the big bad was actually Thanos the way they were vaguely showing him. Still, most of it looks great! No matter what you think of 3D, if you're seeing this, I think it should be compulsory to see this in the format. The imagery will look just fine in 2D, but the added depth pushes things into eternal plains and surreal, spiralling, dizzying dimensionality that I've never seen employed so consistently in a 3D movie before. At least one sequence is pure psychedelic bliss.

Another thing is the humour feels almost a bit overplayed and sometimes awkwardly position, even if the material mostly fine in an of itself. I know it was rumoured that Dan Harmon was involved in some of the re-shoots for this, and I felt like from that description I can tell exactly which scenes those were, and it doesn't quite make sense as to why they felt they needed them.

Bottom line: Liked it a bunch! Just as with Peng and TGM, it likely lands safely in the middle third of my MCU ranking.

Credit tag thoughts: They both feel like the most overstretched teases to date outside of the Thanos stuff from Avengers 1. The first one teasing Ragnarok won't be paid off for a full year, and the second is hinting at developments with Ejiofor in another Doctor Strange movie we might not see for maybe half a decade. The Thor one was really fun though. Particularly the tea/beer/refill.

[kuehnepips]

Good. Cumberbatch is great.

[Dukefrukem]

Cumberbatch was great. I can see why Marvel was courting him for so long. He is to Dr Strange as RDJ is to Stark in my eyes.

I also felt like this was a really safe movie on the lines of Ant-Man. Safely setting up an origin story while showing some of the mystical arts. And super disappointing was the presence of Dormammu, almost as if they didn't know what to do with him. The biggest miss of all was basically just using the template of the Matrix and Harry Potter. I was expecting some kind of sparing session like we saw between Neo and Morpheus. There's a little bit of that, but it does feel a bit rushed.

Middle Credits scene takes place after Thor 2 after Doctor Strange and before Thor 3. Very simple, at the end of Thor 2 Odin is missing, so they're looking for him.

And I don't know what was so confusing about the last after credit scene. Mordo is historically Dr Strange's arch rival. So it was setting up Mordo turning into a baddie.

There was a nice Easter egg alluding to Rhode's accident from Civil War. Anyone catch it?

Exiting the theater, my father told me this was his favorite MCU movie, and yes, I've brought him to all of them. I turned the MCU movie releases into a family event.

My rankings:

1. Captain America: Civil War 9/10
2. Captain America: The Winter Soldier 9/10
3. The Avengers 9/10
4. Guardians of the Galaxy 9/10
5. Doctor Strange 8/10
6. Ant-Man 8/10
7. Avengers: Age of Ultron 8/10
8. Iron Man 7/10
9. Iron Man 3 7/10
10. Captain America: The First Avenger 7/10
11. Thor 6/10
12. Iron Man 2 5/10
13. The Incredible Hulk 5/10
14. Thor: The Dark World 4/10

[Dukefrukem]

This is guy Marvel hired to do all the spell choreography.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xaCP3_WZpc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJTBWwHIcjw

[TGM]

And I don't know what was so confusing about the last after credit scene. Mordo is historically Dr Strange's arch rival. So it was setting up Mordo turning into a baddie.

As someone who doesn't follow the Doctor Strange comics, that's precisely what was confusing about it. It was a stark and sudden 180 turn for the character, which felt like it came out of nowhere. Hell, even when he leaves Strange at the end of the movie it feels sudden. I'd say that, like much of the film, his turn was very rushed, as well as very sloppily handled, as I really didn't buy it, given the way the character otherwise acts throughout the entire rest of the film.

[TGM]

The majority of my audience also left during the credits again last night. I'm honestly thinking at this point that the masses just really don't care about these post-credits scenes anymore.

[Henry Gale]

I largely enjoyed Giacchino's score for this (and the new Marvel Studios fanfare he did for them), but man, his triumphant anthem for Strange's character sounds so much like his main Star Trek one that it got distracting every time I heard it. It starts almost identically so I'd be subconsciously humming it and then get thrown when the melody took a left turn before seemingly going right back. (Example: About 4:23 in the piece "Astral Worlds Worst Killer" on the soundtrack. Spotify link. (https://open.spotify.com/track/3OECOXQFTxfoPeDgkWT2bq))

And since it's been a semi-hot topic of online video-essayed discussion lately, I'll just say this is easily one of the most diverse and distinct in the Marvel canon.


The majority of my audience also left during the credits again last night. I'm honestly thinking at this point that the masses just really don't care about these post-credits scenes anymore.

One of my friends had to go to the bathroom right when the credits started and missed the first tag. When he got back he said "Ah ok, I'll just watch it online." and stayed for the other because we were. I feel like that's the general attitude for most audiences. Plus it's already been out in most of the rest of the world for over a week, so it's not a stretch to imagine it's already out there.

[Dukefrukem]

No one left during my viewing. People loved hanging out and waiting.

[Peng]

I think this has my favorite tie-in to other MCU films, in term of being seamless and nonintrusive, which is that one of the multiverse Strange falls into on his first trip is the same as Antman's climatic one.

[amberlita]

I enjoyed the hell out of this. I thought the trailers for this looked super silly and wasn't in a rush to see it but that opening scene really snagged me. I'm sure I'm over-generalizing but I feel like this is the first time that the big budget special effects for these super hero movies were actually worthwhile since they were used for some truly inventive imagery and action sequences. It felt genuinely different from the Avengers line of Marvel output even if it recycled the same formula. And thank god it had a sense of humor.

I admit to also being a bit baffled by the final after credit sequence. I had to have it explained to me why such a character turn would occur based on the source material.

And I don't know how Strange goes from being a trainee to being a master based primarily on one battle sequence in which a cape does half his fighting for him. But even if that middle part was rushed I was glad it spent longer in the beginning establishing Strange's commitment to his neurosurgical life such that giving it up would feel genuinely like character growth.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Welp... it was Marvel.

I'd be inclined to boost this one a leetle more than others, due to the trippy psychedelics and nods toward fatalism (characters commenting on indifferent universes that will suffer heat death), and the strong work from Tilda Swinton and Benedict Wong. Cumberbatch is fine but never really surprised me, and it felt a lot like watching the first Iron Man at times. Part of the issue is that the flick has to cover so much ground, and crucial story like Strange developing his powers is abbreviated with the explanation that he was "born for this," which completely goes against the point of the movie (that Strange needs to realize he's not the most special person in the room). Mikkelson and McAdams and Bratt deserved so much more attention.

There's also a really weird thing here, and this is certainly nitpicky in the scope of things and won't bother most, and I wonder if this is common to all Marvel films, but I noticed that so much of the coverage shot for this film was unimaginative, with shallow depth of field, shoulder-mounted mediums, and basic lighting. When the film decides to pull back, Derrickson and co. manage to stage some impressive visual moments (my favorite are the Ditko-loving vistas of the Underverse or whatever it was called), but even a lot of the hand-to-hand-action (and at least one crucial chase scene through a twisting New York) also feature that sort of anonymous shooting style. It's weird coming from Derrickson, who showed reasonable command of his visuals in movies like The Exorcism of Emily Rose and Sinister.

The best thing about the movie is how it uses that sense of fatalism and psychedelia during its final confrontation with Dormamu (sic), where Dr. Strange uses the "trap" of humanity (the arrow of time) to basically annoy his way to victory. It's unexpected and very, very funny, and if it undercuts the apocalyptic drama, why not? A little more sense of Strange actually suffering during his multiple deaths might've added some poignancy, but the approach twists the formula enough to justify (and more or less avoid) another sound and light show in the middle of an urban area. The backwards-battle leading up to it was also satisfying, and the reveal, obvious as it was, that the medallion holds the TIME GEM, broke from the previous pattern of Infinity Stones being generalized macguffins that instigate generalized armageddons.

So, yeah, Marvel. And I can never seem to write about Marvel without some backhanded bullshit, so I'll close as uncynically as I can by saying that this is a fun film that you are likely to enjoy.

[Henry Gale]

I think this has my favorite tie-in to other MCU films, in term of being seamless and nonintrusive, which is that one of the multiverse Strange falls into on his first trip is the same as Antman's climatic one.

Liked this a lot, but also loved this whole sequence. There was also some definite Thor realm hopping pieces on display in there.

EDIT: I also don't disagree with anything either of you said, amber and DaMU. I think it's completely awesome while somehow failing to be essential. It's not without its thin, transparent structural support beams (with Marvel Studios' name embossed as the manufacturer), but it's almost impressive how far Feige & co. are able to stack a tower this formula and lively entertain with ease rather than grimly bludgeon with redundancy.

Obviously credit to the screenwriters and Derrickson's direction (all the way back to the self-produced portfolio presentation he described that used to lobby for the job) for being variables in here as any creative team might be between projects, but the core recipe is there and it works. Change the ingredients and type of cuisine here and there (Today our special is a political thriller. Or maybe you would prefer the psychedelic sorcerer story?), but the feel of the stories and the reputation of the name remain. I'm totally fine with them doing what we might broadly expect, because at this point it's hard to deny its effectiveness despite itself.

[[ETM]]

I loved how the final confrontation was basically what another Doctor does on a regular basis. It was so Whovian that it gave me a huge grin all the way.

And agreed on 3D - I can't imagine seeing this for the first time in 2D.

[transmogrifier]

It's another Marvel movie, lumpen (the humor for example feels like it is randomly injected at certain points, rather than organically arising from the situation) and buffed clean of anything really ambitious or challenging. And holy monologue city. Meh. Better than Iron Man 2, Thor, Avengers 2, and The Incredible Hulk, not much else. Only the action scene at the end makes much of an impression, and it is all to do with the concept rather than anything to do with the camerawork or staging.

[[ETM]]

Wow, that reads like an endorsement coming from you, trans. :D

[Morris Schæffer]

;562607']I loved how the final confrontation was basically what another Doctor does on a regular basis. It was so Whovian that it gave me a huge grin all the way.

And agreed on 3D - I can't imagine seeing this for the first time in 2D.

That's good to know. Got my 3D ticket for tonight.

[number8]

I cant believe I didn't consider this before seeing this, but I think this might be Marvel's first bit of stunt casting. I realized that Strange's jump from skeptic to believer is really effective despite the rushed arc, because we're familiar with Cumberbatch as someone who's typecast as intensely logical men of science. Watching Strange's conversion to me parallels watching Cumbsy break out of that mold.

[number8]

I largely enjoyed Giacchino's score for this (and the new Marvel Studios fanfare he did for them), but man, his triumphant anthem for Strange's character sounds so much like his main Star Trek one that it got distracting every time I heard it. It starts almost identically so I'd be subconsciously humming it and then get thrown when the melody took a left turn before seemingly going right back. (Example: About 4:23 (http://matchcut.artboiled.com/x-apple-data-detectors://0) in the piece "Astral Worlds Worst Killer" on the soundtrack. Spotify link. (https://open.spotify.com/track/3OECOXQFTxfoPeDgkWT2bq))

And since it's been a semi-hot topic of online video-essayed discussion lately, I'll just say this is easily one of the most diverse and distinct in the Marvel canon.

Glad someone else noticed this. It was driving me nuts for most of the movie because it was so familiar but I couldn't remember what. I was on my way to lunch after the movie when I suddenly just blurted out "Star Trek!" in the middle of crossing the street.

I like the 60s rock version in the end credits a lot though.

[number8]

Oh and I don't know how intentional this is, but it's hilarious that the climactic fight in this movie is a superhero un-knocking down buildings.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Oh and I don't know how intentional this is, but it's hilarious that the climactic fight in this movie is a superhero un-knocking down buildings.

Word of God is that it's very intentional.

[Dukefrukem]

I watched THe Avengers and Age of Ultron again this weekend. I've still only seen Civil War once, but I've reordered the Avengers to be my number 1. It's too good. THe dialog is too good. THe interaction between characters is too good. It has the best villain. Best ensemble.



My rankings

1. The Avengers
2. Captain America: Civil War 9/10
3. Captain America: The Winter Soldier 9/10
4. Guardians of the Galaxy 9/10
5. Doctor Strange 8/10
6. Ant-Man 8/10
7. Avengers: Age of Ultron 8/10
8. Iron Man 7/10
9. Iron Man 3 7/10
10. Captain America: The First Avenger 7/10
11. Thor 6/10
12. Iron Man 2 5/10
13. The Incredible Hulk 5/10
14. Thor: The Dark World 4/10

[Morris Schæffer]

I cannot endorse this movie on the basis that it is an atypical Marvel movie. I was bored by this, bordering on mystical mumbo jumbo to imply depth and texture.

Thoroughly unimpressed by the visual effects (in 3-D). Not in the sense that they looked fake, but rather chaotic and unnecessary. The way the world shifts and contorts has been seen before, and I get this is a power that these folks are equipped with, but I fail to see its purpose within the movie as anything but a way to "see the cool shit that we can do with computers!!"

A bottom tier Marvel for me.

[TGM]

I cannot endorse this movie on the basis that it is an atypical Marvel movie. I was bored by this, bordering on mystical mumbo jumbo to imply depth and texture.

Thoroughly unimpressed by the visual effects (in 3-D). Not in the sense that they looked fake, but rather chaotic and unnecessary. The way the world shifts and contorts has been seen before, and I get this is a power that these folks are equipped with, but I fail to see its purpose within the movie as anything but a way to "see the cool shit that we can do with computers!!"

A bottom tier Marvel for me.

Even though I was more positive on the film than you, I really don't disagree with a lot of what you're saying. As it regards the visuals, I pretty much said that much on twitter yesterday, expressing how the visuals are underwhelming, and that the movie doesn't do a single thing that hasn't already been done in other films and mediums, and done significantly more effective at that. I should've felt chills watching the magic at work in this thing. Instead, I felt nothing.

And even as it regards the film being supposedly "trippy", as so many have described it, even that I call foul on. When I think of a movie that's trippy, I think of something closer to Black Swan. This movie, though, is honestly pretty much a straight forward romp throughout, and almost depressingly so at that.

This movie really isn't sitting well with me, 'cause it's almost that worst case scenario for a movie like this to be. It's not great, but it's not terrible, either. It's absolutely mediocre, it's just another Marvel movie that just happens to exist, and nothing more, nothing less. When really, given the premise and the possibilities for this movie, it could have and should have been so much more than it is.

[Morris Schæffer]

Even though I was more positive on the film than you, I really don't disagree with a lot of what you're saying. As it regards the visuals, I pretty much said that much on twitter yesterday, expressing how the visuals are underwhelming, and that the movie doesn't do a single thing that hasn't already been done in other films and mediums, and done significantly more effective at that. I should've felt chills watching the magic at work in this thing. Instead, I felt nothing.

And even as it regards the film being supposedly "trippy", as so many have described it, even that I call foul on. When I think of a movie that's trippy, I think of something closer to Black Swan. This movie, though, is honestly pretty much a straight forward romp throughout, and almost depressingly so at that.

This movie really isn't sitting well with me, 'cause it's almost that worst case scenario for a movie like this to be. It's not great, but it's not terrible, either. It's absolutely mediocre, it's just another Marvel movie that just happens to exist, and nothing more, nothing less. When really, given the premise and the possibilities for this movie, it could have and should have been so much more than it is.

I'm not at all versed in the character of Doctor Strange, but what about the "premise and possibilities for this movie meant it could have and should have been so much more?"

Yes, a lot of movies can be better than they ultimately are, but I'm not sold on this character and the powers he's apparently mastered or the idea that when you're broken beyond repair you can go to some sanctuary in Nepal, speak to a bald lady, read some books and start doing magic tricks. Doctor Strange is not a wizard, he's a highly skilled and eerily talented doctor. It felt like a step too many. Iron Man flies because of the suit, Spiderman clings to walls because he's bitten by a spider, Steve Rogers is super powerful because he's injected with a serum etc... All fanciful, out there for sure, but still somewhat possible to buy thanks to (albeit tenuous) links to real world developments. Now, unless your Strange movie is literally set in a wizarding world, it is hard for me to swallow his development as a character.

Reversing time to undo bad calls is the worst power-up in the history of supermovies. :)

[Dukefrukem]

The more I think about this movie, the more great stuff comes to mind.

Hard to imagine it took 14 Marvel movies for someone to use time travel- considering how often it happens in the comics. I'm wondering if Marvel would use this to say: bring Quicksilver back from the dead?

It also makes me wonder how the sequel will setup other characters- could Mordo start hunting other sorcerers? Is Scarlet Witch a sorcerers? Death of Thor?

Finally, this next Thor movie- it's starting to look a lot like a defenders movie to me.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Defenders_members

Coincidence????? Founding member Doctor Strange? Check. Hulk? Check. Valkyrie? Check. Thor? Well he's not part of the Defenders but could they be substituting for someone they don't have rights to? Maybe Silver Surfer? Then of course that leaves one major reveal.... Namor... who I predicted a few months ago would have his own movie in Phase 4.

Thoughts>???

[Ezee E]

It's been two years since I've seen a Marvel movie. The last one being Guardians of the Galaxy, which may be the best of the comic book "origin" movies since it has a nice balance of establishing everyone, and having a good story as well.

What the movie does do, is establish Dr. Strange pretty well. In all my years of comics, I never really came across him, and figured he was a fantasy magician villain. Didn't like the look or the cape, so I was weary of seeing this, but the special effects looked pretty damn neat. I'd like to know more about this world and the different laws of the books. Cumberbatch, Ejiofor, and Swinton make possibly the best "acted" Marvel movie to date.

As far as the story, well it's territory that's certainly been done before. Good guys versus bad guys. Bad guys are threatening the world. New hero will be able to stop it all. Luckily, I like the jumps between dimensions and the fighting techniques matched with special effects.

It's fine. I didn't stay for the end credits scenes. I'll probably see Guardians of the Galaxy. But when the heck is Thanos coming?

By the way, I swore that was Thanos the entire time in the final sequence. Whoops.

[number8]

By the way, I swore that was Thanos the entire time in the final sequence. Whoops.

This is hilarious considering he said Dormammu's name about 20 times.

[Ezee E]

This is hilarious considering he said Dormammu's name about 20 times.

Certainly is. I never, ever heard of Dormammu in my life before this movie, so I figured it was some dimensional name change. Whoops.

[transmogrifier]

Mikkelsen's character is kind of a dull plot advancer rather than actually having an inner life of its own, or even an interesting relationship with Strange. He just turns up when the plot needs him too and then is gone.

[Morris Schæffer]

Oh and I don't know how intentional this is, but it's hilarious that the climactic fight in this movie is a superhero un-knocking down buildings.

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/doctor-strange-scott-derrickson/

Check #4. ;)

[number8]

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/doctor-strange-scott-derrickson/

I can totally see why Derrickson wanted Nightmare. Would have made Marvel's first outright horror movie. They've already set up Mordo, but I'd love for the sequel to be just that.

[Dukefrukem]

Certainly is. I never, ever heard of Dormammu in my life before this movie, so I figured it was some dimensional name change. Whoops.

Dormammu is a super cool extra-dimensional immortal. He can technically teleport between dimensions but the way they used him in the MCU was just existing in the dark dimension. It was a start to see the power he can harness and I hope they bring him back.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/2/28028/819499-hellstorm001.jpg

[Dukefrukem]

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/doctor-strange-scott-derrickson/

Check #4. ;)

Holy shit at #10.

They was a rumored Runaways spin-off in the works a few months ago....

[Spinal]

I will preface this by saying that I did not exactly see this movie under the best circumstances. I hadn't planned on seeing it, but my family wanted to do something to get our minds off the election. Before the movie started, I knew that things were not going well and so I watched the film in a state of anxiety.

That said, I thought this was really, really dopey. It starts out with my least favorite cliche, which is the 'arrogant man of science' being scolded and humiliated for not believing in unseen forces that you just have to have faith in and feel. From there on out, it's basically a movie about which side can wiggle their hands the best. Wiggling hands that change the world any way you want. Oh, but it's not that easy! You have to like, really think and stuff! Once you have the wiggling hands down, you need a magic cape that thinks for you. Because you'll be too busy REALLY THINKING, so that you can wiggle your hands.

Talk about a film with no stakes. Everything is subject to manipulation and reversal. There is no sense of what values or ideals anyone is fighting for. This is what passes for philosophy in modern mainstream cinema. It's like sitting down with a 12-year-old for 2 hours and having them explain to you how the world works. The cast makes it bearable in places, but boy, Marvel is not making a positive contribution to humanity.

[transmogrifier]

I will preface this by saying that I did not exactly see this movie under the best circumstances. I hadn't planned on seeing it, but my family wanted to do something to get our minds off the election. Before the movie started, I knew that things were not going well and so I watched the film in a state of anxiety.

That said, I thought this was really, really dopey. It starts out with my least favorite cliche, which is the 'arrogant man of science' being scolded and humiliated for not believing in unseen forces that you just have to have faith in and feel. From there on out, it's basically a movie about which side can wiggle their hands the best. Wiggling hands that change the world any way you want. Oh, but it's not that easy! You have to like, really think and stuff! Once you have the wiggling hands down, you need a magic cape that thinks for you. Because you'll be too busy REALLY THINKING, so that you can wiggle your hands.

Talk about a film with no stakes. Everything is subject to manipulation and reversal. There is no sense of what values or ideals anyone is fighting for. This is what passes for philosophy in modern mainstream cinema. It's like sitting down with a 12-year-old for 2 hours and having them explain to you how the world works. The cast makes it bearable in places, but boy, Marvel is not making a positive contribution to humanity.

I approve of this message.

[Dead & Messed Up]

There is no sense of what values or ideals anyone is fighting for. This is what passes for philosophy in modern mainstream cinema.

The overall philosophy I got from the film was, Strange needs to realize he's not that special, except for all the times he totally is.

[Dukefrukem]

The overall philosophy I got from the film was, Strange needs to realize he's not that special, except for all the times he totally is.

I dont think that's the message at all. When was this suggested?

[number8]

Mordo and the Ancient One both said that he's so fast at learning to be a sorcerer because he's naturally sensitive to magic, like he was born for it.

[Dead & Messed Up]

I dont think that's the message at all. When was this suggested?

Let me amend: Dr. Strange needs to stop being arrogant, but everything in the film suggests his arrogance is more than justified, the quick-study eye-wielding cape-wearing sorcerer-defeating god-outwitting magickal neophyte. The director's stated that the events of the film take place over about a year (including his car carsh and sadness beard), which is actually sort of insane when you think about the decades and centuries other people at the Misty Mountain Hop have spent developing their powers.

[number8]

Comic books have a long history of rich arrogant white men going to mystical eastern places and being the best there is at everything.

Can't wait for Iron Fist though!

[Dead & Messed Up]

Comic books have a long history of rich arrogant white men going to mystical eastern places and being the best there is at everything.

Can't wait for Iron Fist though!

Is it true that Dr. Strange and Batman's journeys to the mystic Orient were both inspired by the Shadow, or was there more going on there? The Razor's Edge.]

[number8]

Is it true that Dr. Strange and Batman's journeys to the mystic Orient were both inspired by the Shadow, or was there more going on there? The Razor's Edge.]

You'll be surprised to know that the idea of Bruce Wayne traveling the world to acquire his skills is a bit of revisionism that wasn't introduced until the '80s, thanks to people like Frank Miller and Denny O'Neill. Before that, dude just went to the gym a lot.

The Shadow is certainly one of the firsts to introduce the idea of a western man getting his superpower from Asia, but I dunno, I'd say Dr. Strange and Iron Fist were more inspired by the interest in Eastern new age and martial arts that boomed in the US in the late 60s rather than the more sinister outlook of the East that was prevalent in the pulps (The Shadow's powers were meant to make him creepy and monstrous).

[number8]

Actually, I forgot about the pulp character that is most likely Stan Lee's main inspiration for Strange:

http://pre-code.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/ChanduTheMagician2-750x410.png

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chandu_the_Magician_(film)

[Grouchy]

I think this has to be the best Marvel film so far, or sharing the podium with Guardians of the Galaxy or Winter Soldier. I might be wrong, though, because I think part of what happened here is that I'm really not as familiar with Strange as I am with the rest of the Marvel Universe and so I found the particulars (the Cloak of Levitation, the Eye of Agamotto, the sidekicks) a lot more fresh. The storyline is cliché, sure. But the character and the actor playing it have enough charisma to overcome that.

And the action/fantasy sequences are simply incredible. The Dormammu showdown at the end is very inspired. I saw it on 2D but I might be willing to make a second trip to the movies just to experience all those flashy images on another level.

EDIT: Also, I'm much more excited for Dr. Strange sequels than for the future of the Avengers storyline at large. I really don't care for the Infinity Gauntlet at the moment.

[Skitch]

This was pretty much everything I wanted in a Doctor Strange movie. Another solid origin film from Marvel. Only hope is they don't drop the ball with a sequel, Captain America aside, I feel like thats another Marvel habit imo.

[Dukefrukem]

This was pretty much everything I wanted in a Doctor Strange movie. Another solid origin film from Marvel. Only hope is they don't drop the ball with a sequel, Captain America aside, I feel like thats another Marvel habit imo.

Wow. That's funny to think of actually. We have only had three sequels to stand alone movies and two of them were terrible. GotG2 will be the first sequel to a solo movie since 2014 (Winter Solider).

[TGM]

If I could change my yay to a nay, I would. This has not sat well with me at all.

[Skitch]

Wow. That's funny to think of actually. We have only had three sequels to stand alone movies and two of them were terrible. GotG2 will be the first sequel to a solo movie since 2014 (Winter Solider).

Its literally my ONLY hesitation about GOTG2. I adore that first film so damn much...

[Skitch]

Also, Doctor Strange deserves Oscars for its special effects. Amazing, beautiful, and most importantly, seamless.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Wow. That's funny to think of actually. We have only had three sequels to stand alone movies and two of them were terrible. GotG2 will be the first sequel to a solo movie since 2014 (Winter Solider).

I know Ultron isn't quite the same, but if you take it more as a direct sequel to Avengers, it lines up nicely with the disappointment factor.

[Skitch]

I was most disappointed with Avengers 2 of the sequels.

[Dukefrukem]

Disappointment is one thing, but it's still in the top 5 MCU movies for me. The dialog stands above all others and that's the Wheedon factor at work.

[Skitch]

Hey I wouldn't give any of the sequels negative scores. Well maybe Avengers 2. I need to rewatch and reevaluate.

[TGM]

Iron Man 2 is not only the worst sequel, it's still the worst movie in the MCU yet.

[Dukefrukem]

Iron Man 2 is not only the worst sequel, it's still the worst movie in the MCU yet.

It has the worst script, the worst exposition and the worst villain... but it still has RDJ, which is why The Dark World is the worst MCU movie.

[TGM]

It has the worst script, the worst exposition and the worst villain... but it still has RDJ, which is why The Dark World is the worst MCU movie.

But The Dark World has Tom Hiddleston, which bumps it up above Iron Man 2. ;)

[Dukefrukem]

But The Dark World has Tom Hiddleston, which bumps it up above Iron Man 2. ;)

I can't even remember what the Dark Elves wanted in Thor 2. That's a huge problem if it's not the worst in the MCU, Hilldeston or not. I'm willing to bet most people on MC can't remember either.

[Skitch]

Red infinity mist....stone.


Edit: But to be honest, I just rewatched it a couple weeks ago because I couldn't remember what it was about. :D :D :D

[Dukefrukem]

They wanted the Aether to do what?

[Skitch]

They wanted the Aether to do what?

Kill worlds. Angry revengy something. The reasons were mostly moot because the bad guys spend most of the movie chasing the weapon, and by the time they get it, you forget why they want to use it. I would say the the Thor/Loki stuff is very strong, and Stellan Skarsgard is the real thief of the flick. It needed to focus more on the villain, or use Dark Elves less in favor of full Loki threat again. The ending is interesting too, because it potentially leaves the Thor series with an extremely dark cliffhanger. Interested to see where it goes next.

Edit: its sounds like like I really like Thor 2. Its still quite broken.

[number8]

*clears throat*

Iron Man 3 is the best movie Tony Stark has appeared in.

[Morris Schæffer]

Also, Doctor Strange deserves Oscars for its special effects. Amazing, beautiful, and most importantly, seamless.

Totally failing to see this bud. I'm trying to think what pluses its FX had. Amazing? I thought they were ordinary, had a big "seen-it-all-before" factor. Beautiful? Doesn't feel like the right word.
Seamless? Perhaps, but I'm not sure that equates with pushing the envelope. But I guess it depends on the competition. Rogue One is more Star Wars and thus hardly original while its CGI characters weren't exactly seamless. DeepWater Horizon's FX I've heard good things about, perhaps that's tougher, to render something which actually happened with authenticity. The Jungle Book really blew me away. Talking animals have been done before too, but here it felt particularly profound and given the fact they were front and center....seamless.

[Skitch]

I did come around on IM3 a bit after a rewatch, but I still think IM1 is the best.


Totally failing to see this bud. I'm trying to think what pluses its FX had. Amazing? I thought they were ordinary, had a big "seen-it-all-before" factor. Beautiful? Doesn't feel like the right word.
Seamless? Perhaps, but I'm not sure that equates with pushing the envelope. But I guess it depends on the competition. Rogue One is more Star Wars and thus hardly original while its CGI characters weren't exactly seamless. DeepWater Horizon's FX I've heard good things about, perhaps that's tougher, to render something which actually happened with authenticity. The Jungle Book really blew me away. Talking animals have been done before too, but here it felt particularly profound and given the fact they were front and center....seamless.

You've named a couple flicks I haven't seen yet. Fair enough. I was just very nearly blown away by the FX. All that spinning around Inception city bending shit looked goofy in the trailer, but hot damn did it work for me in the flick. I just came off of X-Men Apocalypse where it was obnoxiously fake that our stars were sitting on a green screen pretending to be a cliff overlooking a city. Here theyre bending an entire city and and I cant tell where the green stage begins or ends. My disbelief was suspended for the runtime. I entered that theater and suffered no distractions. Whisked away. That happens so infrequently, perhaps I'm jaded.

[Dukefrukem]

*clears throat*

Iron Man 3 is the best movie Tony Stark has appeared in.

So that means you're rankings look like

1. GotG
2. IM3

Interesting...

[number8]

Close. GOTG, Winter Soldier, then IM3.

[Dukefrukem]

I have Winter Solider at #2 too. But I can't get past the dialog in both Avengers films. GotG sits at #5.

https://letterboxd.com/dukefrukem/list/the-best-mcu-movies/

[TGM]

Iron Man 3 is the best Iron Man movie, but Civil War has the best RDJ performance.

[Peng]

Iron Man 3 is the best Iron Man movie, but Civil War has the best RDJ performance.

Yeah, this.

Also my weird opinion is that Thor is the best origin story for a single superhero (I framed it like that because Guardians is technically one, but just doesn't feel like it to me). Such a flawed, goofy, grandiose film that I'm really fond for.

[Henry Gale]

Also my weird opinion is that Thor is the best origin story for a single superhero (I framed it like that because Guardians is technically one, but just doesn't feel like it to me). Such a flawed, goofy, grandiose film that I'm really fond for.

Totally co-sign this. It might even be the MCU movie I've seen the most, which would be a fact just from my own initiated viewings, but also because people I know seem to just put it on randomly too.

[Morris Schæffer]

I did come around on IM3 a bit after a rewatch, but I still think IM1 is the best.



You've named a couple flicks I haven't seen yet. Fair enough. I was just very nearly blown away by the FX. All that spinning around Inception city bending shit looked goofy in the trailer, but hot damn did it work for me in the flick. I just came off of X-Men Apocalypse where it was obnoxiously fake that our stars were sitting on a green screen pretending to be a cliff overlooking a city. Here theyre bending an entire city and and I cant tell where the green stage begins or ends. My disbelief was suspended for the runtime. I entered that theater and suffered no distractions. Whisked away. That happens so infrequently, perhaps I'm jaded.

No prob. The FX in Strange did their job and I found no anomalies. They looked polished and sometimes cool.

[Watashi]

Liked this a lot because it was one of the few Marvel films that didn't feel like a toy commercial setting up another film. CGI is terrific and the climax takes the whole "portal in the sky" and has fun with it. Disappointed with the look of Dormammu. Wish he was more than a floating head, but hopefully he comes back in other films in a physical form.

[TGM]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ffc6y_yzOU8