Arrow + The Flash Power Hour (AND MORE!)

[Thirdmango]

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d185/thirdmango/arrowwallpaper_zps0bcb41ab.jpg

I know there are still a couple of us hanging on and sometimes I wanna talk about this show. Especially this past episode when it had Manu Bennett from Spartacus as a guest star. I hope he sticks around during the in past storyline. I'm not too familiar with the DC universe but I saw the same masked guy in Young Justice the other day so I know it's probably an actually character the double mask guy. Also having John Barrowman on the show is a nice touch.

[[ETM]]

Yeah, that's Slade/Deathstroke (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deathstroke). He appears in a bunch or comics, TV shows and movies.

I watch the show regularly. While it has PLENTY pretty glaring flaws, I'm quite impressed by the dynamic of plot revelations and the integrated continuous flashback sequences.

[slqrick]

Yeah, the shitty CW flourishes (the family scenes, some of the cheesy villains) are there, but this show is better than people think, or want it to be. The first season is moving along at a really good pace, and they're handling the different plots well. I can't wait to see what they do with Slade.

[Thirdmango]

It's been more then a week but thinking back I'm still really happy with the Slade centric episode the other week.

Also having a Speedy moment was pretty good. I wonder when they're going to actually start using him.

[slqrick]

Last night's episode was written by Geoff Johns and it was pretty great. Not a lot of the cheesy CW romance stuff in this episode which was nice. Some really good family moments though, and Deadshot was slightly better this time around. I'm enjoying the show quite a bit.

[Thirdmango]

Best episode of the season? Probably. Though it might be a contender with the on island episode. Alex Kingston showing up at the end of this episode, so awesome.

[Thirdmango]

I know a lot of people jumped out when it was a terrible show in the very beginning but they turned it around very quickly and became a very fun show. Season finale was totally epic. Oh my goodness, so many cool things. I am so excited to see what they do with season 2.

He blew up half of the glades! Oh my goodness they actually pulled it off that he would do it. That is so good. The season ends with total devastation.

[slqrick]

The Flash confirmed for season two! Get excited with me Mango.

I'm sure everyone will scoff at this, but this is a legitimately good show. Yes, there is the occasional (OK, sometimes rampant) soap opera element, but the season finale didn't pull any punches. They delivered on the high stakes, and that's a rarity for first seasons...not just for low budget CW shows, but TV in general. I can't wait to see how they expand the DCU.

[Thirdmango]

Oh my goodness yes. I really do love this show and have gotten to the point of recommending it. The last like 10-15 episodes of the season were so good. And that finale was actually one of the most ambitious finales I've seen in a long time.

[slqrick]

Maybe more people will watch now that it's on Netflix. The premiere was pretty great and made the show both more believable and the logical conclusion to last seasons events. Looking forward to the comic booky stuff this season...they already mentioned Iron Heights.

[slqrick]

Bueller?

This season has been awesome so far. Black Canary, Ras al Ghul shoutout. I'm enjoying the expanding universe.

[Russ]

Halfway through the first season and the flashbacks are by far the most interesting part of the show. Probably because they're parceled out slowly and deliberately, I'm guessing, to dovetail with current day happenings back in Starling City (and the end of Season 1).

Everything is so attractive. The actors are all lovely to look at, as are the beautiful Vancouver locations. But, Jeebus Christ people, SOMEONE PLEASE TAKE SOME FUCKING ACTING CLASSES.

* sigh *

I wish this show was as good as I wanted it to be. It's so fucking paint-by-the-numbers, I honestly don't know why I keep watching. I don't know, but I can almost sense something building.

But I'll be damned if I know what it is.

I like Felicity a lot. I hope they don't kill her off.

[number8]

Yeah, almost done with the first season and having way more fun with it than expected. This show very quickly figured out what it's good at and what it isn't very good at, and does a good job tipping the scales.

[Russ]

I think it finally started to come together for me around episode 13, with the introduction of Slade and bringing Felicity into the team. The show finally seems to have found its purpose as the two main storylines begin to converge. A discernible increase in quality, that's for sure.

I'm sorry about my earlier rant, Arrow. All is forgiven.

[number8]

Oh, and pretty impressed with the amount of comic references they pack into this show without seeming forced, too. Even the throwaway criminals he puts away in the cold opens are DC villains.

[EyesWideOpen]

I thought you were better than this 8.

[number8]

Whatever, man. If they keep up with the intense action scenes and keep pairing up Paul Blackthorne and Alex Kingston together, I'm good.

Mackleroy Harper is pretty annoying, though.

[number8]

Heh. Blatant reference to The Raid and Oldboy at the end.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99MH4uSypzI

[slqrick]

The latest episode was more good stuff.

The Black Canary stuff was so comic booky, I loved it.

[number8]

I'm caught up. They abandoned so much of the insistence on realism in Season 2 and the show's now all the better for it. They finally dropped the ridiculous "The Hood" nonsense. The show takes so much from Batman lore, but I'm okay with it. Making Ra's Al Ghul the new big bad of Season 2 is working out really well.

This show is like the exact opposite of everything Agents of SHIELD is: Nearly every episode is ambitious and action packed, but everything looks so cheap; The characters have depth and are interesting, but the actors cannot keep up.

[number8]

Fucking finally.

http://img2.timeinc.net/ew/i/2013/11/18/Arrow-Three-Ghosts.jpg

[slqrick]

This is how you make a damn comic book show. Too many Dark Knight ripoffs in this episode (or more than usual, I guess), but just really fun, pulpy stuff. Amell's much better than I thought he would be in the role.

[number8]

Hell yeah. It's funny that I keep saying SHIELD needs to get a big bad already, and this show just throws in FOUR supervillains in one episode. :lol:

[[ETM]]

Bah, this was the most naive and boring episode so far this season.

[megladon8]

Watched the first two episodes of this tonight. Holy crap, it's actually pretty great.

[slqrick]

Tonight's a big one.

The Flash

[megladon8]

I'm surprised by the quality of the action on this show. Some pretty nice choreography. A little too much shaky cam, but it's still effective.

[slqrick]

I'm surprised by the quality of the action on this show. Some pretty nice choreography. A little too much shaky cam, but it's still effective.

It's one thing they did well from the get go. If you're liking it now, you'll definitely love it as the story progresses. The thing that's cool about season two is how much more comic booky it's gotten without betraying the "grounded" aspects of the universe, while vastly improving the CW soap opera stuff.

[number8]

Actual superpowers, finally. Game changer.

[Irish]

Surprised me how much this show entertains. Agree with 8 & others. This is how to do a comic book show.

Actually enjoy the WB/CW level of cheese. Feels like a throwback to the late 90s, when shows had no budget & had to rely on actual stories to get by.

Could do without the hoaky voiceovers, though. I'm telling myself it's fun in a low-grade noir ind of way.

The SHIELD guys need to watch Arrow & Sleepy Hollow & pick up a few pointers.

[[ETM]]

Learn something... from Sleepy Hollow? :?

[slqrick]

The show took it to 11 with the midseason finale. Perfect mix of cliffhangers/set up for rest of the season.

[number8]

Just saw the midseason finale. Oh man. I hope that origin isn't going to be a fakeout.

[slqrick]

Back on tomorrow night.

[slqrick]

Awesome episode. Really like what they're doing with the supporting cast although Diggle is getting a bit of the shaft. The Roy/Thea stuff is really much stronger than I ever would have thought, so it's all good.

Also, SLADE. Manu is killing it.

[slqrick]

Another great episode. The shows attitude toward secret identities is really refreshing and keeps things from getting narratively frustrating. Looks like next week will intro Ras al ghuls daughter, which I'm assuming will be Talia.

[MadMan]

I started watching last night on Netflix and I am hooked. I last left off on the fifth episode I think.

[number8]

Man, the show's been kinda boring me since it came back this year with the one-off episodes and the who-cares Roy subplot. Nothing like the League of Assassins to inject some energy into it. The latest episode was just start to finish awesome. I do hope this means that Alex Kingston will be a regular.

[[ETM]]

Red Arrow who-cares Roy?

[number8]

Flash! First official photo.

http://pmcvariety.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/the-flash-first-image.jpg

[Skitch]

So aweseme. Steven Amell is a good fb follow btw.

[MadMan]

I love The Flash so hurray. And I'm now heavily into Season 1, and I imagine it will be a sad long wait until I get to view Season 2. There are some good stand alone episodes but really this show is at its best when its going into arch story mode.

[number8]

Extended trailer for the last 4 episodes of Season 2 that starts tonight. Goddamn.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEZQUcjG6AY

[slqrick]

Damn.

[Skitch]

Fuck me I cannot wait until season 2 hits Netflix.

[slqrick]

Great episode.

[number8]

http://www.comicbookresources.com/imgsrv/imglib/0/0/1/THE-FLASH-Full-Suit-Image-bc095.jpg

[megladon8]

Maybe just the angle of the photo but he looks like a bobblehead toy.

[Grouchy]

I think I preferred the '90s costume, even with the fake muscles.

http://image.toutlecine.com/photos/f/l/a/flash-saaarie-tv-90-91-04-g.jpg

[number8]

Better look:

http://i.imgur.com/Hyi6HcA.jpeg

[slqrick]

It looks fine to me, especially as a season one outfit.

[Grouchy]

Looks like he has an invisible skateboard.

[megladon8]

Why does every superhero costume have to have that basketball texture? I think Batman is the only costume out there right now that doesn't have any of that gunk, and I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the new Batman suit does.

I'm getting really tired of that crap. Makes everyone look like they bought their costume at Aquaman's Wholesaler.

[number8]

I dunno. It's mesh. Mesh is super in right now. I'm currently wearing mesh boxer briefs. That's probably why.

[megladon8]

Hollywood makes costume design choices based on number8's underwear.

You heard the scoop here first, folks! :lol:

[number8]

HARLEY QUINN!!!!

Voiced by Tara Strong too.

Awesome episode.

[Thirdmango]

That was a really fun cameo.

I'm really hoping Slade doesn't get killed at the end of the season. He's been one of my favorite characters through the whole show and I want him to stay on as long as possible.

[slqrick]

This show is so damn good. Another great episode tonight...excited to see where they go with this last act. I've never really been a fan of Deathstroke in the comics, but Manu Bennett should legitimately cross over to the DC movie universe.

[MadMan]

I finished Season 1 a couple days ago. Fantastic stuff, loved how it ended. I cannot wait to see The Flash in action and Diggle is my favorite character at this point. Also Felicity is adorable and funny.

[number8]

Holy shit that Deathstroke fight scene.

[number8]

Also of course fucking Vibe shows up in an episode written by Geoff Johns.

[slqrick]

What a gut punch of an episode.

[number8]

Damn.

[[ETM]]

Did they just kill off the only actually decent actress on the show? That was... dumb.

[number8]

;513180']Did they just kill off the only actually decent actress on the show? That was... dumb.

Flashbacks. Flashbacks everywhere.

[number8]

This whole thing is really starting to stretch to a breaking point, though. Deathstroke is awesome as a villain, but his motivation for his war with Ollie is stupid as shit. I mean, goddamn, Slade, you knew Shado for like two weeks on a dumb island, and you fell in love so hard that you held on to a grudge for like 6 years? "Mirakuru made him crazy" is a cheap excuse, too.

[slqrick]

This whole thing is really starting to stretch to a breaking point, though. Deathstroke is awesome as a villain, but his motivation for his war with Ollie is stupid as shit. I mean, goddamn, Slade, you knew Shado for like two weeks on a dumb island, and you fell in love so hard that you held on to a grudge for like 6 years? "Mirakuru made him crazy" is a cheap excuse, too.

Yeah, it's been a faulty motive from the start, which I've overlooked just because Manu Bennett's been awesome. I'm hoping they add some layers over the last episodes.

[[ETM]]

Idiotic motives are modus operandi on the show lately... everyone's a bloody moron who doesn't remember events from previous weeks, let alone months, and hold grudges based on... nothing.

[slqrick]

Just awesome.

Fun little promo for the Flash too.

[number8]

Yeah, good Flash fx.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnXsnR-2AvU

[number8]

Geez, five and a half minute trailer.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj0l7iGKh8g

[Dead & Messed Up]

And don't be surprised if Arrow stops by to wish him well!

[number8]

I think that trailer shows the entirety of his cameo.

[megladon8]

The Flash effect is great until they try to show his face, and then it looks laughably bad.

This looks horrible...but so did "Arrow" and it ended up being awesome despite its budgetary shortcomings.

I just hope the character writing and action are up to snuff like in its predecessor. This one has a lot more riding on effects that are subpar.

[Dukefrukem]

I haven't watched the Arrow (should I?) but that Flash trailer was impressive to me.. considering it's on the CW.

[Skitch]

I haven't watched the Arrow (should I?)
Yes.

[Irish]

I haven't watched the Arrow (should I?) but that Flash trailer was impressive to me.. considering it's on the CW.

The first season, especially the first half dozen episodes, are good & worth seeing. After that ... Hmmmmmmmmm....

[number8]

The first season, especially the first half dozen episodes, are good & worth seeing. After that ... Hmmmmmmmmm....

???????????!!

The first half of season one was complete garbage. It's only worth seeing 3-4 episodes before the season 1 finale.

[number8]

Season 3 will have a new Count Vertigo, this time actually an Eastern European aristocrat. And he's going to be played by Peter Stormare. Awesome.

[slqrick]

That's a pretty cool way to remedy the Count Vertigo fail. I'm hyped, can't wait for all the scene chewery.

Apparently one of the producers and writers will be taking over the comic soon.

[number8]

Brandon Routh cast as The Atom.

Whaaaaaaaaat.

[number8]

Wentworth Miller cast as Captain Cold. Not bad.

[Watashi]

I watched the first season on Netflix.

I remember I scoffed at the pilot when I saw it at Comic Con. It looked like standard CW melodramatic fluff where everyone is way too attractive, but I stuck with it because I saw 8's comments that it gets better.

And boy does it. It's still melodramatic fluff, but it doesn't hold back. The characters are dynamic and the action is surprisingly well-done given the low budget.

Also, why is John Barrowman not a huge leading man in Hollywood?

[[ETM]]

Also, why is John Barrowman not a huge leading man in Hollywood?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1XOfHax6Q8

I mean, he should be a leading man BECAUSE of that line, but... Hollywood.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Just finished season two. This show is fantastic. Heavily flawed, what with all the monologues and soliloquies, and the corny family moments, but man do they juggle multiple plots, timelines, characters, villains, etc. with finesse, all while making it look so easy, and the twists and turns are soooo much fun. This is one of the most consumable shows in recent memory. It is tailor made for binge watching. 23 episodes in about four days? Yes please. Not sure how I'm going to handle having to wait weeks for new episodes. Trying to get my son caught up so we can watch it together this fall.

I'll be watching The Flash from the start as well. The creators have earned my trust, even if it has a rough start like this one did.

[Qrazy]

Um, holy shit? Tonight's ep.

[Kurosawa Fan]

Um, holy shit? Tonight's ep.

Gah! I might have been slightly spoiled on FB. I can't watch it until tomorrow with my son.

Also, I'm absolutely loving The Flash. That cast has such fantastic chemistry. Jesse L. Martin is crushing the important moments, especially his conversation with Barry at the end of this week's episode. My youngest was sniffling on the couch next to me.

[Qrazy]

Gah! I might have been slightly spoiled on FB. I can't watch it until tomorrow with my son.

Also, I'm absolutely loving The Flash. That cast has such fantastic chemistry. Jesse L. Martin is crushing the important moments, especially his conversation with Barry at the end of this week's episode. My youngest was sniffling on the couch next to me.

There's a fight at the end of the ep that is very strong.

The Flash is good. I like that the main plot is progressing at a reasonable speed.

[Kurosawa Fan]

There's a fight at the end of the ep that is very strong.


http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/a2/3c/37/a23c376be956e707159e53b8e6f5d4 5e.jpg

[number8]

Yeah holy shit. And I thought the Flash finale was a mindfuck.

[number8]

I don't know if you guys ever watched the original Flash show, but it's really cool that they're able to bring back a lot of the cast from it as sort of the same characters.

[number8]

GOT spoiler.

542857382892560384

[Kurosawa Fan]

:lol:

[Watashi]

I'm finally caught up on both shows for tonight's premiere. Um, holy fuck.

I have a feeling Ras will find out Meryln was up to everything and resurrect Ollie via Lazarus Pit and then team up together to tack down Meryln.

For The Flash, just going by the comics, Reverse-Flash is clearly future Eddie that is working with Harrison. I'm still not sure who Harrison exactly is, but my wishes are that he is future Barry.

[number8]

I can't believe we saw a live action Gorilla Grodd. Life is great.

[number8]

Haha, I love how Arrow now straight up embraces the comparisons to Batman and has no qualms adapting his stories. A lot of Batman fans seem to be whining about this, but I'm enjoying it very much.

[Winston*]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ac3a49-sj3A&feature=youtu.be

[Qrazy]

Detective Lance is one of the dumbest characters in the history of television.

[number8]

I don't really believe he actually thinks the Arrow killed the mayor.

[Peng]

This week, The Flash was tremendous campy fun and hilarious. So many great lines, with my favorite as “It's kind of like I'm dating Barry but in Oliver's body… A sentence you'll never repeat to anyone.”

Meanwhile, I gasped at the end of Arrow. Too dark? (although surely it will be reversed, right?)

[Winston*]

Can't see that Captain Cold/Heatwave show being any good. Annoying characters.

[number8]

Arrow's trajectory is so cool right now but man, they need better writers. Everything is so protracted and vague. It's getting to be a depressing joke that whenever the Arrow characters show up on the Flash they're suddenly written 10x better. Also the flashbacks this season, holy shit, it's reached peak boring.

Flash... Keep doing what you're doing.

[Watashi]

Yeah, the flashbacks are terrible and going nowhere. Have they progressed at all since the first episode? I'm also tired of the several fake-out deaths they've done this season (I still don't think Sara is dead). I don't understand why they killed Roy only to bring him back for a few minutes and than have leave in the next scene. Okay?

However Arrow just gets Ra's Al Ghul. Every scene in Nanda Parbat feels like a completely different show. I get depressed when we're taken out of it.

[Watashi]

Hopefully The Flash can paint themselves out of corner with what they're doing with Iris. She's terribly written and developed. She's the stock female love-triangle interest that has plagued bad superhero storylines ("We must protect her! Oh, but everyone else knows my identity, but they're cool") Harrison Wells and Joe are the best characters on the show. I really hope both of them stick around for the second season.

[number8]

I don't understand why they killed Roy only to bring him back for a few minutes and than have leave in the next scene. Okay?

That was baffling, but apparently he was always going to leave at the end of this season because his contract is up and he is apparently in pretty high demand right now (he's in San Andreas and is about to start a movie career), but they don't want to really kill him 'cause Haynes likes playing the character enough that he said he's open to doing guest spots as Arsenal in the future on any of their 4 shows.

[Grouchy]

The first half of season one was complete garbage. It's only worth seeing 3-4 episodes before the season 1 finale.
I came into this thread looking for precisely this kind of information. I binged the first six episodes of Arrow last night and Merlin's beard was it bad. I couldn't believe how shitty it was. It felt like a particularly bad show from another, dumber era of TV.

[Irish]

I'd go the other way-- at least, the initial episodes & the overall setup are a lot more interesting that what comes later in the season (which is more standard, comic booky, hero vs villain stuff).

Or, you could just throw the entire first season out and skip right to the second. The stuff about Ras a Ghul is a helluva lot more interesting than anything in the first season (especially since they quickly abandoned the initial premise).

[Grouchy]

I dunno, man. I got as far as the Huntress episodes, but I don't want to feel like I'm forcing myself to watch a TV show. I might start Season 2 like you say... after I take a long break.

[number8]

Some measured expectations is also needed here. I find these shows highly enjoyable on a story and set piece level but it's not like the writing and acting improve drastically. They still remain largely soap operas throughout, even when the Deathstroke/Ra's Al Ghul stuff ramp up.

[Grouchy]

Some measured expectations is also needed here. I find these shows highly enjoyable on a story and set piece level but it's not like the writing and acting improve drastically. They still remain largely soap operas throughout, even when the Deathstroke/Ra's Al Ghul stuff ramp up.
Well, I'm enjoying the fight scenes and as any self-respecting nerd I like anticipating which comic-book character is going to pop up next, but the soap opera elements really take me off. I don't really give a rat's ass about the Ollie/Lauren/Merlyn love triangle (not just because it's a stereotypical story, but because the acting is awful) and that seems to take so much space.

Also, I hope Deadshot comes back, because if that's all they're going to do with the character, they don't really deserve the license.

In short, I suspected it wouldn't be Daredevil good, but I still had higher expectations.

[Irish]

I dunno, man. I got as far as the Huntress episodes, but I don't want to feel like I'm forcing myself to watch a TV show. I might start Season 2 like you say... after I take a long break.

Yeah if you hit the Huntress stuff you've gone too far into the season. A bit later the big bad shows up wearing a huge, goofy looking skull mask & that's when I checked out of the season.

It was too silly and at that point I just didn't give a shit about the conflicts.

[Irish]

but the soap opera elements really take me off. I don't really give a rat's ass about the Ollie/Lauren/Merlyn love triangle (not just because it's a stereotypical story, but because the acting is awful) and that seems to take so much space

Fair warning, Arrow heavily dupes shows like Smallville-- the tween romance material never goes away, and of course never resolved itself.

Fast forward is you're friend.

[number8]

The soapy romance stuff only increases as it goes on, actually. It's what pays for these shows, so I've learned to just realize that that is a significant part of what I signed up for by watching them.

[Peng]

I'd say Episode 14 "The Odyssey" is worth watching, but yeah, after that you can skip right to the finale. I enjoyed the second half of the season more than the first though; the show began to embrace the pulpiness and that led to some fun episodes.

[number8]

Huh. Wow.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MubNoWQiSc

[Thirdmango]

I didn't realize there was already a full blown trailer. It's already been picked up for a full season so I'm excited. Plus Arthur Darvill huzzah!

[megladon8]

Supergirl looks fantastic.

[[ETM]]

I dunno, all of that looks just... incredibly and embarassingly bad. If I didn't enjoy the Marvel stuff so much, I'd think I'm absolutely not the audience for any of this.

[slqrick]

Flash finale was amazing. Great payoff on some of those emotional beats, although Iris is still poorly written.

You just know Thawne will show up again, sooner than later I bet.

[slqrick]

Not sure what to think of the new show yet.

[Peng]

Yep, pretty grand finale, and these three intensely emotional scenes almost did me in:

Barry/Dad, Barry/Mom (especially tough, this one), and Eddie.

[Watashi]

Goddamn. What a finale. And this is just season one. My face was a mess. I love how this show uses time travel not to emphasize science, but emotion.

Biggest chill for me: Seeing future Barry wave off present Barry

[number8]

You know, if it was me, as soon as I found out about my evil great-grandson, I'd immediately get a vasectomy.

[number8]

White circle!

http://www.comicbookresources.com/imgsrv/imglib/500/0/1/FlashS2-FIRST-LOOK-r-e438a.jpg

[number8]

Arrow also gets a new suit.

https://i.imgur.com/SFjIkjf.jpg

[number8]

631211617859059712

Confirmed! Matt Ryan will guest star as Constantine in an episode of Arrow this upcoming season.

Also, lol, if you guys watched RAW this week, Stephen Amell has a tag team match at SummerSlam.

[number8]

Plot detail on his guest spot. Very spoilery:

Team Arrow will try to use the Lazarus Pit to resurrect Sara Lance, but it will go horribly wrong at first, so they call in Constantine for help.

[number8]

Also, nice poster.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CMKEgJoWIAAj5Yl.png:large

[Mara]

So I decided to give this show another shot and it's going down a lot smoother this time. Binging helped me through the rough first half of the first season, and I'm about 2/3 done with the second season now.

The silly soapy aspects don't always work, but they've put together a pretty nifty little show. I think Ammell has grown into his role a little bit, but I just do not find Oliver very compelling. He has a charisma of, maybe, a three. Spiking up to a five if he is actively climbing a salmon ladder.

The show also has trouble with drawing compelling characters but then not being sure what to do with them. Laurel has floundered for two whole seasons, and this season Diggle is practically an afterthought.Tommy was a big problem in the first season until the last few episodes.

As of now, I love Slade more than any other character on the show. I am Team Slade. I want him to win. Slade Slade Slade. Oliver Shmoliver.

Other thoughts:

If the women want to wear nothing but black leather and cleavage while fighting, that is entirely their own choice, but I will never understand why they don't pull their hair back.

Oliver had underarm hair in the first season but they're making him wax it now. The trend towards total body hairlessness in men continues to my mystification.

I found the island backstory tedious to begin with but I am liking it better now. Mostly because of Slade. (Slade!)

John Barrowman is pretty great, too.

The girl who is Sara, who I keep mentally calling "Anna Draper's niece" even though it's clumsy, has an odd way of moving her mouth when she speaks and kind of a funny chin. Especially when she is all masked up I find it distracting.

I also keep thinking of Laurel as being First Ruby (the blonde one!) from Supernatural. My favorite First Ruby moment is from the Supernatural episode where the precinct is under siege and Dean says something stupid and she spits out, "I'm sorry, I must have blood in my ear." The line delivery is great, and I say that out loud in Arrow every time Laurel looks at someone like they're an idiot.

Quentin Lance is pretty attractive, and they don't make him wax.

Given how much I like the middle-aged men on the show (Slade!) I think I might be getting old.

[Thirdmango]

I'm so happy you've gone back to it.

[Mara]

I'm at the beginning of The Flash S1/Arrow S3 and I'm still enjoying it. The Flash in particular has a goofy vibe that is really working.

However, I'm here to complain some more. Even though the female characters are drawn as smart, brave, and loyal, all the male characters in both shows have this really paternalistic attitude towards them. "Noo, don't tell that grown-up woman the truth, you'll just put her in danger!" "I can't be honest with someone I love; I need to protect her!" "You can't come along to the big fight scene because I can't fight if I'm worried about you getting hurt!"

Get over yourselves, dudes.

[slqrick]

Yeah, that's always been a problem with superhero stuff. "It's for your own good, Mary Jane!"

[Mara]

Yeah, that's always been a problem with superhero stuff. "It's for your own good, Mary Jane!"

Right, yes, it's very true to the genre. But I feel like these shows have played with superhero conventions in innovative and fun ways. This irritating remnant could be thrown out and open up some cool creative options

[number8]

In terms of that stuff, it's really bad when they're talking about science stuff as a group. Caitlin, THE GENIUS SCIENTIST, always gets the set-up "___? What's that?" lines for Cisco and Wells to layman it down for the audience, even though Joe, THE BLUE COLLAR COP, is in the room.

[Winston*]

I think the most ridiculous moment in The Flash is when they have a pub quiz at night in a coffee shop.

[Mara]

Okay, so this prison of super-powered humans in the basement of The Flash... I mean, I've seen Buffy Season 4, I know where this is going... but I have questions.

1. Who is preparing the food for these prisoners? Who is doing the dishes?
2. Are the prisoners getting any exercise? Or socialization?
3. Where are they pooping?
4. Do they ever get fresh clothes? Who is doing the laundry?

This just does not seem like a very great system, guys. Especially if we're supposed to be the heroes.

[number8]

You will not get an answer for those questions (except #2, which is no). It's kind of a running joke with the fandom. It's inhumane as hell.

[Mara]

Well done, heroes! It's irresponsible to execute villains, but we can let them starve in their own filth!

[Mara]

I am truly enjoying these shows and I apologize that I only come in here to complain.

But.

In the first couple of episodes, Barry used his superpowers to rob a department store and that has never been mentioned again.

Also, Lauren keeping her sister's death from her father is one of the most nakedly evil things I can imagine. Way to be a COMPLETE ASSHOLE, Ms. Supposed Hero.

[number8]

I think complaining about the dumb morality of the characters is an essential part of being a superhero fan.

[Mara]

Also, Lauren keeping her sister's death from her father is one of the most nakedly evil things I can imagine. Way to be a COMPLETE ASSHOLE, Ms. Supposed Hero.

AND NOW SHE'S TELLING RANDOM OTHER PEOPLE. LAUREN.

Also, Lauren's hair is a perfect example of the hair every girl on television has right now, and in a decade we're all going to look back and ask ourselves why.

[Mara]

Hey guys Oliver just got stabbed and thrown off a mountain and I'm not okay with it.

[number8]

SPOILER: There's still a show.

[Mara]

SPOILER: There's still a show.

STRAIGHT THROUGH LIKE A ROTISERRIE CHICKEN, 8.

[Mara]

Guys, the Arrow episode "The Uprising" was some bullshit and I'm moving over to The Flash for awhile as a palate cleanser.

It should have been so cool, and instead it was really pretty bad. The civilian uprising against Brick should have really worked, in a Buffy Finale of Season 3 kind of way, but instead it felt unearned and cheap. Then they brought back two really interesting, nuanced characters I like (Wildcat and Sin) and just wasted them.

Arrow rising from the grave and saving his friends should have been hugely emotionally cathartic, and instead everyone was just kind of like, whelp, Ollie's back. And Felicity's like, I hate you now! Because us getting together would be narratively inconvenient!

Dumb dumb dumb.

[slqrick]

Season 3 of Arrow was really frustrating overall, and the finale was a complete atrocity...but so far this season has corrected a lot of problems so it's aite, I guess. Flash keeps expanding its universe in ways I didn't expect this soon. I'm enjoying both new seasons a lot.

[Watashi]

I know it's a CW show and everything, but Jesse L. Martin is on another level on this show. He's up with Eric Taylor as TV dad that makes me cry every time he's onscreen.

So... is Zoom Earth-2 Barry who wasn't raised by Joe?

[number8]

I don't think I'm exaggerating in saying that I enjoyed Constantine's guest spot on Arrow more than any Constantine episode.

[number8]

Man, the fight scenes on Arrow keep getting worse and worse.

[Mara]

I like Barry Allen so much more than Oliver Queen it isn't even funny. Oliver is dumb and Barry is THE BEST.

[Irish]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JlXb7NYhHk

[number8]

Only two episodes in and I'm already liking Legends of Tomorrow more than Flash or Arrow.

[Mara]

Only two episodes in and I'm already liking Legends of Tomorrow more than Flash or Arrow.

Not my experience. It feels unsure and wobbly to me. Wentworth Miller is killing it, tho.

Note on The Flash: nerdy, bespeckled Barry-2 has my entire heart.

[Mara]

Then again, Legends of Tomorrow had three male characters take their shirts off this week, so the showrunners aren't devoid of vision.

[number8]

So Supergirl has been cancelled at CBS and picked up by CW for the second season. They may or may not decide to do this, but they should really just pluck her out of her universe and drop her in the Flarrow universe. It will fix the Superman problem and let them reboot the show with a new supporting cast if necessary (since apparently they're also moving production from LA to Vancouver and I can see some of the actors not going for that move).

[Mara]

CROSS PROMOTION

Tony from The Flash is the same actor who played Drake on iZombie, and this week he came back... AS A ZOMBIE. Clever.

[Thirdmango]

Season finale:

FLASHPOINT PARADOX SEASON 3????

[number8]

The Flash: OK guys, I'm rebooting this universe from scratch.

Arrow: But what will happen to my storyli--Yeah all right let's do it.

Supergirl: Whatever's best! Just happy to not be cancelled!

Legends of Tomorrow: K. We do that like every week.

[Mara]

Booooooo to a massive reboot.

Also booooo to Barry/Iris quasi-incest. It's just squicky, guys.

[number8]

booooo to Barry/Iris quasi-incest. It's just squicky, guys.

I have the solution --


Booooooo to a massive reboot.

Nevermind.

[Milky Joe]

I really hate Barry. He's just the worst. This show is really stupid actually, but I somehow watched two seasons of it and will probably continue to watch it.

[number8]

Legends of Tomorrow had the better finale. The exposition scene where they try to explain Savage's doomsday plan is absolute madness. I cackled like an idiot for a minute straight. Out of love.

I miss when Doctor Who was this fucking crazy.

[Mara]

I really hate Barry. He's just the worst. This show is really stupid actually, but I somehow watched two seasons of it and will probably continue to watch it.

I love Barry. Much more than Oliver, who is a sulky child.

And I dunno, 8. My feelings about Legends of Tomorrow is that someone loved Dr. Who but took away all the wrong lessons. It is a show with a lot of potential but not much follow-through.

[number8]

Season finale:

FLASHPOINT PARADOX SEASON 3????

Yea boi

744932568106049536

But of course:

744951601341702144

[number8]

Oh ho ho (http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/30/flash-tom-felton-season-3)

[number8]

Super fun crossover. That was the best Arrow episode in like two years.

[Thirdmango]

Flash finale wasn't great. Whole third season seemed to be treading water as much as I dislike saying it. It feels odd that I'm going to say of the 3 shows Legends had the best season this year.

[number8]

I'll say it. This season was bad. I am considering dropping it like I did Arrow. Especially since Black Lightning is coming up.

Two CW superhero shows at a time seems to be all I can follow.

[number8]

This upcoming season's crossover event: WEDDING NAZIS.

http://media.comicbook.com/2017/09/dctv-crossover-cvr-fnl-921-1-1--1022509.jpg

[Dukefrukem]

The Atom? The Ray? I gotta start watching this.

[Skitch]

Its great.

[number8]

I wasn't planning on seeing Justice League anyway but I'm expecting this to be way better.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6T-jPN-VCoA

[number8]

Also I'm so used to Legends being the best superhero show on TV that I just don't see the point of coming in here praising its excellence every week, but man, this season is rapturously great every week. I rewatched the vampire episode from two weeks ago a couple of times just for this scene:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-J6x6cGLsy0

[Irish]

My enthusiasm for that show died at the end of season one when I realized I was only really watching for Wentworth Miller. Without him doing that Captain Cold voice every week, it turned into zero fun.

(I still catch like every 3rd episode of the Flash and Arrow. They remain terrible, but a good kinda terrible.)

[number8]

My enthusiasm for that show died at the end of season one when I realized I was only really watching for Wentworth Miller. Without him doing that Captain Cold voice every week, it turned into zero fun.

This is nonsense because I think the show started doing every aspect of its production in that Captain Cold voice. In Season 3, they conscripted the boring serious villains from Arrow and Flash and smartly told them to now do their characters more on Wentworth's level.

This show is just turned up to 11 every week. Last week's episode was about Helen of Troy being time-displaced into 1930s LA and was so desired that it started a literal studio war over her, which is a crazy enough story, but the real plot is that Legends has to fix it because Helen took Hedy Lamarr's roles, and because Lamarr never became famous, nobody took her inventions seriously, and thus the entire future history of engineering was threatened. But wait, that's not all, the B-plot was that there was an accident with Firestorm and Jackson and Stein spent the ep in a Freaky Friday situation.

[Irish]

This is nonsense because I think the show started doing every aspect of its production in that Captain Cold voice. In Season 3, they conscripted the boring serious villains from Arrow and Flash and smartly told them to now do their characters more on Wentworth's level.

Ha, that's fair, I guess?

I dunno. I tried to check out an episode in the second (?) or third (?) season and just couldn't get into it. I never knew how big a fan I was of Miller until they took him away.

(Meanwhile The Flash has Plasticman now as a semi-recurring role and it's still pushing that super-creepy incest subplot, so I guess that's something?)

[number8]

It's Elongated Man.

[Irish]

I don't discriminate among plastic people.

[number8]

Anyway, I stopped watching Flash this season, but I did see a picture of Elongated Man's costume I don't know why they took the handsome purple suit from the comics and turned him into a racist condom.

[Irish]

I was hoping the suit was gonna build up to something that didn't look so completely shitty.

(Also, I thought E.M. and P.M. were in different fictional universes but they're both DC? WTH? Why does DC need two guys with stretch powers?)

ETA: If they do another big crossover this year, I'll watch. Last year, that was a lot of fun.

[number8]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iw17PRECpP4&t=9s

[number8]

Irish you have to watch this week's legend. I want your opinion on a certain character's speaking voice.

[Irish]

LOL---I'll check it out tonight

[Irish]

Irish you have to watch this week's legend. I want your opinion on a certain character's speaking voice.

OMFG. That was simultaneously the best thing and the worst thing I've seen on the CW all year. I couldn't help giggling every time that dude opened his mouth to speak.

ETA: Also always good to see Ol' Grodd again but man oh man was that Vietnam stuff was really tasteless. ("What my people really need isn't a god but a leader." Uh, fuckheads, you realize Ho Chi Minh was still alive in 1967?)

ETA 2: Mick was my second favorite character so it was an unexpected treat for the episode to revolve around him. They did a little something with his backstory in the first season, iirc. Good stuff and profoundly fucked up.

[Irish]

So wait "Crisis on Earth-X" is only 4 parts over 2 nights? Whatta gyp!

[number8]

It's a crossover event and there are only 4 shows. What did you think it was gonna be?

[Irish]

It's a crossover event and there are only 4 shows. What did you think it was gonna be?

It's a small thing, but last year they spread the story out over the week. So there was a fresh installment every night over 4 nights and that was a lot of fun. This time, they changed "Arrow's" time slot to Monday (?!) and crammed the whole thing into 2 nights, which felt less epic.

Anyway, I got a huge kick out of how over the top it was, especially this mid-fight exchange:

"Is that a kryptonite arrow?"
"Yes."
"Why do you have a kryptonite arrow?"
"In case an Evil You ever showed up."

[number8]

Ah, yes, I agree, but since the shows are no longer spread out through the week like that, it's probably the better option than having an ep on Monday, 2 on Tuesday, nothing on Wednesday and then the finale on Thursday. That'd be weird.

It's frustrating how Oliver becomes a 10x more fun character whenever he's in a crossover.

[Dukefrukem]

So, Black Lightning is currently scoring 100% on RT. Should I start watching this universe now?

https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/black_lightning/s01/

[number8]

If you want, but Black Lightning is not part of this universe.

[Dukefrukem]

oh? I just assumed.

[number8]

It is a reasonable assumption, but it's a standalone show. It was originally developed at FOX but got dropped and CW picked it up.

Not that it matters, since these characters travel through the multiverse regularly. Supergirl takes place in a different universe until it's crossover week and she travels to the Arrowverse. Constantine is also retroactively made to be part of the universe despite originally from a different network.

So let's just say, not yet.

[Irish]

Is anybody watching "Black Lightning"? (number8?)

I caught the first episode and while it was a traditional hero's-arc kinda thing, I enjoyed it.

[number8]

I like it! It's slightly jarring how visually it looks exactly like all the other CW shows, but it's got this different tone that very clearly separates it. There's much more menace to its scenes.

The entire cast plays the scenes the way Jesse L. Martin used to play Detective West in the first season of Flash before he got complacent.

[Thirdmango]

Yeah I watched the first episode and I bet it'll go into the universe at times depending on if they need the ratings boost.