Game of Thrones (Season 4)

[Dukefrukem]

psyched


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZY43QSx3Fk

[Morris Schæffer]

There are murmurs going around that, maybe, they're going to end the show with one or two, 100 million dollar each, theatrically released movies.

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/66623

[slqrick]

So great to have this back...hashtag team jaime.

[dreamdead]

Was interesting to see how the show presented Arya's satisfactory and disturbed sentiments at the same time, with the latter quality achieved principally through the music.

Worried for Shae. It seems unlikely that she'll make it through the whole series, but I'd been optimistic that her arc would be longer. The discovery of a link to Dinklage seems to foretell her demise this season.

[number8]

Deadwood flashback, anyone?

[Watashi]

It's been too long. I love this show.

[EyesWideOpen]

I was wondering from the start who the new brown haired guy was with Daenerys and looking online it looks like they recast Daario Naharis (blond haired guy before). But once I got past that it was fantastic. I'm Team Arya all the way.

[number8]

Greyworm made sure to awkwardly call him by his full name in his first scene just to let viewers know that.

Michael Huisman is a big improvement over skinny Fabio, though. I like that guy a lot.

[Lazlo]

Greyworm made sure to awkwardly call him by his full name in his first scene just to let viewers know that.

Michael Huisman is a big improvement over skinny Fabio, though. I like that guy a lot.

Yeah, Huisman is an upgrade for sure. I knew they were recasting Daario but I'd forgotten it was Huisman so that was a pleasant surprise. I hope that dude gets more work.

[number8]

He's going to be a major character in the second season of Orphan Black. The guy's on 3 popular TV shows this season.

I was kind of surprised that they let him keep his regular look on GOT. When they announced the casting I thought they'd make him shave and dye his hair.

[number8]

Anyway, this episode was all about The Hound and his hilarious one-liners. The show's sense of humor is often underrated.

[[ETM]]

I think Dina and I laughed more often during the episode than during most recent comedies.

[Thirdmango]

It was good to see Arya the badass come into being.

[Dukefrukem]

It was good to see Arya the badass come into being.

That was the highlight of the episode.

[Dukefrukem]

Greyworm made sure to awkwardly call him by his full name in his first scene just to let viewers know that.

Michael Huisman is a big improvement over skinny Fabio, though. I like that guy a lot.

I had no idea who he was until then. That seems weird that they recast him but a quick google shows that I guess he was cast in the new Transporter movie and he figured that would be a better career move...

[Sxottlan]

It's crazy how fast these episodes fly. You think twenty minutes have gone by and I look at the clock and it's 45 minutes.

[Lucky]

Was Margaery saying the wedding is in a fortnight a real-world hint that the royal wedding will be in episode 3?

Because I'm already anticipating the internet reaction and memes.

[Lazlo]

Was Margaery saying the wedding is in a fortnight a real-world hint that the royal wedding will be in episode 3?

Because I'm already anticipating the internet reaction and memes.

The "next on Game of Thrones" made it look like it happens this Sunday, though the whole event may not happen in that episode.

[Morris Schæffer]

two more seasons for this. Will that allow them to wrap it all up in sync with Martin's books?

[Dukefrukem]

I was hoping for a movie wedged in between.

[slqrick]

two more seasons for this. Will that allow them to wrap it all up in sync with Martin's books?

There will be another renewal. HBO said they envision seven seasons, eight tops. I think that might still be cutting it close, so that could change, but I think the show will go at least seven seasons. I also saw rumors about the possibility of a couple of feature films wrapping things up.

[EyesWideOpen]

Yeah they didn't say anything about it only being two more seasons.

[Lazlo]

It's even possible the series will end before the books. I read something recently about Benioff and Weiss visiting Martin to discuss the story's endgame. Martin's just nowhere near finishing the books and the series isn't going to stop rolling to wait on him.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Here's a good rundown of the possibilities if Martin can't get the final two books finished in time:

http://www.avclub.com/article/george-rr-martin-might-be-little-panicked-game-thr-202330

EDIT: Whoops, wrong article. That's the one where Martin is optimistic he can finish before the show. He hints that he's already close to done with book six.

[slqrick]

I think a prequel season, even a shortened one that's only 6-8 episodes covering stuff like the Mad King's reign would be amazing. I don't see HBO going for that, though.

[Dukefrukem]

I'm wondering what other moves HBO will do once Netflix catches up from a subscriber count. More and more leave cable and go to Netflix-

Fun Fact, 28.41% of cable, satellite subscribers also subscribe to HBO. *about 32 million* That's actually a lot higher than I thought.

[number8]

This is fantastic.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwF-D5wEEmk

[Scar]

Good.

I started chanting DIE a few minutes before it happened....

[Wryan]

This wedding almost felt longer than the one in The Deer Hunter. A few trims wouldn't have gone awry. But yay anyway.

I look forward to seeing someone attempt to explain how Tyrion could have gotten anything into the wine when he was essentially center stage for everyone pretty much the whole time because of the uncomfortable awkwardness. Wouldn't there have been dozens of witnesses to corroborate that he didn't do anything?

[number8]

I can't believe how offended I could be by a tasteless reenactment of a fictional war. That kid truly is outstanding at being a fucking shithead.

[number8]

It's 11:30 and I got work in the morning but I just broke out the whiskey. It's a merry occasion. I wish I have a cigar.

[Wryan]

Also, props to the makeup department. That face is gonna haunt my dreams. Props to Gleeson as well. He's been so fucking good this entire time.

[Henry Gale]

Welp, Benioff & Weiss weren't kidding when they said they weren't going to wait for the 9th episode of the season to dole out the huge, emotionally frantic developments this season.

So, so good. And just terrifying and haunting enough to not quite give you the morbidly gleeful catharsis you might want out of it, especially with all the hanging repercussions for so many others surrounding it.

I'd been vaguely spoiled when last year people were speculating prior to last year's wedding if they were going to have this one somehow strung together with it in parallel, and also I'd seen a random internet commenter wondering if Joffrey's last Season 3 scene could be the last we see of him (not sure why, maybe they confused the confrontation between the two at Tyrion's wedding to be a way of adapting this reception's events into a less gratifying send-off), so I was expecting something similar. But still, I didn't quite expect it in the moment (despite all the blatant visual foreshadowing and unbearably foreboding tone), it made my heart crawl up my throat, and tied so many storylines and the episode together beautifully, especially the inconspicuous wine scene with Tyrion and Jaime at the beginning...

Just some masterful television all around.

[number8]

Masterful indeed, because there's so much at play during that wedding, but obviously overshadowed by the ending. Oberyn's subtle threatening of Cersei and Tywin was a huge moment, too, and my favorite line of the episode. Then there's Cersei's undermining of Margery, Jamie confronting Loras... Man.

[Lazlo]

Book Spoilers:

I'm gonna guess the 9th episode is the battle at the Wall, one of my favorite scenes. Neil Marshall's directing. It doesn't have a title yet, but none of the first eight episodes have titles that hint at it.

[slqrick]

Book Spoilers:

I'm gonna guess the 9th episode is the battle at the Wall, one of my favorite scenes. Neil Marshall's directing. It doesn't have a title yet, but none of the first eight episodes have titles that hint at it.

Definitely.

Love that Bronn's role keeps increasing every season.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Nice acting in the final minutes by Gleeson. Good episode. Strong tension at the wedding with all the miniature fights mocking the repeated claims of a new and peaceful kingdom. That re-enactment was unbearable. The entire wedding was like a greatest hits of his brand of petulant dickhood.

It's a good thing the show spends so much time on the wedding, because God, that Bolton and Baratheon stuff is such dry, mushy chamber play boredom. There's a nice bit there with Ramsay testing Theon's allegiance, but that mostly just reminds me of how much time was wasted last season watching Theon suffer.

[slqrick]

My wife is physically repelled by the Ramsay scenes. I wasn't a fan at all of this week's "hunt," but the Theon/Ramsay/Roose scene was great.

[number8]

Lighten up, people!

http://i.imgur.com/UACUrYh.gif

[Irish]

It was good to see Arya the badass come into being.

I didn't see that as so much badass -- the Hound's lines about eating every chicken in the place was -- but not Arya's actions. She attacked a man who had his back turned toward her, taunted him, killed him in cold blood, and seemed to delight in his death.

That's pretty much the exact opposite of the sort of thing her father taught in the first episode of the first season. It's a good turn for the character, but a decidedly dark turn.

[Irish]

Masterful indeed, because there's so much at play during that wedding, but obviously overshadowed by the ending. Oberyn's subtle threatening of Cersei and Tywin was a huge moment, too, and my favorite line of the episode. Then there's Cersei's undermining of Margery, Jamie confronting Loras... Man.

Oberon (more subtlety from George RR, I guess) told Tyrion that he suspected Tywin of orchestrating the rape and murder of his sister. Then, the next time we see him he goes up to Tywin and introduces the words rape and murder into the conversation within the first five seconds of the encounter. That's not quite what I'd call "subtle."

While we're on it, how exactly did this dude get invited to the wedding? This seems to be a land with strict, stultifying moral and social codes. The kind where people swear things like blood oaths before they breakfast in the morning.

"Oh hey Circe (haha get it? Still more subtlety from George), I say Circe, remember that time I had the Mountain rape and murder that girl? Be sure her brother is on the guest list. Because nothing could possibly go wrong by having that dude running around King's Landing."

[Irish]

Nice acting in the final minutes by Gleeson. Good episode. Strong tension at the wedding with all the miniature fights mocking the repeated claims of a new and peaceful kingdom. That re-enactment was unbearable. The entire wedding was like a greatest hits of his brand of petulant dickhood.

This bothered me too, partly because it makes little sense from the point of view of "Royalist" pro-Lannister wedding guests. I mean, everyone there looks uncomfortable at Joffrey's bullshit, but would they be? The winners write the history, and this is the winners doing a victory lap. Why would anyone there bat an eye?

The only reason the audience does is because of Sansa -- a dramatically inert character who's foil for Joffrey. She doesn't do anything in that scene except passively feed our angst. I'd be more excited about that if Sansa served any other purpose, had any stories of her own, and whose very presence made any kind of sense at all. These people killed her entire family but leave her alive? That's been dumb since Ned died and it's increasingly dumb with each passing TV season.


It's a good thing the show spends so much time on the wedding, because God, that Bolton and Baratheon stuff is such dry, mushy chamber play boredom.

This was always my problem with phone book sized fantasy epics -- invariably you run into a set of characters that you don't like, and yet you're required to slog through their pages the same as everyone else. I almost fast forwarded through the Baratheon stuff.

[Irish]

Serious question: the next time the Lannisters throw a party, do the RSVPs go up or down?

You go, you get a free meal, some booze, and a chance to see some crazy shit. But it also seems really fucking dangerous.

[Qrazy]

Oberon (more subtlety from George RR, I guess) told Tyrion that he suspected Tywin of orchestrating the rape and murder of his sister. Then, the next time we see him he goes up to Tywin and introduces the words rape and murder into the conversation within the first five seconds of the encounter. That's not quite what I'd call "subtle."

While we're on it, how exactly did this dude get invited to the wedding? This seems to be a land with strict, stultifying moral and social codes. The kind where people swear things like blood oaths before they breakfast in the morning.

"Oh hey Circe (haha get it? Still more subtlety from George), I say Circe, remember that time I had the Mountain rape and murder that girl? Be sure her brother is on the guest list. Because nothing could possibly go wrong by having that dude running around King's Landing."

He wasn't supposed to come, the Prince of Dorne was. They are one of the great houses, Cersei's daughter (Myrcella) was to marry into their line to cement allegiances there during the war when all allies were a necessity.

[Qrazy]

This bothered me too, partly because it makes little sense from the point of view of "Royalist" pro-Lannister wedding guests. I mean, everyone there looks uncomfortable at Joffrey's bullshit, but would they be? The winners write the history, and this is the winners doing a victory lap. Why would anyone there bat an eye?

The only reason the audience does is because of Sansa -- a dramatically inert character who's foil for Joffrey. She doesn't do anything in that scene except passively feed our angst. I'd be more excited about that if Sansa served any other purpose, had any stories of her own, and whose very presence made any kind of sense at all. These people killed her entire family but leave her alive? That's been dumb since Ned died and it's increasingly dumb with each passing TV season.



This was always my problem with phone book sized fantasy epics -- invariably you run into a set of characters that you don't like, and yet you're required to slog through their pages the same as everyone else. I almost fast forwarded through the Baratheon stuff.

Yes in regards to batting an eye. They fear that Joffrey will become another mad and tyrannical king. The average person in this world is not a monster like Joffrey. They are hard and the world is harsh but they do not delight in death and violence.

Sansa is a Stark and the key to securing the allegiances of the north. If they kill her outright they will have constant rebellion in the north. Using her by forcing her into a marriage makes more sense. It's the same reason Roose was excited to hear Rickon and Bran are alive.

But I do agree that Sansa is an uninteresting character.

[Watashi]

Loved the Sigur Ros cameo.

[number8]

This bothered me too, partly because it makes little sense from the point of view of "Royalist" pro-Lannister wedding guests. I mean, everyone there looks uncomfortable at Joffrey's bullshit, but would they be? The winners write the history, and this is the winners doing a victory lap. Why would anyone there bat an eye?

You seem to have the wrong idea on who the wedding guests were. They're people from various houses of the seven kingdoms. That's why Oberyn was there, to represent House Martell on behalf of the Prince of Dorne. And that's why the reaction shots to the reenactment were people looking uncomfortable. Joffrey had a dwarf dressed as Renly riding a Loras puppet around. That's his brother in law. He was deliberately insulting his new wife's entire family at their wedding. I mean, no one's gonna call him out for it or anything, but I don't see why we should be surprised if the guests were like, "What the fuuuck, kid?"

[number8]

Loved the Sigur Ros cameo.

I chuckled. Now I really want to go to a concert of theirs and throw some coins on stage.

[Watashi]

I also have to commend Martin for this being his first written script without any gratuitous nudity.

[ledfloyd]

This wedding almost felt longer than the one in The Deer Hunter. A few trims wouldn't have gone awry. But yay anyway.

I look forward to seeing someone attempt to explain how Tyrion could have gotten anything into the wine when he was essentially center stage for everyone pretty much the whole time because of the uncomfortable awkwardness. Wouldn't there have been dozens of witnesses to corroborate that he didn't do anything?

http://imgur.com/a/2DtPH

[Dukefrukem]

I keep forgetting to remove this from my DVR schedule since you can On Demand them all.

[Lucky]

I also have to commend Martin for this being his first written script without any gratuitous nudity.

At least there was a spread eagle contortionist.

[number8]

At least there was a spread eagle contortionist.

"Hellooo."
"Hello."
"Not you."

[Wryan]

Goddamn. Charles Dance and Liam Cunningham are like the crown jewels of this ensemble. They elevate every scene they are in. Rory McCann is also becoming increasingly impressive now that they are giving him more to do. He's like the Brienne of this season. Great episode. The first scene in the sept might be my favorite so far this season.....followed swiftly by an ugly little moment. :/

[slqrick]

Did not like how they handled that Jaime/Cersei scene, at all.

[slqrick]

This is actually really bugging me, for a few reasons.

Using rape or the threat of rape for the shock factor is pretty much the worst thing this show has going for it, and most of the time it's not really necessary. This was particularly egregious, though, because it just makes no sense to have Jaime rape Cersei other than not wanting him to be too likable. Well, mission accomplished I guess. Chucking Bran off the roof is something that's redeemable in the context of the story, but this was just flat out gross.

[Ezee E]

Daenerys Targaryen's scenes are on such a higher level then the rest of the show (which is good, mind you) that I have an inner shriek whenever her color palette shows up. The show is sure taking it's sweet time getting her to Westeros. Would you say she has the largest army already?

Pretty sure I could do without any Sam or Brian Stark. Not really sure what the point of them is right now.

I don't know Arya Stark's purpose right now either, but that subplot is so good to watch, that I don't care.

All caught up now... Marathoning through it definitely brings up some questions that probably have been answered, but it's been a great series.

[number8]

Sorry Tyrion. Team Oberyn now.

[Irish]

This is actually really bugging me, for a few reasons.

Using rape or the threat of rape for the shock factor is pretty much the worst thing this show has going for it, and most of the time it's not really necessary. This was particularly egregious, though, because it just makes no sense to have Jaime rape Cersei other than not wanting him to be too likable. Well, mission accomplished I guess. Chucking Bran off the roof is something that's redeemable in the context of the story, but this was just flat out gross.

Could not agree more.

It made me uncomfortable, but more than that I feel like an ass for ever rooting for Jaime's redemption. I can't figure out what Martin is going for by jerking around his readers/viewers this much. (Also, having the rape occur in a mausoleum next to their kid's dead body was laughably over the top, even for this show.)

As a side note, this episode had a few too many (?!) creepy incest babies. Makes my skin crawl. Serves no real purpose that I can see, other than George wanting to play around with outré human behavior to push some kind of envelope. (Same thing with those cannibal wildlings.

[Irish]

Daenerys Targaryen's scenes are on such a higher level then the rest of the show (which is good, mind you) that I have an inner shriek whenever her color palette shows up. The show is sure taking it's sweet time getting her to Westeros. Would you say she has the largest army already?

She has great individual moments (catapulting broken shackles into the city was a terrific image) but there is no real story there. Every scene plays like a cliffhanger, so the tone ends up flat. It's like a song made up of a single, high pitched note. How long can the singer hold that before the audience catches on and gets bored?

If/when she lands in Westeros, it'll be something like a ~3 year build up to a somewhat singular payoff. Worth it?

There are similar problems with other storylines (Jon Snow comes to mind).

[Kurosawa Fan]

Could not agree more.

It made me uncomfortable, but more than that I feel like an ass for ever rooting for Jaime's redemption. I can't figure out what Martin is going for by jerking around his readers/viewers this much. (Also, having the rape occur in a mausoleum next to their kid's dead body was laughably over the top, even for this show.)

As a side note, this episode had a few too many (?!) creepy incest babies. Makes my skin crawl. Serves no real purpose that I can see, other than George wanting to play around with outré human behavior to push some kind of envelope. (Same thing with those cannibal wildlings.

According to George (http://www.avclub.com/article/george-rr-martin-nikolaj-coster-waldau-and-directo-203689?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:1:Def ault), he had nothing to do with the rape scene. It certainly wasn't in the book, and he says he doesn't remember ever discussing its inclusion in the show.

[number8]

If anything, at least, this show is fulfilling my wish for a show where the characters don't have clear character arcs. They can simply exist, and sometimes they're likable, sometimes they're not, depending on the context and situations. Usually you can only find that in pro wrestling.

[Watashi]

I don't think Dany is coming to Westeros anytime soon.

[Qrazy]

I don't think Dany is coming to Westeros anytime soon.

Most likely Martin will decide to rape and kill her off before she gets there anyway. He's all about unpredictability guys!

[Qrazy]

She has great individual moments (catapulting broken shackles into the city was a terrific image) but there is no real story there. Every scene plays like a cliffhanger, so the tone ends up flat. It's like a song made up of a single, high pitched note. How long can the singer hold that before the audience catches on and gets bored?

If/when she lands in Westeros, it'll be something like a ~3 year build up to a somewhat singular payoff. Worth it?

There are similar problems with other storylines (Jon Snow comes to mind).

Yeah I find the overall structure of the series extremely problematic for those reasons. I don't find he intertwines plot threads particularly well.

[number8]

Likely because the series tries to present the events in chronological order, while the books were not written that way.

[Irish]

According to George (http://www.avclub.com/article/george-rr-martin-nikolaj-coster-waldau-and-directo-203689?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:1:Def ault), he had nothing to do with the rape scene. It certainly wasn't in the book, and he says he doesn't remember ever discussing its inclusion in the show.

Interesting. I liked this bit from Coster-Waldau:


There is significance in that scene, and it comes straight from the books—it’s George R.R. Martin’s mind at play. It took me awhile to wrap my head around it, because I think that, for some people, it’s just going to look like rape. The intention is that it’s not just that.

Also, this article from the same site (http://www.avclub.com/article/rape-thrones-203499) says the scene is in the books, but in a slightly different form.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Interesting. I liked this bit from Coster-Waldau:



Also, this article from the same site (http://www.avclub.com/article/rape-thrones-203499) says the scene is in the books, but in a slightly different form.

I read the book last year. The sex in the sept between Cersei and Jamie is most certainly written as consensual. Sure there's the unreliable narrator angle since it's Jaime's POV, but nothing about the dialogue or the scene suggested to me that it was possibly rape.

[Irish]

The sex in the sept between Cersei and Jamie is most certainly written as consensual. Sure there's the unreliable narrator angle since it's Jaime's POV, but nothing about the dialogue or the scene suggested to me that it was possibly rape.

Click through and read. The article says as much. The differences in interpretation between book, script, and screen are worth considering. It strikes me as a little more nuanced than "well, that wasn't in the book and George had nothing to do with it."

[Kurosawa Fan]

Click through and read. The article says as much. The differences in interpretation between book, script, and screen are worth considering. It strikes me as a little more nuanced than "well, that wasn't in the book and George had nothing to do with it."

Sorry, the wording of your post led me to think that the article suggested the scene in the book was sort of murky when it came to the sex being consensual. I read the article and while George may have let that moment hang in the air a bit in the book, much like with the Dany example they bring up later in the article, it's clear that Cersei decides that sex is what she wants. I'm in agreement with the article that the rape needs to lead to something this time. If not, it's a pointless move and another ugly strike against the show.

[Qrazy]

Likely because the series tries to present the events in chronological order, while the books were not written that way.

What I find problematic is having multiple major characters off elsewhere throughout an entire series. And also the incredibly slow progression of major plot threads. The restructuring of the books is a good thing. I enjoy the series much more than the books since I don't have to read endless descriptions of blood oranges.

[Ezee E]

I don't think Dany is coming to Westeros anytime soon.

Neither do I. In the show, she doesn't even seem to have that in her near future goal.

I hope we get to that point though.

[Lazlo]

Well, the rape wasn't addressed. Either they're holding reaction to it back, playing it way subtle, or they truly fucked up and mis-played that scene. Alan Graves and Nikolaj Coster-Waldau's comments last week point to those involved completely misunderstanding the scene and what it portrayed.

Tonight Jaime was back to his sympathetic ways and Cersei's behavior toward him was no different than before last week. These were not characters recently involved in the violent exchange we saw last week. Is this this show's Landry/Tyra murder plot? Are we just going to have to pretend the rape didn't happen and chalk it up to their attempts to be shocking in the moment with no repercussions? If so, very very poor form from everyone involved.

Rest of the episode was good. I decided to stop reading the books after #4, preferring to have some surprises with the show. They're starting to show some things I'd not read yet, which is neat.

[Qrazy]

Finally some white walker developments.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Judging by reactions on FB and Twitter, that white walker scene wasn't in any of the books. A few people have been up in arms about it. I thought it was cool, but really, it's a fat load of nothing if they aren't addressed again for the rest of the season.

[Irish]

Finally some white walker developments.

I was trying to remember what season it was that had the zombie army marching as a closer. First? Second? Where did all those guys go?

Edit: what the hell, while some of you are here, why is Peggy so angry with Don again? For the life of me, I can't recall.

[number8]

Judging by reactions on FB and Twitter, that white walker scene wasn't in any of the books.

Most of the episode never happened in the books, apparently. The white walkers scene, Jon Snow's interactions with Locke (who is an original character created for the show), Bran's group ending up at Craster's Keep, Hodor getting stabbed.

It's funny seeing all the book readers freaking out because for once, they know nothing.

[slqrick]

The white walkers scene makes sense, but needs more follow up, I think Locke is a Roose Bolton spy, and that whole Craster's Keep scene was just awful.

In terms of the rape, this episode makes it pretty clear that the director really did think they shot in a consensual manner, because it just seemed like just another night of fucked up twincest to both characters, although they clearly wanted Cersei to gain an upper hand on Jaime this episode.

[number8]

I think Locke is a Roose Bolton spy

What do you mean? He does work for House Bolton. He took Jamie and Brienne hostage last season under Roose's orders. And the wedding episode had that scene where Roose tells Locke to find Bran and Rickon. He's at Castle Black because Ramsay told them that Jon Snow knows where Bran and Rickon are.

[[ETM]]

It's funny seeing all the book readers freaking out because for once, they know nothing.

Or do they? Someone noticed HBO Go put something in their information titles, and it basically blew up everything (http://io9.com/this-accidental-game-of-thrones-spoiler-just-changed-1568796246?utm_campaign=social flow_io9_facebook&utm_source=io9_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow).

That is - if we consider "official" additional information to be canon, as it's all done with Martin's blessing.

[number8]

It's not just that. I assume we're going to see several episodes of show-exclusive material this season based around Jon Snow heading out to Craster's Keep and Bran & Rickon being there, which didn't happen in the books.

...Actually I just realized that saying these are new stories could be considered a spoiler since you know they're not going to die during "filler" events between the book canon events. I'm not even sure I'm using the spoiler tag correctly on this.

[Dukefrukem]

Finally some white walker developments.

Fuckin barely.

Can someone please remind me what happened to Osha?

[Dukefrukem]

I was trying to remember what season it was that had the zombie army marching as a closer. First? Second? Where did all those guys go?

Edit: what the hell, while some of you are here, why is Peggy so angry with Don again? For the life of me, I can't recall.

It was the season finale of Season 2 and why Season 3 was so damn disappointing.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Fuckin barely.

Can someone please remind me what happened to Osha?

She went with Rickon after he and Bran went their separate ways.

[Ezee E]

What are the readers going to do when the show passes up the books?

I guess I've never seen so much passionate stuff about making sure it matches the books for quite some time. It seemed like people were about to move past that.

The whole White Walkers thing seems so intentionally sparsed out that nobody really believes it's happening, even though it's truly a huge deal.

[Qrazy]

Fuckin barely.

Can someone please remind me what happened to Osha?

I'll take something over the nothing I got from the books.

[Wryan]

Well, the rape wasn't addressed. Either they're holding reaction to it back, playing it way subtle, or they truly fucked up and mis-played that scene. Alan Graves and Nikolaj Coster-Waldau's comments last week point to those involved completely misunderstanding the scene and what it portrayed.

Tonight Jaime was back to his sympathetic ways and Cersei's behavior toward him was no different than before last week. These were not characters recently involved in the violent exchange we saw last week. Is this this show's Landry/Tyra murder plot? Are we just going to have to pretend the rape didn't happen and chalk it up to their attempts to be shocking in the moment with no repercussions? If so, very very poor form from everyone involved.

In complete accord here. Everything I read makes it sound more and more like things got left on the editing floor or something. That moment was far from consensual, and this latest episode gives the [admittedly brief] impression that welp, life goes on, let's get back to the plot. Haven't read the books, but the impression I get from people who have is that what happened is so contrary to Jaime's character (who loves Cersei mucho and has done things to pretty clearly indicate his distaste for rape, like losing a hand protecting Brienne for one) that it flies in the face of logic for either of them to get over it seemingly so quickly. Similarly, that it would be a huge deal to Cersei in several ways. They can't just let this go and be done with it. They'll need to do something at some point.

[Qrazy]

I was getting Mad Men vibes from that scene. They won't talk about it for a long time and then they'll address it again way down the road.

[Derek]

In complete accord here. Everything I read makes it sound more and more like things got left on the editing floor or something. That moment was far from consensual, and this latest episode gives the [admittedly brief] impression that welp, life goes on, let's get back to the plot. Haven't read the books, but the impression I get from people who have is that what happened is so contrary to Jaime's character (who loves Cersei mucho and has done things to pretty clearly indicate his distaste for rape, like losing a hand protecting Brienne for one) that it flies in the face of logic for either of them to get over it seemingly so quickly. Similarly, that it would be a huge deal to Cersei in several ways. They can't just let this go and be done with it. They'll need to do something at some point.

I remember the sex scene in the book being quick, rough, dirty, with a tinge of desperation and not all that satisfactory for Cersei, but yeah, definitely not rapey like that show. As much as the show has tried to redeem Jaime (and it actually hasn't done that as effectively as the books, mostly due to time constraints), you do have to consider that everything he went through in the last season or two was to get back to Cersei and simply rebuffs for being too late. Not saying that excuses the rape at all, but it makes sense coming from a character who would push an innocent child out of a window and is resigned to remain in the kingsguard for life, despite his ability and position to do much more with his life, just to remain close to his sister-lover. I would've preferred the writers and directors owned that scene as rape and followed it up with something suggesting that was what actually happened. That said, I do have the same feeling as Qrazy that Cersei is holding it close to the vest and this may be addressed later.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I remember the sex scene in the book being quick, rough, dirty, with a tinge of desperation and not all that satisfactory for Cersei, but yeah, definitely not rapey like that show. As much as the show has tried to redeem Jaime (and it actually hasn't done that as effectively as the books, mostly due to time constraints), you do have to consider that everything he went through in the last season or two was to get back to Cersei and simply rebuffs for being too late. Not saying that excuses the rape at all, but it makes sense coming from a character who would push an innocent child out of a window and is resigned to remain in the kingsguard for life, despite his ability and position to do much more with his life, just to remain close to his sister-lover. I would've preferred the writers and directors owned that scene as rape and followed it up with something suggesting that was what actually happened. That said, I do have the same feeling as Qrazy that Cersei is holding it close to the vest and this may be addressed later.

Also, especially after this last episode, it almost felt like a breaking away moment for Jaime, both from his sister and from what the Lannister's stand for. He's standing up for his brother, going completely against his sister's wishes by sending Brienne to protect Sansa, giving Brienne the sword, trying to change his history in the King's Guard, etc. He seems to be severing his ties with his old life, and the rape can be seen as a last desperate act of connection that ultimately turned into the moment of realization that he is no longer part of this family. THIS DOES NOT JUSTIFY THE DECISION TO INCLUDE THAT RAPE (needed to stress that, since I still think the scene is a deplorable change in Jaime's character), but at least some sort of explanation as to why the scene was included.

[slqrick]

Hodor hodor hodor.

As a book reader, the new/extrapolated scenes were amazing in this episode.

[Dukefrukem]

These shows are getting painful. There's too much going on across this universe to care about any particular scene. The shows need to stick to 2 or 3 parties and follow up the next episode with the remainders. 5 minutes of screen time for some of the characters is not enough.

[number8]

Took me for a loop how the major bombshell of the episode was dropped so casually in the middle of a conversation, with no build up or follow through whatsoever. The David Simon approach to plot twists, heh.

That was some pretty fucking crazy reveal, though.

[Scar]

Yeah, I wasn't completely paying attention, and then it was: "Wait, what did she say?!"

[Dukefrukem]

Yeh suddenly Littlefinger is a major plot character.

[EyesWideOpen]

These shows are getting painful. There's too much going on across this universe to care about any particular scene. The shows need to stick to 2 or 3 parties and follow up the next episode with the remainders. 5 minutes of screen time for some of the characters is not enough.

I disagree completely. I love the way this show does storytelling.

[slqrick]

Yeh suddenly Littlefinger is a major plot character.

Nah, he has been the whole time, it's just that no one noticed because he's Littlefinger.

And agreed with EWO. If you have issues with the storytelling, I'm not sure why you're still watching after four seasons, because it's been like this from episode one, and it's not changing any time soon. I agree that sometimes it can get annoying that the characters are so far away from each other and you only get random check ups with one character versus another in any given episode, but it's the nature of Martin's story.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Littlefinger is easily the most evil motherfucker in Westeros.

[number8]

This season has been pretty limited in locations/storylines, actually. Season 2 and 3 jumped around way more.

We haven't even seen Gendry or Rickon all season.

[Dukefrukem]

This season has been pretty limited in locations/storylines, actually. Season 2 and 3 jumped around way more.

We haven't even seen Gendry or Rickon all season.

It has, but why bother showing us Arya last night... ? or Tarth? Extend the other scenes and leave these for other episodes.

[Qrazy]

It has, but why bother showing us Arya last night... ? or Tarth? Extend the other scenes and leave these for other episodes.

Because Arya rules.

[Lazlo]

It has, but why bother showing us Arya last night... ? or Tarth? Extend the other scenes and leave these for other episodes.

Arya's scene contributes to the (admittedly already well-established) theme of the Starks (and others) not understanding that their fancy, honorable ways are worth jack shit outside of Winterfell. Brienne's scenes establish her relationship with Podrick that will become a key storyline here in a bit. I don't see why, having watched 3.5 seasons of a show that has always built itself out of small scenes like these, you'd start complaining now.

I welcome chances to check in with different characters. Which scenes would you have rather seen more of? This seemed like a pretty tightly constructed episode to me.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Yeah, the Brienne and Arya scenes were two of my favorite moments from last night.

[Watashi]

I can already see the internet explode with all the shipping possibilities between Brienne and Pod.

[Dukefrukem]

Because Arya rules.

No doubt.

[[ETM]]

I dunno, I'm perfectly invested in all storylines and care enough to keep track - with ease - of what's going on and where everyone is. It's... not that difficult at all.

[Mara]

I haven't cared about Theon in a couple of seasons. Other than that, I am at least moderately interested in all the storylines.

[number8]

:)

[Wryan]

I hope Rickon (otherwise known as Not-Bran) isn't particularly important to the narrative cause little dude has been a non-entity since day 1 basically. I lost track of him and haven't cared for a moment. Would suck if he Suddenly Becomes Important.

Great episode last night though. All 25 minutes of it.

[Ezee E]

-Arya's scene was the highlight of the episode for me.

-Littlefinger may be my favorite villain in all of the series. What a cool scene to see how well that castle is defended.

-Nah, maybe Cersei.

-Thankfully, no breastfeeding.

-The raping in this episode goes untalked about.

-Will Sansa ever strike anyone?

-The idea of Daenerys even approaching Westeros is exciting. I knew that would be too good to be true. But really, why is she limited to one scene per show?

[Dukefrukem]

Best episode ever.

[number8]

Peter. Fucking. Dinklage.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Fucking incredible. He is just incredible.

[number8]

This is great. (http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/2014/5/8/interview-with-linguist-david-peterson)


HBO: Have you planted any Easter eggs in the show?

David Peterson: One of the biggest is from Episode 3 this season. There's a scene where the Meereenese rider is challenging Daenerys' champion. He's shouting and Nathalie Emmanuel [Missandei] is translating – but she's not translating what he's saying. He's actually saying a Low Valyrian translation of the French guy's insults in 'Monte Python and the Holy Grail.' That was [series creator] Dan Weiss's idea and it was so hilarious that I had to do it.

HBO: Have fans caught on?

David Peterson: They know that something's going on. Right after that episode aired, I was getting tweets like, "Is he saying a 'your momma' joke?" Close… But no, he's actually starting out with, "Your mother is a hamster."

[Barty]

Fucking amazing episode.

Now, I haven't read the books, so please don't spoil anything directly, but is this why Tyrion's move is genius?

By doing trial by combat, Jaime can volunteer to be his champion since Jaime won't want Tyrion to fight for himself? However, of course, if Jaime volunteers for Tyrion that means Tywin is left trying to pick someone to kill his own son or let Tyrion go?

[Ezee E]

I won't say best episode ever, but for once there were multiple scenes that outdid Daenerys' scene. I seriously thought we had another 15-20 minutes to go in this one. That was great.

In fact, each section was pretty topnotch. I like the Greyjoy subplot a lot.

No Jon Snow, Brian Stark, or Winterfell helps things.

[Watashi]

Finally. The Iron Bank.

[Dukefrukem]

No Jon Snow, Brian Stark, or Winterfell helps things.

Or Arya. See this is the kind of episode I was talking about last week. It was the OPPOSITE of last week's 5 minutes here and 5 minutes there episode.

[EyesWideOpen]

Finally. The Iron Bank.

with Mycroft Holmes!

[slqrick]

Good episode with an incredible last 10 minutes. Give Dinklage all the Emmy's.

[number8]

Iwan Rheon and Alfie Allen were terrific this episode, too. That bathtub scene was butthole clenching.

[Wryan]

How the heck are they doing Ser Davos's fingers? CGI? It also appeared in that other scene after he washed up on the rock after Blackwater. Pretty convincing effect regardless. The best is still that shot of the Hound ramming that guy's face onto his own knife several times...in fucking closeup! How!?

Great episode.

[Ezee E]

Iwan Rheon and Alfie Allen were terrific this episode, too. That bathtub scene was butthole clenching.

Yes. Iwan Rheon is fantastic. Although I do question how he comes out unscathed in a fight where everyone else has full armor.

[Lucky]

I thought the Theon stuff was still rather silly, but I'll raise a glass to the praise for the rest.

[Dead & Messed Up]

I dislike the Theon stuff. Whenever a scene in that plot begins, I think, "Well, I'll be feeling unpleasant for the next five minutes."

[EyesWideOpen]

Yes. Iwan Rheon is fantastic. Although I do question how he comes out unscathed in a fight where everyone else has full armor.

Why do you question that?

Are you saying it's not possible? He fought like 2 guys.

[Qrazy]

Not having full armor on means he can move more quickly.

[number8]

It's a bit of a stretch only because he was up against the Ironborn, who the show established as so badass that each of them is worth ten regular warriors, but apparently can be easily matched by Ramsay and his goons. I know that the scene's intention is just to show Ramsay as so crazy that he would go fight Ironborn men unprotected, so it doesn't bother me much, but it does fall into that old trope of crazy > skills.

[Dukefrukem]

Saw that coming.

Solid.

[Wryan]

Pedro Pascal is fucking killing it. That Oberyn/Tyrion scene was beautiful, stunning.

[Lazlo]

Strongest episode in a long, long while. Really brought the characters to the forefront in a way that has been a bit lacking this year. Scene after scene of wonderful things.

[Ezee E]

Pedro Pascal is fucking killing it. That Oberyn/Tyrion scene was beautiful, stunning.

Yeah, he hasn't really had a standout scene yet, but I could tell there's something awesome there. He showed it tonight.

[Sxottlan]

For all the hype about Dinklage's performance last week, which I thought was a little overdone, I thought he was phenomenal tonight. All three scenes of him and his visitors were riveting.

Can't believe there's only three episodes left.

[Qrazy]

The hound's story about his childhood. :cry:

[Lazlo]

For all the hype about Dinklage's performance last week, which I thought was a little overdone, I thought he was phenomenal tonight. All three scenes of him and his visitors were riveting.

Can't believe there's only three episodes left.


100% agree. He was perfect tonight, slightly over the top last week.

[Lucky]

The hound's story about his childhood. :cry:

I'm in the process of researching S1 with a few friends who want to start the show. There's a scene in the fourth episode where Littlefinger whispers the story of The Hound in Sansa's ear while Arya sits right next to them. Well, she knows now.

[Lazlo]

Also: HOT PIE

[number8]

That sharp intake and sigh that convey surprise, gratitude and relief all at once when Oberyn said "I will be your champion." Some of the best acting on this show are when characters just wordlessly react to things. Even last week, I was more impressed by Dinklage's acting when he's listening to Shae and the very last shot when he's smirking at Tywin than the actual speech.

[number8]

Man, tumblr is really freaking out over the "Only Cat"/"Your sister" change.

[Wryan]

That sharp intake and sigh that convey surprise, gratitude and relief all at once when Oberyn said "I will be your champion." Some of the best acting on this show are when characters just wordlessly react to things. Even last week, I was more impressed by Dinklage's acting when he's listening to Shae and the very last shot when he's smirking at Tywin than the actual speech.

Arya: Any man can be killed.

Tywin: ...

[number8]

Margaery: Word has it, that I am to be your bride.

Tommen: ...

[Dead & Messed Up]

Now, how quickly can we toss that Robin kid through the moon door?

[Wryan]

In case anyone wanted to watch this again:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7n79tN6Fpw

Also, apparently, this was the very first scene that Pascal shot for Oberyn. That's pretty impressive.

[Ezee E]

Didn't realize that The Mountain was The Hound's Brother...

[Mara]

Maisie Williams is only one year younger than Sophie Turner. (Also, she's 17. She still looks 14, tops.)

The nine inch height difference might be why it's so confusing.

[Dukefrukem]

Was there not a new episode on last night?

[Henry Gale]

Was there not a new episode on last night?

Nope. You Americans had to have Memorial Day instead. As if people with the day off wouldn't have loved to have had it waiting to catch up with today regardless.

We had our big holiday last weekend, and it felt so good for everyone to get together and watch it without having to duck out immediately because they had work in the morning! Why can't the States enjoy the same luxury?!

So oddly (coincidentally?) for the second year in a row, HBO opted to show an original, high-profile drama where AIDS factors in heavily. But even though I haven't seen The Normal Heart, I'm just gonna go ahead and categorically say: Getting a new Ryan Murphy movie last night < Getting a new Steven Soderbergh movie last year.

[number8]

In season 2, the Battle of Blackwater episode aired on Memorial Day weekend and it had the lowest rating of the season despite the hype. The Memorial Day drop off in viewership is certainly real. Most networks experience about 20% decline.

[Henry Gale]

In season 2, the Battle of Blackwater episode aired on Memorial Day weekend and it had the lowest rating of the season despite the hype. The Memorial Day drop off in viewership is certainly real. Most networks experience about 20% decline.

Yeah I get that, I was being more jokingly sardonic about it than I actually feel, especially since it seems like it'll be a similarly pivotal episode to Blackwater, and I get that HBO would rather allow for the most people see it at once rather than allowing the risk for some to be spoiled if they didn't see it because of the holiday. Not to mention the last episode was a new series high that they wouldn't want to waste the streak of.

But on the flipside, in a day and age where HBO says they value critical acclaim and cultural response over actual viewership, every subscriber to them having an option to instantly catch up on GO, and the rest of the world who doesn't have the holiday so closely plugged into it as a series, it is an unwanted snag.

Oh well, I just used last night to go see Days of Future Past instead. Got my Dinklage fill that way.

[Scar]

SQUISHY!

[Wryan]

Jesus.

No monologuing! How many times we said it!? Just finish it!

[Kurosawa Fan]

Sooooo fucking good. Just a devastating ending. Perhaps the highlight of the episode for me was Arya's reaction after being told about Lady Arryn.

[Scar]

Jesus.

No monologuing! How many times we said it!? Just finish it!

At least he wasn't wearing a cape.

[Wryan]

Also, the beetles convo was a little daffy. Strained for Important...didn't quite get there.

[Henry Gale]

Also, the beetles convo was a little daffy. Strained for Important...didn't quite get there.

Yeah, I feel like the dramatic momentum and general point came about halfway through it. Well acted and interesting enough, but it just felt like stalling knowing what the next scene was.

And what a scene it was.

[number8]

(ノ ゜Д゜)ノ ︵ ┻━┻

[EyesWideOpen]

Sooooo fucking good. Just a devastating ending. Perhaps the highlight of the episode for me was Arya's reaction after being told about Lady Arryn.

Ditto to everything you said.

[Ezee E]

If they're both dead, how does that affect the trial?

[slqrick]

If they're both dead, how does that affect the trial?

Who said they're both dead?

[Barty]

Jesus...

that was the worst death on this show in pure horrifying terms. Oberyn has never shown any vulnerability, until that horrifying scream of having your eyes gauged out.

[Henry Gale]

Jesus...

that was the worst death on this show in pure horrifying terms. Oberyn has never shown any vulnerability, until that horrifying scream of having your eyes gauged out.

Not only that, but this might just be the first time the show killed a character I loved this much, despite him being such a recent addition. (Which of course Martin probably did by design and subsequently Benioff & Weiss knew from their own relationship to him from the books to completely played into with their teleplays). It all only makes it even more gutting, especially as it sinks in since the comedown of watching the general rush and then horror of the scene.

I liked Ned just fine -- since that's how he kind of was by design, making you view him as the agreeable moral center that's going to take you through the series, and then by killing him mischievously taking all of those safety nets away, with all bets off -- but the show in its first season hadn't yet become what it is for me now (though his death was a major factor in my solidifying my admiration for the series early on). It's a shame I didn't care nearly as much for Catelyn and (particularly) Robb (King of Dullsville in addition to the North), since Rains of Castamere was such a major episode for the series, and really made the otherwise stellar Season 3 conclude with a bit of a messy wimper in my eyes. Michelle MacLaren's direction, the design of the episode, the performances and the storytelling momentum towards it were all superb, I just couldn't muster much anguish for who ended up dying, especially since the vague hype of the episode basically told me what was bound to happen.

Oberyn (and Pascal playing him), on the other hand, was just awesome and completely brought his own energy and worldview to the show. It's like if they had killed Tyrion after his 8th episode.

Damn...

[Watashi]

http://i.imgur.com/K8E2u3h.jpg?1?6790

[amberlita]

I know everyone else will talk about the ending, but bravo to Sansa for behaving like something other than a total wet rag for the first time ever. Was it just the light playing tricks on me, or did she color her hair dark in the final scene where she's coming down the stairs? She looked remarkably like Catelyn and I'd assume that was her intent given that she knows "what Littlefinger wants".

[Kurosawa Fan]

I know everyone else will talk about the ending, but bravo to Sansa for behaving like something other than a total wet rag for the first time ever. Was it just the light playing tricks on me, or did she color her hair dark in the final scene where she's coming down the stairs? She looked remarkably like Catelyn and I'd assume that was her intent given that she knows "what Littlefinger wants".

She had definitely colored her hair to look more like Cat.

[number8]

Oh there are a lot of things we're glossing over because of the fight. It was a superb episode all around. The opening scene, for instance: that last shot of Ygritte walking away and the camera rack focusing on blood dripping trough the ceiling was righteous. Grey Worm's cute talk with Missandei, quickly countered with Ser Jorah's banishment.

The beetle speech is a bit on the nose, but man it was also really, really funny. I laughed hysterically when Jaime said, "He tried to touch me once!" and Tyrion just ignored it.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Grey Worm's cute talk with Missandei, quickly countered with Ser Jorah's banishment.


This sequence, and the event that led to the talk, was the only part of the episode that felt off to me. I've abandoned the books in favor of the show, so perhaps it's something that will be developed later, but to me it just felt like an excuse to throw more nudity on screen. The crux of their conversation had already taken shape while she was teaching him language. I feel they could have arrived at the same point more organically from those private lessons rather than what felt like an awkward and forced confrontation with his ability to be sexually aroused after watching her bathe. Sort of made me roll my eyes. This show is strong enough at this point to rid itself of cheap thrills via female nudity.

[number8]

Their closeness was already established, but the point of this episode's scenes was to specifically address his ability for sexual desire as an unsullied. It's why their conversation about how he appreciates her lessons ended with the awkward "I'm glad you saw me naked" line. I would think that this is one of the few instances where the nudity was absolutely warranted. If it was just affection, it would be a different interaction.

[number8]

Another thing I laughed pretty hard at: the thought that someone picked Pycelle to be the hype man to a fight.

[Lazlo]

Another thing I laughed pretty hard at: the thought that someone picked Pycelle to be the hype man to a fight.

When Tywin cut him off I got a Roger Sterling/Harry Crane vibe. Pretty damn funny.

[number8]

This fucking guy.

473481358556160002

[Kurosawa Fan]

Their closeness was already established, but the point of this episode's scenes was to specifically address his ability for sexual desire as an unsullied. It's why their conversation about how he appreciates her lessons ended with the awkward "I'm glad you saw me naked" line. I would think that this is one of the few instances where the nudity was absolutely warranted. If it was just affection, it would be a different interaction.

But the show has had this discussion before with Varys. I guess at this point I question the purpose of the moment. Sure, they're addressing his ability to experience sexual desire, but to what end? Why is that significant? They can humanize Grey Worm in other ways, as they were with his language lessons. Perhaps I'm just cynical because of the amount of times this show reverts to shallow titillation.

[amberlita]

I hope the next death on this show is someone dying of liver cirrhosis or old age. Now that would be shocking.

[Henry Gale]

This fucking guy.

Not sure why this makes me laugh so much. (instagram.com/p/ov11YCnw-U) Probably his combination of the thumbs up, the shades, and the caption.

And from Lena Heady's Instagram two months ago...

http://photos-h.ak.instagram.com/hphotos-ak-xfp1/1527730_478809682242495_565204 005_n.jpg

Sly gal...

[Ezee E]

Who said they're both dead?

I was thinking they might be. Guess not..

[Dead & Messed Up]

Who said they're both dead?

Mountain got two direct chest stabs from an expert swordsman. Frankly thought it was a bit silly that he felt capable enough to leap up and crush a skull and smirk the whole time. Heat of the moment? Either way, hope he enjoys the victory with his punctured organs.

[Scar]

Mountain got two direct chest stabs from an expert swordsman. Frankly thought it was a bit silly that he felt capable enough to leap up and crush a skull and smirk the whole time. Heat of the moment? Either way, hope he enjoys the victory with his punctured organs.

Adrenaline is a beautiful thing. Watch a pissed off cape buffalo with a couple large bullets through the heart go right through the hunter.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Adrenaline is a beautiful thing. Watch a pissed off cape buffalo with a couple large bullets through the heart go right through the hunter.

Does the adrenalized cape buffalo play dead for a solid minute while you try to extract a confession? Moreover, what does the buffalo need to confess to? What exactly happened between you and that buffalo, Scar?

[quido8_5]

Meh. Any special passion I had for this series got squandered when it took the same basic blueprint for three concurrent episodes. My litmus test for success this season is still obstinately in the air: will the White Walkers be even remotely substantial this season. Considering they started the series off with such promise on this front, it's a shame to see the show shy away from this. The most important piece of WW backstory this season was outside of the book, from what I understand. If they want GoT to be something set apart, Weiss and co. Will have to stop the serialization and amp up the skilled writing. The past couple of episodes have been painful with dialogue more often than not. Once, just once, I'd love for there to be a surprising character shift (not like the hound being vulnerable or Sensa being a projection of Catelyn).

[Ezee E]

I completely buy the adrenaline bit and have no problem with it.

[Dead & Messed Up]

I don't think it breaks the scene or anything. Just a bit farfetched and silly. The show's not above that. See also: Ramsay's Shirtless Immunity Powers.

Anyway, that scene about the beetles was awesome.

[Qrazy]

Pretty sure in the book he just grabs him and crushes him against himself, no leaping on top. That would have been better.

[Wryan]

Tee-hee.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vob2_MSpXQc

[Ezee E]

Either way, The Mountain will need to be put down like a horse. His Achilles is gone. A man that big will never walk again.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Either way, The Mountain will need to be put down like a horse. His Achilles is gone. A man that big will never walk again.

I envision a sedentary Jabba the Hutt existence. Ut ta choo toh, Arya? Oh oh oh. Ahh ah ah.

[Dukefrukem]

Tee-hee.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vob2_MSpXQc

Good video but I was distracted by: Glasses hipster, green hair hipster, beard hipster, dyed black hair hipster.

[Dukefrukem]

Either way, The Mountain will need to be put down like a horse. His Achilles is gone. A man that big will never walk again.

Tell that to Vince Wilfork!

[number8]

ALL YOUNG PEOPLE ARE NOW HIPSTERS!

YOU'RE A HIPSTER!

AND YOU'RE A HIPSTER!

AND YOU'RE A HIPSTER TOO!

TATTOOS? THAT MAKES YOU A HIPSTER!

T-SHIRT? YOU'RE A HIPSTER!

[Dukefrukem]

You forgot the V-neck hipster.

[number8]

Doesn't matter, anyone with a neck is a hipster.

[Watashi]

I'm a hipster.

[number8]

I believe the new cultural punchline is normcore now.

[Wryan]

I just saw a lot of young people. I must be doing something wrong.

[Dukefrukem]

I just saw a lot of young people. I must be doing something wrong.

Cuz green hair is normal.

[number8]

:lol: How old are you, duke?

[Dukefrukem]

:lol: How old are you, duke?

30- why is that funny? Wryan was having difficulty spotting the hipster and I was pointing out that it was incredibly hard to miss if you you were looking for the girl with the green hair.

[number8]

...I wasn't seriously asking, I already know how old you are from Facebook. It was just a crotchety old manny thing to say.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Damn kids with their green hair and their Game Boy Micros, listenin to the Lana DeRay.

[EyesWideOpen]

People way overuse the word hipster nowadays.

[Dukefrukem]

...I wasn't seriously asking, I already know how old you are from Facebook. It was just a crotchety old manny thing to say.

Reading back, you're probably right. For some reason, the people in that video really annoyed me. I'm channeling my inner Louis CK.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOmwZUsgBBE

[Ezee E]

I kept watching the GoT scene rather then the reactions of the people.

[Ivan Drago]

Duke, I honestly think you're a bro, bro. How many miles does your Hummer have?

[Dukefrukem]

Duke, I honestly think you're a bro, bro. How many miles does your Hummer have?

You keep saying this on twitter and MC- What does this question even mean? Man up and explain yourself.

[EyesWideOpen]

By using the term "man up" you've already explained it.

[Benny Profane]

But the show has had this discussion before with Varys. I guess at this point I question the purpose of the moment. Sure, they're addressing his ability to experience sexual desire, but to what end?


Game of Thrones is trying to win the Emmy for most boobs in a drama series.

True Detective should win for best boobs.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Game of Thrones is trying to win the Emmy for most boobs in a drama series.

True Detective should win for best boobs.

That would be a lock.

[Scar]

That would be a lock.

Oh yeah....

[amberlita]

Dear god yes. I must have stared at that TD woman's tits for at least 5 minutes. I think its boob envy. Or they were so perfect that even I wanted to bury my face in them.

On another note, my sister sent me a video of my nephew squashing a blueberry because it reminded her of Prince Oberyn. Hee.

[number8]

435672641966313472

[Kurosawa Fan]

:lol:

[dreamdead]

Awwwww. I was looking forward to Oberyn being a major player in the series--was thinking he, like Charles Dance, would keep becoming more and more vital to the show. Curious as to if this anticipates the usual "oh shit episode 9 = :( over a character's fate" or it this is all I'll be forlorn about re: this show in the coming days.

[Ivan Drago]

You keep saying this on twitter and MC- What does this question even mean? Man up and explain yourself.

What EWO said. My questions imply that in instances like that, you sound like the stereotypical equivalent of a frat boy, otherwise referred to in today lingo. . .as a BRO, BRO!!! Have no fear, 'tis only a repetitive jab at your side with a stick. I mean no harm. :D

In all seriousness, did you get that TV for your bathroom? This is the post you made about it, if I remember correctly:

http://matchcut.artboiled.com/showthread.php?4324-Black-Friday-2012&p=451347&viewfull=1#post451347

Steering the thread back on track, though, as soon as. . .The Mountain knocked Oberyn's teeth out, I cringed in both disgust for how Oberyn died, in disappointment that he died, and sadness that Tyrion might die. :(

[Dead & Messed Up]

There's something maybe funny about the broad labeling of hipsters corrected with the broad label of bro. We've balanced the scales, folks.

[Dukefrukem]

I never was in a frat in college and never have used the bro after a sentence. Glad we can get past that now.

[slqrick]

Watched the episode again last night, and hoooly shit Indira Verma's scream is seriously one of the most harrowing pieces of audio I've ever heard on TV.

Funny to see all posts on my facebook talking about how this was "THE WORST EPISODE OF GOT EVERS."

[Henry Gale]

Funny to see all posts on my facebook talking about how this was "THE WORST EPISODE OF GOT EVERS."

Haha, I don't even know how someone who's stuck with the show this long could even think that. Do people really want everything in the shows they watch to go as gratifyingly swimmingly in as much stasis as possible?

Just give a simple virtual nod if their profiles have "Likes" for things like Suits, Entourage, Dexter, Big Bang Theory or any procedurals.

[Ezee E]

Gotta say that I haven't seen any criticisms of the show, just sorrow that one of their faves got killed.

[Scar]

Watched the episode again last night, and hoooly shit Indira Verma's scream is seriously one of the most harrowing pieces of audio I've ever heard on TV.


That scream was perfection.

[Russ]

...the stereotypical equivalent of a frat boy, otherwise referred to in today lingo. . .as a BRO

Down here in the Deep South, I hear both BRO (Brother) and BO (Bubba) used frequently as part of the young, white redneck vernacular. Don't know about any of its origins associated with colleges and/or fraternities.



How'bout that Davos, eh? My favorite character...glad he didn't get his head smushed in.

[Irish]

Gotta say that I haven't seen any criticisms of the show

<< Coughs quietly from the back row >>

[Dead & Messed Up]

Gotta say that I haven't seen any criticisms of the show, just sorrow that one of their faves got killed.

I think I've criticized it before, but maybe not here. Certainly this season has been awfully heavy on "characters sit down and discuss the plot to each other" scenes. To the point that Rigg even lampshades it with a joke about having to walk through the gardens one more damn time.

EDIT. And the stuff with Sansa's aunt laid thick into soap opera theatrics. Shocker-- somebody saw them kiss! And the old "You know as well as I do" style exposition she delivers to Littlefinger.

EDIT. And the Ramsay scenes continue to be dryly functional and fail to offer any character enlightenment (even moreso than the Stannis stuff, which is just as dull but at least offers the possibility of sorcery instead of mutilation genital and otherwise).

EDIT. And the rape stuff.

[EyesWideOpen]

Game of Thrones is one of those shows that I am so blindly in love with that other peoples criticism don't mean fuck all to me.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Game of Thrones is one of those shows that I am so blindly in love with that other peoples criticism don't mean fuck all to me.

The only kind of love is stone blind love.

[slqrick]

I think I've criticized it before, but maybe not here. Certainly this season has been awfully heavy on "characters sit down and discuss the plot to each other" scenes. To the point that Rigg even lampshades it with a joke about having to walk through the gardens one more damn time.

EDIT. And the stuff with Sansa's aunt laid thick into soap opera theatrics. Shocker-- somebody saw them kiss! And the old "You know as well as I do" style exposition she delivers to Littlefinger.

EDIT. And the Ramsay scenes continue to be dryly functional and fail to offer any character enlightenment (even moreso than the Stannis stuff, which is just as dull but at least offers the possibility of sorcery instead of mutilation genital and otherwise).

EDIT. And the rape stuff.

I love the Misfits dude in Ramsey's role, and I gotta say I found the scene between him and Roose at Moat Cailin one of the most beautifully filmed sequences of the season.

[Dead & Messed Up]

I love the Misfits dude in Ramsey's role, and I gotta say I found the scene between him and Roose at Moat Cailin one the most beautifully filmed sequences of the season.

Agreed to the second part. The location work on the show is nearly immaculate.

[quido8_5]

<< Coughs quietly from the back row >>

:Looks down at half eaten bowl of popcorn, nodding dejectedly:

[number8]

The show has many faults. I will always contest the idea that they kill main characters just for shock value, though. Which is why I found the heavy handed beetle speech compelling nonetheless. Of course there's a reason. Every single major character death so far has led to huge narrative shifts.

[quido8_5]

The show has many faults. I will always contest the idea that they kill main characters just for shock value, though. Which is why I found the heavy handed beetle speech compelling nonetheless. Of course there's a reason. Every single major character death so far has led to huge narrative shifts.

At this point, to me, it seems like they're relying on it. The last major narrative turn that didn't happen through a death was, what, Jamie's disfigurement?

Game of Thrones puts me in that awkward position of liking something that everyone loves. It's entertaining and well-made, but saying that it's something special is a leap. In an era where there actually are special things happening elsewhere (Louie, Mad Men, True Detective and to a lesser extent The Americans), it's frustrating that the praise for GoT is so deafening. Especially this season, they seem to have doubled down on the shock and withdrawn from the biting dialogue and complex politicking that were my favorite parts of the first two seasons. Hey, I appreciate gratuitous nudity and gruesome violence as much as the next HBO viewer, but come the fuck on- it's a fun serial, not the second coming.

[Irish]

The excessive violence is for shock value. The sudden deaths are in lieu of any real, human drama.

There are many elements to this show that I enjoy, but this past season seemed repetitive and contrived. (The explanation of Joffrey's murder, Tyrion falsely accused in a ridiculous way. Tyrion pulling the trial by combat card ... again. Tywin, aka wannabe Machiavelli, somehow doesn't see that coming. As a guy distracted by his family's reputation, Tywin's a little too willing to stage a show trial for regicide. Sansa's entire story arc, which really isn't an arc but a flat line with a single bump in it. Jon Snow. Oberon's entire character. Arya wandering the Vale for .. How long? Etc. Etc.).

The staging, I think, is a problem. Most scenes contain just two characters, usually standing in a bare room, making idle threats to one another or foreshadowing, foreshadowing, foreshadowing. Every other scene feels like a major cliff hanger, which makes every other scene feel tone deaf.

The show does what it does well enough, but I think it unintentionally showcases the weaknesses around George RR Martin's writing. He seems to be very good at description and world building, but very ham handed around plot.

[Dead & Messed Up]

The show has many faults. I will always contest the idea that they kill main characters just for shock value, though. Which is why I found the heavy handed beetle speech compelling nonetheless. Of course there's a reason. Every single major character death so far has led to huge narrative shifts.

I didn't see that speech as a reference to GRRM. I thought it was more of a thematic apogee in a story about quests for thrones.

What I gleaned from it was that Orson khunked beetles because of power. Tyrion relates how he was looked down upon by his surrounding family, but rather than see his cousin with sympathy, he elected to join his family in looking down on Orson. So the powerful castigate Tyrion because it reinforces their superiority, and Tyrion joins in the mockery of Orson because it makes him feel less helpless (more powerful). And what can poor Orson do to not feel helpless? Seek out his own victim. All the poor kid's got is a bunch of beetles. We all want power. We all feel better when we have a beetle to khunk.

I don't know if I believe it completely, but I remember that, back when I was bullied in school, I once laughed along with the bullies at someone even dorkier than me. I feel shitty about it to this day, but I remember what a relief it was to not be the most helpless person in the room.

[Ezee E]

It's officially HBO's biggest show ever now. Impressive, I would never have thought that a few years ago.

[Mara]

Baby Pedro Pascal, before he learned to defend himself and got et by vampires.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v254/maragirl/4X01FRE0905.jpg

[Henry Gale]

The individual storytelling threads might be more fragmented and intermittent than ever but wow, the episodes not suffering at all.

Re-watched last week's episode this morning and tonight's was so grandiose and stunningly visceral in its own ways too. No idea what they'll do next week since this year has broken the structural formulas so much already, and I can't wait for the finale, but I'm already so satisfied by what they've done thus far that it'll just be a big cherry (and reunion of recently M.I.A. characters) on top. For me, maybe its best season?

[Lucky]

Prince Oberyn was Buffy's first new college friend? Ha, that's amusing.

[Dukefrukem]

By far the best season.

[number8]

Neil fucking Marshall.

[Ezee E]

That was more thrilling then any LOTR battle.

Neil Marshall needs to return to movies, that was quality.

[Sxottlan]

Nice!

[Dead & Messed Up]

Needed more wolf, and I was wondering why the Night's Watch weren't immediately throwing arrows at the mammoth and giants when they started chaining up the gate, but yeah, very satisfying. I liked it a good deal more than "Blackwater."

[Kurosawa Fan]

Meh. Technically impressive, but I was bored. A few standout moments, one particularly eye-roll worthy moment (Jon and Ygritte), and a shrug of the shoulders when the credits rolled. Looking forward to next week.

[number8]

That was more thrilling then any LOTR battle.

Let's not go crazy. Jon Snow's jump from the elevator was badass, but it was no skating on a shield while shooting arrows.

[Dukefrukem]

Let's not go crazy. Jon Snow's jump from the elevator was badass, but it was no skating on a shield while shooting arrows.

Nor was it gaining the trust of a ghost army and to have them fight Orcs.

[Mara]

It was dark and there was fighting.

I imagine this is the sort of episode that would fit better in a marathon rewatch. Exciting, but not kuch happened.

[Dead & Messed Up]

Maybe after all the narrative subversions of this show, I was primed for a traditional big battle with melodramatic, rewarding beats and cheer-worthy honor-heavy valor. And big fucking wall-scythes.

[Mara]

It looked very cool, well-choreographed, and relatively expensive. I just didn't feel much narrative drive to it.

[Irish]

Someone please tell me I'm wrong in this prediction:

Jon Snow becomes leader of the wildlings & uses that army to invade the north & retake his father's throne.

[Dukefrukem]

Someone please tell me I'm wrong in this prediction:

Jon Snow becomes leader of the wildlings & uses that army to invade the north & retake his father's throne.

He's the most likable character in the show so I pray that doesn't come true.

[Lazlo]

Meh. Technically impressive, but I was bored. A few standout moments, one particularly eye-roll worthy moment (Jon and Ygritte), and a shrug of the shoulders when the credits rolled. Looking forward to next week.

I'll agree with this (and Mara too). This was one of my favorite scenes in the book and as an episode it fell completely flat to me.

[Watashi]

I thought this was one of the best episodes of the series based on a pure visual storytelling scale.

Why does everything need to be about plot?

[[ETM]]

This was one of my favorite scenes in the book and as an episode it fell completely flat to me.

My girlfriend cried.

[EyesWideOpen]

I thought this was one of the best episodes of the series based on a pure visual storytelling scale.

Why does everything need to be about plot?

And normally the complaint I hear is too much talking and not enough action.