The Book Discussion Thread

[megladon8]

Reading Dark Harvest now, due to meg's rave.

It seems like it should be a kid's book, but by all means it isn't. I'm digging it a lot right now. I bet I'll have it finished by the weekend.


:) Awesome!

If you enjoy it, though, D_Davis is the one to thank! He got me to read it - his review was even read and commented on by Norman Partridge.

It's a brilliant little horror story, and it's exactly the type of book that keeps my love for horror fiction burning bright.

[Spinal]

After nearly six months of bedtime reading, my son and I finally finished the His Dark Materials trilogy this evening. It gives me such joy to have been able to read him such a beautiful expression of the value of humanism. Many moments tugged at the heartstrings, but those final two chapters were very difficult to read with an unwavering voice. Masterful.

[Mara]

After nearly six months of bedtime reading, my son and I finally finished the His Dark Materials trilogy this evening. It gives me such joy to have been able to read him such a beautiful expression of the value of humanism. Many moments tugged at the heartstrings, but those final two chapters were very difficult to read with an unwavering voice. Masterful.


I like them quite well. Did you see the film adaptation? I was excited until the reviews came out, but then avoided it so it wouldn't sully the novels for me.

[Spinal]

I like them quite well. Did you see the film adaptation? I was excited until the reviews came out, but then avoided it so it wouldn't sully the novels for me.

I won't be as harsh on the film as others will be, but no, it is not a throughly satisfying experience for those who love the book. I do think that they get a lot things right, particularly in casting. The film looks great and the special effects Oscar was well deserved. But due to the constraints of the medium and having to be mainstream fare (apparently restricted to under two hours), the focus shifts more to the action-based stuff and not the rich philosophical base that makes the story so special. Also, they opt to end the story before getting to the devastating final event.

I will say this though. I probably wouldn't have been able to get my kid to sit through the books if he hadn't been exposed to some of the marketing images surrounding the movie. They gave him a base to start from, even though I decided not to have him watch the film at this point. I hope that they continue on with the series, even though the films will be imperfect. I suspect that something like a BBC miniseries might be the best way to get the story right, although you wouldn't have the effects budget to handle some of the more spectacular stuff.

[lovejuice]

my problem with the film is that, when you imagine the world where everyone has his or her own animal, it's sorta cool. but visually it's really messy. probably there is no way to go around that.

oh i don't like the books that much either. i really like the first one, but by the third, it kinda goes over its head.

[Spinal]

oh i don't like the books that much either. i really like the first one, but by the third, it kinda goes over its head.

How so? I thought it was masterfully plotted and thematically rich. It aims high, but it also succeeds.

[Ezee E]

I forgot to mention that I finished Dark Harvest, and while it seems like a more adult-oriented version of a Goosebumps book, it was highly enjoyable, with a great finish.

It would make a hell of a Masters of Horror movie if they figured out how to properly show the pumpkin head.

Now I'm reading Playing with the Enemy which is moving along quite nicely. It has more of a sports journalistic approach, and it's working just great.

[Qrazy]

How so? I thought it was masterfully plotted and thematically rich. It aims high, but it also succeeds.

Yeah, personally I never felt like the ideas failed but the plotting got somewhat more monotonous and there's a lot of dicking around and not doing much as the trilogy progresses. I quite liked the world building throughout and there are an equal number of scenes I really enjoy sprinkled throughout but pacing-wise things become a bit more lax I found.

[lovejuice]

How so? I thought it was masterfully plotted and thematically rich. It aims high, but it also succeeds.

it has been a while, but by the time the high angle has a mano-a-mano with the two head generals of the rebel army it gives me a weird feeling. what kind of battle/war is that? (umm....another voice inside my head whispher prince caspian, but that's entirely different.) also i feel like pullman doesn't do a good job tying the knots. too much left unexplained for my taste, and his multiverse seems too random in many ways.

is daemon a real physical being? everything from the first book seems to suggest so. then how come after laura left hers at the river of death, it can appear at entirely different world? i also dislike that the world of death is another world. it doesn't make much sense to me in the logic of this multiverse. so our soul has an ability to transverse across the world without the use of the subtle knife?

[Qrazy]

it has been a while, but by the time the high angle has a mano-a-mano with the two head generals of the rebel army it gives me a weird feeling. what kind of battle/war is that? (umm....another voice inside my head whispher prince caspian, but that's entirely different.) also i feel like pullman doesn't do a good job tying the knots. too much left unexplained for my taste, and his multiverse seems too random in many ways.

is daemon a real physical being? everything from the first book seems to suggest so. then how come after laura left hers at the river of death, it can appear at entirely different world? i also dislike that the world of death is another world. it doesn't make much sense to me in the logic of this multiverse. so our soul has an ability to transverse across the world without the use of the subtle knife?

I found the world of death to be one of the most interesting elements of the series... and the idea of being unable to return back to the oneness.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Finished Cannery Row and pretty much loved it. It has one of the best final four chapters of any book I've read. Mack and Doc are wonderfully written, and Frankie is one of those memorable characters that stick with you, even though he's in the story for all of 8 or so pages. Steinbeck continues to wow me. The Washington Post is loony.

Started reading God Save the Fan this evening. A bit repetitive, but entertaining thus far.

[Benny Profane]

I've been on a tear lately. Going on vacation always helps my reading. Hell, it's one of the main reasons why I look forward to vacation.

Tortilla Flat -- Steinbeck
The Martian Chronicles -- Bradbury
Divisadero -- Michael Ondaatje

All finished recently, all of which I would recommend.

Now starting The Raw Shark Texts by Stephen Hall. VERY interesting so far.

[Dead & Messed Up]

I've been reading a lot of nonfiction for research, but, in the meantime, I finally tackled Brave New World. As far as its genre of future dystopias goes, it's pretty damn interesting. I can't say I loved it like I love Fahrenheit 451, but I understand the respect.

Next up is probably A Canticle for Liebowitz.

[lovejuice]

i'm at the beginning of the tenth man, and it's really wonderful.

[Kurosawa Fan]

i'm at the beginning of the tenth man, and it's really wonderful.

:cool:

You rule.


I finished God Save the Fan, which was entertaining but repetitive, and am now reading Beloved, which is long overdue.

[Mara]

Just read the writing guide Bird by Bird by Anne Lamott. Surprisingly fun, personal, and honest look at writing. Felt more like a memoir or a confessional than a manual.

We disagree about plot, but other than that I found it pretty inspiring.

[monolith94]

What does she say about plot that you disagree with?

And K. Fan – I kinda hope that you don't like Beloved, just so that I won't be alone on disliking that book.

[megladon8]

KF, sorry it's taking so long for me to read "Hell". It's been so beautiful outside lately, I just haven't been reading much.

I'm planning to bring it on the bus tomorrow, though. I should be able to get throug hthe last 100 pages.

[Mara]

What does she say about plot that you disagree with?

I kvetched about it a little bit in the writer's thread. She is very insistent that:

A. Commercial fiction is plot-based, while Literary fiction is character based, therefore:

B. You should absolutely not ouline a plot for your novel but

C. Simply write good characters and go wherever they take you.

There was a strong implication that anyone who disagrees is a bit of a hack.

I don't doubt this approach works for some people, but with the book I'm writing, I really want the plot to go a certain way. (It's an adventure sort of novel.) I had a mild elitist crisis about it.

[ledfloyd]

Now starting The Raw Shark Texts by Stephen Hall. VERY interesting so far.
i heard good things about this. i read the first chapter online somewhere and it seemed alot like memento to me.

[Kurosawa Fan]

KF, sorry it's taking so long for me to read "Hell". It's been so beautiful outside lately, I just haven't been reading much.

I'm planning to bring it on the bus tomorrow, though. I should be able to get throug hthe last 100 pages.

Completely understandable. I'll keep an eye out for your post when you finish.

And mono, I'm halfway through Beloved, and I'm fairly certain you'll be alone in disliking it. I don't think it's the best book ever written (what list was that again?), but I do think it's quite good so far.

[ledfloyd]

i actually picked up the raw shark texts at barnes and noble today. they had the UK edition of the hardcover for $6. i also got michael chabon's maps and legends.

[Benny Profane]

i heard good things about this. i read the first chapter online somewhere and it seemed alot like memento to me.

Yes, Memento would be the most immediate comparison. But I'm only 60 pages in, so a lot could change.

[lovejuice]

:cool:

You rule.


the tenth man is very good. it's not often that i complain of a novel being too short. greene can torture us a little bit longer about the outcome of the "love triangle'. still as it is, the novel is near perfect. somehow it feels dickensian to me even if i know almost next to nothing about dickens.

i really like carosse the actor. especially at the end when his downfall is to believe in a romantic lie which always is his most efficient arsenal.

so what's next, kf?

[Kurosawa Fan]

Awesome. Really glad you liked it, and I'm in complete agreement that it's a tad too short. As for more Greene, I'm afraid I don't have any other recs for you. I've only read the five that I've mentioned (The Power and the Glory, The Heart of the Matter, The Tenth Man, Brighton Rock, The Third Man), and I'm pretty sure you've read all of them. I own The Human Factor, The End of the Affair, A Burnt-Out Case, Our Man in Havana, and The Quiet American, but haven't gotten to them yet.

[lovejuice]

Awesome. Really glad you liked it, and I'm in complete agreement that it's a tad too short. As for more Greene, I'm afraid I don't have any other recs for you. I've only read the five that I've mentioned (The Power and the Glory, The Heart of the Matter, The Tenth Man, Brighton Rock, The Third Man), and I'm pretty sure you've read all of them. I own The Human Factor, The End of the Affair, A Burnt-Out Case, Our Man in Havana, and The Quiet American, but haven't gotten to them yet.

haven't read the third man actually. but i'm a lazy ass, so i might watch the film instead. :P

[Kurosawa Fan]

haven't read the third man actually. but i'm a lazy ass, so i might watch the film instead. :P

It's basically a glorified screenplay anyway. He wrote it in preparation for the film, so it's short and concise and not much different from the film. I'd say you have the right idea.

[monolith94]

I kvetched about it a little bit in the writer's thread. She is very insistent that:

A. Commercial fiction is plot-based, while Literary fiction is character based, therefore:

B. You should absolutely not ouline a plot for your novel but

C. Simply write good characters and go wherever they take you.

There was a strong implication that anyone who disagrees is a bit of a hack.

I don't doubt this approach works for some people, but with the book I'm writing, I really want the plot to go a certain way. (It's an adventure sort of novel.) I had a mild elitist crisis about it.
Don't stress over it; she has her opinion, and it is one that I don't share, either.

[Melville]

I finally finished Kant's Critique of Pure Reason the other day. Kant is my co-pilot.

[Qrazy]

Finally finished Sartre's Nausea. I'd have to say I found it to be a mixed blessing. I really enjoyed both the beginning and ending of the book but there was a long middle stretch that I found grew quite monotonous, repetitive and felt ultimately superfluous. I liked it for the first 60 pages or so up through the first dissipation of the nausea (jazz/ragtime record)... then it got tedious... then I started liking it again from the tree/root thought sequence up through to the end.

[Qrazy]

Awesome. Really glad you liked it, and I'm in complete agreement that it's a tad too short. As for more Greene, I'm afraid I don't have any other recs for you. I've only read the five that I've mentioned (The Power and the Glory, The Heart of the Matter, The Tenth Man, Brighton Rock, The Third Man), and I'm pretty sure you've read all of them. I own The Human Factor, The End of the Affair, A Burnt-Out Case, Our Man in Havana, and The Quiet American, but haven't gotten to them yet.

Watch Brighton Rock, great Attenborough performance and very quality film as well.

[Qrazy]

I kvetched about it a little bit in the writer's thread. She is very insistent that:

A. Commercial fiction is plot-based, while Literary fiction is character based, therefore:

B. You should absolutely not ouline a plot for your novel but

C. Simply write good characters and go wherever they take you.

There was a strong implication that anyone who disagrees is a bit of a hack.

I don't doubt this approach works for some people, but with the book I'm writing, I really want the plot to go a certain way. (It's an adventure sort of novel.) I had a mild elitist crisis about it.

So tell her your good characters ended up taking you through an interesting plotline.

[origami_mustache]

Bought Irvine Welsh's Glue for $5...I guess that will be the next novel I read after finishing a couple of academic texts.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Finished Beloved. Wonderful book. Fizzled a bit in the end, but still a wonderful read. Definitely worthy of its reputation.

[Benny Profane]

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Plastic surgery for the intellectual. They stole my idea!

[Qrazy]

Wow... frontin' made easy.

[Kurosawa Fan]

All this talk of Graham Greene made me go with The End of the Affair as my next novel.

[SpaceOddity]

All this talk of Graham Greene made me go with The End of the Affair as my next novel.


One of my fave books.

*yays*

[Duncan]

One of my fave books.

*yays*

I read Wuthering Heights. I question your taste in men.

[SpaceOddity]

I read Wuthering Heights. I question your taste in men.


I like 'em otherworldly 'n' sadistic.

*persists*

[Mara]

I read Wuthering Heights. I question your taste in men.

Wuthering Heights is many things.

Romantic is not one of them.

(Sorry, Sp.Od.)

[SpaceOddity]

Wuthering Heights is many things.

Romantic is not one of them.

(Sorry, Sp.Od.)


What do you consider romantic?

[Qrazy]

I've only seen the film but at least Wyler's Wuthering Heights seems pretty obviously romantic to me.

[Mara]

What do you consider romantic?

I see Wuthering Heights being about obsession and vengeance. The emotions are powerful, but they're not actually very loving.

I'm not sure how to answer your question, because romance can be lots of different things. For this instance, though, I will narrow it to one point: Romance is caring about someone else more than yourself.

[SpaceOddity]

I see Wuthering Heights being about obsession and vengeance. The emotions are powerful, but they're not actually very loving.

I'm not sure how to answer your question, because romance can be lots of different things. For this instance, though, I will narrow it to one point: Romance is caring about someone else more than yourself.

Catherine rennounces heaven to be with Heathcliff. That qualifies as caring about someone else more than yourself.

[Mara]

Catherine rennounces heaven to be with Heathcliff. That qualifies as caring about someone else more than yourself.

I understand where you're coming from, but it's too little, too late for me. Catherine is a selfish, shallow person and I don't think she's capable of much genuine self-sacrifice.

[SpaceOddity]

I understand where you're coming from, but it's too little, too late for me. Catherine is a selfish, shallow person and I don't think she's capable of much genuine self-sacrifice.

Yet, there is no more self-sacrificing character because there's nothing greater to sacrifice.

Which novels do you regard romantic? P&P?
Austen's incapable of representing love on account of her observational orientation and ideological opposition to transcendence.

[Raiders]

Picked up Thomas Mann's The Magic Mountain. Will begin shortly.

[Mara]

Austen's incapable of representing love on account of her observational orientation and ideological opposition to transcendence.

I think we may be getting to the root of the problem.

:)

I, myself, have an opposition to transcendence.

Don't get me wrong-- I really respect and admire Wuthering Heights. But I think our ideas of romance are very different. No harm in that!

[Kurosawa Fan]

Finished The End of the Affair and loved it. Definitely among Greene's best work. I'm now about 100 pages into The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao.

[SpaceOddity]

What's everyone's current read?

*halfway through Kiss of the Spider Woman*

[Benny Profane]

Finished The Raw Shark Texts. Let me know what you think about it, ledfloyd.

Now moving on to The Plot Against America, my first Philip Roth.

[ledfloyd]

Finished The Raw Shark Texts. Let me know what you think about it, ledfloyd.

Now moving on to The Plot Against America, my first Philip Roth.
i have like 5 books i'm reading right now, but i should get to it sometime soon.

plot against america was my first roth as well. it's not as good as american pastoral or portnoy's complaint but it's pretty great.

[lovejuice]

Now moving on to The Plot Against America, my first Philip Roth.

kf and i had a really bad time with american pastoral. sabbath's theater is a forgivable book. let me know what you think about TPaA

[Kurosawa Fan]

Finished The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao. It would have been brilliant had it not been for such an irritating narrator. He was like a vulgar Stewart Scott from ESPN. Not a compliment. Still, quite a story, and a very moving conclusion. I dug it.

I'm now making my way through The Tipping Point. Gotta love vacations.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Finished The Tipping Point. Great read. The bits about crime, teen smoking and suicide, and the three personality types were just fascinating. A fast, illuminating read. Recommended to everyone.

Not sure what I'll move onto next.

[Grouchy]

What's everyone's current read?

*halfway through Kiss of the Spider Woman*
Amazing book. Puig is a unique writer and that's his greatest work.

Me, I'm reading Los Detectives Salvajes [The Savage Detectives] by Roberto Bolaño.

[Benny Profane]

Jon Krakauer's new book to be released in October is called The Hero and it's about Pat Tillman. Very much looking forward to that.

[Hugh_Grant]

Entertainment Weekly's list of the top 100 new (published in the last twenty-five years) classic books:
-----------------

1. The Road , Cormac McCarthy (2006)
2. Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, J.K. Rowling (2000)
3. Beloved, Toni Morrison (1987)
4. The Liars' Club, Mary Karr (1995)
5. American Pastoral, Philip Roth (1997)
6. Mystic River, Dennis Lehane (2001)
7. Maus, Art Spiegelman (1986/1991)
8. Selected Stories, Alice Munro (1996)
9. Cold Mountain, Charles Frazier (1997)
10. The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle, Haruki Murakami (1997)
11. Into Thin Air, Jon Krakauer (1997)
12. Blindness, José Saramago (1998)
13. Watchmen, Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons (1986-87)
14. Black Water, Joyce Carol Oates (1992)
15. A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius, Dave Eggers (2000)
16. The Handmaid's Tale, Margaret Atwood (1986)
17. Love in the Time of Cholera, Gabriel GarcÃ*a Márquez (1988)
18. Rabbit at Rest, John Updike (1990)
19. On Beauty, Zadie Smith (2005)
20. Bridget Jones's Diary, Helen Fielding (1998)
21. On Writing, Stephen King (2000)
22. The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao, Junot DÃ*az (2007)
23. The Ghost Road, Pat Barker (1996)
24. Lonesome Dove, Larry McMurtry (1985)
25. The Joy Luck Club, Amy Tan (1989)
26. Neuromancer, William Gibson (1984)
27. Possession, A.S. Byatt (1990)
28. Naked, David Sedaris (1997)
29. Bel Canto, Anne Patchett (2001)
30. Case Histories, Kate Atkinson (2004)
31. The Things They Carried, Tim O'Brien (1990)
32. Parting the Waters, Taylor Branch (1988)
33. The Year of Magical Thinking, Joan Didion (2005)
34. The Lovely Bones, Alice Sebold (2002)
35. The Line of Beauty, Alan Hollinghurst (2004)
36. Angela's Ashes, Frank McCourt (1996)
37. Persepolis, Marjane Satrapi (2003)
38. Birds of America, Lorrie Moore (1998)
39. Interpreter of Maladies, Jhumpa Lahiri (2000)
40. His Dark Materials, Philip Pullman (1995-2000)
41. The House on Mango Street, Sandra Cisneros (1984)
42. LaBrava, Elmore Leonard (1983)
43. Borrowed Time, Paul Monette (1988)
44. Praying for Sheetrock, Melissa Fay Greene (1991)
45. Eva Luna, Isabel Allende (1988)
46. Sandman, Neil Gaiman (1988-1996)
47. World's Fair, E.L. Doctorow (1985)
48. The Poisonwood Bible, Barbara Kingsolver (1998)
49. Clockers, Richard Price (1992)
50. The Corrections, Jonathan Franzen (2001)
51. The Journalist and the Murderer, Janet Malcom (1990)
52. Waiting to Exhale, Terry McMillan (1992)
53. The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, Michael Chabon (2000)
54. Jimmy Corrigan, Chris Ware (2000)
55. The Glass Castle, Jeannette Walls (2006)
56. The Night Manager, John le Carré (1993)
57. The Bonfire of the Vanities, Tom Wolfe (1987)
58. Drop City, TC Boyle (2003)
59. Krik? Krak! Edwidge Danticat (1995)
60. Nickel & Dimed, Barbara Ehrenreich (2001)
61. Money, Martin Amis (1985)
62. Last Train To Memphis, Peter Guralnick (1994)
63. Pastoralia, George Saunders (2000)
64. Underworld, Don DeLillo (1997)
65. The Giver, Lois Lowry (1993)
66. A Supposedly Fun Thing I’ll Never Do Again, David Foster Wallace (1997)
67. The Kite Runner, Khaled Hosseini (2003)
68. Fun Home, Alison Bechdel (2006)
69. Secret History, Donna Tartt (1992)
70. Cloud Atlas, David Mitchell (2004)
71. The Spirit Catches You and You Fall Down, Ann Fadiman (1997)
72. The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time, Mark Haddon (2003)
73. A Prayer for Owen Meany, John Irving (1989)
74. Friday Night Lights, H.G. Bissinger (1990)
75. Cathedral, Raymond Carver (1983)
76. A Sight for Sore Eyes, Ruth Rendell (1998)
77. The Remains of the Day, Kazuo Ishiguro (1989)
78. Eat, Pray, Love, Elizabeth Gilbert (2006)
79. The Tipping Point, Malcolm Gladwell (2000)
80. Bright Lights, Big City, Jay McInerney (1984)
81. Backlash, Susan Faludi (1991)
82. Atonement, Ian McEwan (2002)
83. The Stone Diaries, Carol Shields (1994)
84. Holes, Louis Sachar (1998)
85. Gilead, Marilynne Robinson (2004)
86. And the Band Played On, Randy Shilts (1987)
87. The Ruins, Scott Smith (2006)
88. High Fidelity, Nick Hornby (1995)
89. Close Range, Annie Proulx (1999)
90. Comfort Me With Apples, Ruth Reichl (2001)
91. Random Family, Adrian Nicole LeBlanc (2003)
92. Presumed Innocent, Scott Turow (1987)
93. A Thousand Acres, Jane Smiley (1991)
94. Fast Food Nation, Eric Schlosser (2001)
95. Kaaterskill Falls, Allegra Goodman (1998)
96. The Da Vinci Code, Dan Brown (2003)
97. Jesus’ Son, Denis Johnson (1992)
98. The Predators' Ball, Connie Bruck (1988)
99. Practical Magic, Alice Hoffman (1995)
100. America (the Book), Jon Stewart/Daily Show (2004)

-----

Thoughts?

[Benny Profane]

Finished The Tipping Point. Great read. The bits about crime, teen smoking and suicide, and the three personality types were just fascinating. A fast, illuminating read. Recommended to everyone.

Not sure what I'll move onto next.

I thought this book was waaaay too textbook-ishy. My problem with Gladwell, and this was reinforced when I read Blink, is that he repeats himself incessantly. I firmly believe he thinks his readers are stupid.

[Benny Profane]

The most redeeming part of that top 100 list is that it reminds me I need to read Rabbit at Rest to finish off the series.

Hugh, you ever read any of the Rabbit books?

[Hugh_Grant]

What I've read:
6. Mystic River, Dennis Lehane (2001) (Rightfully placed in the top ten)
8. Selected Stories, Alice Munro (1996)
9. Cold Mountain, Charles Frazier (1997)
16. The Handmaid's Tale, Margaret Atwood (1986)
20. Bridget Jones's Diary, Helen Fielding (1998)
25. The Joy Luck Club, Amy Tan (1989)
27. Possession, A.S. Byatt (1990)
31. The Things They Carried, Tim O'Brien (1990)
34. The Lovely Bones, Alice Sebold (2002) (Yuck.)
35. The Line of Beauty, Alan Hollinghurst (2004)
39. Interpreter of Maladies, Jhumpa Lahiri (2000) (My favorite on this list)
41. The House on Mango Street, Sandra Cisneros (1984)
60. Nickel & Dimed, Barbara Ehrenreich (2001)
67. The Kite Runner, Khaled Hosseini (2003) (Yuck.)
72. The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time, Mark Haddon (2003) (I HATED THIS BOOK!!)
73. A Prayer for Owen Meany, John Irving (1989)
75. Cathedral, Raymond Carver (1983)
77. The Remains of the Day, Kazuo Ishiguro (1989)
80. Bright Lights, Big City, Jay McInerney (1984)
82. Atonement, Ian McEwan (2002)
86. And the Band Played On, Randy Shilts (1987)
88. High Fidelity, Nick Hornby (1995)

I’ve read portions of the following, usually excerpts in textbooks from which I’ve taught:
64. Underworld, Don DeLillo (1997)
94. Fast Food Nation, Eric Schlosser (2001)
21. On Writing, Stephen King (2000)
7. Maus, Art Spiegelman (1986/1991)
37. Persepolis, Marjane Satrapi (2003)

On my very long to read list:
18. Rabbit at Rest, John Updike (1990) (Benny, that would be a “No, not yet� answer to your question. I’ve read plenty of short stories from Updike, but no novels.)
22. The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao, Junot DÃ*az (2007) (I’ve taught one of Diaz’s short stories, which was a bit hit.)
70. Cloud Atlas, David Mitchell (2004)
19. On Beauty, Zadie Smith (2005) (Can’t help but wonder if this is any better than the fantastic White Teeth)
10. The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle, Haruki Murakami (1997)
11. Into Thin Air, Jon Krakauer (1997)
15. A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius, Dave Eggers (2000)
29. Bel Canto, Anne Patchett (2001)
59. Krik? Krak! Edwidge Danticat (1995)
61. Money, Martin Amis (1985)
33. The Year of Magical Thinking, Joan Didion (2005)

[Kurosawa Fan]

I thought this book was waaaay too textbook-ishy. My problem with Gladwell, and this was reinforced when I read Blink, is that he repeats himself incessantly. I firmly believe he thinks his readers are stupid.

I absolutely agree about the repeating. It was annoying. But I thought the information revealed in the studies was well worth his boring writing style. Freakonomics was a much better book.

[Kurosawa Fan]

On that list, I've read:

1. The Road , Cormac McCarthy (2006)
2. Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, J.K. Rowling (2000)
3. Beloved, Toni Morrison (1987)
5. American Pastoral, Philip Roth (1997)
10. The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle, Haruki Murakami (1997)
13. Watchmen, Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons (1986-87)
17. Love in the Time of Cholera, Gabriel GarcÃ*a Márquez (1988)
22. The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao, Junot DÃ*az (2007)
28. Naked, David Sedaris (1997)
40. His Dark Materials, Philip Pullman (1995-2000)
50. The Corrections, Jonathan Franzen (2001)
53. The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, Michael Chabon (2000)
72. The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time, Mark Haddon (2003)
79. The Tipping Point, Malcolm Gladwell (2000)
82. Atonement, Ian McEwan (2002)
87. The Ruins, Scott Smith (2006)
88. High Fidelity, Nick Hornby (1995)
96. The Da Vinci Code, Dan Brown (2003)
100. America (the Book), Jon Stewart/Daily Show (2004)


I didn't care for the ones highlighted in green (though I only read the first part of the Dark Materials trilogy). There are a few on the list I own and am planning on reading soon (Heartbreaking Work, Remains of the Day, Lovely Bones, Clockers, Possession, Blindness, Into Thin Air). For the most part the list is pretty good. Harry Potter up that high, especially my least favorite of the series, is absurd, and I can't help but think that they picked unorthodox titles from certain authors just to make the list look a bit less typical.

[Hugh_Grant]

For the most part the list is pretty good. Harry Potter up that high, especially my least favorite of the series, is absurd, and I can't help but think that they picked unorthodox titles from certain authors just to make the list look a bit less typical.

I agree on both counts. There are some oddball choices balanced with the populist fare (Dan Brown, etc.), but overall, the list isn't too bad, especially compared with the other lists in the same issue (movies, TV, music).

KFan, what did you think of the Haddon book?

[Kurosawa Fan]

I agree on both counts. There are some oddball choices balanced with the populist fare (Dan Brown, etc.), but overall, the list isn't too bad, especially compared with the other lists in the same issue (movies, TV, music).

KFan, what did you think of the Haddon book?

I actually quite liked it. It was gimmicky, but I thought the gimmick worked pretty well and found it fairly affecting. It's nothing to get excited about, but I found it to be a solid read. I give Haddon credit for trying to create something different, something completely outside his range of understanding.


Oh, and major credit to the EW list for not including Running With Scissors, one of those critical darlings that will forever baffle me. What a completely emotionless book that was.

[Kurosawa Fan]

This list inspired me to read A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius next.

[lovejuice]

i hate acting a part of a snobbish but da vinci code included in any best book list doesn't inspire much faith.

[Lucky]

i hate acting a part of a snobbish but da vinci code included in any best book list doesn't inspire much faith.

Regardless of its actual content, the list would be incomplete without its inclusion. That book is not going to be forgotten by the masses anytime soon. I actually applaud EW's ranking of it at the bottom tier, knowing they had to put it somewhere.

EDIT: I think the other thing to consider is that this isn't a "best" list it's a "modern classics" list. That makes the pill a little easier to swallow.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Regardless of its actual content, the list would be incomplete without its inclusion. That book is not going to be forgotten by the masses anytime soon. I actually applaud EW's ranking of it at the bottom tier, knowing they had to put it somewhere.

EDIT: I think the other thing to consider is that this isn't a "best" list it's a "modern classics" list. That makes the pill a little easier to swallow.

This.

I was actually surprised it wasn't ranked higher. And yes, this is a modern classics list, hence the reason why popularity has such pull, and why Harry Potter is ranked so high. I'm actually pretty surprised that the only Stephen King inclusion is his book on writing. I figured there would be more pop entertainment stuff.

[Mara]

I'm really not sure about this list. But here's what I've read:

2. Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, J.K. Rowling (2000)
3. Beloved, Toni Morrison (1987)
7. Maus, Art Spiegelman (1986/1991)
9. Cold Mountain, Charles Frazier (1997)
16. The Handmaid's Tale, Margaret Atwood (1986)
20. Bridget Jones's Diary, Helen Fielding (1998)
25. The Joy Luck Club, Amy Tan (1989)
27. Possession, A.S. Byatt (1990)
28. Naked, David Sedaris (1997)
31. The Things They Carried, Tim O'Brien (1990)
34. The Lovely Bones, Alice Sebold (2002)
36. Angela's Ashes, Frank McCourt (1996)
40. His Dark Materials, Philip Pullman (1995-2000)
41. The House on Mango Street, Sandra Cisneros (1984)
45. Eva Luna, Isabel Allende (1988)
50. The Corrections, Jonathan Franzen (2001)
53. The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, Michael Chabon (2000)
55. The Glass Castle, Jeannette Walls (2006)
65. The Giver, Lois Lowry (1993)
67. The Kite Runner, Khaled Hosseini (2003)
72. The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time, Mark Haddon (2003)
77. The Remains of the Day, Kazuo Ishiguro (1989)
82. Atonement, Ian McEwan (2002)
84. Holes, Louis Sachar (1998)
88. High Fidelity, Nick Hornby (1995)
93. A Thousand Acres, Jane Smiley (1991)
96. The Da Vinci Code, Dan Brown (2003) ARE YOU KIDDING ME?
100. America (the Book), Jon Stewart/Daily Show (2004)

I bolded selections that I didn't think were very good, or at least not good enough to be on any "best" list.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Atonement? Say it ain't so Mara! I thought The Corrections was passable (I've voiced my complaints a few times here), but I agree it would be far from a "Best of" list.

[Winston*]

You two take exception to all those but not America: The Book? So many awful jokes for every half decent one.

[Kurosawa Fan]

You two take exception to all those but not America: The Book? So many awful jokes for every half decent one.

To me it seemed like a token "hip" inclusion on the list. And again, this is going by popularity, not necessarily quality, so it makes sense on there. It did have it's down moments though. I was disappointed, and that disappointment led me to skip Colbert's book, which I've heard is about the same as far as laughs go.

[Hugh_Grant]

I recommend The Line of Beauty to any fan of Henry James (and Thatcherite England).

[Mara]

Atonement? Say it ain't so Mara! I thought The Corrections was passable (I've voiced my complaints a few times here), but I agree it would be far from a "Best of" list.

I thought the first part of Atonement was brilliant, up until the chronological fast-forward, at which point I completely lost interest. I was dragged to the film by my mother and had the same reaction.

I remember thinking The Corrections was okay, but now I can't really remember any plot points. It was just sort of sarcastic and forgettable.

And I think America: The Book is hilarious.

[Lucky]

I picked up McEwan's On Chesil Beach in the airport and read it on my vacation. I wasn't floored by this like I was with Atonement, but I will say that McEwan has a complete mastery of describing the precise psychological state of his characters. There have been so many moments while I'm reading his work where I can pinpoint the exact thought of the character whether it be a 22 year old guy or a 7 year old girl. That's his biggest strength as not many authors could have held my attention with such a mundane story.

Up Next: The New York Trilogy

[Kurosawa Fan]

I picked up McEwan's On Chesil Beach in the airport and read it on my vacation. I wasn't floored by this like I was with Atonement, but I will say that McEwan has a complete mastery of describing the precise psychological state of his characters. There have been so many moments while I'm reading his work where I can pinpoint the exact thought of the character whether it be a 22 year old guy or a 7 year old girl. That's his biggest strength as not many authors could have held my attention with such a mundane story.

Up Next: The New York Trilogy

I liked On Chesil Beach quite a bit. You're absolutely right about McEwan. Everything I've read by him feels completely sincere, and his characters feel comfortable, their actions both believable and understandable, even when they're rash and in error.

[ledfloyd]

what i've read with ratings

1. The Road , Cormac McCarthy (2006) ****
2. Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, J.K. Rowling (2000) **1/2
3. Beloved, Toni Morrison (1987) **
5. American Pastoral, Philip Roth (1997) ***1/2
6. Mystic River, Dennis Lehane (2001) **
7. Maus, Art Spiegelman (1986/1991) ****
11. Into Thin Air, Jon Krakauer (1997) ****
13. Watchmen, Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons (1986-87) ****
15. A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius, Dave Eggers (2000) ****
17. Love in the Time of Cholera, Gabriel GarcÃ*a Márquez (1988) ****
28. Naked, David Sedaris (1997) *** (love sedaris, but me talk pretty one day would've been a better choice)
37. Persepolis, Marjane Satrapi (2003) ****
40. His Dark Materials, Philip Pullman (1995-2000) ***
46. Sandman, Neil Gaiman (1988-1996) ****
50. The Corrections, Jonathan Franzen (2001) ****
53. The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, Michael Chabon (2000) ****
54. Jimmy Corrigan, Chris Ware (2000) ****
64. Underworld, Don DeLillo (1997) ****
68. Fun Home, Alison Bechdel (2006) ***1/2
69. Secret History, Donna Tartt (1992) ****
82. Atonement, Ian McEwan (2002) ***

there's a bunch more on that list i want to read

secret history is one of my favorite books. i like the comics they included as well.

[thefourthwall]

I've read...

2. Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire, J.K. Rowling (2000)
11. Into Thin Air, Jon Krakauer (1997)
15. A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius, Dave Eggers (2000)
19. On Beauty, Zadie Smith (2005)
20. Bridget Jones's Diary, Helen Fielding (1998)
26. Neuromancer, William Gibson (1984)
27. Possession, A.S. Byatt (1990)
28. Naked, David Sedaris (1997)
36. Angela's Ashes, Frank McCourt (1996)
37. Persepolis, Marjane Satrapi (2003)
40. His Dark Materials, Philip Pullman (1995-2000) (well, the first one)
41. The House on Mango Street, Sandra Cisneros (1984)
46. Sandman, Neil Gaiman (1988-1996)
65. The Giver, Lois Lowry (1993)
73. A Prayer for Owen Meany, John Irving (1989)
77. The Remains of the Day, Kazuo Ishiguro (1989)
82. Atonement, Ian McEwan (2002)
84. Holes, Louis Sachar (1998)
88. High Fidelity, Nick Hornby (1995)

Not nearly as many as I'd have liked to though. Sometimes, when I've seen a really long movie adaptation (like The Line of Beauty) I skip the book--not that I privilege one of the art forms over the other though.

And, I'd like to add my huzzah to On Chesil Beach, I haven't read The Gathering yet, but it better be pretty darn good to beat On Chesil Beach for this year's Booker.

[dreamdead]

My list of those read:

6. Mystic River, Dennis Lehane (2001)
7. Maus, Art Spiegelman (1986/1991)
10. The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle, Haruki Murakami (1997)
13. Watchmen, Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons (1986-87)
16. The Handmaid's Tale, Margaret Atwood (1986)
17. Love in the Time of Cholera, Gabriel GarcÃ*a Márquez (1988)
26. Neuromancer, William Gibson (1984)
31. The Things They Carried, Tim O'Brien (1990)
41. The House on Mango Street, Sandra Cisneros (1984)
50. The Corrections, Jonathan Franzen (2001)
53. The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, Michael Chabon (2000)
65. The Giver, Lois Lowry (1993)
75. Cathedral, Raymond Carver (1983)
82. Atonement, Ian McEwan (2002)
83. The Stone Diaries, Carol Shields (1994)
88. High Fidelity, Nick Hornby (1995)
96. The Da Vinci Code, Dan Brown (2003)
100. America (the Book), Jon Stewart/Daily Show (2004)

I've wanted to get around to The Road and Cloud Atlas for the longest time. Those are the ones that will be remedied first.

Also, I feel that I should point out that Shields' The Stone Diaries is incredibly affecting and a great read that transcends any narrow notions of women's literature. Still one of the best books I've ever read.

[Kurosawa Fan]

My list of those read:

6. Mystic River, Dennis Lehane (2001)
7. Maus, Art Spiegelman (1986/1991)
10. The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle, Haruki Murakami (1997)
13. Watchmen, Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons (1986-87)
16. The Handmaid's Tale, Margaret Atwood (1986)
17. Love in the Time of Cholera, Gabriel GarcÃ*a Márquez (1988)
26. Neuromancer, William Gibson (1984)
31. The Things They Carried, Tim O'Brien (1990)
41. The House on Mango Street, Sandra Cisneros (1984)
50. The Corrections, Jonathan Franzen (2001)
53. The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, Michael Chabon (2000)
65. The Giver, Lois Lowry (1993)
75. Cathedral, Raymond Carver (1983)
82. Atonement, Ian McEwan (2002)
83. The Stone Diaries, Carol Shields (1994)
88. High Fidelity, Nick Hornby (1995)
96. The Da Vinci Code, Dan Brown (2003)
100. America (the Book), Jon Stewart/Daily Show (2004)

I've wanted to get around to The Road and Cloud Atlas for the longest time. Those are the ones that will be remedied first.

Also, I feel that I should point out that Shields' The Stone Diaries is incredibly affecting and a great read that transcends any narrow notions of women's literature. Still one of the best books I've ever read.

Added it to my list of books to read. Thanks for the rec.

Any books on that list that you've read that you feel are undeserving?

[Kurosawa Fan]

And, I'd like to add my huzzah to On Chesil Beach, I haven't read The Gathering yet, but it better be pretty darn good to beat On Chesil Beach for this year's Booker.

I bought The Gathering while on vacation last week. I'm looking forward to reading the book that was deemed more deserving of the Booker that McEwan's novel.

[dreamdead]

Any books on that list that you've read that you feel are undeserving?

Well, if we're not counting cultural relevance but are instead only considering literary or artistic achievement, then the following don't really excite me all that much.


16. The Handmaid's Tale, Margaret Atwood (1986)
50. The Corrections, Jonathan Franzen (2001)
53. The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier & Clay, Michael Chabon (2000)
96. The Da Vinci Code, Dan Brown (2003)

I don't really find Atwood's achievement all that monumental, as it is all so heavily predicated on Orwell's fiction that the switch in gender (and the accessibility of teaching it to undergrads) is really the only thing that keeps it so relevant in my eyes. That's not to say I think it's a bad book, just underwhelming given its placement. I'd bury it a lot further down the list... similarly, Franzen makes the list because of the stigma between true and pop literature vis-a-vis the spat with Oprah; to me it reads like Delillo-lite. It's more emotionally affecting, but less convincing in the overarching transnational focus... Chabon's book is a glorious read, to be sure, and I'll never discredit the craft of the man's actual prose, which is masterful, but the book is ultimately a little slight beyond its study of friendship, ethnicity, and the artistic growth... and we all know why we criticize Brown's book, so I'm not going to attack the elephant in the room.

[Milky Joe]

I don't understand how that list can leave off Infinite Jest. I mean, W. T. F.

[Boner M]

My literature lineup for my holiday:

Borges, Fictions
Camus, The Outsider
Sartre, Nausea
Kobo Abe, Secret Rendezvous
Jim Thompson, A Hell of a Woman
Andrew Sarris, The American Cinema

[Boner M]

I've read the following:

1. The Road , Cormac McCarthy (2006)
10. The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle, Haruki Murakami (1997)
88. High Fidelity, Nick Hornby (1995)

lolz.

[ledfloyd]

I don't understand how that list can leave off Infinite Jest. I mean, W. T. F.
yeah. they did include a lesser DFW book though.

[Duncan]

I read Lolita and A Clockwork Orange. Liked both a lot. Both told from the perspective of seriously warped protagonists. And both authors are amazingly dexterous with their use of language. Lolita is the only book I've read that has made me wish I read Russian. Elsewhere on the Russian front, I am half way through Anna Karenina. It's a surprisingly quick read because there are so many characters to jump between. Ten pages with one, ten pages with another. Keeps things moving. That said, I haven't found the ideas presented particularly interesting, nor have I found the prose especially dramatic or moving. Compared to Dostoevsky, I find this novel quite disappointing. At least so far. We'll see how it turns out. And elsewhere still on the Russian front, I read a couple of Gogol's short stories - Diary of a Madman and The Overcoat. Both were good, if not great. Funny, at least.

I will probably read Earthly Powers at some point based on my enjoyment of A Clockwork Orange. Anyone read that? I hear very good things.

[D_Davis]

I think I've read three books on the EW list, and I like one of them, King's On Writing.

The Ruins? Really? Pathetic.

Any book that can have 300 of its 350 pages torn out at random without impacting the narrative does not deserve to be considered a modern classic.

Most of the fiction I read is older (50s-70s) but one book I would add to a modern classics list is Last Dragon by JM McDermott. It is one of the best written books I've ever read. It is a mature fantasy for adults absent of almost all cliche and tired old genre convention. It is the new bellwether for fantasy fiction, and that it is being overlooked for tons of other crap is very sad.

Have you ever watched a movie late at night while dosing off? As you alternate between falling asleep and waking up, the film begins to seep into your shallow dreams, and you struggle to make sense of what you've seen. Some of the pieces fall neatly together, while others seem out of place. It's hard to tell the differences between your waking reality and your dreams, as each become more twisted by the film's imagery. Things become fragmented, kind of confusing, but somewhat alluring, and while this situation may not make for the most sound viewing, in some ways it creates a memorable experience that haunts you for days.


Reading J.M. McDermott's first novel, Last Dragon, is like this.


And it is a fantastic experience.

It is a brilliant piece of fiction regardless of genre.

Check it out.

[Milky Joe]

yeah. they did include a lesser DFW book though.

Ha, I didn't even notice. Is that the only non-fiction book on the list? Seems pretty disrespectful considering DFW doesn't even consider himself a real writer of non-fiction.

[Grouchy]

Lolita is the only book I've read that has made me wish I read Russian.
Heh. I have good news for you.

English is Lolita's original language.

[Duncan]

Heh. I have good news for you.

English is Lolita's original language.

Yeah, I know. What I meant was that since Nabokov has such fluid control over English, I wish I could go back and read his Russian novels in their original Russian.

[lovejuice]

Heh. I have good news for you.

English is Lolita's original language.

this reminds me of the funniest story i've ever heard on RT. there is this pompous high school dude who is half russian and always offers opinions in english class because he's too fond of his own voice. at some point he says something like, "of course you have never read lolita until you have read it in original russian." :lol:

[lovejuice]

Last Dragon by JM McDermott.

if not for anything else, the cover is way awesome.

http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/0786948574.02.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

[lovejuice]

I will probably read Earthly Powers at some point based on my enjoyment of A Clockwork Orange. Anyone read that? I hear very good things.

aside from ACO, what i have read of burgess's are the first in the enderby series which is pretty good, and an unwanted seed which can be so much better.

[Hugh_Grant]

Is that the only non-fiction book on the list?
Nope.

Into Thin Air
On Writing
The Year of Magical Thinking
Parting the Waters
Praying for Sheetrock
The Journalist and the Murderer
The Glass Castle
Nickel and Dimed
Eat, Pray, Love
Friday Night Lights
The Tipping Point
Backlash
The Spirit Catches You and You Fall Down
Last Train to Memphis
And The Band Played On
Comfort Me with Apples
Fast Food Nation
Random Family

[D_Davis]

if not for anything else, the cover is way awesome.



That's why I bought it. Seriously. I judged the book by the cover, and it ended up being one of the best things I've ever read.

And just so you know, there aren't really any dragons in it.

:)

[megladon8]

I am so, so close to finishing "Hell"!

It's taken so long...between my trip to New York, job hunting, work, I just haven't been reading much lately.

It's been a bit tedious at times, because Barbusse uses most of the latter half of the book going on philosophical ramblings about death and how enormous the universe is.

During the first half - which at times gets pretty erotic - there's genuine passion in the language and there's a story promised here. But that very slowly recedes and he will take off for 10-20 pages going on and on about something after he's already made his point.

[Lasse]

The weather is nice, so I'm going to go outside and start a new book. Help me decide which.

- The Firm (Grisham)
- Donnie Brasco (Pistone)
- Leaving Las Vegas (O'Brien)
- Glamorama (Ellis)
- Desperation (King)
- M Is For Malice (Grafton)

[Kurosawa Fan]

The Firm and Glamorama are both mediocre to the core. The only other one I've read is Desperation, which I really liked.

[Ezee E]

Someone gave it to me, so I've started reading Into the Wild, which is pretty damn good actually.

[Raiders]

Elsewhere on the Russian front, I am half way through Anna Karenina. It's a surprisingly quick read because there are so many characters to jump between. Ten pages with one, ten pages with another. Keeps things moving. That said, I haven't found the ideas presented particularly interesting, nor have I found the prose especially dramatic or moving. Compared to Dostoevsky, I find this novel quite disappointing. At least so far. We'll see how it turns out.

Interestingly enough, I think it was among Dostoevsky's (and Nabokov's) favorite books. Upon its release, they were both among the few who really loved it.

[SpaceOddity]

Interestingly enough, I think it was among Dostoevsky's (and Nabokov's) favorite books. Upon its release, they were both among the few who really loved it.

Nabokov hadn't been born.

[Sven]

The Firm and Glamorama are both mediocre to the core. The only other one I've read is Desperation, which I really liked.

Desperation rules. Have you read the companion, The Regulators? Even better.

[D_Davis]

The only one I've read is Desperation - it's totally awesome. A really great King book.

[Thirdy]

Any Chesterton fans around these parts?

[D_Davis]

Heads up bookhounds, there is a new Thomas Ligotti book being published in September. Even if you don't like him, you could probably buy the book and sell it for a profit in the near future.

:)

He is a brilliant author, give him a chance if you haven't done so. This is a good opportunity since most of his books are almost impossible to find because they have small print runs.

First there was Poe, then Lovecraft, and now Ligotti. That we have a genre author of this caliber alive now, to celebrate, is a treasure.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41Wku6HPW%2BL._SS500_.jpg

"Thomas Ligotti is often cited as the most curious and remarkable figure in horror since H P Lovecraft. His work is noted by critics for its display of an exceptionally grotesque imagination and accomplished prose style. In his stories, Ligotti has followed a tradition that began with Edgar Allan Poe, portraying characters that are outside of what might be called “normal life� and rendering a grim vision of human existence as a perpetual nightmare. The stories collected in Teatro Grottesco feature tormented individuals who play out their doom in various odd little towns as well as in dark sectors frequented by sinister and often blackly comical eccentrics."

[Lasse]

I chose King's Desperation, and it seems pretty interesting so far. :)

[D_Davis]

I chose King's Desperation, and it seems pretty interesting so far. :)

It's a fun, quick, and exciting read. What you might call a "page turner."

[Benny Profane]

Finished The Plot Against America. It's a great story that seems like a pointless exercise at the same time. I'm impressed, but not dazzled by Roth's writing, so my thoughts are pretty conflicted at this point. I loved reading it but I have no idea what to make of it.

Moving on to Rabbit at Rest by John Updike. For those who haven't read any books in this series, what is your excuse?

[thefourthwall]

Any Chesterton fans around these parts?

I haven't actually read much just heard excerpts here and there, but he's always been one that I've wanted to read more of.

[Hugh_Grant]

As a relative newbie to this thread, I apologize beforehand if this subject has been discussed, but I will be teaching Kazuo Ishiguro's Never Let Me Go as a part of the "Common Reading Experience" (or whatever the heck it's called) at the university where I teach, and I wanted the BDT's opinions.

[ledfloyd]

Finished The Plot Against America. It's a great story that seems like a pointless exercise at the same time. I'm impressed, but not dazzled by Roth's writing, so my thoughts are pretty conflicted at this point. I loved reading it but I have no idea what to make of it.
i kind of agree. i think Portnoy's Complaint is my favorite of his books i've read so far. i also liked American Pastoral a good deal.

[Thirdy]

As a relative newbie to this thread, I apologize beforehand if this subject has been discussed, but I will be teaching Kazuo Ishiguro's Never Let Me Go as a part of the "Common Reading Experience" (or whatever the heck it's called) at the university where I teach, and I wanted the BDT's opinions.

My second favourite Ishiguro (after The Remains of the Day and before The Unconsoled). Very moving and humane, although it's been a while since I read it.

[Raiders]

About 100 pages into Magic Mountain and so far, so good.

[Raiders]

Nabokov hadn't been born.

:lol:

That was sorta mis-worded on my part. Regardless, he was still a fan.

[D_Davis]

Anyone ever read this:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51AK8707CZL._SL500_AA240_.jpg

It's the book that inspired Jodorowsky to make Holy Mountain. I just ordered it, sounds interesting.

"In this novel/allegory the narrator/author sets sail in the yacht Impossible to search for Mount Analogue, the geographically located, albeit hidden, peak that reaches inexorably toward heaven. Daumal's symbolic mountain represents a way to truth that "cannot not exist," and his classic allegory of man's search for himself embraces the certainty that one can know and conquer one's own reality."

[lovejuice]

Any Chesterton fans around these parts?

somewhere in this thread, i have expressed my love for the man who was thursday. it's only novel of his that i have read, and i absolutely love it.

[Benny Profane]

Duncan, did you ever finish V. and if so what did you think?

[Lucky]

While I really enjoyed the conclusion of City of Glass and its giant meta blur, I don't even have a theory for the ending of Ghosts. What propelled Black/White to do that? Maybe it's because I'm not too familiar with Walden, but I really can't even fathom an explanation. Looking forward to the final entry of the trilogy, nonetheless.

[Kurosawa Fan]

As a relative newbie to this thread, I apologize beforehand if this subject has been discussed, but I will be teaching Kazuo Ishiguro's Never Let Me Go as a part of the "Common Reading Experience" (or whatever the heck it's called) at the university where I teach, and I wanted the BDT's opinions.

I didn't much care for it. It was a fascinating concept, but it felt too easy-going and never established any substatial dramatic weight. It all ended up feeling very inconsequential. I'm still looking forward to Remains of the Day, but Never Let Me Go was a big disappointment.

[D_Davis]

I'm about to start Ballard's The Atrocity Exhibition. Not really sure where to post thoughts. It's not S(cience)F, but it is S(peculative)F, and it is also considered to be one of the great experimental prose novels.

I'm not sure how I am going to read it.

Ballard envisioned it to be a sort pre-internet (1970s) hypertext novel. He encourages the reader to flip through randomly until a certain heading stands out, and to then read that passage. From here, we are supposed to branch out to the surrounding headers and passages as we piece together the narrative.

Or, conversely, it can be read from cover to cover.

There really is not right or wrong way to experience the work, but Ballard wrote it to be experienced according to the first example above.

I've read some of the segments ("Why I Want to Fuck Ronald Reagan" is particularly memorable) and I am looking forward to reading the rest of this challenging, mind altering work.

[megladon8]

Thanks for the heads-up about the Ligotti book, D.

That's one I'll be sure to pick up.

[D_Davis]

Started reading The Atrocity Exhibition last night. Very unsettling. I feel like I am reading something I am not supposed to, as if its subversive nature might actually be harmful to me.

Like some strange kind of hallucinogenic drug. Taking it might open my mind up to new experiences, but there is a lingering fear that it could really screw me up.

[D_Davis]

I love Ballard's fascination with Ronald Reagan and Ralph Nader; the first for being the epitome of the "media politician" (check out the short story The Secret History of World War III), and the later for being involved in automobile safety in the 1960s. In the way that Ballard views automobiles - objects of charged, violent, American sexuality - in The Atrocity Exhibition (and later more fully fleshed out in Crash), one could view Ralph Nader as a proponent for safe sex in a Ballardian world, with this image:

http://www.ballardian.com/images/atrocity_nader.jpg

possessing disturbing innuendo.

[D_Davis]

The Consumer Consumed
by J. G. Ballard

Could Ralph Nader, the consumer crusader and scourge of General Motors,
become the first dictator of the United States? The question isn't
entirely frivolous. Now in his sixth year as the most articulate and
determined champion of the ordinary consumer, Nader already reveals an
ominous degree of self-denying fanaticism that links him to the last of
the old-style populist demagogues and may be making him the first of the
new. Given that party and presidential politics in the USA are no longer
flexible enough to admit any true outsider (the next five US presidents
will probably come from a tiny pool of a hundred or so professional
politicians), one would expect any real maverick with a headful of
obsessions to home in on us from an unexpected quarter of the horizon.

more...

http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/2000/2000-July/012767.html

[thefourthwall]

Rushdie's Midnight's Children just won the Best of the Booker (http://www.themanbookerprize.com/news/stories/1099), celebrating 40 years of Bookers, and it won the Booker of Bookers in 1993. I was kind of hoping something else (like Peter Carey's Oscar and Lucinda) would win (it seems a bit like a redundant award), but since Rushdie remained triumphant, I guess I really do need to read this book...

[Duncan]

Duncan, did you ever finish V. and if so what did you think?

Oh yeah, I finished that a while ago. I liked it. Not as much as Gravity's Rainbow, but I liked it. I think maybe I read them in the wrong order, because V. seems like a less developed version of the later novel. The chaos isn't as chaotic, yet the connections aren't as palpable. His treatment of race is much more advanced with the black commandos in GR. V. is interesting structurally, but Stencil's stories sometimes feel like they belong in a different book altogether. Meanwhile, the comparisons to Melville are more obvious, especially with that epilogue. GR seemed more singular.

Basically, through all 900 pages of GR I felt that I was reading a masterful narrative densely packed with ideas. With V. I felt that he was still nailing down the prose and narrative, and that his ideas were still fermenting.

[Rowland]

Anyone read Dennis Lehane's Shutter Island? I finished the book last night and wasn't impressed, it's a shame this is the source material for the next Scorsese film. It didn't help that I had most of the important plot twists figured out at least a hundred pages before they were revealed.

[Hugh_Grant]

I've decided to read more.

These books came in the mail yesterday:
The Sea (Banville)
Cloud Atlas (Mitchell)
A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius (Eggers)

Just finished The Sea, Booker Prize winner of 2005. Some of Banville's prose is utterly fantastic, the book is also just the right length (under 200 pages), and I liked the use of the fractured chronology. There are flaws, most notably the unlikeable protagonist of the tale for whom my empathy was not in great supply, but I was up early this morning to finish the book, which is a good sign.

thefourthwall mentioned the Best of the the Booker a few posts back. One of my goals by the end of the year is to read the Booker winners from the last twenty years. (I've read almost half of them thus far.)

[SpaceOddity]

Salman Rushdie's new gf...

http://thebollywoodzone.com/blog/images/06-06/riya-sen-2.jpg

http://www.bollywood-gossips.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/riya-sen-sexy-bra-photo.jpg

[Ezee E]

It's on the cover of Entertainment Weekly, and is apparently a huge rave.

But this is the first time I ever heard of it.

What the heck is Twilight?

[D_Davis]

It's on the cover of Entertainment Weekly, and is apparently a huge rave.

But this is the first time I ever heard of it.

What the heck is Twilight?

Isn't this the young-adult vampire series that every girl in the US is reading?

It's Gossip Girl meets Anne Rice.

[Benny Profane]

That girl is fucking gorgeous...

I want one.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Isn't this the young-adult vampire series that every girl in the US is reading?

It's Gossip Girl meets Anne Rice.

Eww. I wasn't planning on reading it anyway, but I didn't realize it was young adult. Anne Rice is bad enough by herself, but combining her with teeny trends is an unbearable thought.

[D_Davis]

Eww. I wasn't planning on reading it anyway, but I didn't realize it was young adult. Anne Rice is bad enough by herself, but combining her with teeny trends is an unbearable thought.

A film series is already in the works and I wouldn't be surprised to see a CW television series.

I've heard that the author suggests that the reader listen to certain songs while reading the books. I guess the main character is a Muse fan, and this bad, as well as other alternative acts, are on the playlists for the novels. I guess this has really boosted Muse's fan base.

There is a girl at my work who tells me all about them.

[Ezee E]

A film series is already in the works and I wouldn't be surprised to see a CW television series.

I've heard that the author suggests that the reader listen to certain songs while reading the books. I guess the main character is a Muse fan, and this bad, as well as other alternative acts, are on the playlists for the novels. I guess this has really boosted Muse's fan base.

There is a girl at my work who tells me all about them.
Barfs.

I won't even read the article then.

[Hugh_Grant]

Barfs.

I won't even read the article then.

I didn't, and I normally read EW cover to cover (except for Diablo Cody's new column).

[Kurosawa Fan]

I didn't, and I normally read EW cover to cover (except for Diablo Cody's new column).

She's really terrible, isn't she? Man, I didn't even hate Juno, but I just can't stand her column. I'm always a little bummed when I notice it's her week.

[Mara]

Isn't this the young-adult vampire series that every girl in the US is reading?

It's Gossip Girl meets Anne Rice.

They're actually pretty good books... in the sense that they are way better than any young adult book about vampires has a right to be.

I'd consider myself a fan.

[Duncan]

I took a bit of a reading break, but I seem to be back in the swing of things. I'm halfway through Cinema 1: The Movement Image by Gilles Deleuze. It's really interesting. I kind of wish I had read some Bergson prior to tackling this, but I think I'm keeping up. Melville, I think you'd like this a lot. Have you read it? He addresses phenomenology and Husserl specifically.

After that I guess I'll finish of Anna Karenina.

[D_Davis]

This is cool. I discovered this on Boing Boing this morning.

There is a group pool on flickr devoted to posting photos of Ballardian imagery.

http://www.flickr.com/groups/jg_ballard

There is some great stuff there, and some of these really capture the tone and atmosphere of Ballard's brilliant prose.

Ballardian - resembling or suggestive of the conditions described in Ballard’s novels & stories, esp. dystopian modernity, bleak man-made landscapes & the psychological effects of technological, social or environmental developments.

[Melville]

I'm halfway through Cinema 1: The Movement Image by Gilles Deleuze. It's really interesting. I kind of wish I had read some Bergson prior to tackling this, but I think I'm keeping up. Melville, I think you'd like this a lot. Have you read it? He addresses phenomenology and Husserl specifically.
I haven't read it, but hopefully I'll get around to it someday. First I need to finish that damn Hegel book, and I'll probably read Husserl's Ideas before tackling any more phenomenology books.

Did you ever finish Being and Time?

[Duncan]

I haven't read it, but hopefully I'll get around to it someday. First I need to finish that damn Hegel book, and I'll probably read Husserl's Ideas before tackling any more phenomenology books.

Did you ever finish Being and Time?

No. My plan is to read The Movement-Image, then the Time part of Being and Time, then The Time-Image, then write some massive paper combining the two to create a brand new theory of film. And I'll just throw in the second half of Anna Karenina for good measure. Yup. It could happen.

[lovejuice]

No. My plan is to read The Movement-Image, then the Time part of Being and Time, then The Time-Image, then write some massive paper combining the two to create a brand new theory of film. And I'll just throw in the second half of Anna Karenina for good measure. Yup. It could happen.

how's that damn hegel book going?

[Ezee E]

Damn, that opening passage in Blood Meridian is a work of art.

[Duncan]

how's that damn hegel book going?
I dunno. I've never tackled a whole book by Hegel. Maybe you're thinking of Melville?

[Melville]

how's that damn hegel book going?
Very slowly.

[SirNewt]

http://www.securenet.net/tbcl/27233.jpg

Just snagged this at a local book shop while I was hiding from a storm that literaly dropped eight inches of rain in thirty minutes. This is Montana for Christ's sake! Anyway, I can't wait to read it. I'm thinking of putting off Dante and starting this. I think it's actually a first edition: though, I'm not really a collector. Hey, it was only $12.00.

[Gerbier]

The last book I read was Chaplin's autiobiography. It's out-of-print (I think) so I had to order a used copy off amazon. Fascinating stuff.

[D_Davis]

The last book I read was Chaplin's autiobiography. It's out-of-print (I think) so I had to order a used copy off amazon. Fascinating stuff.

I bet that's fascinating. I didn't even know he wrote one.

[SirNewt]

The last book I read was Chaplin's autiobiography. It's out-of-print (I think) so I had to order a used copy off amazon. Fascinating stuff.

Nice, my first AV was from L'Amee as well. You may feel a slight change in your statistical prowess!

[Gerbier]

I bet that's fascinating. I didn't even know he wrote one.

Yep, in 1963 I believe. You can get a used, hardback 1963 print of amazon for about $10. I couldn't put it down.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Yep, in 1963 I believe. You can get a used, hardback 1963 print of amazon for about $10. I couldn't put it down.

It's even cheaper in paperback on half.com (http://product.half.ebay.com/Charles-Chaplin_W0QQtgZinfoQQprZ464009 ). I ordered one for $2.84.

[D_Davis]

The Atrocity Exhibition - Ballard

The final parts of this book are amazing. Why I Want to F*** Ronald Reagan, The Assassination of JFK Considered as a Downhill Motor Race, Princess Margaret's Face Lift, and Mae West's Reduction Mammoplasty are all brilliant works of satire, and deeply scathing of American pop-culture and humanity in general.

The rest of it is good in spurts, but I found the vision to be too singular to warrant the length - and it's not even that long. Throughout these pages it is easy to pick up on themes that Ballard would return to later, or had visited previously, and had executed them better.

It is interesting, and I recommend it to people who really want a challenge, but I am not as enthused about this as I am Ballard's other fiction.

It is uniquely Ballardian though - I cannot imagine another author who could pull this off and get away with it.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I can't take anymore of A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius. Eggers writing feels like phony hipster posturing. I don't feel like he's getting anywhere with this so-called cathartic exercise. He seems content just skimming the surface of things in the name of style. It's not the least bit compelling. I'm moving on to something else.

[D_Davis]

I can't take anymore of A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius. Eggers writing feels like phony hipster posturing. I don't feel like he's getting anywhere with this so-called cathartic exercise. He seems content just skimming the surface of things in the name of style. It's not the least bit compelling. I'm moving on to something else.

IN YER FACE HIPSTERS!

:)

This book is good for about 50 pages, then it just gets stupid.

At one time I really tried to like it, but I soon realized that didn't.

[megladon8]

So I officially gave up on "Hell" 30 pages from the end.

I'm terribly sorry, KF, because I know you were looking forward to my thoughts - but hey, maybe giving up on it is the best criticism of all?

It started out wonderfully, with a very neat idea for a story. Then this became simply a base on which Barbusse could build his own philosophical ramblings, and totally ignored the story that had been built up 'til then.

Anyways, I've begun reading something else.

[Benny Profane]

I can't take anymore of A Heartbreaking Work of Staggering Genius. Eggers writing feels like phony hipster posturing. I don't feel like he's getting anywhere with this so-called cathartic exercise. He seems content just skimming the surface of things in the name of style. It's not the least bit compelling. I'm moving on to something else.

Hey man, I got just the right book for you...

[Kurosawa Fan]

IN YER FACE HIPSTERS!

:)

This book is good for about 50 pages, then it just gets stupid.

At one time I really tried to like it, but I soon realized that didn't.

That's about right. After their parents both pass, it became bland as ever, and I kept having to force myself to pick it up and read more.

[Kurosawa Fan]

So I officially gave up on "Hell" 30 pages from the end.

I'm terribly sorry, KF, because I know you were looking forward to my thoughts - but hey, maybe giving up on it is the best criticism of all?

It started out wonderfully, with a very neat idea for a story. Then this became simply a base on which Barbusse could build his own philosophical ramblings, and totally ignored the story that had been built up 'til then.

Anyways, I've begun reading something else.

That's still good to hear. Lately I've grown tired of author's philosophical ramblings, so if that's much of what the book consists of, I'll keep holding off for the time being.


Hey man, I got just the right book for you...

:lol:

Alright, here's my plan: I'm going to read two books at the same time for the first time in my life. I'm going to be reading When You Are Engulfed in Flames by Sedaris and a crime novel my father-in-law loaned me. When I'm finished with those two, your book will follow. You have my word.

[Benny Profane]

Now starting Time's Arrow by Martin Amis, which starts with an old man at a hospital and works its way backwards. The style definitely takes some getting used to.

Rabbit at Rest was absolutely outstanding. My favorite in the series. Easy to see why Updike won a Pulitzer and a bazillion other awards for this.

[Ezee E]

Hmm... Blood Meridian or The Road. Which is better?

Thus far, Blood Meridian somehow.

[ledfloyd]

That's about right. After their parents both pass, it became bland as ever, and I kept having to force myself to pick it up and read more.
the beginning is genius. when it gets on about starting his magazine it's awful, it picks up again towards the end.

[Kurosawa Fan]

the beginning is genius. when it gets on about starting his magazine it's awful, it picks up again towards the end.

The magazine was where I dropped out for good. I don't really care if it picks up at the end, I wasn't going to slog through that nonsense. No offense to anyone who likes him, he's just not for me.

[Izzy Black]

Reading Kafka's Metamorphosis, or rather, finished, and Wittgenstein's Culture and Value. I am also embarking on Kierkegaard's Either/Or having read Fear and Trembling and Repetition.

[D_Davis]

Finally got my copy of Mount Analogue: A Novel of Symbolically Authentic Non-Euclidean Adventures in Mountain Climbing. I forgot that I ordered this! I am greatly looking forward to reading it, as it was what inspired Jodorowsky to make Holy Mountain. Unfortunately, the book is not finished. It ends half way through a sentence in chapter 5.

:(

[Qrazy]

I'm thinking of putting off Dante and starting this.

Don't.

[Qrazy]

Finally got my copy of Mount Analogue: A Novel of Symbolically Authentic Non-Euclidean Adventures in Mountain Climbing. I forgot that I ordered this! I am greatly looking forward to reading it, as it was what inspired Jodorowsky to make Holy Mountain. Unfortunately, the book is not finished. It ends half way through a sentence in chapter 5.

:(

Meh, finished or unfinished isn't really all that important in the grand scheme of things. I've seen half-finished paintings by Cezanne which still managed to out-class 90 percent of the other paintings in the museum. And let's not forget Mr. Notorious for not finishing his work Kafka and the literary earth-shaking he enacted.

[D_Davis]

I agree. I am not an endings person. If you've read the Dark Tower, and really get the metanarrative, you'll understand when I say that I am a Suzanna, not a Roland. The end only happens at one point, the journey happens throughout.

To me it's all about the journey.

In many ways it is fitting that Duamal never finished his tale. There is a certain amount of artistic power in an unfinished book about finding one's true self. Often times the most important journeys have no real ending.

In the version I got, a reporter interviews the author about the end of the book, how he was going to conclude it, and why he stopped writing it. Should be very interesting.

However, it is a bit disappointing to think that this book cuts off right in the middle of the journey. Actually, less than 1/2 of the book was finished - so it's more than just an ending missing. Maybe I'll find that it's okay, reading it is also part of the journey.

[Duncan]

Finished Cinema 1: The Movement-Image last night. I found it a little uneven. The most fascinating chapters are definitely the ones where Deleuze discusses Bergson directly. Towards the end of the book he seems to be just discussing films as it pleases him. Yes, the discussions are always tangentially related to his primary thesis, but they're not consistently direct or even interesting. Deleuze's terminology also seems a bit vague at times. For example, is he using "wrinkled lines of the universe" in reference to Mizoguchi only for poetic purposes, or is he using it as a technical term? Because he seems to be using it technically, and I have no idea what it means.

Still, some fascinating ideas and a truly novel approach to film. Definitely worth the read. It's high points were very high.

[Duncan]

Hunter S. Thompson is in the news a lot recently because of that new documentary on him. I thought I would pick up one of his books today. Any one in particular a good place to start? I was thinking Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas...

[Qrazy]

I agree. I am not an endings person. If you've read the Dark Tower, and really get the metanarrative, you'll understand when I say that I am a Suzanna, not a Roland. The end only happens at one point, the journey happens throughout.

To me it's all about the journey.

In many ways it is fitting that Duamal never finished his tale. There is a certain amount of artistic power in an unfinished book about finding one's true self. Often times the most important journeys have no real ending.

In the version I got, a reporter interviews the author about the end of the book, how he was going to conclude it, and why he stopped writing it. Should be very interesting.

However, it is a bit disappointing to think that this book cuts off right in the middle of the journey. Actually, less than 1/2 of the book was finished - so it's more than just an ending missing. Maybe I'll find that it's okay, reading it is also part of the journey.

Yeah that's a reasonable disappointment but all I'm saying (and it seems you agree so there's no reason for me to reiterate but...) is that an unfinished work can sometimes be much better than other finished works. By the way D have you ever seen Kwaidan? It strikes me as a film you may quite enjoy but be sure to see the longer cut, the last section (there are 4) deals with a ghost story and the way it ends (I won't spoil it but it has something to do with what we're talking about) is absolutely chilling.

[Qrazy]

Hunter S. Thompson is in the news a lot recently because of that new documentary on him. I thought I would pick up one of his books today. Any one in particular a good place to start? I was thinking Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas...

I've only read that one and it's pretty solid. It's a lot like the film with a few more extended sequences but I thought Gilliam captured it quite well. I've heard that Fear and Loathing: On the Campaign Trail is even better.

[Qrazy]

Also I'm about half-way through The Unbearable Lightness of Being right now. I'll probably watch the film once I finish the book.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Also I'm about half-way through The Unbearable Lightness of Being right now. I'll probably watch the film once I finish the book.

You might want to reconsider. The film was a big disappointment after reading the novel.

[Qrazy]

You might want to reconsider. The film was a big disappointment after reading the novel.

Well that's a shame but I'll probably see it anyway since it's Criterion and I've given myself the criterion challenge... about 80 films left to see.

[Milky Joe]

In terms of phony hipster posturing, I'd much rather read Eggers than I would David Sedaris.

And Duncan, if you're not all that interested in the 60s drug culture, Fear & Loathing might not be as good an introduction to Thompson as say, The Rum Diary would.

[ledfloyd]

I've only read that one and it's pretty solid. It's a lot like the film with a few more extended sequences but I thought Gilliam captured it quite well. I've heard that Fear and Loathing: On the Campaign Trail is even better.
i wouldn't recommend fear and loathing on the campaign trail unless you're really interested in politics. i am so i liked it. but he throws around alot of obscure names of people that were running for the nominations. and the vast majority of the book is about the election, there are a few vegasesque escapades but that's not the main focus.

i think fear and loathing in las vegas is the logical place to start.

i really liked the rum diary. hell's angels is the one thing of his i've read and disliked. i just couldn't get that interested in it.

the gonzo papers series is great. especially the great shark hunt and generation of swine. there are some articles that aren't that interesting, but the vast majority of the stuff is great.

the general consensus seems to be that the curse of the lono is his best, but the $50 price tag has kept me from picking it up. i also have yet to read screwjack or the gonzo letters.

[Kurosawa Fan]

In terms of phony hipster posturing, I'd much rather read Eggers than I would David Sedaris.

Hipster is the last word I'd use to describe Sedaris. What about him strikes you as "hipster"? Like him or not, I just don't see it.

[Qrazy]

After seeing Reds I feel compelled to pick up a compendium of Jack Reed's journalistic articles.

[Ezee E]

They sure spit a lot in Blood Meridian.

And the violence... If they faithfully adapt this, it'll be tough to even get a R-rating. sheesh.

Tremendous book though.

Besides this, No Country, and The Road, is there anything else of his that's amazing? I didn't really care for Suttree.

[Duncan]

Yeah, I think I'll just go with Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. Thanks guys.

I'm almost done Isaac Asimov's Foundation. So far it is a very breezy read. Maybe it's because this book is apparently so influential (I swear every one of these scenarios has been adapted into an episode of Star Trek) but the ideas really don't seem so amazing. And I've heard Asimov is an ideas guy, so...I'll just have to finish it today and see if my opinion improves.

[D_Davis]

I'm almost done Isaac Asimov's Foundation. So far it is a very breezy read. Maybe it's because this book is apparently so influential (I swear every one of these scenarios has been adapted into an episode of Star Trek) but the ideas really don't seem so amazing. And I've heard Asimov is an ideas guy, so...I'll just have to finish it today and see if my opinion improves.

I recently posted some thoughts on this in the SF thread. I didn't like it at all, and couldn't even finish it.

[Qrazy]

Yeah, I think I'll just go with Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas. Thanks guys.

I'm almost done Isaac Asimov's Foundation. So far it is a very breezy read. Maybe it's because this book is apparently so influential (I swear every one of these scenarios has been adapted into an episode of Star Trek) but the ideas really don't seem so amazing. And I've heard Asimov is an ideas guy, so...I'll just have to finish it today and see if my opinion improves.

He's an ideas guy in the sense that he's writing thoughtful science fiction with a heavy science background. So the science he introduces in his novels has a stronger foundation than most of the gadgets and nonsense in lighter fare. Interestingly enough (if memory serves) he's contributed to every section of the dewey decimal system except for the 100's - The philosophy/psychology section. I quite enjoy the series and I recommend continuing with it (also read prelude to foundation) but the ideas are not going to be earth shattering, just thought provoking.

[Duncan]

He's an ideas guy in the sense that he's writing thoughtful science fiction with a heavy science background. So the science he introduces in his novels has a stronger foundation than most of the gadgets and nonsense in lighter fare. Interestingly enough (if memory serves) he's contributed to every section of the dewey decimal system except for the 100's - The philosophy/psychology section. I quite enjoy the series and I recommend continuing with it (also read prelude to foundation) but the ideas are not going to be earth shattering, just thought provoking.

I don't think I'm going to continue with it. I didn't like it much. He had 300 pages to present an interesting idea, or even an interesting character. Besides, I usually get bored with a long series like this. I love Dune, for example, but even I can't bring myself to pick up Chapterhouse Dune.

[D_Davis]

I don't think I'm going to continue with it. I didn't like it much. He had 300 pages to present an interesting idea, or even an interesting character. Besides, I usually get bored with a long series like this. I love Dune, for example, but even I can't bring myself to pick up Chapterhouse Dune.

Totally agree with the length, and the general aversion to long series. Give me a great, single volume narrative. The curse of series is something that has plagued genre fiction for far too long. I think this is why my favorite SF authors are who they are - no series!

[Qrazy]

I don't think I'm going to continue with it. I didn't like it much. He had 300 pages to present an interesting idea, or even an interesting character. Besides, I usually get bored with a long series like this. I love Dune, for example, but even I can't bring myself to pick up Chapterhouse Dune.

He presented interesting ideas, even if you did not find them interesting... and yes as you note it has been copied to death so that does play a role... I'm inclined to agree with you that his characters aren't very interesting.

[Qrazy]

Totally agree with the length, and the general aversion to long series. Give me a great, single volume narrative. The curse of series is something that has plagued genre fiction for far too long. I think this is why my favorite SF authors are who they are - no series!

I don't see it as a curse, it's just something different. Something like Wheel of Time or The Wire could not exist in a compact format. It's because they're series that they have room to build an expansive world. This would not be possible within the confines of a single volume. Furthermore it gives the author room to follow characters over a longer period of time, to play with themes and motifs across many novels and to weave narrative threads together like an enormous tapestry. The foundation series taken together is much more powerful than any one novel of the series in isolation because the world and themes grow and the series' approach to thought, politics and morality changes in a natural and compelling manner across many volumes.

[Benny Profane]

Kafka on the Shore -- Murakami.

My first from this author.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Finished both books I was reading (though honestly, I read about 20 pages of both, then blew through each separately). Finished The Black Echo first, which was solid as usual. I like Michael Connelly. He's a good crime writer. Last night I finished When You Are Engulfed in Flames. It's minor Sedaris. The problem with the book isn't that it feels redundant, it's that it just isn't very funny. It has its highlights (the spiders on his windowsill, his first time traveling in Business Elite, etc.), but I only laughed out loud a handful of times, which is significantly less than Me Talk Pretty or Naked. Still, it was a fast, entertaining read.

And now, onto The Devil in the White City. For you Benny. For you.

[Ezee E]

Is Devil in the White City about the Fair in Chicago? It's awesome.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Is Devil in the White City about the Fair in Chicago? It's awesome.

That's the one. I blew through the first 50 pages last night after the game. I'm intrigued.

[Ezee E]

That's the one. I blew through the first 50 pages last night after the game. I'm intrigued.
You'll be done with the book by next week.

[Raiders]

Still going on Mann's Magic Mountain. Outstanding stuff, but frustratingly long and dense. I have fit two other books in between. I hope to have it finished by the end of the week, but I don't know.

[Duncan]

Still going on Mann's Magic Mountain. Outstanding stuff, but frustratingly long and dense. I have fit two other books in between. I hope to have it finished by the end of the week, but I don't know.

I'm in the same boat with Anna Karenina. Got 400 pages in then started reading a couple other books. I still have 4 or 5 hundred pages left. Maybe I can finish it by the end of next week, but I'm pretty busy right now.

[Benny Profane]

I bet you guys would have finished these books quicker if you hadn't read two other books in between.

[Raiders]

I bet you guys would have finished these books quicker if you hadn't read two other books in between.

I'm not sure. It just hasn't been a book I can pick up every day and get into. When I do read it, I love it, but there's so much there it gets to where I need something a little breezier in between.

[Hugh_Grant]

I'm in the same boat with Anna Karenina. Got 400 pages in then started reading a couple other books. I still have 4 or 5 hundred pages left. Maybe I can finish it by the end of next week, but I'm pretty busy right now.

And I'm in the same boat with Cloud Atlas, which is turning out to be one of those "I admire it more than I like it" books.

One of my German profs in college used to joke about Mann's Doctor Faustus being the antithesis of a beach read. Dense indeed.

[D_Davis]

Started reading William Peter Blatty's I'll Tell Them I Remember You last night, and I had the hardest time putting it down. Finally, at midnight, I forced myself to stop reading because I knew I had to get up early this morning to start a very long day.

This book is part autobiography, part biography (of his mother), part immigrant story, and part religious testimonial.

I am consistently shocked and amazed by Blatty; the dude can write like the dickens. There is a beautiful, soft elegance in his simple, straightforward prose. When I see the way he constructs certain sentences, I think to myself that he phrases things in their exact optimal way.

I am also shocked that Blatty is really only known for The Exorcist, when everything else I've read by him has been as good if not better.

I am really looking forward to diving into some of his satires next.

[Benny Profane]

So what's so great about Murakami?

I'm halfway through Kafka on the Shore and it's pretty underwhelming. It's easy to read and I feel as if there's a great story in there somewhere so I'll press on for now.

[Kurosawa Fan]

So what's so great about Murakami?


This was my question after reading The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle. lovejuice was the only one I remember agreeing with me that it was a mediocre novel.

[Duncan]

I thought Sputnik-Sweetheart was mediocre. Only novel of his I've read.

[Raiders]

This was my question after reading The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle. lovejuice was the only one I remember agreeing with me that it was a mediocre novel.

:: Ahem ::

[D_Davis]

So what's so great about Murakami?

I'm halfway through Kafka on the Shore and it's pretty underwhelming. It's easy to read and I feel as if there's a great story in there somewhere so I'll press on for now.

He's okay - kind of like PKD for a more mainstream audience. At least, that's what I was reminded of.

I haven't read a lot of his stuff, and I doubt I will read anymore.

[megladon8]

I've only read one Murakami, but I thought it was scintillating.

"Sputnik Sweetheart" was the name.

[Kurosawa Fan]

:: Ahem ::

Nice. Did you voice your displeasure after I finished reading it? I can only remember lovejuice siding with me, but perhaps I'm mistaken. Man, before I read it, I thought it was praised by everyone on this site. I remember thinking I was going to get flamed.

[Benny Profane]

He's okay - kind of like PKD for a more mainstream audience. At least, that's what I was reminded of.

I haven't read a lot of his stuff, and I doubt I will read anymore.

I get more of a Marquez-wannabe vibe. Either way, not overly impressed.

[megladon8]

Oh well, I guess I'll have to be this board's second-in-command (head officer being Space Oddity) with the Murakami love.

"Sputnik Sweetheart" was one of the most beautifully written books I've ever read. The man has a way with words.

[D_Davis]

Starting on John Goldfarb, Please Come Home!, today. On Goodreads, there is not a single person who has rated/read this book. Beyond The Exorcist, I think Blatty may be the most unappreciated and overlooked author I've ever read. He's 5/5 for me, and I hope I like this one. It is a Cold War satire about a Jewish U-2 pilot who crash lands in Arabia.

[Benny Profane]

Long books. I'm talking 700+ pages. Recommend me some good ones. I'm going to Europe and Africa next week and like to read long books on long trips, because it's the best time to read them.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I read Don Quixote on a long trip. Good a time as any.

[Benny Profane]

Interesting.

Anyone ever read The Executioner's Song by Norman Mailer? It's about 1,000 pages and the description gives me an In Cold Blood vibe.

[Raiders]

Starting on John Goldfarb, Please Come Home!, today. On Goodreads, there is not a single person who has rated/read this book. Beyond The Exorcist, I think Blatty may be the most unappreciated and overlooked author I've ever read. He's 5/5 for me, and I hope I like this one. It is a Cold War satire about a Jewish U-2 pilot who crash lands in Arabia.

Read this in college. Remember liking it, but that's about it. I have also read Twinkle, Twinkle Killer Kane, which I didn't care much for. Interesting ideas (some even recycled in The Exorcist), but I had the disadvantage of seeing the movie first, and I found it held a better mood and the narrative choppiness had a more surreal, almost-comedic quality whereas the book felt a little more aimless.

[Sven]

Anyone ever read The Executioner's Song by Norman Mailer? It's about 1,000 pages and the description gives me an In Cold Blood vibe.

I read bits and pieces of it, amounting to about maybe 20% of the book, for a semblance of cultural literacy, having come from Utah. It reads more like Krakauer than Capote, in my opinion. Not necessarily a bad thing. One of these days, I may pick it up. Some interesting things.

[Sven]

Long books. I'm talking 700+ pages. Recommend me some good ones. I'm going to Europe and Africa next week and like to read long books on long trips, because it's the best time to read them.

King's The Stand
Dickens's Barnaby Rudge

[Duncan]

The Brothers Karamazov, if you haven't already read it.

[Benny Profane]

The Brothers Karamazov, if you haven't already read it.

I have.

That was on my Denmark trip.

[D_Davis]

I have also read Twinkle, Twinkle Killer Kane, which I didn't care much for. Interesting ideas (some even recycled in The Exorcist), but I had the disadvantage of seeing the movie first, and I found it held a better mood and the narrative choppiness had a more surreal, almost-comedic quality whereas the book felt a little more aimless.

It's actually the second part of his trilogy of faith, and so it shares some thematic and dramatic elements with the Exorcist and Legion. I, too, saw the film first, but then recently read the book, loved it, and rediscovered the movie. While I like the film a lot, very much so, I think the book is much stronger - especially the end. While the end of the film is taken from Blatty's own life experience, I found it too pat in the film. The book's ending is far more powerful. But both are pretty amazing, and I would argue that it is easily the best book to film adaptation I've seen. The book is one of the best things I've ever read - as a matter of fact, I'd say it is at least life confirming, if not changing. Yes, I found it quite powerful.

[D_Davis]

Long books. I'm talking 700+ pages. Recommend me some good ones. I'm going to Europe and Africa next week and like to read long books on long trips, because it's the best time to read them.

Delaney's Dhalgren or John Brunner's Stand on Zanzibar.

[Sven]

Moby Dick!

[Benny Profane]

Moby Dick!

Only book I started but never finished.

[D_Davis]

The Company, by Robert Littell is supposed to be amazing, and it is quite long. I plan on reading it soon.

[Raiders]

Definitely Thomas Mann's "Magic Mountain." I finished it yesterday.

[Qrazy]

Long books. I'm talking 700+ pages. Recommend me some good ones. I'm going to Europe and Africa next week and like to read long books on long trips, because it's the best time to read them.

Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time series. :-P

[Milky Joe]

Long books. I'm talking 700+ pages. Recommend me some good ones. I'm going to Europe and Africa next week and like to read long books on long trips, because it's the best time to read them.

infinite jest. but I can't imagine lugging that thing all over europe would be very much fun. but seriously, infinite jest.

[Ezee E]

The Bible!

[Qrazy]

Finnegan's Wake!

(I think my copy is pretty long at least.)

[Milky Joe]

you could take finnegans wake to the moon and back and still not understand more than a quarter of what it has to offer.

but go for it!

[Benny Profane]

I picked up a copy of Finnegan's Wake at my friends house. I read the first paragraph. I read it a second time. I had a look at the second paragraph. I tried reading the first paragraph again. Closed the book.

[D_Davis]

Raiders -

When you read John Goldfarb, was it for a class in college, or just for fun? I am interesting in the capacity in which people read non-Exorcist Blatty, especially considering that most of his books (all except The Exorcist?) are OOP and have been for quite some time.

[ledfloyd]

i second Infinite Jest.

i went to the bookstore today and got Catch-22. i'm excited about this.

[Qrazy]

I picked up a copy of Finnegan's Wake at my friends house. I read the first paragraph. I read it a second time. I had a look at the second paragraph. I tried reading the first paragraph again. Closed the book.

Yeah I did something similar except leafed around a bit more. I just didn't have the patience to really piece-meal dissect it at the time or to just let it wash over me. I did just buy the skeleton key for it though so I'm going to give it another try.

[Qrazy]

i went to the bookstore today and got Catch-22. i'm excited about this.

Tis good.

[Milky Joe]

Yeah I did something similar except leafed around a bit more. I just didn't have the patience to really piece-meal dissect it at the time or to just let it wash over me. I did just buy the skeleton key for it though so I'm going to give it another try.

I recommend listening to this lecture (http://www.zshare.net/audio/1106459e40ab0a/) by Terrence McKenna in which he talks about why he thinks Finnegans Wake is "the quintessential work of art, or at least work of literature, of the 20th century." It's what got me wanting to dive into it, anyway (having read Ulysses twice, one of which was for a class devoted to the novel, also helped).

[D_Davis]

I recommend listening to this lecture (http://www.zshare.net/audio/1106459e40ab0a/) by Terrence McKenna in which he talks about why he thinks Finnegans Wake is "the quintessential work of art, or at least work of literature, of the 20th century." It's what got me wanting to dive into it, anyway (having read Ulysses twice, one of which was for a class devoted to the novel, also helped).

Robert Anton Wilson also adored Finnegan,s Wake, and was one of the world's leading Joyce scholars. In his recorded interview, Robert Anton Wilson Explains Everything, old Bob spends a great deal of time discussing the novel. While I have never had a desire to read it, Wilson's passion for the novel got me close.

Seeing as how close they were, I wouldn't be surprised if McKenna's love for Joyce was birthed by Wilson. I would love to listen to them both discuss the book.

I highly recommend the RAW interview - it is available on CD. It was recorded a couple of years before his death, and it is incredibly good. It is a rare opportunity to listen to a truly brilliant man discuss all of the things that shaped his unique and amazing life.

Thanks for that link, I'll check it out. Terrence McKenna is awesome. I love his DMT lectures, and was first introduced to him on the Art Bell show years ago. Such a fascinating man. With Leary, Wilson, and McKenna all dead, who will become the new gurus of esoteric knowledge?

Any ideas?

[D_Davis]

Listening online to Terrence McKenna discuss James Joyce, complete with psychedelic visualizations on the audio player, while images of half-naked girls posing as links to a video site plagued with spyware beckon me to click on them, is something that I am sure he and Robert Anton Wilson would have discussed at length and probably would have approved of.

[Milky Joe]

With Leary, Wilson, and McKenna all dead, who will become the new gurus of esoteric knowledge?

Any ideas?

Yeah, in fact, I'd say Daniel Pinchbeck is making some great strides to filling that gap. His recent book 2012: The Return of Quetzacoatl is fantastic.

Thank you for that recommendation, I will look into it. I have developed quite a serious jones recently to hear some Joyce discussion. This will be perfect for me, I think.

EDIT: Just found a rip of it on Waffles. Excellent!

[Qrazy]

I recommend listening to this lecture (http://www.zshare.net/audio/1106459e40ab0a/) by Terrence McKenna in which he talks about why he thinks Finnegans Wake is "the quintessential work of art, or at least work of literature, of the 20th century." It's what got me wanting to dive into it, anyway (having read Ulysses twice, one of which was for a class devoted to the novel, also helped).

Alright I'll give it a shot (the lecture) but I already understand why it's supposed to be amazing so I don't particularly need to be convinced, just have to have the patience to tackle it.

[Raiders]

Raiders -

When you read John Goldfarb, was it for a class in college, or just for fun? I am interesting in the capacity in which people read non-Exorcist Blatty, especially considering that most of his books (all except The Exorcist?) are OOP and have been for quite some time.

College. It was my professor's pick for our satire discussion.

[Kurosawa Fan]

i went to the bookstore today and got Catch-22. i'm excited about this.

You should be.

[D_Davis]

Yeah, in fact, I'd say Daniel Pinchbeck is making some great strides to filling that gap. His recent book 2012: The Return of Quetzacoatl is fantastic.

Thank you for that recommendation, I will look into it. I have developed quite a serious jones recently to hear some Joyce discussion. This will be perfect for me, I think.

EDIT: Just found a rip of it on Waffles. Excellent!

Cool, I'll check out Pinchbeck.

I think you're going to like the RAW interview quite a bit. It's very long and very interesting. At first I thought I was mainly going to be interested in him talking about magic, the Illuminati and all the other esoteric theories he and Robert Shea popularized, but I came away from the interview far more interested in Wilson's studies of general semantics, maybe logic, and James Joyce.

I just found this documentary on Google video:

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=robert+anton+wil son&emb=0#

There are quite a few RAW videos there. The I in the Triangle series is fantastic.

[D_Davis]

You know, I can't think of anyone I disagree with more, but find as interesting, fascinating, and compelling as Robert Anton Wilson. Even though I have a vastly different world view than Mr. Wilson, he does something to me that is very important: he makes me think about the stuff I believe in in new and interesting ways. Sometimes he challenges me, sometimes he pisses me off, sometimes he makes me laugh, and sometimes he saddens me, but he never bores me and he is always engaging.

[D_Davis]

Yeah, in fact, I'd say Daniel Pinchbeck is making some great strides to filling that gap. His recent book 2012: The Return of Quetzacoatl is fantastic.


We also have:

Douglas Rushkoff
Rudy Rucker
Vernor Vinge
Ray Kurzweil

While not as far out as RAW, McKenna and Leary, and probably not nearly as into psychedelics, these 4 dudes are definitely tapped into some deep wells of pop-esoteric knowledge.

[Grouchy]

Long books. I'm talking 700+ pages. Recommend me some good ones. I'm going to Europe and Africa next week and like to read long books on long trips, because it's the best time to read them.
Roberto Bolaño's The Savage Detectives.

Best novel I've read in years. Hell, second best novel I've ever read after Lolita.

[Benny Profane]

Roberto Bolaño's The Savage Detectives.

Best novel I've read in years. Hell, second best novel I've ever read after Lolita.

Very intriguing since I see part of it is set in Barcelona and that's where I'm headed. This is in the lead for now.

[D_Davis]

This year I've been averaging about 6 books read per month.

I have about 100 books in my "to read" stack (shelves) at home.

My Amazon wish list is now over 10 pages long.

I have a feeling I will die before I read everything I want to read, and that sucks.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I have a feeling I will die before I read everything I want to read, and that sucks.

This is an absolute certainty. It's the same with films. You'll never do everything you want to do. It's a bummer.

[D_Davis]

This is an absolute certainty. It's the same with films. You'll never do everything you want to do. It's a bummer.

When I think about it, it really makes me want to prioritize, and I realize that those last 6 hours I've spent playing Geometry Wars 2 probably weren't spent very well.