Winter's Bone

[Henry Gale]

Yeah, can't say I'm sure what to make of Winter's Bone. Hawkes and Lawrence are great, but one thing I kept thinking was that for for such an independent movie, it oddly felt like the sort of things where too many different hands came in and tinkered the plotline over time, having the script in a place where it seemed like whatever point it was trying to make was lost.

The ending is especially strange, almost as if it had one more scene taken away from the end to add some sort of irony or sense of a huge journey to the end of it. But instead, it leaves everything more or less where they were at the beginning, and without giving much catharsis along with it. For such strongly drawn characters, they don't have moments to act as much else but victims to circumstances beyond their control, and not even in particularly compelling ways. The only exciting parts for me seemed to be when the film has strangely mislead me into thinking it was going in a direction it wasn't. Instead, it just finds itself clinging to one emotional spot, never really adding many layers to it.

So overall disappointing, though mostly well made. I'm just not sure how much of that comes from the reception it's had up to me actually seeing it. Aside from the performances, there isn't much I can say stands out here. The fact that it's going to likely be such an awards darling in the next few months really puzzles me.

[Spinal]

Hope you don't mind me using your post to start a Winter's Bone thread. We needed one.

[Ezee E]

Hawkes' scene in his truck with Dillahunt pulling him over is one of the best scenes this year.

[Spinal]

John Hawkes is in this? Oh, I definitely want to see it now.

[Henry Gale]

Hope you don't mind me using your post to start a Winter's Bone thread. We needed one.

Perfectly fine with that, especially after struggling to find others' thoughts on it after watching it.


Hawkes' scene in his truck with Dillahunt pulling him over is one of the best scenes this year.

See, this I can agree with. Everything else overwhelmingly positive surrounding it... less so.

[Irish]

John Hawkes is in this? Oh, I definitely want to see it now.

Yep, and he's nearly unrecognizable. Amazing performance all the way down the line.

[Ezee E]

John Hawkes is in this? Oh, I definitely want to see it now.
I wouldn't have recognized him if it weren't for the logline telling me so.

He's the best thing about the movie though, and one of the best performances this year by far.

[Irish]

The ending is especially strange, almost as if it had one more scene taken away from the end to add some sort of irony or sense of a huge journey to the end of it. But instead, it leaves everything more or less where they were at the beginning, and without giving much catharsis along with it. For such strongly drawn characters, they don't have moments to act as much else but victims to circumstances beyond their control, and not even in particularly compelling ways.

It's strange because:

The movie sets up this incredible, independent heroine ... and then gives her no opportunity to solve her problems. There's two key scenes, one where she's rescued by her uncle (who shows up at exactly the right time) and another where the women of the community hand (haha! hand, get it?) everything she needs to solve her problems.

[Ezee E]

There's a lot to like about this movie if you're a fan of film noirs. The difference between this and something like Brick which also is sort of a film noir, is that Winter's Bone doesn't seem to be making it too obvious that it's using that type of structure.

The ending did disappoint me a little. Can't say I've read any raves about it either.

I think I read it on MC, but I'm a little puzzled about all the raves of Lawrence's performance, who, like a gumshoe in the film noir movies, is really just our guiding line through the world that the movie is set in.

[Henry Gale]

It's strange because:

The movie sets up this incredible, independent heroine ... and then gives her no opportunity to solve her problems. There's two key scenes, one where she's rescued by her uncle (who shows up at exactly the right time) and another where the women of the community hand (haha! hand, get it?) everything she needs to solve her problems.

Yeah, this is what I was trying to say without getting too specific. It feels like it pulls back at all the moments it seems like it's going to really go for something, with her character especially. And even without that everything finds a way of resolving itself quite nicely without much sacrifice aside from her being unfairly beaten up and then being forced to dig for her father's hands in the river. This isn't a fault to Lawrence's performance, because there's a good chance that she just played it a lot more assured and strong than the way story may have conceived for her to be. But as it is, it does feel awkward.

Also, in terms of the ending: When Teardrop says he figures out who killed his brother/Ree's dad. Are we supposed to assume that he means the cop or bail bondsman, or anyone else we've met? Or is it meant to be left ambiguous or possibly even someone we didn't get to see too much? I hate to say that I didn't care enough to really think about it too much.

[Benny Profane]

I remember the first time I saw John Hawkes (I think it was in Perfect Storm) I said to myself he looks like a freakin' crank-head. This is the role he was born to play and he really disappears into it. Other than that the film is meh-tabulous. I'm guessing a lot of it's critical reception has to do with its setting in the Ozarks. Oh look at the squalor of these incestuous poor white teenage mother meth addicts! That part isn't standard. The rest basically is.

[Pop Trash]

There's a lot to like about this movie if you're a fan of film noirs. The difference between this and something like Brick which also is sort of a film noir, is that Winter's Bone doesn't seem to be making it too obvious that it's using that type of structure.


YES! This is exactly what I thought too. Brick seemed to be rubbing the noir style in your face the whole time, constantly reminding the audience "see it's a high school movie meets film noir! Clever!" It took me awhile to even figure that out while watching Winter's Bone. The noir style is much more organic and lived in than Brick IMO. Anyways, I loved this movie.

[Derek]

YES! This is exactly what I thought too. Brick seemed to be rubbing the noir style in your face the whole time, constantly reminding the audience "see it's a high school movie meets film noir! Clever!" It took me awhile to even figure that out while watching Winter's Bone. The noir style is much more organic and lived in than Brick IMO. Anyways, I loved this movie.

Funny, after Benny's post, I was going to complain about people going off on what a great noir this is, as if by subduing the noirish elements of the film was in itself an impressive feat. Fact is its so subdued as to render the mystery inert, which is why, for me, it comes off a lifeless film that methodically and rather dully plods along from one location to the next, functioning more as a travelogue of an Ozarks community than the taut thriller it supposedly is.

[Henry Gale]

The things is, I don't personally look at either film from the point of how well it may fall nicely into being a current, less overtly-dressed noir, but simply how much they did for me as stories in general. Sure, Brick is way more obvious and reliant on the connection, but at the same time, it still seemed to offer more for me to chew on in terms of the world it created than Winter's Bone did. I'm even not a huge fan of Johnson's film, nor do I think either is "better" at showing affection for or being affected by the noir genre, I just simply like Brick and found a less satisfying experience with Bone outside of its performances.

For me, things just as recent like Kiss Kiss Bang Bang, Bored To Death, and (though potentially a more of a stretch) any number of Chris Nolan's films have all done much more interesting jobs of reflecting elements of the genre in modern settings without being slavish to its conventions and structure.

[Yxklyx]

This was a very solid film but didn't feel like it had much new to offer. I found it similar in tone and story to Wendy and Lucy which I found much more affecting.

[Ezee E]

I'm still disappointed by the ending is all. The whole journey on the way was leading to plenty of ideas and options that I felt could have been discussed afterwards as anyone and everyone could've been responsible. Or maybe not.

But instead, everything seems to end with a shrug.

[BuffaloWilder]

Oh, so is this that "it's-popular-now-it-sucks" thing everyone always talks about?

I see.

[soitgoes...]

23 out of 27 people here like it. People aren't saying it sucks, just that the ending is weak. I said the same thing when I saw it two months ago. It's still a good film, I just think it could have been great.

[Spinal]

Enough good scenes and good acting to make it worthwhile, but it seems incomplete somehow. The film ends as we're still getting to know people, just beginning to understand relationships. Dale Dickey was the highlight for me and John Hawkes is always stellar. But I can't say that this had much of an impact on me.

[Ezee E]

Worked the station last night and had a patient that looked even scarier then Dale Dickey. Yikes.

[MadMan]

I still haven't bothered to write a review for this film, namely out of laziness but also because it would really only take me two seconds to do so. The film was largely great because of the performances and the story, and while I liked the ending I do agree it was rather anti-climatic. Yet I got something of a film noir feeling from how the movie ended. Her father is dead, and she decided it was wise to just accept the closure of knowing he was dead, while her dad's brother decides to go out and possibly avenge him, even if it means he's going to get killed in the process. She lets revenge and justice slide in favor of taking care of the kids, but its really depressing because those kids really are preventing her from getting out of that shithole of an area.

[Raiders]

Some might call it "film noir" but I'll call it "film drab." Lifeless in its construction and narrative flow and so enigmatic as to be more grating than intriguing. Granik seems to be determined to undercut the film's drama as much as possible and stitch together the film as a series of meetings, slowly unfolding the underbelly of the community with each encounter Ree has in her search for her father. Granik ultimately uses Ree as a kind of Pip, a window into the peculiarities, ugliness and fractured familial bonds that string the community together. But the film never congeals or creates a compelling tapestry of the town and ultimately leaves itself very incomplete. The only dynamic character in the film is Hawkes' Teardrop, Ree's uncle, who is given the time to sit and talk and reveal himself. Such interesting figures as Thump Milton are ultimately given nothing at all but a scowl, and a character such as his wife(?) are never given any motivation for their actions, neither at the beginning or end.

On the flipside, one positive I did take away is surprisingly enough the ending. It most certainly comes too soon--the community and characters Granik so desperately wants to make the focus are left scrambled, unfinished and with minimal impact--but I think it finally makes a statement of some sort, showing the difference between Ree and Teardrop; subtly it shows him consumed with revenge and her consumed with caring for the only innocence left in her family, her two younger siblings. It gives a nice retrospective context to her character. Unfortunately though, it is a little too late to salvage the film.

[MacGuffin]

I can't even remember the ending. :sad: Great movie though.

[Hugh_Grant]

I saw it a couple months ago, and I barely remember anything about Winter's Bone, save Hawkes' performance. I much preferred Down to the Bone, Granik's previous film, with great performances from Vera Farmiga and Hugh Dillon.

[StanleyK]

This was quite dull, for most the same reasons Raiders posted. I think the movie could have benefited from either embracing its noir angle (as it is, the mystery story is underdeveloped and unsatisfying), or shifting focus away from it and its protagonist Ree and being mostly about the community. Winter's Bone strikes me as an insecure film, trying to make up for its formulaic narrative and lack of thematic focus only with its performances and pretty cinematography.

[Dukefrukem]

This was quite dull, for most the same reasons Raiders posted. I think the movie could have benefited from either embracing its noir angle (as it is, the mystery story is underdeveloped and unsatisfying), or shifting focus away from it and its protagonist Ree and being mostly about the community. Winter's Bone strikes me as an insecure film, trying to make up for its formulaic narrative and lack of thematic focus only with its performances and pretty cinematography.

This.

Why was this nominated? Over say... Shutter Island (open for discussion). Hell Tron Legacy even.

[Pop Trash]

This thread has become morbidly depressing.

[Morris Schæffer]

And add another who was fairly unimpressed by it. Didn't even think Hawkes' was that great although I do find it cool that he's nominated.

[elixir]

Dang, I'll just say I liked this, to counteract all the meh reactions.

[Boner M]

TEAM WINTER'S BONE

[DavidSeven]

Nothing new to add. It has its moments, but doesn't rises above the level of "whatevs" with any consistency. Lifeless and inert are the proper descriptors here.

[Lucky]

I tend to avoid threads like this before I actually see the film to avoid spoilers, but man, this thread is as disappointing as the film itself.

Having not seen The Kids Are Alright and The King's Speech, I would easily rank this the weakest out of The Academy's choices for best picture.

[Raiders]

I tend to avoid threads like this before I actually see the film to avoid spoilers, but man, this thread is as disappointing as the film itself.

:confused:

[Lucky]

Oh, I only meant that this movie didn't spark much discussion on here. I didn't mean anything personal. Coming on here to read thoughts on a movie I just watched is something I look forward to.

[MadMan]

I'm actually surprised that this got nominated for Best Picture. It came out earlier in the year, and the only reason I even bothered to see it was because it was getting some awards buzz and I think someone either on this site or RT praised it.


This.

Why was this nominated? Over say... Shutter Island (open for discussion). Hell Tron Legacy even. Because it was better than both those movies? :P

Really though, Shutter Island came out way too early in the year, and thus was forgotten. And the Academy continues to shun sci-fi movies that are not directed by James Cameron, which is why Tron: Legacy didn't stand a chance. Well that and the negative reviews the movie got.

[Sycophant]

Where did you get that quote?

[MadMan]

http://www.match-cut.org/showpost.php?p=321765&postcount=26

PS: Although perhaps Duke was really referring to cinematography. In which case, he'd actually be right.

[balmakboor]

Re-watched this and liked it a bit more, but still didn't change my overall impression. Good atmosphere and strong performances hampered by a sloppy and unfocused script (too many characters, insufficient differentiation between characters, too much told through dialog rather than shown). And the ending still feels too posed and forced and cutesy.