Sucker Punch (Zack Snyder)

[eternity]

People at test screenings are dumb as fuck. I know from first-hand experience.I concur. The shit that spouted from people's mouth at Pilgrim was mindblowing. "I wish it was less like a video game." was the primary complaint.

[eternity]

What the fuck.
http://www.nylonmag.com/?section=article&parid=5928
I'm thinking of where that scene would have been in the film, and if it's where I think it would be, that would have really made that part of the film better, or at least more coherent. It explains something that otherwise is quite flimsy.

It's not that she was really the fifth item as much as it was that she was sick of all of it; the torture she was going through by being there made her want to escape the only way she really could by letting the lobotomy happen. The asylum and her treatment made her exactly the thing she was being falsely treated for. Thus Hamm's character / "the high roller" saw her wanting to be lobotomized, and if that sex scene was in the film in that second reality towards the end and it appeared like she was being taken advantage of, then the entire film would be thrown off just a bit more than it already was, considering how it's a mess and all.

It's clear as day that this movie was going to suck no matter what, and Snyder may deserve a little bit more credit. I don't know; it's a mess, but I can't help but to respect what it is and most of all what it could have been.

[Bosco B Thug]

I actually believe Snyder when he says that a big part of this movie is trying to deliver a criticism on fanboy culture's objectification and sexism towards women through things like video games and movies, because I think a lot of people have overlooked the humour in the device of transforming Baby Doll's dancing (which the male characters in the film see as sexual gyrating, possible stripping) into sequences the audiences sees as specific genre ass-kicking with the girls scantily clad as they invade these giant worlds, plowing through endless zombies, robots, trolls and dragons, which is what is pre-established as the real-world ticket buyer's expected PG-13 entertainment and titillation. Cool, I'm impressed this was what he intended.


But most of all, it's really sad to hear how Snyder originally wanted to end the movie and tie all the threads together, because aside from giving Jon Hamm a bigger role, it would have easily been a more satisfying conclusion to the movie:

Interview link. (http://www.filmschoolrejects.com/features/interview-zack-snyder-on-the-sexuality-and-world-of-sucker-punch.php)

I don't care how the studio looked at it, that should have been the ending no matter what. But that seems to sum up the whole end result of this movie in a way: muddled, neutered and stripped of its focus by forces beyond what anyone involved may have been able to control or see as it was happening.

**, maybe **1/2 That sounds wonderful. Well, not that it doesn't sound hokey or any more intelligent than the rest of the movie, but just that it totally pushes forward the film's moral and emotional intentions and is an outwardly abstract and artistic sequence. And there is the possibility that it could be very beautiful or moving (or not). Guess the Moulin Rouge/musical observation earlier is even more apt now.

And that explains the John Hamm sequence, also. And I see how it works.

I for one am really interested in this Director's Cut. Fast-forwarding through it, at least.

[Henry Gale]

That sounds wonderful. Well, not that it doesn't sound hokey or any more intelligent than the rest of the movie, but just that it totally pushes forward the film's moral and emotional intentions and is an outwardly abstract and artistic sequence. And there is the possibility that it could be very beautiful or moving (or not). Guess the Moulin Rouge/musical observation earlier is even more apt now.

And that explains the John Hamm sequence, also. And I see how it works.

I for one am really interested in this Director's Cut. Fast-forwarding through it, at least.

Yeah, I'm not assuming that having those scenes re-instated would suddenly save the movie from the other problems it firmly has etched into it, but it just feels like a more natural conclusion to a movie that takes place 95% in imagined spaces. It's also a bit he claims the movie is only one third as "crazy" as he wanted originally, while also claiming he always wanted it to be PG-13. I think it's now safe to assume that an R-rating, complete creative control and final cut would have been the only ways to have seen a final product that satisfied Snyder's original vision and potentially us as an audience. It's a shame what we have instead is kind of a mess.

The only thing is that he says later on in that interview is that the alternate ending I highlighted won't be in the Director's Cut because they pulled the plug on it after it tested badly and they never finished securing the music rights or even all of the effects for it. He said that if the movie does well, he may be able to convince the studio to give up the money to properly complete it, but as it is (along with the way the movie is currently performing), the only way we'll likely see it is as a separate, unfinished special feature.

[Bosco B Thug]

Yeah, I'm not assuming that having those scenes re-instated would suddenly save the movie from the other problems it firmly has etched into it, but it just feels like a more natural conclusion to a movie that takes place 95% in imagined spaces. Totally, and I agree it could fit in quite nicely. For the record, though, I rather like the bus scene as the ending (it being the only naturalistic, "outside-world"-set scene, so ending on that note seems a nice idea).


The only thing is that he says later on in that interview is that the alternate ending I highlighted won't be in the Director's Cut because they pulled the plug on it after it tested badly and they never finished securing the music rights or even all of the effects for it. He said that if the movie does well, he may be able to convince the studio to give up the money to properly complete it, but as it is (along with the way the movie is currently performing), the only way we'll likely see it is as a separate, unfinished special feature. Ah, that's not good... Well then, I hope we get even that.

[Mr. Pink]

Man . . . I keep logging on with the intention of posting my thoughts to this, but I just don't really even know where to begin. I was annoyed right from the beginning at the turns the plot took once they hit the mental institution, and I stayed annoyed throughout. I had to separate the action pieces from the story just to find some enjoyment out of the experience, but even that was difficult.

Made Battle for L.A. seem downright respectable.

[lovejuice]

I've never got the Asian girls that spread the Asian Bug. Zhang Ziyi asides, you guys still pretty much have your own non-Asian standard of what a beauty constitutes.

[Qrazy]

I've never got the Asian girls that spread the Asian Bug. Zhang Ziyi asides, you guys still pretty much have your own non-Asian standard of what a beauty constitutes.

Yeah well, you can keep your Yaeba culture and we'll keep our...

http://www.sportressofblogitude.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/SexyAsianGirl41.jpg

[lovejuice]

A picture speaks thousand words of argument.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ocC4LGQZwEs/SgfwWcFXA5I/AAAAAAAAKGc/M2K2qVPZ1WE/s400/yaeba009.jpg

[Kurosawa Fan]

Zack Snyder would be proud of the current direction of this thread.

[Qrazy]

A picture speaks thousand words of argument.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ocC4LGQZwEs/SgfwWcFXA5I/AAAAAAAAKGc/M2K2qVPZ1WE/s400/yaeba009.jpg

Yeah except she would be that much hotter sans yaeba.

[lovejuice]

well...the movie's terrible in a rather unique way. Most bad flicks are bad either because the film-makers don't respect their audiences enough or due to series of missteps. Sucker Punch doesn't seem to have a footing to begin with. The problem should be clear 30 minutes in -- after the duel with three samurais -- that the whole things just. Won't. Work. The aesthetic, the storyline, the setting, the characters.

I like Wat's comparison to Moulin Rogue. Guess that's what Snyder aims this to be if he could find the right wavelength. The movie, unfortunately, doesn't appear as polished as Synder's lofty ambition.

[Ezee E]

Moulin Rouge at least makes sense with its zaniness.

[Skitch]

Music Video!: The Movie!

I bet I wasn't the first to say this, right? :lol:

[Bosco B Thug]

Music Video!: The Movie!

I bet I wasn't the first to say this, right? :lol: Nope, but it bears repeating, because it is absolutely right on. :lol:

[Boner M]

I actually believe Snyder when he says that a big part of this movie is trying to deliver a criticism on fanboy culture's objectification and sexism towards women through things like video games and movies, because I think a lot of people have overlooked the humour in the device of transforming Baby Doll's dancing (which the male characters in the film see as sexual gyrating, possible stripping) into sequences the audiences sees as specific genre ass-kicking with the girls scantily clad as they invade these giant worlds, plowing through endless zombies, robots, trolls and dragons, which is what is pre-established as the real-world ticket buyer's expected PG-13 entertainment and titillation.

I have to admire Sucker Punch for one thing: it baits moviegoers pretending to be an action-fantasy movie, and it turns out to be a grim women's picture, with a surprising deal of compassion for the weakest of the female suffering and a surprise theme that promotes the deeper and internally existent girl over the merely female or kickass.
This is actually a very good points, and probably why Snyder chose the film's title (rather than just for the promise of an in-yo-face & vizionary movie). Ultimately nothing much of that core idea emerges in what's onscreen, but I don't think the Snyder's vision is as reprehensible as his kneejerk critics are making it out to be.

That said, the central escape narrative is a bore, the action/fantasy scenes are ugly and uninvolving, and it looks like turd throughout, so boo-urns overall.

[Boner M]

Y'know what this film really needed?

http://i.picasion.com/pic39/1c88f6d998a3a44910701418094f8c 5f.gif

[Bosco B Thug]

Y'know what this film really needed?

http://i.picasion.com/pic39/1c88f6d998a3a44910701418094f8c 5f.gif It actually felt a lot like watching Enter the Void.

[eternity]

It actually felt a lot like watching Enter the Void.
I concur. It's like a mainstream, sanitized Enter the Void at a lot of points.

[number8]

I concur. It's like a mainstream, sanitized Enter the Void at a lot of points.

Shit, you guys sure know how to get a guy to want to watch a movie.

[Ezee E]

Shit, you guys sure know how to get a guy to want to watch a movie.
Well, I'll reply with that I have no idea how they make that distinction at all. I'd still say it's more comparable to your favorite video game directed by a music video director.

I'm not a fan of Enter the Void, but this comparison devalues it.

[baby doll]

I concur. It's like a mainstream, sanitized Enter the Void at a lot of points.Which puts it only two degrees of separation from Michael Snow.

[Bosco B Thug]

I meant mostly they're similar in watching them. They have very comparable ratios of viewing time spent feeling admiration to viewing time spent involuntarily drooling.

Though there is the fact that both are rigidly structured thingamabobs that force you to endure long, protracted, clearly demarcated bouts of real-time reverie/idleness.

Enter the Void is certainly 10x more worthwhile and interesting formally than Sucker Punch, don't wish to mislead anyone there.

[eternity]

Well, I'll reply with that I have no idea how they make that distinction at all. I'd still say it's more comparable to your favorite video game directed by a music video director.

I'm not a fan of Enter the Void, but this comparison devalues it.I think you're devaluing Sucker Punch more than the comparison devalues Enter the Void.

[Ezee E]

I'd say the only comparison is that it takes Enter the Void 90 minutes to go from good to awful. Sucker Punch is like starting out 5-10 minutes before the Love Hotel or whatever it was called.

[Sxottlan]

Sucker Punch and the Fetishized Image (http://www.slantmagazine.com/house/2011/04/sucker-punch-and-the-fetishized-image/) over at The House Next Door.

Interesting defense.

[dreamdead]

There are enough interesting things about this film, even if Snyder fails to explore them in convincing ways, that I can't disparage this one. Browning as the main vocalist for the cover tracks alone is interesting to think about--I mean, it's guaranteed to be more interesting for me as a film than Thor, X-Men: First Class, or the other summer fare.

Yet the film would be so much better had we started one layer down and felt that there was more at stake in the fantasy reveries (a la Mulholland Dr.). The replacement of violence for sexuality, and basic lobotomy stuff with blockbuster film that the THND piece SxottIan links to identifies, is just ambiguous enough that I can see value in what Snyder is trying to explore. Again, it's seldom developed enough, but maybe a Director's Cut can fix that. And this is coming from someone who generally hates his Watchmen.

[Sxottlan]

So an extended cut was quietly put out on disc today. I'm thinking of giving it a try.

[Dukefrukem]

So an extended cut was quietly put out on disc today. I'm thinking of giving it a try.

I wouldn't bother. It doesn't piece together the dream sequences any better. This movie is an utter wreck. I don’t remember the last time a movie had so much promise but was so poorly put together, either in from the director’s chair or in the editing room. This is by far Snyder’s worst movie.

[EyesWideOpen]

I'm fine with being the only one here who liked Sucker Punch more then The Tree Of Life.

[TGM]

I'm fine with being the only one here who liked Sucker Punch more then The Tree Of Life.

Oh, you're not the only one.

[transmogrifier]

I'm fine with being the only one here who liked Sucker Punch more then The Tree Of Life.

I haven't seen Sucker Punch yet, but it stands a chance.

[Dukefrukem]

Now that I've time to reflect, the only thing I really enjoyed about Sucker Punch was the first dream sequence with the three samurai.

[max314]

Not as bad as I was fearing, but still weighed down by its predictability and mostly tension-less action interludes. Still, it was fun while it lasted.

★★★★★