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View Full Version : The Raid 2 (Evans)



Winston*
03-31-2014, 10:25 AM
http://timsfilmreviews.files.wordpres s.com/2014/01/the-raid-2-poster.jpg

IMDB (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2265171/)

Winston*
03-31-2014, 10:26 AM
This movie is bonkers.

number8
04-01-2014, 04:20 AM
Yeah. I don't think I've flinched so much at sharp objects being swung around since The Blade. It's not as relentlessly nonstop as the first one, but you can see that as a plus or a con depending on how you prefer your action movies structured.

That prison yard scrap is just outrageous.

number8
04-02-2014, 04:52 PM
It is interesting to hear feedback on how the level of uncomfortable violence in this is preventing a lot of folks from fully enjoying the fight scenes. Unlike the first film, in which the gore were mostly over-the-top money shots, the fights in this keep interrupting your appreciation of the choreography by inserting little moments of realistic reaction to pain that really make you wince. Rama dragging that one gangster's leg through the broken window in the car chase and ripping it open is one that sticks with me, but I'm sure everyone has their own pet cringes. I think there's an interesting discussion on how cinematic violence is controlled there, by comparing the two Raids.

Stay Puft
04-02-2014, 06:22 PM
I'm looking forward to catching this (opens here next week, I think?) but I'm still worried about the violence. I saw the Hammer Girl fight scene as a sneak peek bonus for fans at TIFF last year, and I thought it was a decent fight scene but Evans is just so clumsy when it comes to gore. It would have played just fine without (maybe better). That was probably my biggest complaint about the first film, too. The special effects are bad and it's so tasteless. But if the violence is treated with more respect, and less like "money shots" in the first film as 8 says, maybe I can handle it.

Grouchy
04-06-2014, 06:08 PM
This was just incredible and relentless. It's a film that leaves you physically exhausted.

I didn't have a problem with the gore and I don't think the special effects are bad at all. It certainly didn't look ridiculous and it made every fight scene more intense.

Mal
04-12-2014, 11:49 PM
This was just incredible and relentless. It's a film that leaves you physically exhausted.

I didn't have a problem with the gore and I don't think the special effects are bad at all. It certainly didn't look ridiculous and it made every fight scene more intense.
This. Incredible is the word I was left with afterwards. I liked it more than the first film, there's a decent polish this time around with the filmmaking.

Acapelli
04-14-2014, 03:03 AM
the prison yard fight is basically a live-action version of superjail

Dukefrukem
04-14-2014, 12:28 PM
the prison yard fight is basically a live-action version of superjail

:eek:

Stay Puft
04-15-2014, 06:35 PM
I think I prefer the first one, but this is still pretty damn good. Evans seems to be shooting tighter, cutting faster and shaking the camera more with each successive film, though, so I'm hoping this is about as far as he takes it. Like okay the kitchen fight is still good but I honestly prefer the assassination sequence earlier in the film, as there's one incredible unbroken shot of Rama and the knife guy that's much more impressive than any of the quick shots in the finale (which also suffers the same problem of the finale in the first film, as it goes on for too long and starts to feel repetitive).

And yeah the violence wasn't really a problem for me. It's not that graphic and the special effects are used sparingly, with only a couple sequences that I can recall that bothered me (one of a guy getting his throat repeatedly stabbed, which was unnecessary and looked bad, and then the shotgun scene at the end, which again struck me as tasteless). For the most part though yeah the choreography and effects were all solid, and focused less on pandering money shots, so that was good.

Also, the Hammer Girl scene on the subway looked like it may have been cut tighter than in the preview (or anyways it looked better than I remembered) but I didn't expect it to be intercut with two other scenes, so that was actually sort of disappointing. I didn't think the intercutting was particularly interesting, and detracted from the choreography if anything. Also thought the baseball execution in this sequence was dumb. Tonally, there are a few things like this that feel like they've been mashed together from different films. I appreciate a lot of the details and side characters Evans builds up here to flesh out the universe, but it also felt a bit inconsistent and could have been tighter. For the content the film offers, I don't feel the running time was entirely justified.

Rowland
04-21-2014, 11:08 PM
The too-muchness really works here I think, and is thematically appropriate as well. I like the original, but this is an improvement in my estimation.

Winston*
07-16-2014, 07:48 AM
http://i.imgur.com/v604GpS.gif

Lunacy.

Lazlo
07-16-2014, 04:05 PM
I love it. Such a low tech move and we've seen similar shots that involve two or three shots being composited together. Nah, just dress a dude as the car seat.

Henry Gale
07-16-2014, 06:57 PM
Gonna have to re-watch this now that it's out for home. I guess I never said anything about this, but when I saw it in theatres I was just coming off a shift at work on little sleep (I'm assuming), so at a certain point the movie just became a two and a half hour game of being able to keep myself awake.

Oddly, the long-winded dialogue scenes kept me alert, maybe because the tension of action breaking out at any moment loomed, but once the insane fighting (or the car chase scene above) erupted late into the movie, I was somehow more relaxed and delighted... and dozed off accordingly.

Dukefrukem
07-22-2014, 03:02 AM
A little too long but damn, best car chase ever?

TGM
07-22-2014, 03:20 AM
A little too long but damn, best car chase ever?

Hell, it's up there.

Spun Lepton
07-25-2014, 04:54 PM
The car chase is easily one of the highlights of the movie. But, yeah, a little overlong for its own good.

Scar
07-26-2014, 09:41 PM
Suppose I should check this out.

number8
08-16-2014, 10:46 PM
I watched it again, and that tracking shot that opens the prison yard fight is longer than I remembered it. Very impressive. That whole scene is just insane.

Sven
08-17-2014, 03:51 AM
Sadly thought this was too bloated and sadistic. Still jaw-dropping in the ballistics/choreography department, esp. the climactic martial arts sequence, which not only surpasses the limp noodle of the first film's tryst, but ends up being one of the great tet-a-tets in modern memory. But I can't help but fault the film for its unnecessary 150 min runtime (there was SO much padding) and brutal gratuity (bat left in guy's face... come on...)

As a series of setpieces exploring conceptual integrity of action and choreographed filmspace, this is a fantastic textbook, maybe one of the best. As a recommendable piece of story/drama, I'm less confident.

Bosco B Thug
08-21-2014, 10:28 PM
Think the first film is intolerable, so I reacted much better to this one. Car chase, kitchen fight, incredible. Ending incredible, with its melancholy suggestion of never-ending fight.

megladon8
03-11-2015, 04:15 AM
Ordered a copy of this off Amazon. Came absolutely smashed to hell - looks like it's been through both movies!

At least I should have a replacement copy for my days off later in the week.

megladon8
03-13-2015, 02:49 AM
I did not like this very much.

It's beyond overlong. No reason at all this had to be the length of a LOTR film. It becomes a convoluted mess and is a complete bore at times.

It's also the first time I can ever remember feeling revulsion towards an action movie's violence. It felt like someone crafted fight scene "money shots" taking inspiration from a 4chan death thread. Some truly disgusting and unpleasant stuff on display here.

I wasn't even particularly wow'd by the action until the kitchen fight, mainly because the action was so crippled by an inability to write it properly to propel the plot without it seeming artificial. Why does Rama continually fight enormous groups of men who only come at him one at a time? Honestly it could be forgiven...until Evans remember that the plot needs to move forward, and THEN they all swarm him to end the confrontation. Why did they not attack him all together in the first place?

Similarly people are invincible when they need to be, and breakable rag dolls when they need to be. During the kitchen fight Rama receives some nasty gashes and stabs, one in particular on the back of his leg. Yet he continues to run, kick and jump like normal, until suddenly he can't lift his leg for another kick in order to build tension. He gets hit a few times, then he's back to kicking like that leg is untouched. This type of stuff happens in just about every fight in the movie.

I realize it's unfair of me to make these complaints when I've certainly been unbothered by this kind of stuff in other movies, but man, this stuff just drove me nuts here.

A mess, with a few occasional glimpses of great choreography and editing.

transmogrifier
07-23-2015, 12:58 PM
Interesting movie. A lot to think about, and I'm not sure whether the film-maker intended it or not. Doesn't matter, it's there.

So.....choreography: great. Camerawork and inventiveness of: great. Pacing of individual scenes: great.
Also...characterization: so-so. Plot: serviceable. Acting: meh. The fact that the "many people vs. one superhuman" gets a little tiring after a while just in terms of sheer familiarity: yes.

Theme and subtext: geez. There's the rub. This is violent, and the violence doesn't relent. There is no discernible shading in the violence either - the hero being as brutal as anyone else. And the violence is not just a kiss-off at the end as a cap to a particular fight - it crops up throughout, meaning as a viewer (at least, this viewer) you are always a little on edge, because brutal shit can happen at any time. The violence gets so ridiculous at times that it doesn't mesh with the otherwise realistic-ish seriousness of the rest of the movie, and it becomes off-putting, you can't really get a handle on it, and it bugs you, needles at you. Can't I just enjoy the intricate choreography of someone being smashed in the face without worrying that the fist will come out the back of their head (btw, this doesn't happen, but I wouldn't have been surprised).

But I wonder, was that the point? Is this a sneaky treatise on the power of screen violence, on how it can be used to entertain, hurt, bewilder, or upset the audience, and oftentimes we never really see the button-pushing that goes on behind it, the way it is an easy method of garnering a reaction. Here, Evans is mashing all the buttons at once, and (judging from the reviews) audiences are noticing and responding to the actual implementation of violence in the film, reflecting on its use. I like that. I don't know if it was intentional, but I like it. I also found it darkly humorous that all this intricate plotting and subterfuge on the part of all the various interests in this movie amounts to zero in the face of just relentless violence.

I found the first film to be entertaining, but a little tedious in its limited scope (and I hate the idea of two good guys against one bad guys in a climatic fight - it just doesn't seem fair). This film I found entertaining, a little tedious, but also extremely fascinating in its use of violence. One thing I find interesting is that (in my opinion) The Raid 2 is really not all that different in terms of style of entertainment than Mad Max: Fury Road - a lot of practical effects, graceful, kinetic camerawork, non-stop carnage, a certain single-mindedness and purity of vision, but the latter has been embraced and exalted by the critical community as some kind of work of genius while the former has been very divisive and has received some vitriolic reviews. I don't get that. MM:FR is far less plotty and is obviously shorter - is that the only reason why?

Grouchy
07-23-2015, 02:56 PM
Well, I loved the hell out of both, so I guess I'm coherent.

number8
07-23-2015, 05:16 PM
One thing I find interesting is that (in my opinion) The Raid 2 is really not all that different in terms of style of entertainment than Mad Max: Fury Road - a lot of practical effects, graceful, kinetic camerawork, non-stop carnage, a certain single-mindedness and purity of vision, but the latter has been embraced and exalted by the critical community as some kind of work of genius while the former has been very divisive and has received some vitriolic reviews. I don't get that. MM:FR is far less plotty and is obviously shorter - is that the only reason why?

I don't know what would have inspired the vitriol, but one thing that makes Fury Road a masterpiece while this is just a crazy action movie, I believe, is the use of the carnage in the storytelling. This movie is long because when the carnage starts, the narrative stops. You're purely watching the car chases and fight scenes for the thrills, and then when it's over, we have dialogue scenes that advance the relationships of the characters until the part where they engage in mayhem again. In Fury Road, what many of the glowing reviews are praising is the way it advances the relationships of the characters using the car chases and fight scenes. It comes down to pure visual spectacle versus visual storytelling.

Peng
07-23-2015, 09:01 PM
Yeah, I liked The Raid 2, but the action is very single-minded; I feel like the whole film stops for its fight scenes. Meanwhile, Fury Road's story and characters feel much more ingrained into its action scenes, like how Max is trying to free himself during the first car chase, how his fight with Furiosa establishes her as someone to be reckoned with, how their trust in each other keeps being more quietly pronounced when they're fending off enemies together, etc. For me, The Raid 2 inspires "isn't that wicked/cool/too-violent-maybe/impressive!?", while Fury Road involves me deeply in its characters' plight. I enjoy the former's technical precision, while the latter is that, and more as well -- it can get me a little emotional during the action scenes. I was really taken aback and much more awed by how the film can manage that while rarely slowing down its action.

Skitch
11-29-2015, 02:53 PM
All my love for this story is for the incredible martial arts, action, and violence. Fuck this plot to death. Completely needlessly over-complicated. Its Hard Boiled meets Ricki-Oh.