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Lazlo
01-14-2014, 04:14 AM
http://images.starpulse.com/news/bloggers/6/blog_images/true-detective-1.jpg

Lazlo
01-14-2014, 04:16 AM
Say what you will about TV murder fatigue, but this was pretty top notch. McConaughey's philosophizing was a little silly, but I enjoyed it. The leads are great. Fukunaga's on his game. Mystery is suitably creepy. Looking forward to what goes on between Harrelson and McConaughey's characters.

Unexpected Clarke Peters appearance FTW.

number8
01-14-2014, 12:36 PM
Yeah, strongest pilot I can remember in a while. It's so thickly gothic and immediately fascinating.

I hope more networks get into this anthology miniseries business.

Raiders
01-14-2014, 12:52 PM
It's a shade too on-the-nose and pointed in its dialogue, but with Fukunaga directing all the episodes, the splendid atmosphere and genre trappings should easily overcome and it can never hurt to have McConaughey and Harrelson as your two leads. A little disappointing that the inevitable second season will have neither on board (most likely anyway).

number8
01-14-2014, 04:10 PM
They are producers on the show. I'm hoping they do the American Horror Story thing and just give them different characters, even if supporting.

I like how they're already using McConaughey's philosophizing for humor. The look Woody gave him after he said, "I don't sleep, I dream" was great.

Lucky
01-14-2014, 10:10 PM
I'm going to have to bump this up on my watch list.

Sxottlan
01-15-2014, 09:09 AM
Very good first episode. Love the atmosphere. I'm in.

Didn't know it was an anthology series until today. That does explain why these two movie stars would suddenly go to a TV series. I like what American Horror Story has started.

Henry Gale
01-17-2014, 03:29 AM
My biggest issue with that first episode is that I don't have the remaining seven right now to binge like I haven't with a show in a long time.

So strong. Really connected in a way I didn't quite expect. Even things like McConaughey's morbid life philosophizing managed to feel genuinely compelling and loopy all at once. Loved the faded town bit too (but it wouldn't work without the visual, which luckily television is such a medium).

Mara
01-18-2014, 01:14 AM
Yes, this was really strong. Already feels like a slow burn after one episode.

Mara
01-18-2014, 12:06 PM
So now I'm reading through reviews and there's a scene where I thought it was telegraphed that there was something inappropriate going on between Hart and the lady that brought over files. None of the reviews mentioned it. Anyone else see that or was it in my head?

Acapelli
01-19-2014, 02:59 AM
So now I'm reading through reviews and there's a scene where I thought it was telegraphed that there was something inappropriate going on between Hart and the lady that brought over files. None of the reviews mentioned it. Anyone else see that or was it in my head?
not just you. seemed pretty clear to me

Irish
01-19-2014, 03:40 AM
Liked this a great deal. I'm hoping it becomes more Homicide: Life on the Streets and a little less Criminal Minds (getting really tired of stories about fucked up, out there, methodical serial killer types).

Was a little surprised they seemed to borrow imagery wholesale from the first season of Hannibal.

Mara: Not just you. Painfully obvious that Harrelson's character is having an affair with the file girl.

Mara
01-19-2014, 05:05 PM
Was a little surprised they seemed to borrow imagery wholesale from the first season of Hannibal.


Yeah. It sort of takes the suspense out when you totally know it was that dude from Hannibal.

Irish
01-19-2014, 09:52 PM
Yeah. It sort of takes the suspense out when you totally know it was that dude from Hannibal.

This was a dumb comment, even for you.

Mara
01-19-2014, 09:54 PM
This was a dumb comment, even for you.

I was... joking?

Do I make a lot of dumb comments?

Mara
01-19-2014, 10:05 PM
After ten minutes of reflection I'm pretty sure I don't deserve that.

Henry Gale
01-20-2014, 01:55 AM
After ten minutes of reflection I'm pretty sure I don't deserve that.

Well maybe it's just selfish of you to assume Irish should be able to know when something is a joke! I mean, even if some might say your post is clearly written like one and is funny with it's words and ideas, blah blah - boring. It's still written in the same type of text as things that are not jokes! This can be confusing!

Boiiiiiiiiing splat........ farrrrrrrrrt
(For you "readers": Someone was hurled through the air, hit the ground, then farted!!!!!!)

There you have it, Match-Cut's first joke. Take notes, people. ^

Lazlo
01-20-2014, 04:10 AM
After ten minutes of reflection I'm pretty sure I don't deserve that.

Nope, pretty fucking mean, even for Irish's standards. Though not the first time he's missed out on a joke or sarcasm in the past 24 hours.

Also, this episode was good. Liked getting to know more about Cole and the ending was creeptastic.

The burned out church was a very, very cool set.

Winston*
01-21-2014, 08:05 AM
This was a dumb comment, even for you.

You really should apologise for this. Don't understand how you could think it was acceptable.

Winston*
01-21-2014, 08:06 AM
Enjoying this show.

Irish
01-21-2014, 09:25 AM
You really should apologise for this. Don't understand how you could think it was acceptable.

What, that? I was totally joking.

:|

Lazlo
01-21-2014, 12:55 PM
What, that? I was totally joking.

:|

Hard to see it as anything but just plain mean.

Winston*
01-21-2014, 06:26 PM
What, that? I was totally joking.

:|

I don't get it.

Mara
01-21-2014, 06:28 PM
The burned out church was a very, very cool set.

Agreed. This was the episode that had me googling to figure out where it was shot-- apparently, in South Louisiana, exactly where it is set. I guess I tend to picture Louisiana as being more swampy, with lots of trees and overgrowth. This town is so desolate, with those huge stretches of nothing, and the boarded-up shopping complex from last week, which read add to that feeling of emptiness.

Irish
01-21-2014, 07:54 PM
Hard to see it as anything but just plain mean.

I don't get it.

Huh. Imagine that.

Raiders
01-21-2014, 08:12 PM
I see what you did there. You continued to be a dick to make a point without actually making any point whatsoever (y'know, since Mara was just being silly and you were an ass). Good job.

Anyway, second episode continued the path of the first. Good show. I won't pretend to be above ranking this episode above the first thanks to Alexandra Daddario's surprising scene. There are advantages to HBO's desire to make every series earn its MA rating.

Irish
01-21-2014, 08:36 PM
I see what you did there. You continued to be a dick to make a point without actually making any point whatsoever (y'know, since Mara was just being silly and you were an ass). Good job.

The fact that you've said anything about this at all makes you a massive hypocrite.

To remain on topic: I enjoyed the hell out of the second episode, but recently Jessica Valentin said this: "So far the female characters on True Detective are murder victims, prostitutes, nagging wives, hot mistresses or sassy secretaries."

She's right, and looking back on it, it bugs me.

number8
01-28-2014, 04:02 AM
Man I can listen to McConaughey monologue all day. Great 3rd ep. I love how the serial killer investigation keeps getting less screen time with each episode.

Ezee E
01-28-2014, 07:19 AM
All caught up. Some of the monologue stuff is going above my head, but I'm completely involved in this. I thought I'd catch up on Game of Thrones first, but I'm struggling through the second season, and this is way down my alley.

What a great way to end that third episode, with the question that Harrelson brings up, on top of that final image.... Damn.

Ezee E
01-28-2014, 07:27 AM
How long until a top-notch director goes to do something like this? Soderbergh has already said he'll never do a feature-length movie again, just HBO (or something along those lines). Fukunaga is basically displaying Fincher-like aptitude here.

Irish
01-28-2014, 07:42 AM
I enjoyed parts of the third episode.

Thought the religion-tent monologue was a little too facile, though, compared to the other things Rust has said.

The dialogue still pops, the characters strong, the interactions enjoyable but it felt like they were spinning their wheels a bit. Like he show is starting to eat itself. I wonder if hey have enough story for 8 episodes.

Otoh. Worst part is we gotta wait 2 weeks for this to come back. Goddamn Super Bowl.

number8
01-28-2014, 02:49 PM
How long until a top-notch director goes to do something like this? Soderbergh has already said he'll never do a feature-length movie again, just HBO (or something along those lines). Fukunaga is basically displaying Fincher-like aptitude here.

Jane Campion. Top of the Lake.

slqrick
01-28-2014, 06:31 PM
Really great stuff. Strong episode for Harrelson this week.

Ezee E
01-29-2014, 01:13 AM
Jane Campion. Top of the Lake.

Good call. I've watched the first episode and forgot about it. Not the show's fault, I've been meaning to get back to it.

Mildred Pierce by Todd Haynes could probably be considered as well.

Mara
01-29-2014, 11:29 PM
Caught up. I wasn't expecting this show to rely so heavily on religion-- or, maybe more accurately, warring personal philosophies and individual hypocrisies.

Marty is not a stable person.

IMO Top of the Lake is unmissable-- a fantastic, elegiac piece that stretches the medium.

Boy howdy, did I not like Mildred Pierce, though.

Lazlo
02-10-2014, 04:12 AM
Was a bit down on this episode (too much Marty marriage drama) but then Rust put on the jacket and it kicked in, and then...

that fucking shot. Holy crap. Never seen anything like that from a TV show before. Would be jawdropping in a movie. Just stunning work.

Winston*
02-10-2014, 07:06 AM
The production values of this show are going to ruin all other shows for me.

Russ
02-10-2014, 09:30 PM
that fucking shot. Holy crap. Never seen anything like that from a TV show before. Would be jawdropping in a movie. Just stunning work.
Here's how they did it. (http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1722001/true-detective-long-take.jhtml)

[ETM]
02-10-2014, 09:36 PM
Boy howdy, did I not like Mildred Pierce, though.

It goes from impressive o completely unbearable really fast that one.

Raiders
02-10-2014, 10:29 PM
Then there's me who considers Mildred Pierce among the best TV/film creations of the past few years.

This show here is one that could be maybe more effective as a shorter miniseries or even single film. Gorgeously created, but not sure the narrative has really held up. The characters are great though and I could see it building up and paying off splendidly.

number8
02-11-2014, 02:04 AM
Okay, okay, that shot, yes, awesome. But that aside, I'm loving just how many different flavors this show is giving us. It started like it was going to be a David Fincher style creepy procedural, then it got weird and philosophical in the second episode, then a straight-faced domestic drama in the third episode, and now we got a whopper of a suspense-thriller episode. Fuck, this show is fun.

Ezee E
02-11-2014, 05:55 AM
Holy moly. That was great.

Ezee E
02-11-2014, 06:10 AM
Shoot, I was hooked on the edge of my sheet the second they left the hospital. I want to watch it again.

Gittes
02-11-2014, 02:51 PM
Pretty incredible.

I don't mean to be the bearer of negativity, but I noticed some people on a different forum discussing the dubious way that Marty immediately made it just on time to the location that Rust provided. I'll quote an example of this criticism that someone wrote up (it's the last bullet point I'm talking about, as I don't think the other aspects he discusses are genuinely problematic):


- The guy did at least 5 lines of coke
- Agreed to take a bunch of white bikers dressed up as cops to rob a black projects
- He gets apprehended by two black guys and disarms both of them, one with a bat - then is able to apprehend and basically escort/carry a biker through 1 house, 2 blocks, and over a fence
- Had the wherewithal to scope out the numbered addresses of a neighborhood he had never been to at night, called his partner to be at a location that he did not know will be safe in 90s when he could have been anywhere - and both of them triangulated perfectly to the perfect location at the exact same time

I'm curious to see if anyone can argue against this. The finale of the episode is a fairly remarkable piece of virtuoso filmmaking, to be sure, but does it culminate in a bit of narrative contrivance?

number8
02-11-2014, 02:56 PM
Rust did know the location. They had that discussion at Ginger's house. They asked him if he knows where the projects they're talking about is. And they did not triangulate the exact location to meet. Rust gave Marty the address of the house he had to abandon because Ginger ran out. He then took Ginger to the main road outside the housing complex, where Marty passed. That he arrived just in the nick of time is a coincidence, but them finding each other isn't a stretch at all.

Gittes
02-11-2014, 03:31 PM
Yeah, it still seems a little convenient that Marty was able to make it to the projects so quickly, given that he had no idea where Rust was going to be before that phone call. I suppose we have to assume that Marty didn't stray too far from the biker bar when he drove off and that the projects also happened to be relatively close to the bar.

The fact that Rust had to improvise and ended up meeting up with Marty at an area other than their proposed meeting spot (and right on time, no less) still seems a bit too tidy.

This ultimately isn't a terribly big deal, though, especially given how enormously compelling and fascinating this show is. The finale is still among the most striking visual feats I've seen on television, and the fact that it is a genuine oner is pretty remarkable.

slqrick
02-11-2014, 03:37 PM
The killer's gotta be Lester Freamon.

Mara
02-11-2014, 05:17 PM
"You're like the Michael Jordan of being a sonovabitch."

Catching up.

Mara
02-11-2014, 06:51 PM
That was... intense.

number8
02-11-2014, 08:06 PM
That was... intense.

Easy... Easy.

Mara
02-11-2014, 10:40 PM
Easy... Easy.

I WON'T EASY AND YOU CAN'T MAKE ME.

Ezee E
02-12-2014, 01:17 AM
I thought they knew the location, and Rust had even worked on that location in the past, didn't he?

I do have a small issue with the massive amount of drugs he took, and being able to take down those two men, but when all that happens, you sober up pretty damn quickly. He also seemed to be a ghost in a neighborhood where seemingly everyone was outside.

Sxottlan
02-12-2014, 09:52 AM
Just watched this tonight. Unbelievable how Fukunaga put this together so quickly. I love how this went all GTA on us. I was thinking of picking up this season on blu-ray when it comes out. This guarantees it.

Here is the shot:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bq837PY8ZA

number8
02-12-2014, 02:48 PM
The Wu-Tang beat really added to the scene.

Henry Gale
02-13-2014, 08:37 PM
Holy shiiiit. Watched the last three episodes back-to-back last night, and even though I'd already heard about the 6½-minute take, I was still blown away by it in such a visceral, one-of-a-kind way, more than anything I've seen from TV in a long time.

I mean, half of my mind was properly going "Oh my god, how is Rust possibly going to push through all of this?" and the other portion was jumping out of my head yelling "How are Fukunaga and his team DOING this?!", and it was exhilarating.

I was even pretty sure there might have been two cheats to keep the take appearing seamless, but then I read the MTV article that said they used those exact moments as "outs" to edit in other takes if they needed to, but ultimately didn't. Wooww.

Those first two hours and fifty-three minutes of the episodes had some pretty standout stuff too, but for the show to put that as the last thing in my head, it's going to be the only thing there 'til Sunday.

Lucky
02-14-2014, 09:21 PM
Ahh all the raving and I still haven't found time to watch this yet. Need to give my television priorities a reevaluation.

Acapelli
02-17-2014, 05:09 AM
ugh i don't know if i'm going to be able to fall asleep tonight

"I saw you in a dream. You're in Carcosa now with me."

Ezee E
02-17-2014, 07:31 AM
Some of that went over my head as to what's going on. But I'm so intrigued that I can't wait to watch it again.

Qrazy
02-17-2014, 09:41 AM
Some of that went over my head as to what's going on. But I'm so intrigued that I can't wait to watch it again.

What didn't you follow?

Mara
02-17-2014, 09:56 PM
Here is a great piece on the literary allusion in the show:

http://io9.com/the-one-literary-reference-you-must-know-to-appreciate-1523076497

Ezee E
02-17-2014, 11:28 PM
Here is a great piece on the literary allusion in the show:

http://io9.com/the-one-literary-reference-you-must-know-to-appreciate-1523076497

This is what I needed. Thanks.

By the way, I spoke to a Reggie from a Missouri store I'll manage. He's from Ledoux, Missouri.

Eek!

number8
02-18-2014, 01:25 AM
That abandoned building was creepy as shit.

Qrazy
02-18-2014, 01:50 AM
It's definitely not going to go into the realm of the supernatural but I could see it going into the realm of the occult with Lester Freamon leading some satan worship shit with a bunch of eyes wide shut hood wearing lunatics at his beck and call.

number8
02-18-2014, 01:52 AM
Yeah, it still seems a little convenient that Marty was able to make it to the projects so quickly, given that he had no idea where Rust was going to be before that phone call. I suppose we have to assume that Marty didn't stray too far from the biker bar when he drove off and that the projects also happened to be relatively close to the bar.


I thought they knew the location, and Rust had even worked on that location in the past, didn't he?

By the way, I rewatched Ep 4 before starting Ep 5 and here's what happened if anyone still cares:

Rust told Marty that he's been posing as Crash in Beaumont for a week, and he's finally managed to set up a meet at the biker bar outside the city with Ginger that night. Rust told him to not lose sight of him, and to also monitor the local police band just in case.

When Marty saw Rust leaving on a boat with Ginger, he didn't know where they were going, so he just drove to Beaumont, which he knew where Ginger's from, parked in a lot and sat in the car listening to the police band. The shot cuts from this to the chopper in the air monitoring the projects, making it clear that Marty's listening to the chopper's broadcast. Now when the shooting started, the chopper called it in, and presumably Marty heard it and decided to go check it out as per Rust's instructions.

Meanwhile, Rust found out that he's going to the projects, which he'd been to before and knew that it's a gated area with only one way in and out (hence his concern about the plan). When he called Marty to get there in 90 seconds, he didn't tell Marty where he was (I was wrong on that in my last post). He just told him to go where the gate's entrance was. We saw that that's exactly where he was heading, because he passed the police cars coming in.

number8
02-18-2014, 02:16 AM
Here's a good quote from Pizzolatto:


"I’ve enjoyed reading people theorize about what’s going to happen because it’s a sign that you’re connecting. But I’m also sort of surprised by how far afield they’re getting. Like, why do you think we’re tricking you? It’s because you’ve been abused as an audience for more than 20 years. The show’s not trying to outsmart you. And really if you pay attention… if someone watches the first episode and really listens, it tells you 85 percent of the story of the first six episodes."

I do think that this isn't the right show to be treating like a clever whodunnit. I always get the feeling that it's being very straightforward about the narrative. They're clearly way more interested in the Rust/Marty relationship than the murders.

Ezee E
02-18-2014, 02:24 AM
Here's a good quote from Pizzolatto:



I do think that this isn't the right show to be treating like a clever whodunnit. I always get the feeling that it's being very straightforward about the narrative. They're clearly way more interested in the Rust/Marty relationship than the murders.

Yeah, I certainly don't really care WHO did the murders. I'm very much concerned at how the detectives will figure it all out.

Now the whole analyzation of how an 1890s book is involved, well, that's just an awesome extra.

Qrazy
02-18-2014, 02:46 AM
Here's a good quote from Pizzolatto:



I do think that this isn't the right show to be treating like a clever whodunnit. I always get the feeling that it's being very straightforward about the narrative. They're clearly way more interested in the Rust/Marty relationship than the murders.

SPOILERS

I don't see how. If it were being straight forward then the guy in the compound would have been the killer. Also the story is about a murder that remained unsolved for 17 years so clearly there's something going on. I don't think it's going to go Shyamalan on us with a twist ending but clearly it's not just Point A to Point B. There are plot reveals.

My guess is it's going to be somewhat similar to how Top of the Lake plays out.

number8
02-18-2014, 03:08 AM
I don't see how. If it were being straight forward then the guy in the compound would have been the killer.

Well, no, because we found out in the first ep that they probably got the wrong guy. Of course there are plot reveals, but it's being straightforward in that it doesn't seem to be presenting us any misdirections or red herrings, which is what Pizzolatto's saying.

Qrazy
02-18-2014, 04:00 AM
Well, no, because we found out in the first ep that they probably got the wrong guy. Of course there are plot reveals, but it's being straightforward in that it doesn't seem to be presenting us any misdirections or red herrings, which is what Pizzolatto's saying.

So McConaughey's character did it then? Because that's the direction some of the characters have been pushing in.

Henry Gale
02-18-2014, 08:41 AM
So McConaughey's character did it then? Because that's the direction some of the characters have been pushing in.

I might just be speaking for myself here, and it may seem like a much easier idea to throw out considering what happened in the newest episode, but hasn't this been something the show has planted in the viewer's mind since the ending of the first episode?

Not to say it should all be as much of a cut and dry, pull-the-rug-from-under-you sort of reversal as that, but keeping the possibility of the unsuspecting yet in-plain-sight possibility as the ultimate key to the main crux of things that makes the most sense and as well as the most unsettling is sort of the tone this entire series seems to operate on.

Episode 5 was almost dizzyingly haunting at times. Is T-Bone Burnett actually doing the score or just selecting the pre-existing pieces? Because if this is all him, then wow. As if I thought he couldn't seem any more talented, this equally bone-chilling and gorgeous music spills out of him.

ThePlashyBubbler
02-18-2014, 12:39 PM
This thing has really been masterfully constructed so far.

Even just how after five episodes of monologuing you finally understand that Cohle has just been blowing smoke at the 2012 detectives in order to learn what they have on the new murder (complete with asking for beer in episode one so his testimony would be inadmissible). That slow evolution of characters intent and motivation has been thrilling to watch, and while by no means do I think Cohle is responsible for the murders we've seen, I have a feeling his agenda is going to be more complex than merely tracking down those he thinks are responsible (Tuttle?).

ThePlashyBubbler
02-18-2014, 12:46 PM
I also have a feeling that Cohle and Hart's "fallout" in 2002 may turn out to be as fabricated as their story about the gunfight. If Cohle is off the grid working on collecting evidence against the yellow king / whatever cult element is really behind the murders, I wouldn't completely rule out Hart being subtly involved somehow and not wanting it publicized for the sake of appearances. Then again, something does have to break up Hart's marriage (no ring in 2012) at some point, so maybe I'm wrong and that's part of the same 2002 disturbance that separates the pair of detectives as well.

number8
02-18-2014, 05:56 PM
I love this: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/16/true-detective-episode-5-review-the-secret-fate-of-all-life-is-the-best-episode-yet.html

Acapelli
02-19-2014, 01:45 AM
Not sure how you could possibly think cohle is responsible for the killings, especially after the end of the most recent episode

Ezee E
02-19-2014, 05:30 AM
Not sure how you could possibly think cohle is responsible for the killings, especially after the end of the most recent episode

To me, it would make sense if you look at it from the first episode only, and even from the side of the cops that get to hear him wax philosophy. But with everything we've seen from 1-5, it certainly doesn't seem the case.

Ezee E
02-19-2014, 06:16 AM
Oh man, the next episode is titled, Haunted Houses. This show might be the closest thing to giving me nightmares.

Sxottlan
02-19-2014, 06:59 AM
I also have a feeling that Cohle and Hart's "fallout" in 2002 may turn out to be as fabricated as their story about the gunfight. If Cohle is off the grid working on collecting evidence against the yellow king / whatever cult element is really behind the murders, I wouldn't completely rule out Hart being subtly involved somehow...

I'm starting to lean this way. I'm wondering if Cohle's last ten years have been working the case from the outside. His scenes in interrogation rooms in this show are reminding me of the performances that the detectives would go through in Homicide: Life on the Street.

Gittes
02-22-2014, 03:39 AM
By the way, I rewatched Ep 4 before starting Ep 5 and here's what happened if anyone still cares:

Rust told Marty that he's been posing as Crash in Beaumont for a week, and he's finally managed to set up a meet at the biker bar outside the city with Ginger that night. Rust told him to not lose sight of him, and to also monitor the local police band just in case.

When Marty saw Rust leaving on a boat with Ginger, he didn't know where they were going, so he just drove to Beaumont, which he knew where Ginger's from, parked in a lot and sat in the car listening to the police band. The shot cuts from this to the chopper in the air monitoring the projects, making it clear that Marty's listening to the chopper's broadcast. Now when the shooting started, the chopper called it in, and presumably Marty heard it and decided to go check it out as per Rust's instructions.

Meanwhile, Rust found out that he's going to the projects, which he'd been to before and knew that it's a gated area with only one way in and out (hence his concern about the plan). When he called Marty to get there in 90 seconds, he didn't tell Marty where he was (I was wrong on that in my last post). He just told him to go where the gate's entrance was. We saw that that's exactly where he was heading, because he passed the police cars coming in.

Thanks.

ledfloyd
02-24-2014, 12:20 AM
I binged on this over the weekend. Excellent show.

slqrick
02-24-2014, 03:28 PM
Didn't like this episode as much as the last two, but the comedown was expected. I am starting to agree with articles like this one (http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/television/2014/03/03/140303crte_television_nussbaum ) regarding the females on this show, though.

Dillard
02-24-2014, 05:31 PM
Didn't like this episode as much as the last two, but the comedown was expected. I am starting to agree with articles like this one (http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/television/2014/03/03/140303crte_television_nussbaum ) regarding the females on this show, though.

I agree more with Molly Lambert over @ Grantland. Her take (http://grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/her-looming-shadow-grows-the-women-of-true-detective/) on the women of the show reflects mine: that episode 6 had a real showcasing turn for Michelle Monaghan and that Monaghan nailed it, stealing the spotlight from Rust and Marty for an episode. I loved this episode by the way. It brought the show back down to earth from all the nutty hypothesizing about the Yellow King and flat circles and so on. This show has some of those trappings, but this show is more than a philosophical whodunnit - it's about complex, well-acted, and well-drawn characters and their relation to one another.

Mara
02-24-2014, 05:46 PM
http://www.slate.com/articles/arts/television/2014/02/true_detective_the_women_on_th e_show_are_treated_badly_but_t here_s_a_good.html

Another perspective on TD + women.

slqrick
02-24-2014, 06:00 PM
I agree more with Molly Lambert over @ Grantland. Her take (http://grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/her-looming-shadow-grows-the-women-of-true-detective/) on the women of the show reflects mine: that episode 6 had a real showcasing turn for Michelle Monaghan and that Monaghan nailed it, stealing the spotlight from Rust and Marty for an episode. I loved this episode by the way. It brought the show back down to earth from all the nutty hypothesizing about the Yellow King and flat circles and so on. This show has some of those trappings, but this show is more than a philosophical whodunnit - it's about complex, well-acted, and well-drawn characters and their relation to one another.

I was actually going to add that article into my edit, because you're right, she does make some good points. That being said, I don't see how Monaghan's character has been a complex character, at all. To me, it doesn't feel like much thought is given to Maggie other than being the doormat wife who then lashes out at her husband in a very soap opera-ish manner. I agree that Monaghan hits it out of the park with her scenes in this past episode, but her character hasn't been given any real depth and the show seems more interested in what she can provide for the Rust and Chole's relationship. Doesn't feel like there's a lot of complexity there, even though Monaghan is doing what she can.

At least people aren't proclaiming she's the worst, like they did with Skylar. That's something I guess.

Qrazy
02-24-2014, 09:55 PM
Crime fiction has always been about male-centric worlds with peripheral female characters. There are a few exceptions but very few. This type of neo-noir is also primarily concerned with one or two primary antagonists and not in an Altman-esque examination of the life and times of everyone that populates the world. While it's true that the women are flat so are most of the peripheral male characters. It's a plot driven narrative. So yes, I agree that True Detective doesn't feature women in strong female roles but it's not unexpected that this would be the case. In terms of physical objectification (shots of strippers T&A, sex scenes, etc) this is a larger problem with a great deal of 'adult' media in general (TV/film). Sexual content is thrown in to titillate the viewer on a regular basis. Say what you will about the Hayes code in relation to free speech (it was ultimately a bad thing) but at least it kept things a little classier in the boudoir.

I also have no doubt though that the show will draw out the connection between the fact that our two leads succumbed to their sexual desires and the impulses of the killer(s). That would also be in typical noir fashion.

D_Davis
02-24-2014, 10:58 PM
Wow - this show references The King in Yellow? OK. It now has my interest.

Not only is The King in Yellow the best weird fiction ever written, it also contains my all-time favorite short story, "The Repairer of Reputations." A creepier, more doom-ridden story does not exist. I'm not quite sure how Chambers accomplished what he did with mere words, because after reading the story for the first time I swore there was actually something supernatural about it. I've never felt more hypnotized by printed words - there has to be some kind of weird metaphysical thing going on with the way Chambers structured his prose, because it reaches deep down into the reader's psyche, and utterly chills the soul.

That io9 article basically reads like a list of my favorite things.

Also, The King in Yellow is in public domain, and can be read for free, and "The Repairer of Reputations" kicks off the version they have on Google.

http://books.google.com/books?id=qHgKEqjdy-wC&oe=UTF-8

Milky Joe
02-25-2014, 12:22 AM
Crime fiction has always been about male-centric worlds with peripheral female characters.

Genre is not an excuse. "This is how it's always been done, so we shouldn't expect it to be done any other way." Westerns have also traditionally been about male-centric worlds with peripheral female characters but that didn't stop David Milch from avoiding male-gazey bullshit and crafting a rich tapestry of women (however still beholden to men they are by necessity of the setting) in Deadwood. Same could be said of police procedurals, David Simon, and The Wire. You can have female characters be peripheral without being flat and unbelievable. Of course, in order to do that you have to know how to write human beings and not just fantasist extensions of oneself, which I gather from all this that Nic Pizzolatto doesn't really know how to do. I haven't seen the show though, so I'm just guessing.

Mara
02-25-2014, 01:01 AM
My take (for what it's worth) is that the show is both acknowledging and subverting the trope of the peripheral women. In many ways, the story that it is telling is a story of masculinity-- a story told by men, to men. The show doesn't dwell on the female characters because the men telling the story don't particularly care about the female character's outside lives. When the show subverts that, it's not for the male characters (who never seem to get it) but for the outside audience.

Take Marty-- who considers it his masculine duty and right to get violent when "his" women are compromised. His violent outbursts are when someone sexually violates something that he considers "his." He beats up his girlfriend's date. He beats up his daughter's sex partners. He beats up his wife's lover. He's the Big Man. There's the acknowledgment of the trope.

The subversion of it is more subtle, and it's more for the audience than it is for the characters, who are completely oblivious. In this example: the women in Marty's life loathe him. They're not grateful for his protection. They don't appreciate his defense of them-- it just makes them angrier. His life is filled with women who can't wait to get the hell away from him. Part of Marty's eternal confusion is that he thinks he is doing, over and over again, what good men do. He can't understand why everyone doesn't appreciate that.

Now, it's a fair argument to say that these kind of subversions could be a bigger part of the story. I thought maybe, with this episode, it might change a little because we finally had a woman come in to tell her story. It didn't-- because Maggie is not her husband. Marty loved having men willing to sit and let him talk on and on about his glory days. He was gregarious and acted like a man of wisdom and experience, sharing his insight with younger, less powerful colleagues. He only got angry and left when his own ego was threatened. His wife, though, doesn't put up with that bullshit for one second. She comes in, and instead of telling it how it was, she says, tiredly, "In a former life I used to exhaust myself navigating crude men who thought they were clever. So ask your questions or I'm leaving."

It's rare for the show to come right out and call the men on their crap, but when they do it's pretty good. In the second episode, when Mr. Big Man Savior gives the teenage prostitute Beth some money to have a better life (or, as Rust prophetically calls is, a "down payment") the madam of the area shuts him down hard.

"Such holy bullshit from you. It's a woman's body, ain't it? A woman's choice... Girls walk this earth on the time screwing for free. Why is it you add business to the mix and boys like you can't stand the thought? I'll tell you. It's cause suddenly you don't own it the way you thought you did."

number8
02-25-2014, 01:12 AM
Hah. Mara, you highlighted exactly the two lines I was going to cite.

Qrazy
02-25-2014, 01:22 AM
Genre is not an excuse. "This is how it's always been done, so we shouldn't expect it to be done any other way." Westerns have also traditionally been about male-centric worlds with peripheral female characters but that didn't stop David Milch from avoiding male-gazey bullshit and crafting a rich tapestry of women (however still beholden to men they are by necessity of the setting) in Deadwood. Same could be said of police procedurals, David Simon, and The Wire. You can have female characters be peripheral without being flat and unbelievable. Of course, in order to do that you have to know how to write human beings and not just fantasist extensions of oneself, which I gather from all this that Nic Pizzolatto doesn't really know how to do. I haven't seen the show though, so I'm just guessing.

I don't think I made myself clear. I'm not defending the tradition. I'm saying that it is a problem but it's a problem with crime fiction in general and it seems pointless to me to single out True Detective in this case. The article ought instead to be written about genre and this problem generally.

The Wire avoids the issue up to a point because it's more naturalistic but it still features plenty of gratuitous sex. Sopranos also featured shots of strippers T&A. Deadwood did too. That's why I sought to explain difference between characterization and sexual objectification in my previous post.

Also I don't know why I'm having this conversation given that you haven't even seen the show. The primary female character in True Detective has desires and uses the tools at her disposal to get what she wants as much as any Deadwood character. I hate Deadwood anyway for completely different reasons.

---

My point about the nature of the noir, detective story genre is that as an example replace a female character with any peripheral male role and see if it actually helps empower women at all. I find it typically doesn't because those who aren't protagonists are themselves there to serve the narrative. If a story is fixated upon plot they are typically less focused on character the way say an art drama would be. Let's say we replace the drug dealer Marty beats up for information with a woman or any of the antagonists or etc... You could replace the police captain with a woman or one of the two protagonists but that's about it. The thing about this genre is almost everyone is morally compromised and it's typically a cynical take on how shitty the world is precisely because it's driven by ugly male desires. Women then either become victims or femme fatales.

Top of the Lake did what I suggested as an alternative and made the protagonist a female detective. Women are still portrayed as victims though (even the protagonist) although in that case they are searching for a means by which to escape their victimhood and the ugliness of men.

Barty
02-25-2014, 02:07 AM
Hah. Mara, you highlighted exactly the two lines I was going to cite.

The madam's retort to him was so fucking good. I was literally cheering when watching it.

number8
02-25-2014, 03:32 PM
The domestic drama in this is so well done, though. McConaughey may get all the cool cop scenes that people go crazy for, but Harrelson is getting the juicier character stuff to me. In fact, I think my favorite scene in the episode is Maggie discovering that he's cheating again and then serving Marty spaghetti. Harrelson's complete obliviousness to how much his daughters and his wife don't like him is equally believable and overwhelming in that. My roomies and I all laughed out loud at the "I love you." "Thank you." exchange. What a fucking idiot. And he probably thinks all he did wrong was sleep with another woman. Nevermind that he treats his family like shit.

number8
02-25-2014, 03:37 PM
Fukunaga will not direct Season 2. (http://www.deadline.com/2014/02/fox-preempts-feature-pitch-for-true-detective-helmer-cary-fukunaga/)

I'm okay with this! Get another interesting indie director to bring their visual style, make it different.

number8
02-25-2014, 03:43 PM
The madam's retort to him was so fucking good. I was literally cheering when watching it.

Rust's was even better, actually, because it turned out to be a prophecy.

"That a down payment?"

slqrick
02-25-2014, 03:44 PM
The domestic drama in this is so well done, though. McConaughey may get all the cool cop scenes that people go crazy for, but Harrelson is getting the juicier character stuff to me. In fact, I think my favorite scene in the episode is Maggie discovering that he's cheating again and then serving Marty spaghetti. Harrelson's complete obliviousness to how much his daughters and his wife don't like him is equally believable and overwhelming in that. My roomies and I all laughed out loud at the "I love you." "Thank you." exchange. What a fucking idiot. And he probably thinks all he did wrong was sleep with another woman. Nevermind that he treats his family like shit.

I really liked that scene because it did feel like a corrupt king enjoying his undeserved spoils.

Interesting conversation, you guys have swayed me a bit back to my original position of not buying into the show being purposefully misogynistic. That being said, I think the scene that stuck out to me in the last episode was the scene where Marty's talking to the ex-prostitute on the phone and of course she's in her lingerie and the camera is luridly giving the audience it's fill of HBO T&A. That kind of thing sticks out to me as unnecessary and not really a moment where the show is trying to say anything.

number8
02-25-2014, 04:21 PM
Eh. I think it's fair to linger on a sexy ass when there is a conversation about anal sex.

slqrick
02-25-2014, 04:34 PM
Eh. I think it's fair to linger on a sexy ass when there is a conversation about anal sex.

Fair enough. :lol:

Raiders
02-25-2014, 04:47 PM
The show isn't necessarily trying to "say" something there, but it is an effective trick of using her relative nudity to appropriately position the conversation that Marty is having with her and reinforce his objective world view and predatory nature. I think it works much better as a lurid moment than not.

Qrazy
02-25-2014, 11:44 PM
There was really no need for the anal sex scene at all with or without the ass shot. We already know he's a weak willed character, having a two-dimensional former prostitute talk him into having sex with her again is unnecessary. Cut that scene out entirely and I don't think you lose much. It would probably have been in the show's favor anyway to have him pursue this new girl rather than having her pursue him. As it stands he's just falling off the wagon and he's less responsible, just weak willed. That said, we'll see. It's possible she was sent to him to distract him from the case and to keep Rust isolated. Perhaps they will do more with this new girl's character arc.

ledfloyd
02-25-2014, 11:48 PM
That was my least favorite episode of the show.

Milky Joe
02-26-2014, 02:59 AM
It's pretty funny to read r/truedetective where all these dudes are claiming the show doesn't objectify women ("it's like, about the way men objectify women, dumbass feminists, lol") while the page is simultaneously full of gifs of all the hot naked women on the show for the same dudes to jerk off to.

Acapelli
02-26-2014, 03:03 AM
this show probably has the least gratuitous nudity/violence of all of the more recent hbo dramas

and that girl that harrelson's character had sex with is naked pretty much all the time on banshee

Ezee E
02-26-2014, 03:49 AM
It is my least favorite of the series, but not a bad episode by any means.

Yes, the spaghetti scene is probably my favorite scene as well. Although the investigations were all pretty great. "If you get the chance, I recommend killing yourself."

number8
02-26-2014, 03:29 PM
I shall once again reiterate that there is nothing inherently wrong with gratuitous nudity.

Mara
02-26-2014, 05:50 PM
I'm not sure if wrong is the correct word, but nudity is a powerful tool in a visual narrative. (Like gore, for instance.) If it is there, I expect it to serve a narrative purpose, or it starts to feel weird.

I also respect equal opportunity nudity. If it is the women and only and always women who are naked, it gets a side eye from me. Also if the nudity is always physically perfect people.

I think "The Americans" was a show that used nudity judiciously and effectively.

Qrazy
02-26-2014, 07:01 PM
There's nothing inherently wrong with nudity. There is something wrong with gratuitous slickly shot sex scenes.

Raiders
02-26-2014, 07:09 PM
There is something wrong with gratuitous slickly shot sex scenes.

Nah.

number8
02-26-2014, 07:23 PM
I don't believe sex or nude scenes require narrative purpose. It is as valid as a way to entertain viewers as fight scenes and hands rustling through leaves of grass are.

Qrazy
02-26-2014, 08:00 PM
Well then you're advocating for an incredibly lazy form of storytelling that doesn't interest me. I think everything in a film/show should serve a purpose and create unified and inextricable whole. Tension is different from titillation and the degree of titillation one can wring from a narrative should not be the creators end goal. Superficial excitation by it's very nature avoids the act of genuine exploration.

number8
02-26-2014, 08:14 PM
I like it.

Qrazy
02-26-2014, 08:17 PM
Fair enough.

number8
02-26-2014, 09:07 PM
This is amazing. (http://www.collegehumor.com/post/6955188/rust-cohle-okcupid-profile-true-detective)

Lazlo
02-26-2014, 09:29 PM
This is amazing. (http://www.collegehumor.com/post/6955188/rust-cohle-okcupid-profile-true-detective)

"Time is a flat circle, but so is my heart." :lol:

Lazlo
02-26-2014, 10:08 PM
Pizzolato hints that next season could have two women in the lead. He's since deleted the tweet, though. (http://www.uproxx.com/tv/2014/02/nic-pizzolatto-hints-deleted-tweet-female-detectives-next-years-true-detective/)

number8
03-04-2014, 12:08 PM
"High praise from a bartender."

So ready for the finale.

Barty
03-10-2014, 07:24 AM
Damn, Mcconaughey's breakdown at the end. Welcome to your Emmy.

Sxottlan
03-10-2014, 07:55 AM
Kind of a wonderfully simple and understated end. Beautifully done.

Loved the discovery of the old Civil War fort as "Carcosa."

I think it's pretty much a perfect season. Such a wonderful surprise at this time of year. Definitely getting it on disc.

amberlita
03-10-2014, 01:05 PM
Suspenseful finale. Fantastic visuals. But ultimately hollow, like the entire show, in retrospect. This show is just filled with too much hot air for me to love it.

Benny Profane
03-10-2014, 02:09 PM
I wish they had colored in more of the sprawl and the rituals, but overall this is one of the best TV seasons I've ever seen.

Watashi
03-10-2014, 05:55 PM
Perfect way to end it.

ledfloyd
03-10-2014, 09:22 PM
The last scene was great, but other than that, meh.

Per Sepinwall:

"...it still felt more simplistic and formulaic than previous episodes had suggested. After the fact, Rust and Marty talk about how they didn't get all the members of the conspiracy, and the TV news reports suggest that the Tuttles have already shut down any attempts to connect them with the Childresses, but in the moment, a show that had been so very complex and strange so often boiled down to unkillable Rust Cohle in battle with the superhumanly strong monster Errol Childress."

number8
03-11-2014, 02:01 AM
Didn't want it any other way. Superb.

slqrick
03-11-2014, 06:49 PM
It's the last show that I would have expected to end on a somewhat hopeful note, but damn that last scene was crushing. Great ending.

I think the fact that they took it in such a straightforward direction in the end made a lot of sense and works better the more I think about it. "The oldest story", "time is a flat circle" etc.

transmogrifier
03-17-2014, 01:19 PM
I found the last two episodes...kind of meh. The rest were good.

DavidSeven
04-25-2014, 05:04 PM
Finished the season, and not much to add. It was exceptional. Could go down as the anchor piece of The McConaissance. Harrelson deserves equal praise for taking the more thankless role but really rolling with it. Monaghan was fantastic -- played my favorite character of the series. I thought some of the stuff they did on male/female dynamics was actually the most interesting of the season. I do think they set up the Tuttle stuff to be more intriguing than it ended up being, but the finale being so well done, particularly as to the interplay between Cohle and Hart, makes that fairly forgivable.

Lucky
04-25-2014, 06:17 PM
I appreciate you singling out Monaghan. Been rooting for her since Kiss Kiss Bang Bang and think she is underappreciated here due to the heavy one-two punch of the male leads.

Ezee E
04-26-2014, 04:54 PM
I appreciate you singling out Monaghan. Been rooting for her since Kiss Kiss Bang Bang and think she is underappreciated here due to the heavy one-two punch of the male leads.

She's a pretty great actress, that just hasn't had the distinguishing role that she needs. She's pretty great in Trucker and even Eagle Eye.

Ezee E
04-26-2014, 04:58 PM
Rumors have the second season taking place in SoCal, with Ellen Page/Kate Mara as the leads. Nothing confirmed.

EvilShoe
04-26-2014, 08:53 PM
I really don't get the Kate Mara hype.

Unless there isn't one. In which case: good.

ContinentalOp
04-26-2014, 09:34 PM
What a huge step down that would be in terms of casting. I want them to pick bigger names and not people who I am going to have a hard time accepting as detectives, as in not someone who could still play a teenager or someone who looks like a model. I've never much liked Page, except in Super. She strikes me as kind of one-note as an actress. I've never seen Mara in anything.

Lucky
04-26-2014, 10:06 PM
Pick up Elisabeth Moss. And maybe Marisa Tomei.

Lazlo
04-26-2014, 11:32 PM
Pick up Elisabeth Moss. And maybe Marisa Tomei.

Mad Men still be going on when True D needs to start shooting.

And yeah, that casting would be a step down. Show needs bigger stars and heftier actors. That's one of the main points of the structure of the show.

Ezee E
04-27-2014, 02:01 AM
I'm curious as to why Kate Mara is getting these roles, when Rooney is clearly the better actress.

I could buy Ellen as a detective-in-training, but not as a partner to Kate. I'm going to guess that casting won't be true when it's all said and done.

I'd actually find it surprising to have two female detectives together anyway.

Meanwhile, Charlize Theron seems to not have anything big going on.

In the end, I'm most curious as to who they take on as director.

Henry Gale
04-27-2014, 05:48 AM
Trying to brainstorm what directors I'd like to see brought in for Season 2, but I realize the thing that make Fukunaga so great was how unestablished he was with me.

Jeff Nichols, Andrew Dominik, Terence Davies, Derek Cianfrance, Martin McDonagh, Sean Durkin, and Bart Layton all crossed my mind.

Beyond those names, I guess I'd like to see someone I've found myself admiring the abilities of more than their actual films, who could use this as a platform to show what they can really do for eight hours or so.

Lazlo
04-27-2014, 06:15 AM
I'm curious as to why Kate Mara is getting these roles, when Rooney is clearly the better actress.

I could buy Ellen as a detective-in-training, but not as a partner to Kate. I'm going to guess that casting won't be true when it's all said and done.

I'd actually find it surprising to have two female detectives together anyway.

Meanwhile, Charlize Theron seems to not have anything big going on.

In the end, I'm most curious as to who they take on as director.

I like the Theron suggestion. Jodie Foster crossed my mind too. I think Pizzolato has alluded to them not having just one director this year. Kind of a bummer as it takes some of the singular vision-ness away but really it's always been Pizzolato's show. I've heard rumors from a friend of mine who knows Pizzolato well that he and Fukunaga did not get along and he wouldn't want to wrangle with that control dynamic again. Also the reality of the show taking six months to shoot is prohibitive to the single director model.

Ezee E
05-21-2014, 05:31 AM
Sounds like Jessica Chastain is being offered the lead.

DavidSeven
05-21-2014, 07:35 AM
That would be a huge get for the show. But for her, I dunno. I feel like she already sort of nailed the obsessive detective thing in Zero Dark Thirty.

Lazlo
05-21-2014, 07:46 PM
Sounds like Jessica Chastain is being offered the lead.

Rumor has been denied.

number8
05-27-2014, 04:22 PM
“Right now, we’re working with three leads. It takes place in California — not Los Angeles, but some of the much lesser known venues of California — and we’re going to try to capture a certain psychosphere ambiance of the place, much like we did in season one,” he said. “The characters are all new, but I’m deeply in love with each of them. We’ve got the entire series broken out with a couple of scripts, and we’ll probably start casting in earnest in the coming months.”

Nice. They can do the same for desert sprawls the way they did the bayou.

slqrick
05-27-2014, 05:55 PM
Yeah, there are a lot of smaller, desolate parts of California that would fit right in for the atmosphere of the show. Glad they're staying away from LA.

Ezee E
05-27-2014, 10:51 PM
I was thinking it'd be more Inland Empire area. While I was living in OC, I was kind of shocked at the amount of prostitutes that were killed and discussion of sex slavery, but only for it to basically be mumbled in the newscast.

Morris Schæffer
06-28-2014, 04:10 PM
Those tits!!!! :eek:

DavidSeven
07-11-2014, 09:32 PM
Colin Farrell in talks to take one of the Season 2 lead roles. Being reported by Variety, so this is likely more than pure internet speculation.

http://variety.com/2014/tv/news/colin-farrell-in-talks-for-true-detective-season-two-1201261235/

Henry Gale
07-11-2014, 11:00 PM
Taylor Kitsch too. Of course I have no idea what the characters are like, but him and Farrell seem perfectly suited for this sort of thing, in terms of them not quite seeming to land that great piece of work in film that shows off what they can do best.

I think everyone (them included) would much rather see them do a season of this than another risky tentpole with their faces front and centre taking a hit when they underwhelm financially.

Lazlo
07-12-2014, 01:30 AM
I'm sure they'll both do great, but it's not shocking given their career trajectories that they'd be on a TV show by now. It's not the big huge get that McConaughey was and the way (the rumored) Pitt and Chastain would have been.

megladon8
07-17-2014, 05:22 AM
This was just too damn good. Makes life unfair for other shows.

Start to finish brilliant.

Morris Schæffer
07-25-2014, 05:31 AM
It was rather exceptional. My reservations are small such as when hart is granted access to old case files because he's writing a detective novel and needs the research. I would reckon that the way that whole case went, and with the suspicions on the Cohle character they wouldn't let him in particular near it.

EvilShoe
08-05-2014, 05:54 AM
Rumour of the week: Vince Vaughn to star in season 2?

Lazlo
08-05-2014, 11:42 AM
Rumour of the week: Vince Vaughn to star in season 2?

Sigh. Again someone who isn't a surprise to be involved in a TV show at this point in his career. I get that this show is a massive time commitment for a big movie star, though.

Ezee E
08-05-2014, 02:16 PM
At this point, we may as well wait for cameras to shoot, because it seems like everyone is in talks.

EvilShoe
08-05-2014, 02:23 PM
Now rumoured, Elizabeth Moss!

Mara
08-05-2014, 03:44 PM
Now rumoured, Elisabeth Moss!

She's not a surprising choice, but she's a fantastic actress.

Grouchy
08-31-2014, 08:58 PM
Binge-watched this. Fantastic all around. Reminded me of Alan Moore's works for some reason, particularly Neonomicon with its obsessive detective, and this was before I read in the Internet that the ending was reminiscent of Top Ten, which I haven't read. McConaughey is just a revelation lately, great work by this man.

The discussion about women is just depressing. Does this nonsense need to be brought up everywhere? Watch Qrazy defending the Hays code as a class act.

Irish
08-31-2014, 10:28 PM
Does this nonsense need to be brought up everywhere?

If you're tired of hearing about it, imagine how tired women are of constantly being portrayed that way.

Also, Moore never did anything as shallow as True Detective. The show was good for 3-4 episodes and then it glides on familiar tropes. Much mystery. Deep thinking. And it ends with a fistfight in a cave. Gimme a break.

Milky Joe
08-31-2014, 11:29 PM
If you're tired of hearing about it, imagine how tired women are of constantly being portrayed that way.

*high five*

Grouchy
09-01-2014, 05:29 AM
If you're tired of hearing about it, imagine how tired women are of constantly being portrayed that way.
All I know is if you're watching an intelligent, well-written crime drama like this one and your mind wanders to making a list of how many women characters are hookers or someone's girlfriend, there's something wrong with you. As if there weren't hookers and wives and girlfriends in real life. If the characters are well written, as they are here, I don't give a fuck about the latest P.C. agenda.


Also, Moore never did anything as shallow as True Detective. The show was good for 3-4 episodes and then it glides on familiar tropes. Much mystery. Deep thinking. And it ends with a fistfight in a cave. Gimme a break.
Well, I don't think it was a work of genius, but it kept the interest high for me for all eight episodes. I think it does something slightly different with familiar tropes, which is almost the definition of good genre fiction these days. Agreed, Moore's writing is on a superior level. What I meant was that certain themes reminded me of his work, specially when he goes all holistic like in From Hell.

Milky Joe
09-01-2014, 08:08 AM
If the characters are well written, as they are here, I don't give a fuck about the latest P.C. agenda.

They're not, though. Also: "latest P.C. agenda" = half the world's population.

number8
09-03-2014, 02:20 PM
It does seem to me that people are finally being much more sensitive to gender representation than ever before, and they're speaking out rather than shrugging it off. That's kind of exciting. Feels like the underdog rising up against the ruling class, and I wanna be on the right side of that.

Morris Schæffer
09-12-2014, 05:48 AM
Justin Lin in talks to direct some eps.

http://www.empireonline.com/news/story.asp?NID=42100

MadMan
09-14-2014, 06:48 AM
Thursday I got my hands on the show thanks to my local public library, and I started watching. I've viewed the first two episodes already. Some of you who posted on Icine do recall when I would post write ups of episodes of Lost. Well I'm doing it again. Its been a while so I'm a tad out of practice....

True Detective Season 1 Episode 1: The Long Bright Dark

http://nerdrepository.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Review-True-Detective-02-600x336.jpg

Opening in the Deep South and focusing in on a case that had long been thought solved in 1995, the HBO show True Detective utilizes flashbacks and flash forwards for a season centering around two Louisiana State CID's, Rust and Marty. These former partners are being interviewed, or more likely interrogated, by current detectives because someone has been killed in the same fashion as the girl that they found in a field over a decade prior. Having fallen out after years of working together, Marty and Rust are grilled separately, each giving accounts of what transpired during the murder investigation. In the process certain elements come to light, and we begin to get a certain picture of who these men are and how they think.

This is especially made clear in a scene in which Rust offers his darkly humorous and brutal outlook on humanity after Marty unfortunately asks Rust what his belief system is. Matthew McConaughey breaks free of his movie persona here, delivering a brooding monologue that Woody Harrelson reacts to quite strongly, which in turn was funny and rather apt given the nature of what Rust had just said. Its interesting that Marty's wife, Maggie, wants Rust to meet Marty's family, as the two men seem to have little in common and Rust is no longer a family man. Perhaps curious to see who has her husband's life in his hands, although maybe also a typical formality of sorts. What occurs as a result of that decision is Maggie realizing what Marty already knows: that Rust is on edge, teetering on that line between sanity and madness.

Another choice moment is when Rust in the interview forces one of the detectives to get him a six pack of Lone Star as he continues to chain smoke away during their questioning. The first episode concludes with a rather nice puzzling quote that does not come across as typical or cliche based on how McConaughey delivers the line. Harrelson and McConaughey display a natural rapport and connection in this show, playing off of one another and reflecting their fantastic talents onscreen. I'm looking forward to viewing the rest of the series based on this gorgeously shot, bleak and neatly directed episode.

MadMan
09-18-2014, 04:56 AM
True Detective Season 1 Episode 2: Seeing Things

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"Yeah, back then, the visions, yeah most of the time I was convinced... Shit... I'd lost it. But there were other times... I thought I was mainlining the secret truth of the universe."-Rust Cohle

While the pilot was really great I actually liked this episode more, as it was subtle, rather eerie, with undercurrents lying beneath the surface. Also featured here is where Rust starts to go down the rabbit hole as he stops circling the drain and plunges into the dark, sinister hole, diving into something that might lay beyond his understanding. Marty at the present does not realize this until the end of the episode, and even after hearing from Rust about Rust's family and what happened to them he still fails to fully know his partner. Funny how you can work together with another person and still never unravel the layers, peeling them back until a clearer picture emerges.

This is underlined by a scene of raw emotional intensity where Rust and Marty almost come to blows in the locker room after Rust pulls a Sherlock Holmes and reveals to Marty that he knows about the other woman in Marty's life. That woman would be Lisa, played with gorgeous charisma by Alexandra Daddario, who in her few moments with Marty plays an effective mistress to his need to blow off steam. Even as she desires something far more tangible, something that Marty does not want or can give he beyond casual sexual hookups between the two of them. Whether or not Marty's wife Maggie (expertly played by Michelle Monaghan) knows about Lisa is not revealed in this episode, although its clear that Marty and Maggie are having some troubles at home and its possible Maggie suspects.

Previously I failed to mention how amazing this show's music is, as the legendary T Bone Burnett is responsible for that area and he does his usual fantastic job. I love how the songs set the tone of the show, giving the episodes added empathises and adding to the show instead of being distracting or driving the moments-the scenes proved imaginary for the music instead of the other way around, if that makes any sense. Oh and the shots of the countryside are beyond amazing, in addition to the scenes where Rust hallucinates cryptically, almost showing himself the way. What this means, only future episodes will tell.

MadMan
09-23-2014, 05:56 AM
Some possible spoilers btw, although this thread seems dead right now so it doesn't matter:

True Detective Season 1 Episode 3: Locked Rooms

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Later on in the episode the two detectives who have the misfortune to question Rust and Marty become tired of Rust's opinions, which at this point have turned to religion, life, and whatever else pops into Rust's head at the moment. They respond to such horribly strong negativity that they leave the room, using a so called "Break" to excuse themselves from having to hear more from a man that is clearly broken, left with nothing and no one. This episode more than any of the other ones so far properly illustrates Rust's loneliness, his distance from people and mankind in general, his unwillingness to connect with others. This lack of faith in people and Rust withdrawing into himself is even more noted when Maggie and Marty make the mistake of trying to hook him up with one of her friends-she's willing, he is not, yet Rust goes through the motions.

What troubles Marty is that as he cheats on his wife and drinks more he is growing apart from Maggie, and she not only sees this but confronts him about it. For reasons unknown Rust shows up at Marty's house, thus angering Marty yet also reminding Marty that he has let the job consume his life despite his attempts to, in his own words, keep the job and life separate. This failure threatens his marriage and his relationship with his own children, and it leads to Marty lashing out in anger against his own mistress after she takes a man home and tells him its over. That scene is chilling in that Marty realizes he is capable of violence, and luckily for the young man he almost beats up Marty recognizes his limits and goes home instead. The conversation between Marty and Rusty where Marty wonders about love and if he is a good man is one of the best parts of the episode, as it is stark and real.

Finally the journey concludes one part, starting a new one as the pair of detectives find the gateway to the rabbit hole, to hell and beyond. A break in the case occurs, however this moment only leads to more questions without answers, answers that lie with of all things a man. Interesting how when events appear complex they can be simplified with the right key, a key that Rust discovers thanks to his inability to sleep and his strong obsession. Marty tries to deny his obsession, while Rust refuses to admit doubt clouds his mind more than sleep does. Both men have their own demons to overcome, and each must get his affairs in order before the tide comes in.

number8
09-23-2014, 06:40 PM
It's official: Colin Farrell and Vince Vaughn. Justin Lin directing the first two episodes.


“Colin Farrell as Ray Velcoro, a compromised detective whose allegiances are torn between his masters in a corrupt police department and the mobster who owns him.”

“Vince Vaughn as Frank Semyon, a career criminal in danger of losing his empire when his move into legitimate enterprise is upended by the murder of a business partner.”

Henry Gale
09-23-2014, 06:55 PM
Nice. Two actors that I always like more than the big roles they tend to end up with, and it'll be refreshing to finally see Lin do something non-Fast-related after all his years served there.

I guess McAdams isn't confirmed but I'd like to see her in this too, or at the very least something like it.

Ezee E
09-24-2014, 03:55 AM
Well, one cop so far, so maybe there still is a female lead detective?

I do hope that Pizzolatto has a unique take on a big city approach.

MadMan
09-24-2014, 06:46 AM
Sounds good to me so far.

PS: I finished the show last week, I'm just reposting reviews I wrote elsewhere...

True Detective Season 1 Episode 4: Who Goes There

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Much has been made about that brilliant tracking shot, which is something that would never be featured on a network TV show these days and utterly lives up to the hype. What's forgotten amongst the talk about that scene is that Who Goes There is the shit hitting the fan, the storm exploding onto all in moments both surprising and expected. You have Marty facing Maggie's wraith as Lisa gets revenge on him by telling Maggie about the affair, followed by Rust being forced to go back deep undercover with a group of people that he was hoping he would no longer have to deal with. The consequences of Rust and Marty's previous actions come down upon them just as they have a break in their case, and that's rough.

One of the best moments in this episode, tracking shot aside, is when Marty is forced to go into a rave club to find a man capable of telling Rust and him about the biker gang that Rust has to go meet after a couple years of playing dead. The lightening is absolutely perfect and the scene is tense, unwinding by the end, as if it were a slinky bouncing down the stairs. This moment is matched by the the tracking shot of course, and yet Who Goes There feels nervous and tense throughout, mirroring the feelings of the two main characters. Rust has to prevent Marty from going to pieces over Maggie, all while breaking rules and laws so that they have a shot at finding a man known as Reggie Ledoux. Such a move proves to be tricky and risky, particularly with Rust having to steal evidence to have a shot of meeting with the bikers who know him as Crash.

Ah, that tracking shot. Its a thing of beauty, winding and curling around, following people amongst chaos that emerges during a robbery gone horribly wrong. Violence erupts as the hostile natives respond to murder, resulting in an orgy of killing and beatings. The police helicopter circles overhead, capturing the scene in all its terrifying glory. Rust and Marty are baptized together in fire, emerging bound together as partners, not opposites, brothers in arms centered on a singular purpose. What happens next I have no idea, and I can't wait to view the aftermath.

Morris Schæffer
09-24-2014, 10:45 AM
Good to see Vaughn mix things up a bit, never saw him as ideal romcom fodder anyway. Seems like he's better suited as a serious actor.

Mara
09-25-2014, 06:59 PM
Yessss I would watch this show.

http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/97xq

quido8_5
09-28-2014, 03:01 PM
Yessss I would watch this show.

http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/97xq

"Oh, that's just my face-penis."

Philip J. Fry
10-03-2014, 06:42 PM
Just binge watched the show. Top notch stuff, I really loved McConaughey in this and I kinda love how...
Marty of the two, ends up solving the case.:D

Also, found this essay somewhere, cool stuff. Need to read The King in Yellow.

True Detective and Loveraftian Horror (http://unitedfederationofcharles.blog spot.mx/2014/06/true-detective-and-lovecraftian-horror.html)

D_Davis
05-26-2015, 09:35 PM
Started this the other night.

Pretty interesting.

Really well made.

I like that McConaughey is so into the Thomas Ligotti school of pessimism. I keep waiting for The Conspiracy Against the Human Race to show up some where.

http://www.vulture.com/2014/08/thomas-ligotti-true-detective-guide.html

D_Davis
05-26-2015, 09:37 PM
Speaking of which, looks like the show as pushed the price of my like-new copy 1st edition of The Conspiracy.... above $250.

Maybe next season will be inspired by Michael Cisco.

Winston*
05-26-2015, 09:56 PM
Have you read The King in Yellow, Davis?

D_Davis
05-26-2015, 10:07 PM
Have you read The King in Yellow, Davis?

Oh yeah, many times.

It contains my all-time favorite short story, "The Repairer of Reputations." I've never ready a better depiction of madness and insanity. The entire book feels dangerous, as if its something that shouldn't be read. There is a real sense of dread that emanates from the pages.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Repairer_of_Reputations

Winston*
05-26-2015, 10:11 PM
It contains my all-time favorite short story, "The Repairer of Reputations." I've never ready a better depiction of madness and insanity. The entire book feels dangerous, as if its something that shouldn't be read. There is a real sense of dread that emanates from the pages.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Repairer_of_Reputations
Yeah, I've read that one. . It's great, though never finished the collection. He's like Lovecraft if you didn't have to feel guilty reading him.