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Dukefrukem
04-10-2015, 11:25 AM
Cool intro.

Oh a whim I decided to take today off. I know what i'm doing for the next 12 hours.

Dukefrukem
04-10-2015, 07:00 PM
Episode 5; These story arcs are not all that interesting.

Dukefrukem
04-10-2015, 11:59 PM
Hmm. Episode 7 thoughts.

I'm guessing this Black Sky reference is referring to something else I'm not making the connection with.

I also have no idea who that is at the end of episode 7. I wanted to guess it was leader of the Chaste (not the Hand, I get them mixed up). Hard to tell though.

Dukefrukem
04-11-2015, 12:39 AM
Episode 7 and 8 are the highlights so far. The build is getting worth it.

Skitch
04-11-2015, 11:53 AM
Watched first episode last night. WOW. Those fight scenes were fantastic, or at least far above what I was expecting.

number8
04-11-2015, 11:58 AM
Yeah, they killed it on the fight choreography. And they don't fuck it up with shooting them well, too!

Dukefrukem
04-11-2015, 12:46 PM
I was thinking the choreography was clunkly and slow. There's one fight scene in a hallway (fake one shot) that goes back and forth on angles- that was pretty good, the rest have been over edited with punch sound FX that makes me think of Indiana Jones. I noticed it early but as the season goes on, it becomes less obvious.

Dukefrukem
04-11-2015, 06:05 PM
Finished. Dialog in the last episode is painful.

Kingpin: "You took everythiiiiing. I'm gonna kill youuuuu!"

Daredevil: "Take your best shot"

[ETM]
04-11-2015, 06:25 PM
Dina and I are about to start episode 4... lovin' it so far. The intro is pretty great, although it follows in the footsteps of recent stuff like "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo", "Fringe", "Black Sails" etc.
We love Deborah Ann Woll even more now. Just a solid, solid show.

Dukefrukem
04-11-2015, 06:44 PM
;537326']Dina and I are about to start episode 4... lovin' it so far. The intro is pretty great, although it follows in the footsteps of recent stuff like "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo", "Fringe", "Black Sails" etc.
We love Deborah Ann Woll even more now. Just a solid, solid show.

I was thinking the same thing. More like a combo of Nip/Tuck and Fringe with a Trent Reznor twist.

[ETM]
04-11-2015, 08:48 PM
One thing I forgot: this is pretty much the first time I've seen anyone on US television and/or movies do real, actual Russian. There are slight accents, but it feels real. I know it largely makes no difference to Americans, but I truly appreciate the effort to at least appear authentic.

Henry Gale
04-11-2015, 09:42 PM
Should we just make a "Daredevil (Season 1)" thread? Contains thoughts a little better for future reference, especially if people don't necessarily watch it within these first 48 hours of its release.

Thought the first two episodes were strong though. Even just from the cinematography in the trailers I got a Hannibal vibe, and the show maintains a similar chilly grit to its look, but it's kind of funny just how already having that feeling going in, the opening credits kind of went all the way with the similarity.

Watashi
04-11-2015, 11:02 PM
Outside of the cool fight at the end of episode 2, the first three episodes were a chore. The supporting cast is awful. Maybe it's because I've been high on The Flash recently.

Mara
04-11-2015, 11:29 PM
I made a new thread for clarity.

slqrick
04-12-2015, 12:01 AM
I don't like the dude playing Foggy but Cox and Woll are excellent through the first few eps, and Fisk is appropriately slow played as a force to be reckoned with. The action is brutal.

ledfloyd
04-12-2015, 01:31 AM
Outside of the cool fight at the end of episode 2, the first three episodes were a chore. The supporting cast is awful. Maybe it's because I've been high on The Flash recently.
Foggy is pretty bad. I realllly like Dawson as Night Nurse, and the guy they cast as Urich. Woll is pretty good as Karen Page too.

Skitch
04-12-2015, 11:58 AM
I think I'm jaded because I was a huge fan of Smallville despite its flaws, and all the comic based shows since have blown that out of the water. Maybe I just cant be impartial because I'm so happy to have cool comic book shows. :D

[ETM]
04-12-2015, 08:46 PM
The supporting cast is awful. Maybe it's because I've been high on The Flash recently.

Haven't seen The Flash, but... wot?

ledfloyd
04-12-2015, 09:08 PM
Finished the show. Really like it, even if that development at the end of episode 12 is really questionable, for lots of reasons.

number8
04-13-2015, 12:28 AM
The Wilson-Vanessa dinner scene was the highlight of the season for me. I also don't have a problem at all with the end of Ep 12. The confrontation was too good for it to have ended up as a copout. I respect the follow through.

Thirdmango
04-13-2015, 02:53 AM
I'm currently on episode 11. I like the fighting but I like the court room stuff more. Unfortunately they seem to go more to the fighting. This isn't better than some of the other super hero shows, but it's still fun. I actually really like Foggy. Obviously since I am marathoning it I'm into it, but if I was more into it I would be done by now.

Skitch
04-13-2015, 03:01 AM
Episode 3: holy moley suicide. Show continues to surprise.

number8
04-13-2015, 03:03 AM
Also, I like that they're doing their own little section of MCU interconnectness by setting up Iron Fist and Luke Cage so overtly already. I didn't catch any references to Jessica Jones, but maybe I missed it.

Irish
04-13-2015, 06:39 AM
Enjoying this but good god it's violent for a "tv" show.

Echo previous sentiments (Foggy bad, Russian good).

Little disappointed in the fight scenes, which look too choreographed and plain. Like out takes from a Statham film, except its Statham's second string stunt double.

Mildly amused and slightly annoyed that it took the writers a whole three episodes to pair off every major character. Gimme a break. Kingpin has a crush!

MIA: New York City, which always felt like another major character in the comic books. It really grounded the stories when they straddled Marvel's fantasy universe and, say, Miller's grit. Anyway, this show looks like it's shot on lots and stages in LA/ Vancouver/ Toronto or wherever. The feel is off. There's no New York soul to it.

Otherwise, I dig everything else immensely. But then I also have a soft spot for this character.

Dukefrukem
04-13-2015, 11:59 AM
Also, I like that they're doing their own little section of MCU interconnectness by setting up Iron Fist and Luke Cage so overtly already. I didn't catch any references to Jessica Jones, but maybe I missed it.

Will you care to elaborate a bit more?

[ETM]
04-13-2015, 12:30 PM
My girlfriend loves Foggy. He grows on you over the course of the season. I haven't read any of the comics or seen the movie(s) so my views are based purely on the show.

TGM
04-14-2015, 03:34 AM
So just finished this a little earlier today, and I thought it was pretty good for the most part.

Loved most of the action, though I'll agree with the sentiment that it could at times feel a bit TOO violent. That "single take" hallway fight scene in episode 2 was especially stellar, however.

Great acting all around for the most part I felt. The show coulda used a bit more of Rosario Dawson's character I felt, though. I found myself missing her presense whenever she was away for too long.

I can also appreciate this take on the Kingpin character, and the parallels of inner turmoil between both he and Murdock, though there are aspects to the character that I had a hard time buying. There's a certain timidness to him early on especially that left me scratching my head, wondering how such a guy could become so powerful within the underground criminal world.

That said, his relationship with Vanessa was another highlight, with their dinner scene as the world explodes around them being an awesome visual.

On the other end of the spectrum, some of the dialogue can be a bit cliche at times, especially the church scene within the first five minutes of episode one, which is one groan inducing cliche after another. Also the writers had a tendency to give several characters similar verbal tics at times, though I doubt most people would really notice or care about that.

Also, the fact that this was done as a series I still am not a big fan of. It could've easily been written into a film format without losing too much, but this is mainly just a gripe of bias, as I just happen to greatly prefer film as a medium over television in general. *shrug*

number8
04-18-2015, 03:10 PM
I wrote this pretty long thing on the history of Wilson and Vanessa Fisk (http://www.artboiled.com/2015/when-a-kingpin-loves-a-woman/)

Ezee E
04-18-2015, 05:17 PM
I just watched Episode I.

Some nitpicks that I'm kind of harping on is the reference of "The Incident," but no discussion of any of the superheroes, Daily Bugle, etc. Tony Stark, Captain America, and The Hulk seem like they'd be discussed in these talks.

[ETM]
04-18-2015, 06:08 PM
That is a slippery slope in any attempt at a connected universe such as this one. I mean, forget Stark and the Hulk: ALIENS INVADED NEW YORK.
It's best that they keep the more direct references to a minimum, because it detracts from the significantly more grounded tone of the show.

Also, the whole Spiderman thing was still up for grabs, so the Bugle is actually the Bulletin on the show.

Skitch
04-18-2015, 06:36 PM
I do find it amusing how Cult Of Marvel Fanboy is losing their shit over this show while also blasting the Batman v Superman teaser as being too dark and gritty.

Dukefrukem
04-18-2015, 07:10 PM
I do find it amusing how Cult Of Marvel Fanboy is losing their shit over this show while also blasting the Batman v Superman teaser as being too dark and gritty.

The youtube comments on the Batman v Superman trailer is mind boggling.

slqrick
04-18-2015, 08:22 PM
I do find it amusing how Cult Of Marvel Fanboy is losing their shit over this show while also blasting the Batman v Superman teaser as being too dark and gritty.

Daredevil's best iteration is dark and gritty (although Mark Waid's recent run is showing you can do a somewhat happy Matt Murdock too), while Superman's best version is being a sunny, nice dude. That's why the reactions are like that. Frank miller'ing Superman was unnecessary, but wholy appropriate for Daredevil.

Ezee E
04-18-2015, 09:17 PM
;537808']That is a slippery slope in any attempt at a connected universe such as this one. I mean, forget Stark and the Hulk: ALIENS INVADED NEW YORK.
It's best that they keep the more direct references to a minimum, because it detracts from the significantly more grounded tone of the show.

Also, the whole Spiderman thing was still up for grabs, so the Bugle is actually the Bulletin on the show.

Fair point. There's basically no terror of the idea that aliens exist amongst civilians.

number8
04-19-2015, 02:43 PM
I do find it amusing how Cult Of Marvel Fanboy is losing their shit over this show while also blasting the Batman v Superman teaser as being too dark and gritty.

There is no correct tone of doing a superhero story. You should only pick something appropriate to the character and the intention. Most Daredevil fans are crime/noir fans. Most Superman fans are little kids looking for a role model.

Skitch
04-20-2015, 03:13 AM
Episode 8....holy crap. Shit got real.

And I should have made note about my previous comment...I am constantly bewildered by label following. I am not a Marvel or DC guy, Im a comic book fan. I will never understand people that feel the need to pick one or the other. Both have good and bad. Its so bizarre to me how one property is criticized so harshly and another is not, but I guess thats the nature of criticism, and I need to quit reading comic book nerd fanboy comments. (Totally not pointed at MC, btw.)

Grouchy
04-20-2015, 06:11 AM
Cool show for the most part. The real highlight is Vincent D'Onofrio as Kingpin and his storyline with Vanessa, that (as number8 points out) draws cleverly from the different versions of the character in the comics and her doomed love story.

They need to improve the dialogue, though - at times it's so cheesy it's embarassing to watch. This is particularly noticeable in everything that involves Foggy and Karen. I'm also surprised at how they got rid of Ben Urich so soon.

Skitch
04-20-2015, 10:33 AM
Sigh, spoooooiler.....

Grouchy
04-20-2015, 11:56 AM
Sorry, mate.

MadMan
04-20-2015, 07:06 PM
This was largely fantastic. I don't really care about dialogue as long as it doesn't negatively impact the overall story or what is going on. I loved how well acted, shot and directed this show was, and the opening credits were really sweet. I was surprised at how they erased the disappointing memory of the cheesy 2003 film.

Also I can't recall Superman ever being brutal, and I don't care for the character anyway. Where as Daredevil is clearly film noir style and thus more suited to my interests. Vincent D'Onofrio was exceptional and deserves Emmy consideration for what is one of the best villian portrayals I've seen in a while. And I really liked Charlie Cox as Matt. Foggy was actually likable to me yet it seems they stopped knowing where to go with the character. Oh well.

The Oldboy homage was amazing, in addition to many shocking moments. "I'm here to kill you" being the chief one. Also Fisk damn near beating Matt to death. This show killed off a lot of key cast members.
They said that this is supposed to be part of the Defenders universe. I wonder if the other shows will be half as good as Daredevil. Also I'll never look at Rabbit in a Snowstorm the same way again.

Peng
04-20-2015, 10:43 PM
Finished it, and while I'm not wholly sold on it (the world isn't built well enough to engage me much in the first half), it's totally worth it just for Charlie Cox and especially Vincent D'Onofrio. One of the best villains ever. What's most amazing is that while his character is really vile and evil, I still found his relationships with Vanessa and Wesley so unexpectedly touching (or at least clearly felt) that I almost got choked up a couple of times. I always have fascinatingly conflicting emotions when Fisk is onscreen. Great writing and performance there.

Acapelli
04-21-2015, 03:45 AM
MIA: New York City, which always felt like another major character in the comic books. It really grounded the stories when they straddled Marvel's fantasy universe and, say, Miller's grit. Anyway, this show looks like it's shot on lots and stages in LA/ Vancouver/ Toronto or wherever. The feel is off. There's no New York soul to it.
this is funny, since people i've spoken to have said that this is the most recognizably new york show they've seen. i mean sure there are no tracking shots of the skyline or scenes at rockefeller center, or at other major landmarks, but it feels like it's achieving exactly what it's setting out to do, achieving that grittiness that daredevil needs while actually filming in the city (albeit in queens and brooklyn, hell's kitchen is nothing like the hell's kitchen from the comics anymore)

Mara
04-29-2015, 01:42 AM
;537329']One thing I forgot: this is pretty much the first time I've seen anyone on US television and/or movies do real, actual Russian. There are slight accents, but it feels real. I know it largely makes no difference to Americans, but I truly appreciate the effort to at least appear authentic.

What about "The Americans"? (You might not watch it.) But a number of the actors are actually Russian or speak it as one of their languages (Nina, Arkady, Oleg) so it's probably good. And they have longs scenes in Russian.

I am finally getting around to watching this. It's solid but nothing spectacular so far.

Irish
04-29-2015, 05:27 PM
this is funny, since people i've spoken to have said that this is the most recognizably new york show they've seen. i mean sure there are no tracking shots of the skyline or scenes at rockefeller center, or at other major landmarks, but it feels like it's achieving exactly what it's setting out to do, achieving that grittiness that daredevil needs while actually filming in the city (albeit in queens and brooklyn, hell's kitchen is nothing like the hell's kitchen from the comics anymore)

Outside of characters constantly mentioning the name "Hells Kitchen," there isn't anything New Yorkish about the show. I'm not sure what your friends see.

Daredevil has a constrained budget, and it shows. For a bunch of workaday characters in New York, nobody ever rides the subway. There are few to no crowd scenes. No outdoor scenes. There are no recognizable New York voices or attitudes.

I wasn't really talking about "grit," because you can place that anywhere. From what I've seen of Daredevil so far, it could just as easily take place in Chicago because there's no distinction to the setting. That feels very different from some of the comics I've read.

Scar
05-03-2015, 10:02 PM
Five? Episodes in, and really enjoying it. Minor gun quibbles:

First fight sequence, where DD keys on the bad guy ratcheting the slide on his pistol. And then less than a minute later, the same guy ratchets the slide again.
Episode five, during the dinner date, she says she's carrying a .22. When she gives it to him, its defintely a .32 or .380, even though that gun model is available in .22. (The gun she has is a cheap POS, in my opinion).

Anyways, hadn't been following the thread, all I knew is that people were enjoying it. More brutal than I expected, and that is NOT a complaint.

number8
05-12-2015, 08:57 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpjocsKaI1g

Spun Lepton
05-17-2015, 02:23 AM
It was a bit of a chore getting through the first four episodes. I think I watched those over the course of about two weeks, forcing my way through with everybody encouraging me to go on. Episode 2 was the highlight of those first four episodes.

Anyway, after Fisk's introduction, the wheels start turning and the show becomes very interesting. I binged, or, well, as much as I can binge on a given show. Finished the last nine this week. Fantastic. I hope they do another season.

Acapelli
05-17-2015, 09:15 AM
Outside of characters constantly mentioning the name "Hells Kitchen," there isn't anything New Yorkish about the show. I'm not sure what your friends see.
they literally recognize new york

slqrick
05-17-2015, 03:45 PM
they literally recognize new york

Haha, exactly. This show depicted NY perfectly without hitting us over the head with bad Brooklyn accents. Not everyone in NYC says fuggedaboutit after every sentence, a lot don't even ride the subway depending on where they work. I'm glad the show didn't shoehorn in shots of 30 Rock or Times Square and instead relied on effective sets like the waterfront where Kingpin had his meetings or stuff like the goons getting drinks at an actual bar in Brooklyn. I especially loved the roof top meeting between Fisk and Madame Gao. It's definitely the only Marvel property that didn't feel like it was being shot by an NYC tourist.

Irish
05-18-2015, 12:34 AM
Have either of you read any of the comics?

I'm not talking about postcard shots of Time Square.

Acapelli
05-18-2015, 02:38 AM
Have either of you read any of the comics?

I'm not talking about postcard shots of Time Square.
Yes

Irish
05-18-2015, 03:14 AM
Well okay then

Acapelli
05-19-2015, 04:28 AM
glad that's all settled!

Morris Schæffer
06-10-2015, 05:36 AM
Jon Bernthal is Frank Castle.

megladon8
06-23-2015, 06:14 PM
Finally getting around to this - have discovered that I can watch Netflix even with my crappy Internet!

6 episodes in and really enjoying it. D'Onofrio is entrancing as Fisk, and I want to spend more time with that character, learning about why he is so socially awkward and what made him the man he is now.

Action is great. Occasionally too dark, but visceral and appreciate that Murdock doesn't walk away unscathed.

megladon8
06-29-2015, 09:22 PM
This couldn't have had a better resolution.

The situation actually was solved with the law, we have potential for key characters in Daredevil's lore to have ongoing presence. Great stuff.

Some wonderful character work in this show. Everyone felt three dimensional. Fisk in particular was just a fascinating character.

Dead & Messed Up
07-06-2015, 04:59 PM
Watched the first two episodes and enjoying this so far. Appreciate that they connected it to the MCU with talk about the destruction of "half of New York" without going any further. Staved off the cutes. Dat hallway fight. Appreciate how Murdock is not a "superhero" in the traditional sense but gets beat the hell up on the regular. Didn't like how the guy he chucked into the dumpster lived. I want to see his hard-fighting lifestyle have some unfortunate side-effects. Maybe that's forthcoming.

amberlita
07-06-2015, 07:06 PM
This show is really not very good. I enjoy the hell out of the fight scenes, and they picked a great lead actor. Rosario Dawson does way more with what little she is given and I wish there were a good way to incorporate her more and every other minor character less. Foggy and Karen are annoyingly sweet and one-dimensional. Their loooooong stretches of groan-worthy dialogue and cutesy teasing are horribly painful. But Vincent D'Onofrio is the WORST. Listening to him speak Mandarin (Chinese? sorry I'm not sure) is like listening to my dog retch up a piece of turkey. And that's only marginally worse than his warm-marble-mouthed English. As much as I appreciate the effort to do something interesting with the villian character by giving him a soft spot for the art gallery owner, I can't for the life of me figure out why she's interested in a man so devoid of any joy. I dunno...maybe some women, when presented with the question of what she finds most attractive in a man, choose "Total wet blanket". I just don't know any of these women.

The story and the writing doesn't make me care about anything that seems to motivate these people. They are constantly talking about how much they want to save "this city" and blahblah Hell's Kitchen, but everything is told so narrowly and with such a claustrophobic perspective that I can't seem to understand why any of them says any of that crap.

Grouchy
07-06-2015, 07:23 PM
I agree with you about Karen and Foggy and how painful their dialogue sounds. I also agree that vague, almost esoteric talk about "this city" gets a little ridiculous at times. I can't agree with D'Onofrio - he's easily the best part of everything he's in, and this is no exception. I think it's made abundantly clear that what attracts this lady to him is the wealth and power and display, for example, so I don't see a problem there.

amberlita
07-06-2015, 08:58 PM
I agree with you about Karen and Foggy and how painful their dialogue sounds. I also agree that vague, almost esoteric talk about "this city" gets a little ridiculous at times. I can't agree with D'Onofrio - he's easily the best part of everything he's in, and this is no exception. I think it's made abundantly clear that what attracts this lady to him is the wealth and power and display, for example, so I don't see a problem there.

How has that been made abundantly clear? Other than a predilection for fine wine and a single comment to him when he tells her about his terrible childhood, she hasn't said or done anything that gives me the impression she cares about his wealth or power. I think that's based on our own natural assumption that she is attracted to him for those reasons, but that's only because there are no OTHER reasons. She's something of a blank slate. I think the actress pulls off vague mystery well and so I enjoy her scenes, but I don't suspect the show will give us much of her beyond simply being a motivation for Fisk.

Grouchy
07-06-2015, 11:08 PM
How has that been made abundantly clear? Other than a predilection for fine wine and a single comment to him when he tells her about his terrible childhood, she hasn't said or done anything that gives me the impression she cares about his wealth or power. I think that's based on our own natural assumption that she is attracted to him for those reasons, but that's only because there are no OTHER reasons. She's something of a blank slate. I think the actress pulls off vague mystery well and so I enjoy her scenes, but I don't suspect the show will give us much of her beyond simply being a motivation for Fisk.
Well, from the dinner scenes and from her performance, mainly. I don't know if it's ever stated on the dialogue, but she's not bothered by the fact that she's a mobster and she wants to stand next to him in his new political career even if it costs her her life. In the scene where they're watching the explosions from the window she also seems fully supportive. In fact, I think that's the specific point in the TV series that sets her apart from her comic book counterpart.

I think the Fisk/Vanessa and Murdock/Stick relationships are the highlights of the show so far. Everything Foggy and Karen related I don't like nearly as much.

Morris Schæffer
08-22-2015, 09:47 PM
Brilliant, blown away, flabbergasted by the whole of it. It's exactly how I want my superhero stories. Realistically violent, rooted in reality, with kickass (but vulnerable heroes), villains that are actually menacing and terrifying, coherent action scenes (fight scenes rock not only because of how they're shot, but because they made me wince a few times). I love some of the peripheral characters such as Ben Urich and how that becomes a powerful story within the story and christ D'Onofrio! Seems like a completely different person from the one I saw this summer in Jurassic World. Got some Colonel Kurtz vibes from him. Is that weird?

edit: Incidentally, Matt's powers are curious to me. Can someone who's knowledgeable explain how he perceives the world? I mean, he's obviously blind, but is he able to perform extraordinary feats because of his heightened senses or does he in fact see...something? Shapes, contours whatever. Of all the superheroes out there, there's a small part of me which thinks this one's powers are the most ludicrous. Think about it. If Superman was blind, he'd fly right into objects and structures all the time regardless of how strong he is.

Milky Joe
01-13-2016, 09:03 AM
Brilliant, blown away, flabbergasted by the whole of it. It's exactly how I want my superhero stories. Realistically violent, rooted in reality, with kickass (but vulnerable heroes), villains that are actually menacing and terrifying, coherent action scenes (fight scenes rock not only because of how they're shot, but because they made me wince a few times). I love some of the peripheral characters such as Ben Urich and how that becomes a powerful story within the story and christ D'Onofrio! Seems like a completely different person from the one I saw this summer in Jurassic World. Got some Colonel Kurtz vibes from him. Is that weird?

Not at all. He's like Colonel Kurtz meets Gomer Pyle. Just an incredible performance. I was similarly stunned by the quality of this show. They did an incredible job making these characters complex and more than just 'comic book' good and evil. It's a cliche to do the 'shades of grey' thing but they pulled it off brilliantly. The amount of sympathy they get you to feel for Fisk is amazing, even though he decapitated a guy with his car door.

Eagerly await season 2. Marvel is just killing it.