The Dark Souls Discussion Thread

[Morris Schæffer]

Yeah those sewers actually lead eventually to the (very hard) boss you'll have to beat to get past this area. If you explored by the rats a little you may have found Madman's Knowledge - use that and go back to the Hunter's Dream and you'll be able to level up then, without even seeing a boss.

Indeed, I did receive something called Madman's knowledge. I'll see what happens at the hunter's dream.

@Megladon: Right you are!

[Morris Schæffer]

By the way, what is the single best tip you folks can give for when facing a boss for the very first time?

[Idioteque Stalker]

Don't get discouraged by how impossible it may seem or how many times you die.

[Scar]

By the way, what is the single best tip you folks can give for when facing a boss for the very first time?

Die.

[D_Davis]

Don't worry about losing souls/echoes.

[megladon8]

Don't get discouraged. I know that sounds like an impossible task, but just accept that you're going to die a lot. You're going to feel like you lost everything, and you might as well just turn off and delete your save game. Don't. When you finally figure out the boss' pattern, or find that one cheat you can exploit to cheese him, or sometimes even defeat them with blind luck...you'll have a sense of satisfaction rarely matched by any other game.

[sevenarts]

Yeah just be prepared to die a lot. The game's all about learning through death. If you just keep facing the boss and watch their moves, you'll eventually figure out how to avoid them, when it's safe to attack and when you'd better retreat, etc. I'd say the first 2-3 times you face a boss, don't even attack much, just stay back, watch them, dodge them if you can, until you start to figure out what they're doing.

[Morris Schæffer]

ooookay!:)

[D_Davis]

Also don't be afraid to watch videos and read wikis for strats.

[megladon8]

Also don't be afraid to watch videos and read wikis for strats.

Pfft. What a casual.

I beat all three Souls games AND Bloodborne, no deaths on my first run through. No armour no weapons. No levelling.

Didn't look up a single video or wiki.

Easiest games I ever played.

[D_Davis]

Surprisingly enough, I've recently gotten super back into Dark Souls II: Scholar of the First Sin. I still feel like it's a mixed bag, but in most areas the changes have drastically improved the game. The whole thing flows better, especially after the Forest of the Fallen Giants. There are some exciting new enemies, and a lot of the enemy placement makes a lot more sense (although those Grave Wardens are STILL in Earthen Peak! WHY? WWWHHHYYYY????) I was initially somewhat cold on DSII, and very cold on this updated version, but something has changed. It might be that I'm simply craving some new Souls, and DSII is the one I've played the least of. I've just gathered the final Old One soul, and so I'm entering the final stages of the game, and I've really, really enjoyed it.

I've also booked an entire week off from work for DSIII. Man, that's like right around the corner.

[megladon8]

New enemies? As in, stuff that wasn't in the original? Or just new enemy placements?

I might need to check this out, then.

[D_Davis]

Maybe the new enemies I encountered were from NG+?

There are some point-headed, claw-wielding assassin guys, and an invader called The Forlorn that invades all the time. Fun battles.

There are definitely more red phantom invaders in NG+0 in Scholar of the First Sin. Also, a lot of the item placements make more sense - the game flows a little better. As an example, you get the Dull Ember far earlier, and the Fragrant Branches of Yore are in different places, and there are more stone statues around.

[Morris Schæffer]

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLW03xEr-pTeZ0Nlh_SpNQ5Zh3R0un3q1D

This guy completed Bloodborne without rolls and evade move.

[D_Davis]

Yep. He's great. Probably the second best right after Lobos jr.

[Sycophant]

I've been playing Dark Souls II a lot since I finally got the DLC last month (would love to go for SotFS, but my PC's a little too weak for it). I still find a lot of the game to be somewhat disappointingly uninspired when put up against Dark Souls (and I'm having a hard time finding equipment setups that feel good to me). But the new DLC areas are incredibly well-designed. Loving it.

[D_Davis]

The first DLC area is not only the best part of DSII, but it might be my favorite area in all of the Souls franchise. But alas, I totally agree with your opinion on the game in general.

[D_Davis]

For some reason I follow the official Dark Souls page on Facebook.

On it, the community managers ask the dumbest, shittiest questions, and then they get a bunch of typical video game asshole answers. Here is one from today:



DS Community manager - Pretend you live in the world of ‪#‎DarkSouls‬ (https://www.facebook.com/hashtag/darksouls?source=feed_text&story_id=1012618642144513) and have to face the Chosen Undead controlled by a seasoned Dark Souls veteran. How do you attempt to beat them? ‪#‎BonfireTalk‬ (https://www.facebook.com/hashtag/bonfiretalk?source=feed_text&story_id=1012618642144513)


Some user - That's why None of you douche BAGS can't play this game to busy scamming to actually play it the right way lag rapers back stabbing magic used using armor and swords numb skulls rolling on the ground and using havels = casuals get good and hit the Gus noobs

[Scar]

Think I'm going to grab Dark Souls II for PS4 right now.

[megladon8]

I got it for XBone yesterday!

[D_Davis]

Lobos Jr raffled off a Dark Souls challenge run. The winner chose 'no right stick usage,' so Lobos had to beat the game with out ever locking on or controlling the camera at all. Crazy.

[megladon8]

I really wish/hope that someday there will be a remaster of Dark Souls for current gen.

[D_Davis]

I finally, FINALLY beat Lawrence, the final optional boss in the Bloodborne DLC. Took me a couple of months.

Playing BB along side Dark Souls 2 has proven to me one thing: BB is far harder than the Souls games, at least for me. No boss in any of the Souls games gave me as much trouble as The Martyr and Lawrence in BB. Like not even close. Flame Lurker, Skinny and Fatty, The Fume Knight....all pushovers in comparison.

I then went on to complete the one ending I was missing.

Now all I need to do is finish up the Chalice Dungeons, and I'll have officially seen everything BB has to offer. Such a great game. Between my two characters, I've logged in about 150 hours, which is far less than the previous Souls games.

[megladon8]

I thought you spent like 500+ hours on Dark Souls?

Was there one between DKS2 and BB that I'm forgetting?

[D_Davis]

I thought you spent like 500+ hours on Dark Souls?

Was there one between DKS2 and BB that I'm forgetting?

I did.

No.

[megladon8]

Sorry, I misread and thought you said 150 hours was "far more" than the two previous Souls games.

D'oh.

[D_Davis]

One more month....

Man, not watching the Japanese streams in a couple of weeks is going to take super human will power.

[D_Davis]

Salt and Sanctuary is out on PS4. It truly is 100% 2D Dark Souls. Absolutely loving it. Reminding me a lot of Simons Quest and Symphony of the Night as well. Lots of weapons and items and the skill tree is insane. Seems like the world is pretty huge, lots of short cuts and secrets. Highly recommend.

[megladon8]

Very cool I'll check it out.

Read today and interview where Miyazaki said DS3 is smaller than DS2, but much more complex.

[D_Davis]

That makes sense. DS1, Demon's Souls and BB are all smaller than DS2 as well. DS2 was far to open and sprawling. DS3 is more compact, which is great.

[D_Davis]

Salt and Sanctuary is SO good. Five bosses down. Finally found some cool armor I like. I'm going for a Holy Assassin build - fast dagger weapons with holy magic for healing and buffs.

[D_Davis]

25 days to go...

[D_Davis]

Man, Namco and From royally screwed up the release of Dark Souls 3. They've gone ahead and given the game out early in English to a bunch of Twitch and YT streamers (luckily ENB and Lobos are waiting until April to stream), and yesterday the international version of the game, complete with all English text and voices, was available to purchase on XBone in the US! So the game is completely done, and yet they're waiting to release on April 12 for their fiscal year numbers.

This is bad for a number of reasons. First off, the best thing about these games is the mystery, and being around at the beginning to be a part of solving and discovering stuff. Well, in three weeks everything will pretty much be known and already available on Twitch and YT - there won't be anything left to discover. Secondly, these are multi-player games, so the rest of us waiting to play on April 12th will be plagued by Twinks and griefers when it comes to invasions. And finally, because the game was given to streamers on the PC early, there are already torrents with 250k downloads.

This has killed a ton of my excitement for the game.

[megladon8]

Doesn't affect my excitement at all. I always do my first run blind and with no help whenever possible.

People are saying it's the hardest game From has made. I can't freaking wait.

I still haven't watched anything since the first reveal trailer. I know nothing about the game. It's going to be a great experience.

It comes out on the 12th and as of the 16th I'm on vacation for a week!

[D_Davis]

You could have had it yesterday on XBone!

[sevenarts]

Anyone else get 3? I played it for a few hours last night, beat the tutorial section and explored a bunch of the first BIG area. Really great so far. Everything looks so beautiful. Enemies are so aggressive and punishing.

[megladon8]

My copy is being delivered by Amazon today!

[bac0n]

Do you need to have played previous versions of Dark Souls to really enjoy this game?

[sevenarts]

Do you need to have played previous versions of Dark Souls to really enjoy this game?

Doubtful. The series isn't so much a continuing story as a series of riffs on a theme. I'm early on and have already seen some references to past games but the Souls games aren't too plot-heavy by any means, the stories are enigmatic and emerge slowly and organically. They're much more about exploration and combat mechanics than following a linear plot. Get it!

[megladon8]

Do you need to have played previous versions of Dark Souls to really enjoy this game?

Not at all.

I also suggest you play Bloodborne. That game is totally up your alley.

[bac0n]

Not at all.

I also suggest you play Bloodborne. That game is totally up your alley.

Holy shit, you can play Godzilla in Bloodborne?


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[megladon8]

This should have been called Demon's Souls 2 instead of Dark Souls 3.

[Scar]

This should have been called Demon's Souls 2 instead of Dark Souls 3.

Sir, you have my attention.

[sevenarts]

It feels like a natural continuation of Dark Souls to me, with lots of Bloodborne thrown in.

And it is SO good. I saw some early reviews complaining about the game being too linear and level design not being up to par, but those people could not possibly have actually played this game. The areas I've seen so far are huge and sprawling, with multiple branching paths and so many little hidden nooks to explore. This is amazing.

[Idioteque Stalker]

So I've played this a lot this week. The difficulty, world, and lore feel a lot more like 1 than 2 which is a huge plus. That's enough for me to feel confident saying I love it--the gameplay and tone of these games at their best is pretty unmatched in modern games imo.

I haven't finished it yet, but the "throwbacks" to 1 are pretty incessant, and if there doesn't prove to be some awesome narrative slight-of-hand at work then it's going to feel cheap. There's a sense of wonder lost when you feel as though you recognize so much.

Also one of my main takeaways so far is, funnily enough, reflecting on how good Bloodborne was. As a straight horror game for its first third it is fantastic, then once the cosmic stuff is introduced (for me in a wild WTF moment in the Forbidden Woods) it gets even creepier, and then from Byrgenwerth (sp) on that fucking game just got under my skin in a way no other game has. Dark Souls may always be my favorite because it was my first, but there's a part of me that is just certain Bloodborne is the best game From Software has made.

[megladon8]

A friend of mine posted a screen cap of where he is currently in DS3, and it looks like something directly out of Bloodborne.

[sevenarts]

So this game is downright phenomenal. I'm very far in - pretty close to the end, I'm guessing - and pretty much every area has been thoughtfully designed, beautiful, and densely packed with enemies, lore, weapons, etc. The area-to-area progression is unfortunately rather linear in comparison to Dark Souls 1, which I think will hurt replays - it was nice in the original to have some freedom in the order you approach areas, to build characters in different ways and skip around through the world using ingenious shortcuts. There's not much of that here, other than a few large branches, which is a disappointment.

But it's also the only major disappointment. While the overall progress is linear, the path through levels is anything but, and each level is cleverly laid out with lots of branching paths, shortcuts, and vertical layering. The levels are so much fun to explore, and the feeling of satisfaction when a path eventually loops around to open a previously glimpsed locked door or kick down a ladder is very much present. The levels are also, for the most part, HUGE, so each area feels like a fully realized place with a lot to do and see before moving on.

Those levels are the big focus here. The boss fights have all been very well-designed, with some especially impressive from an aesthetic/lore perspective, but most haven't been especially difficult - at least not to someone who's played a lot of Souls games. Later in the game there have started to be a few that are really tough and challenging, though. Regardless, the bosses have almost all been really cool and fun to fight, even if I do wish for a few more who are as punishing as the best bosses in previous installments.

As for the lore and references to previous games, for the most part I've found it well-done and satisfying. There are times when they go overboard and it seems a bit gratuitous, but mostly they've done a good job of building upon previous games, combining elements of the other games into a cohesive whole that may just be the best thing they've done in many ways. It's certainly the most polished and coherent, with no half-assed areas and nothing that is out of place.

[megladon8]

I am, I think, a little over halfway through the game and I have yet to find a weapon better than the long sword I started with. I've levelled it up and imbued it with fire, but man, the weapons in this game are disappointing.

I'm loving the game for sure, but the weapons are a big gripe for me at this point.

[sevenarts]

Isn't the whole point of weapons in these games that you can take any weapon, upgrade it, level the right stats, and it'll be viable all game? The weapons are great, there's so much variety and so many cool ones to try. I'm doing a greatsword build and have at least 6-7 of them that I like, each with different movesets and advantages/disadvantages.

[megladon8]

My problem is that the game has it ten so much faster paced (which I love!) but the move sets for many of the weapons remain the same speed, leaving them next to useless.

Most all of the heavy weapons I have come across are so slow that they leave the player wide open for a period of time that is relatively much longer, due to the increased speed and aggression of the enemies.

[sevenarts]

I've played the whole game two-handing the biggest, slowest swords I can find with no shield. If anything it's too powerful a playstyle. Like any other weapon, you just have to pick when to dodge and when to attack. I really feel like every weapon I've come across (and there are so many!!!) would be viable with the right investments, just like in Dark Souls 1. It's just a matter of how you like to play.

[megladon8]

I just killed one of the Fat Evangelists and got her mace/walking staff and it seems pretty cool.

Going to try it out for a bit. If I like it I may imbue it with lightning.

[Scar]

Just beat those Knights of the Abyss or whatever they're called. Spent waaaay too much time on those mother fuckers. Started as a Sellsword and I've found his twin swords to be my weapons of choice, with the katana a close second.

[Idioteque Stalker]

Thats a really hard but also really awesome fight. Feels very Bloodborne to me.

Never tried dual-wielding. I don't think I'd be good at it.

[Scar]

Thats a really hard but also really awesome fight. Feels very Bloodborne to me.

Never tried dual-wielding. I don't think I'd be good at it.

I rarely use a shield, so dual wielding / two handing came naturally. I've got a shield strapped to my back that increases stamina regeneration, and that's the extent of my shield use.

[Scar]

That Catacombs boss was the definition of a cake walk.

[sevenarts]

I love this game so much. I've gone through 2 NG+ cycles on my main/first character (a strength/quality build focused on two-handing ultra greatswords) and have now started a pyro run, which started out as kind of a drag but has become really fun once I started to get my Int/Faith high enough and get some of the better spells.

After Catacombs starts the best stretch of the game so enjoy! The bosses are considerably tougher and better too - all the first half bosses are arguably way too easy but they definitely make up for it big-time later on.

[Scar]

Now that I'm to the level where I needed the doll, the souls pile up quick. I just lost 32k, and decided it was time for a break. And, per usual, I lost them by being stupid and rushing through what should have been a very manageable section.

[megladon8]

Just finished my first playthrough.

Holy disappointing ending, Batman.

Though I gather I didn't get the "true" ending.

[sevenarts]

If anyone's interested, I've started a no-healing run, aiming to beat every boss without using Estus or healing spells, and I've started streaming it occasionally late at night: https://www.twitch.tv/sevenarts112

Mostly endless attempts at Pontiff or Dancer lately, I'm pretty stuck on both of them.

[Scar]

Just finished my first run with my +10 sellsword twin blades. Once I get his strength up to 18 I'm going to try out the Abyss Watchers sword dagger combo. His Dex is damn near 50 right now.

[Winston*]

Is Bloodborne generally considered the easiest of the Souls games? I'm not on a particularly high level (in the sixties) but I just beat the last two bosses first time (Darkbeast Paarl and One Reborn) and have found whole areas completely without challenge (the Forbidden Woods).

There's definitely been some frustrating bits but nothing like the constant grind of the other games for me.

[Idioteque Stalker]

No I think dark souls 2 is considered easiest. I thought bloodborne was really hard. Forbidden woods isn't super difficult but aside from the dumb looking snakes I love that area, and the boss is hard imo.


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[Idioteque Stalker]

The dlc for bloodborne is ridiculous. I gave up.


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[Winston*]

No I think dark souls 2 is considered easiest. I thought bloodborne was really hard. Forbidden woods isn't super difficult but aside from the dumb looking snakes I love that area, and the boss is hard imo.


I beat the boss first time.

[Winston*]

I should note I also think it's my favourite of the Souls games. The RPG aspect is my least favourite aspect of the other games, so I like that I don't have to think too much about armour, weapon and personal stats and just go for the weapon I like the feel of best.

[sevenarts]

Is Bloodborne generally considered the easiest of the Souls games? I'm not on a particularly high level (in the sixties) but I just beat the last two bosses first time (Darkbeast Paarl and One Reborn) and have found whole areas completely without challenge (the Forbidden Woods).

There's definitely been some frustrating bits but nothing like the constant grind of the other games for me.

One Reborn is such a pushover that the AI almost seems broken, while Paarl is available to be fought much earlier in the game, when he's a bit more of a challenge, he's very easy if you only find him shortly before the One Reborn.

That said, Bloodborne was my first Souls game and I found much of it, especially the earlier areas, very difficult, while playing the original Dark Souls after beating Bloodborne several times was fairly easy. I don't actually think Bloodborne is harder - in fact now I can breeze through it except for the later Chalice Dungeons - I think there's a bit of scaling with these games in that once you get used to their systems and their combat, whichever games you play second/third/fourth will seem easier than the first exposure.

[Sycophant]

Finally playing Bloodborne and it's really brilliant how similar and utterly distinct it is from the Souls games. I don't think I've been this excited diving into a game since Dark Souls or maybe even Demon's Souls.

I'll get to DS3 after I get through a playthrough of Bloodborne.

[Winston*]

The dlc for bloodborne is ridiculous. I gave up.

Yeah, it's tough. I'm currently at a crossroads with three different bosses I can't beat: Gehrman: the first hunter, Ludwig the Accursed in the DLC, and the boss in Cainhurst Castle. Might give it a break for a bit.

I gather that if I'd chosen the other dialogue option with Gehrman I would've completed the game but it didn't feel right.

[Winston*]

The dlc for bloodborne is ridiculous. I gave up.


Gave up on it too. Spent hours trying to beat that first boss to no avail, and just decided to go ahead and complete the game so that I didn't have to think about it any more. It's very easy for these games to cross over for me from fun but rewarding challenge to soul crushing obsession.

Beat every boss in the main game though, including the two optional end bosses. Gerhman was insanely tough for me.

[sevenarts]

Still loving and getting a lot out of DS3. I just finished a playthrough where I purposefully did not use any healing items, so I could only restore health at bonfires or by dying. It's a really fun and challenging way to play; a lot of the difficulty of the game is assuaged by having 15 estus flasks and being able to heal through mistakes and hits. The second half of the game is quite hard this way, I had to really learn movesets and make very few mistakes in each boss fight. I definitely recommend this as a good way to get more out of the game.

[Idioteque Stalker]

Wow. I'm not nearly good enough to imagine doing that.


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[Gittes]

After spending an entire weekend on The Orphan of Kos in Bloodborne, which is the penultimate DLC boss, I lost all motivation to exert the same amount of effort on any other boss. I did eventually beat him. The victory was really hard-sought, so it served as a kind of de facto final boss. I mean, Lawrence was still out there, but after two or three tries, I just wasn't feeling it. I saw a vision of an inordinate amount of attempts rising up before me and I gave up. I couldn't do that again. I don't really feel bad about this, though, as I don't think a game needs to be thoroughly exhausted in order to satisfy as a great experience.

Anyway, I feel kind of guilty about the considerable amount of time I spent playing this, but I'm glad I gave it a shot despite fearing that it wasn't for me. It's among the greatest games I've ever played and Cainhurst Castle is a top-tier video game location.

[megladon8]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FchVNsV8Ido

[D_Davis]

Looks cool. I hope they looked at the right parts of the Souls formula for their emulation.

Most devs, From included now, seemed to focus on the difficulty of the Souls games when formulating their new games, thinking that it was the raw challenge of the combat encounters that people enjoyed the most. So Dark Souls III was plagued with bosses with multiple stages and huge pools of HP. Go back and look at the bosses in Dark Souls and Demon's Souls in comparison.

What From has forgotten, and what others have overlooked, is that it was not just the challenge of the combat encounters that made the Souls games great. It was also the mystery, the level design, the obtuse nature of the narratives, and the over all feeling of despair that made Demon's Souls and Dark Souls so great. The challenge of the combat encounters was just part of the successful recipe.

It's as if Bandai-Namco's marketing team ended up dictating what was relevant and desired with their Prepare to Die slogan.

[megladon8]

I hope the world is a little livelier than what we saw in the video.

[megladon8]

And it's nice to see a new aesthetic being used.

Bloodborne looked wonderful, but I found DS3 very ugly.

[Idioteque Stalker]

lmao


https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=101&v=_yIg9OTys6o

[D_Davis]

Hahaha. He's got the role down!

Who is the character with the rack of guns?

[Idioteque Stalker]

I immediately thought Quiet, but that's not right. The I thought Overwatch, but that doesn't seem like Bluzzard's style.

[D_Davis]

Probably the most revealing cosplay I've every seen. Gotta have some major confidence to pull that off all day.

[[ETM]]

Internet says it's Nonon Jakuzure from Kill La Kill, on a nudist beach?

[D_Davis]

;577206']Internet says it's Nonon Jakuzure from Kill La Kill, on a nudist beach?

Ah! Kill la Kill. That makes sense. Cray amounts of fan service in that show.

Haven't seen the nudist beach episode, I guess. :)

[megladon8]

That was glorious.

[Dukefrukem]

Whelp dd. They just announced a remaster for PS4 xbone and PC.

[D_Davis]

Yep.

I was really hoping for a Dirctor's Cut, something that would include all the cut content. There was so much cut from the game, and the devs even said that the final 3rd of the main game was rushed and unfinished.

I'm less excited for just a better looking version, but I'll still buy it just so I can play it without having to hook up my PS3.

[Idioteque Stalker]

Switch. Souls on the go is just...

[D_Davis]

Do the switch joy cons have two should triggers?

[Idioteque Stalker]

Yes. Aside from pausing problems, I think it'll feel great.

[Dukefrukem]

:D


So yeah, I'm mighty stuck at the Bell Gargoyles.

Is it pretty much impossible to defeat them without summoning Sun Bro?

I read that they are both susceptible to lightning based attacks...but I don't have a weapon that does enough damage in the first place to warrant throwing some gold pine resin on it. I might as well just use the Drake Sword.

But man oh man...I just cannot beat these mofos.


How's about this - any tips for getting some humanity back? Any particular areas or enemies where humanity is fairly commonly found?

Haha. Found this thread, I don't think I've posted in here once, and this was the crowning achievement for me on Monday.

[Idioteque Stalker]

Yoooo, this thread is 64 pages long!

[megladon8]

Haha. Found this thread, I don't think I've posted in here once, and this was the crowning achievement for me on Monday.

Whoooooo! Good going, Duke!

That is one hell of a fight.

Could you see yourself becoming a big fan of these games? Wanting to play more?

[Scar]

*slams DS3 platinum trophy down*

*walks away*

[Scar]

Just finished my first run with my +10 sellsword twin blades. Once I get his strength up to 18 I'm going to try out the Abyss Watchers sword dagger combo. His Dex is damn near 50 right now.

Yeah, my play style changed a touch. Curved Greatswords of doom. Doooooom!

[Dukefrukem]

Whoooooo! Good going, Duke!

That is one hell of a fight.

Could you see yourself becoming a big fan of these games? Wanting to play more?

Hard to tell at this point. We'll see how DS1 goes. I'm enjoying playing with an audience for sure. And I suspect it's fun watching me suffer in return...

I do own Dark Souls II on steam as well.

And I can't believe I just learned of Dark Souls Remaster....