Gran Torino

[Ezee E]

http://www.awardsdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/torino-posterx-large.jpg

So badass.

This is the poster that'll feature the movie nominated for Best Picture?

[number8]

Heh, I bet they made it so that people think it's an action movie.

[Ezee E]

An action movie starring a 70+ year old. Can't wait!!!

[Grouchy]

Wow, the Eastman sure doesn't waste time. The Changeling doesn't even have a wide release date yet, right?

[bac0n]

Wow. Gran Turismo is that last video game I would have thought they would make into a movie... :crazy:

[Raiders]

Wow. Gran Turismo is that last video game I would have thought they would make into a movie... :crazy:

It still might be.

[eternity]

Wow, the Eastman sure doesn't waste time. The Changeling doesn't even have a wide release date yet, right?

October 31st.

[megladon8]

So, what's it about?

[Ezee E]

Eastwood is a war veteran racist, and Koreans move next door.

Seriously, that is what it's about.

[megladon8]

Eastwood is a war veteran racist, and Koreans move next door.

Seriously, that is what it's about.


I hope there's bullet-time.

[number8]

He learns the error of his racist ways when his Korean neighbor helps him fix his Gran Torino. It's a movie about male bonding over cars.

[Wryan]

He learns the error of his racist ways when his Korean neighbor helps him fix his Gran Torino. It's a movie about male bonding over cars.

I read "bending over cars."

Moving on...

[Morris Schæffer]

Do you feel lucky punks? Well, ya should cuz I proudly present:

THE TRAILER

http://www.davestrailerpage.co.uk/

(top of page)

[DavidSeven]

WTF? Did he film this over a long weekend or something?

[Robby P]

The premise of this movie sounds impossibly stupid. Seems like something in the vein of Crash.

[Qrazy]

The premise of this movie sounds impossibly stupid. Seems like something in the vein of Crash.

Sometimes we shoot each other in the face, just so we can feel something.

[Morris Schæffer]

Clint looks absolutely homicidal! :lol:

[Watashi]

Badass.

[Watashi]

The shot of Angry Clint pounding that guys face in is beyond words.

[EvilShoe]

Seems like they could've actually used this poster had the movie been in fact another Dirty Harry sequel. (As was rumored)

[EvilShoe]

It looks terrible.
Pass.

[Ezee E]

Haha. Yeah, I don't think this will be Best Picture contender.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I'm stunned. That couldn't have looked worse without adding Cuba Gooding Jr. to the cast.

[Ezee E]

I'm stunned. That couldn't have looked worse without adding Cuba Gooding Jr. to the cast.
No need for a spoof of some of those scenes, I was already roaring.

"Get off my lawn!"

[Grouchy]

It looks like Clint makes one really stupid movie and one really good one these days. I hope Changeling is the really good one.

And, speaking of Clint, I'd like another Dirty Harry sequel. Sudden Impact fucking rules.

[Watashi]

You guys are crazy. This looks awesome.

It will totally get nominated for Best Picture.

[Watashi]

Clint has said that Gran Torino will be his last film, both acting and directing.

[Ezee E]

Clint has said that Gran Torino will be his last film, both acting and directing.
doubt that'll be true. where'd you see this

[Raiders]

Clint has said that Gran Torino will be his last film, both acting and directing.

Except he's already signed on to direct The Human Factor.

[number8]

I don't care that it looks terrible, I want to fucking see this REALLY badly.

"GET OFF MY LAWN!"

Yesssss!

[Grouchy]

Except he's already signed on to direct The Human Factor.
He's also working on a documentary on Tony Bennett.

I think he'll keep working until death does him in. Which hopefully is a long time away.

[Ezee E]

I don't care that it looks terrible, I want to fucking see this REALLY badly.

"GET OFF MY LAWN!"

Yesssss!
Oh, I'll be there regardless. That line alone. I'm sure there will be a WWII story, some birthday of his, and hopefully, Bingo.

[number8]

doubt that'll be true. where'd you see this

Article on USA Today:


Eastwood is producing, directing and even composing music for movies at an age when other filmmakers would be retired. Acting is the only area in which he has cut back.

"Yeah, it'll probably be my last," he says of Gran Torino. "I'll be drummed out of it after this one."

After more than 50 years and dozens of iconic characters, could he be serious?

That familiar dry voice on the phone turns into a chuckle. "Nah, I'm just kidding."

But Eastwood acknowledges that the thought crosses his mind. "Every time you do one you think, 'Aw, that's enough of that.' I always feel it's very comfortable to be behind the camera."


Reading is important. :P

[Acapelli]

it looks like a straight-faced falling down more than crash

[megladon8]

Yeah this looks awesome.

Even if something by Eastwood looks not great (this), I'll see it because it's Eastwood.

I wish I had been alive when he was doing westerns. I guess this is my way of saying "thanks" for giving the world so many great films to treasure.

He's a cool guy. I like to support him.

[Pop Trash]

I don't care that it looks terrible, I want to fucking see this REALLY badly.

"GET OFF MY LAWN!"

Yesssss!

Hahaha yes this looks hilarious. I hope Clint steals the uzi from that gang and gives it back at them. Hopefully it doesn't get too schmaltzy cuz this looks like good Republican exploitation in the vein of Dirty Harry/Death Wish/Friday the 13th.

[Boner M]

That spitting scene was amazing.

[Boner M]

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d121/PositiveJon/ANGRYCLINT.jpg

[Kurosawa Fan]

:lol:

That needs to be the banner. Immediately.

[MacGuffin]

:lol:

That needs to be the banner. Immediately.

Yes, it does.

[Ezee E]

Yes, it does.
thirded.

[SirNewt]

Seems like they could've actually used this poster had the movie been in fact another Dirty Harry sequel. (As was rumored)

Or add a chimp, matte it in white, and use it for his next film "No which way but down".

[Morris Schæffer]

I don't care that it looks terrible, I want to fucking see this REALLY badly.

"GET OFF MY LAWN!"

Yesssss!

Yeah, that is exactly how I feel.:)

EDIT: Oh and fourthed.

[Amnesiac]

Some of it seemed a little... I don't know, hammy? Contrived? Unnatural? Maybe all those things.

And yet, I'm still intrigued. I guess I just think it will be fun to see Clint in a role like this.

[Grouchy]

Fifthed.

[eternity]

Sixthed.

[Pop Trash]

David Seventhed

[Pop Trash]

Some of it seemed a little... I don't know, hammy? Contrived? Unnatural? Maybe all those things.

Oh totally! I hope Clint just goes for it and it works as a high-larious comedy.

[Boner M]

All it needs is cartoon steam coming from his ears.

[SirNewt]

All it needs is cartoon steam coming from his ears.

or a chimp

[Ivan Drago]

it looks like a straight-faced falling down more than crash

...is that supposed to be a good thing? Because Falling Down was terrible.

[origami_mustache]

Wow, this looks pathetic.

[Raiders]

I think it looks better than Changeling. More interesting at the least.

[MadMan]

I'd rather see this movie than The Changeling. It looks more entertaining, at least.

[Ezee E]

More interesting. More entertaining.

More Eastwood.

[Sven]

I dunno... I think it looks kinda interesting. It looks like the whole priest angle is going to be an eye-roller, and Eastwood's performance is comically growly. Also, his son and (I assume) daughter-in-law giving him retirement home pamphlets on his birthday and then being vocal about him kicking them out seems a little bit like Swank's family in Million $$$ Baby, no?

[DavidSeven]

Every moment in that trailer looked embarassing on some level.

Good call on the birthday party scene, iosos.

[Boner M]

http://www.justpressplay.net/images/stories/clinteastwood-getoffmylawn.jpg

These scowly Clint pics correspond with my av so beautifully.

[Ezee E]

I dunno... I think it looks kinda interesting. It looks like the whole priest angle is going to be an eye-roller, and Eastwood's performance is comically growly. Also, his son and (I assume) daughter-in-law giving him retirement home pamphlets on his birthday and then being vocal about him kicking them out seems a little bit like Swank's family in Million $$$ Baby, no?
Yeah, I thought the same thing. heck, the Priest angle was even done in Million Dollar baby.

[Grouchy]

Wow, it's like he suddenly decided: "I'm really going to ACT in this one!".

DRAMA!

[Mal]

Looks like MST3K material.

[Wryan]

If the trailer is any indication, this will make male audience members' balls sweat and then grow three sizes larger.

[Sxottlan]

Oh I don't know about this one.

[Ivan Drago]

The movie itself looks good. The writing...not so much.

[Boner M]

Looks like MST3K material.
The early buzz (http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/2008/12/torino_troubles.php) agrees.

Mike D'Angelo wrote these few tidbits in his twitter (http://twitter.com/gemko):


I don't know what to do with this. It's like trying to rate Reefer Madness or something


Lest there be confusion, I am at best mixed. This film is soooo bad. But hilariously bad.


It's like they shot the SNL parody of the film instead of the film.

Cannot. Fucking. Wait.

[Watashi]

Clint will be nominated for Best Actor. Guaranteed.

[eternity]

The reviews coming out are proof that this is going to be BP nom #5.

Or not.

[DavidSeven]

The people at Warners should probably watch the movies before they organize FYC campaigns for them.

[Grouchy]

I thought Changeling was the Oscar Clint Eastwood movie of the year? And this was the badass one?

[number8]

I need to see this, stat.

[KK2.0]

Unintentional hilarious or Ironic?

I'm going to love this movie. The "get off my lawn" line could only be made better by the addition of "punk!" in the end.

[Boner M]

D'Angelo also nicknamed the film "Listen Eggroll" after an actual line in it.

[number8]

Oh man, I cannot wait for the torrent of Eastwood's Asian slurs.

[Ivan Drago]

D'Angelo also nicknamed the film "Listen Eggroll" after an actual line in it.

Are you serious?

Man and I thought the writing was bad in the trailer.

[Amnesiac]

Manohla Dargis (and others) have had some favourable things to say about the film (http://movies.nytimes.com/2008/12/12/movies/12tori.html):


"Twice in the last decade, just as the holiday movie season has begun to sag under the weight of its own bloat, full of noise and nonsense signifying nothing, Clint Eastwood has slipped another film into theaters and shown everyone how it’s done. This year’s model is “Gran Torino,” a sleek, muscle car of a movie Made in the U.S.A., in that industrial graveyard called Detroit. I’m not sure how he does it, but I don’t want him to stop. Not because every film is great — though, damn, many are — but because even the misfires show an urgent engagement with the tougher, messier, bigger questions of American life.

[...]

Walt assumes his protector role gradually, a transformation that at first plays in an often broadly comic key. Mr. Eastwood’s loose, at times very funny performance in the early part of the film is one of its great pleasures. While some of this enjoyment can be likened to spending time with an old friend, Mr. Eastwood is also an adept director of his own performances and, perhaps more important, a canny manipulator of his own iconographic presence. He knows that when we’re looking at him, we’re also seeing Dirty Harry and the Man With No Name and all his other outlaws and avenging angels who have roamed across the screen for the last half-century. All these are embedded in his every furrow and gesture."

http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/images/column/103108/clintsquint.jpg

So, there you have it. Perhaps this one shouldn't be so quickly dismissed.

[Ezee E]

I've got a pass to see this on Wednesday.

[Duncan]

I'd definitely rather see this than Changeling.

[Derek]

I'd definitely rather see this than Changeling.

Ditto.

[Raiders]

It's at 79 on Metacritic, and every review I skim makes me really want to see it.

[transmogrifier]

It's at 79 on Metacritic, and every review I skim makes me really want to see it.


Critics slaver over Eastwood shock!

[Amnesiac]

Critics slaver over Eastwood shock!

I'm guessing you meant to say 'schlock'.

[transmogrifier]

I'm guessing you meant to say 'shlock'.

Hee! No, he is far too MOR to ever get into schlock, unless it's unintentional.

[Amnesiac]

Hee! No, he is far too MOR to ever get into schlock, unless it's unintentional.

:|

MOR?

[transmogrifier]

:|

MOR?

Middle of the Road

[Amnesiac]

Middle of the Road

Schlock, as in "cheap or inferior goods or material; trash". I thought that's what you were trying to infer about Gran Torino.

[transmogrifier]

No I was doing a fake headline - Critics Slaver Over Eastwood ShocK!

Sarcasm may have been involved.

[Amnesiac]

... Magpie.

[transmogrifier]

... Magpie.


:crazy:

[DavidSeven]

Maybe it would help if you put a period after "Eastwood."

[Amnesiac]

:crazy:

Oh yeah, isn't that reference to another communication breakdown we had just downright zany? :P

Magpies, MOR, and sarcastic newspaper head-lines, oh my.

[transmogrifier]

Oh yeah, isn't that reference to another communication breakdown we had just downright zany? :P

Magpies, MOR, and sarcastic newspaper head-lines, oh my.

Communications breakdowns are fun. They keep you on your toes.

[Amnesiac]

Communications breakdowns are fun. They keep you on your toes.

Keep doing what you're doing then. :P

[transmogrifier]

Keep doing what you're doing then. :P

I'm not sure I know how to do anything else. :(

[Morris Schæffer]

I'd definitely rather see this than Changeling.

ditto again! And I've seen Changeling. Which was ok.

[Raiders]

No I was doing a fake headline - Critics Slaver Over Eastwood ShocK!

Sarcasm may have been involved.

Critics were pretty mixed on Changeling. Schlock!

[B-side]

Eastwood's trite, unintentionally silly "I used to be bad, but now I'm good!" film. Thankfully, when the film isn't being unintentionally funny, it's being intentionally funny. The humor isn't for everyone, though, as it largely comes from Eastwood's racist remarks and tirades, as well as his exaggerated scowls and bitter attitude. It's completely predictable, pretty unaffecting and the Asian boy who co-stars is relatively bad. Eastwood may have conjured up a decent performance, though. I say "may have" because I can't get over the forced nature of a lot of his actions in the first, say, 45 minutes. He did start showing some range in the second half of the film.

Anyway, has anyone else seen this yet?

[Watashi]

Everything you heard about Gran Torino is correct. This movie is so awful that it becomes amazing. This may be one of the most glorious films ever. Even Joel and Mike would have to bow down to this movie.

Let's just say, if you did a drinking game with every time Clint scowls or makes a racial remark, the strongest of drinkers would be shitfaced within 10 minutes.

Also, the Christ parables at the end are stunning. No joke.

I can't rate this movie. No one should. It's in a league beyond ratings.

I can't wait to see it again.

[Watashi]

Did I mention Clint Eastwood calls a kid "pusscake"?

Yeah, it's awesome.

[Ezee E]

Didn't go to the screening yesterday. Too cold, and too far away.

I did get another one for Revolutionary Road though. I definitely will attempt to go to that one.

[eternity]

Jungle people.

This is so fucking awesome.

[eternity]

"Mr. Ting Tock Dingdong walked out with what's her face and you blew it Toad! You know why, because you're a bit fat pussy! Good day, pusscake."

I love this movie.

[chrisnu]

Did I mention Clint Eastwood calls a kid "pusscake"?

Yeah, it's awesome.
I must see this.

[eternity]

I must see this.

That's really only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to this film. Walt, by the end, is probably one of the more likable/especially hilarious characters in recent memory. If it weren't for the horribly cliche, after school special dynamic to the film's structure and events, I might have liked it a whole lot. Eastwood's character is a rather fascinating one and at times the film is very strong. It just happens to be god awful half the time.

[B-side]

The film's sense of humor is intact, that much is for certain. I love that he calls Toad a zipperhead and a gook. I also love when he intentionally mispronounces Toad's crush's name and calls her Miss Yum Yum.

[eternity]

The film's sense of humor is intact, that much is for certain. I love that he calls Toad a zipperhead and a gook. I also love when he intentionally mispronounces Toad's crush's name and calls her Miss Yum Yum.

And the boy that his crush walks out with "Mr. Ting Tock Dingdong". :lol:

[B-side]

And the boy that his crush walks out with "Mr. Ting Tock Dingdong". :lol:

Classic. I'm tempted to watch it again just for those scenes.

[number8]

I loved the hell out of this. It's a great Christmas movie.

[chrisnu]

OMG this movie rocks. It's like The After-School Special with Clint Eastwood the Badass Geezer, complete with six-fingered thugs and gratuitous dog shots.

I desperately need the song at the end.

*bangs screen door* WAAAALT!!! WAAAALT!!! WAAAALT!!! WAAAALT!!! WAAAALT!!! WAAAALT!!!

[number8]

Saw it again today. Still great.

"I got a joke. A Mexican, a Jew and a colored fella walk into a bar. The bartender looks up and says... Get the fuck outta here."

[chrisnu]

I can't believe that a movie this colossally bad was awarded Best Screenplay by the National Board of Review. If the name Clint Eastwood wasn't attached to it, it would be universally ignored. Thankfully for us, he is involved, and the movie is awesome because of it.

[Ivan Drago]

Goddammit, why won't this come to my area?

[Ezee E]

Goddammit, why won't this come to my area?
It will, in a week or two.

[Boner M]

My dad saw the trailer for this a few days ago and he's said 'we have to see this!' at least 5 times since.

[Ivan Drago]

It will, in a week or two.

I'm sure it will...plus my indie theater's website has it under "Coming Soon". But then again it might pull a fast one and replace it with some shit like The Unborn. It's done that before.

[Ezee E]

Wow. #1 opening weekend with $30 million. Eastwood's biggest hit.

Acceptable?

[Raiders]

Wonderful.

[Raiders]

I had a discussion after this movie, and someone said to me they were offended by the film's cavalier use of racial slurs. But I quickly pointed out that the characters in the film who we expect to share this disgust, especially since it is at their own expense, simply refuse to comfort us and instead look beyond the words. We have Paul Haggis to rub our face in our insensitivity. What Eastwood and screenwriter Nick Schenk do here is create a character who never becomes cute, cuddly or even less than offensive. You aren't going to change his cursing or his careless and ignorant slurs. Despite the film's occasionally cringe-worthy, on-the-nose dialogue it is a surprisingly sensitive portrait, especially in the way it equates Walt with his minority neighbors (much like Haggis vainly attempted with the father figure in Crash). It gracefully and poetically avoids condescending to liberal superiority and instead seeks to find the common ground between generations and races. Eastwood is a smart, careful surveyor of his own legacy and the almost inevitable finale is beautifully opposite of what we would expect from Dirty Harry; the notion is strikingly anti-violence and shows you're never too old to learn something about life and placing the importance on someone other than yourself.

[Watashi]

So tenderly... your story.

[Philosophe_rouge]

Raiders, I agree whole-heartedly, but I think I might even like it more than you. I might think up some words that express my reasons... but right now, it seems like work.

[eternity]

This seemingly random 180 of reception is baffling. I just don't get it.

[number8]

What Raiders said. Wrote the same thing in my review. The handling of the racial sensitivity is the film's biggest surprise.

[Pop Trash]

I quite liked it as well. Sure it has glaring flaws. Most of the acting other than by Clint is passable at best and pretty bad at worst. The gangsters are sometimes cartoonishly broad. The scene with Walt and the barber trying to teach "Toad" how to act like a man is fairly eye-rollingly cheesy. But ultimately the film lives and dies on your opinion of Clint Eastwood. If you never liked him or his various personas (Dirty Harry, Man with No Name, etc.) than stay far away from this film. I think you have to watch it with his filmic history in mind. His character in this is a crank who uses racial slurs that are so antiquated many (and many in my audience did...more on that later) will find them hilarious (seriously "zipperhead?" never heard that one before) But Clint never placates the audience. And the movie remains memorable and interesting for this reason. His character never really changes on the surface -he's still griping and using offensive language even after death but he changes in subtle ways by finding a new lot in life by protecting the Hmung family next door. The most interesting scene is his death. Granted even this scene has flaws -you really shouldn't have filmed yourself giving the Jesus Christ death pose Clint -but it flips the audiences need for vengeance and violence.

Clint has been doing this in most of his better films from Unforgiven on forward. Nearly all of them use classic and now cliched Hollywood genres (The Western-Unforgiven, Cops and Robbers-A Perfect World, Romance-The Bridges of Madison County, Film Noir-Mystic River, Sports Movie-Million Dollar Baby, War Movie-Flags of Our Fathers/Letters to Iwo Jima, Dirty Harry-esque Rouge Avenger-Gran Torino) to flip our expectation of those genres and use them to examine either aging and/or violence.

It's interesting to think of the audience's reaction to this film. It has become a surprise hit, possibly because the trailer enticed audiences to view the vengeance of an old racist crank in an increasingly multi-culti post Obama America. But the film never placates into right wing wish fulfillment (I noticed in my nearly sold out show that many in the audience were old white men and many were wearing some sort of veteran hat) The ending never lets the audience's expectations of blood lust off the hook. Also in our polite society it's more common to not be racist by not using racial slurs but also many people would never engage their "other" neighbors and lock themselves away. Walt continues to be an unapologetic politically incorrect slurring crank but at least he engages the "others" around him. It's interesting how the film never kowtows towards explicitly liberal or conservative agendas.

Due to many of the flaws I can't quite give it above a 7/10 but I do think it's a much more interesting film than the current front runners for Best Pic: Benjamin Button and Slumdog Millionaire.

[Philosophe_rouge]

I think zipperhead was actually referring to his haircut, which seemed something of a faux-hawk thing. I could be wrong though.

[Ezee E]

Well, I'll go into this with no expectations now. Nice.

[NickGlass]

I think zipperhead was actually referring to his haircut, which seemed something of a faux-hawk thing. I could be wrong though.

I bet you wish it was that innocent. Unfortunately, it has deep, nasty roots in the Korean/Vietnam war tradition:

http://www.rsdb.org/search?q=zipperhead

[Philosophe_rouge]

I bet you wish it was that innocent. Unfortunately, it has deep, nasty roots in the Korean/Vietnam war tradition:

http://www.rsdb.org/search?q=zipperhead

Well then... that's much worse.

[Boner M]

Umm, normally I don't care about such things, but this made $29 million on its opening wide release weekend!?! W.T.F.

[Watashi]

Umm, normally I don't care about such things, but this made $29 million on its opening wide release weekend!?! W.T.F.
Don't underestimate the power of Clint.

Most of the people going to this movie haven't been to the theaters in years.

[Ezee E]

Don't underestimate the power of Clint.

Most of the people going to this movie haven't been to the theaters in years.
Nobody's exactly rushed out to see any of his previous movies like this on an opening weekend though.

[number8]

Nobody's exactly rushed out to see any of his previous movies like this on an opening weekend though.

They marketed this as a gun-toting-Clint action movie. When was the last time people saw that?

[megladon8]

I find Ahney Her quite attractive.

[Ezee E]

Not bad actually. I didn't find it as meaningful as Raiders, but I'll side more with him on this one.

Quite surprised really.

[Sxottlan]

I think we can get this on a double bill with Appaloosa for WTF? end credit songs sung by the director.


I was expecting Clint to appear as a towering ghost on Lake Michigan's horizon pointing at the camera and winking.

[Ezee E]

I think we can get this on a double bill with Appaloosa for WTF? end credit songs sung by the director.


I was expecting Clint to appear as a towering ghost on Lake Michigan's horizon pointing at the camera and winking.
Just another Oscar nom that Clint can smirk about.

[Dukefrukem]

Just another Oscar nom that Clint can smirk about.

I'm predicting he wins everything again....

[Sycophant]

I saw this yesterday! I rather liked it! I could reiterate the points that Raiders and Arya made, but I'm not going to. I liked it when its first half hour was the Crazy Adventures of Grump Clint Eastwood, Old Man Next Door, and I like it when it turned into one of the soundest philosophical interpretations of Christianity I've ever seen produced in American film.

Though I must admit, I was baffled as to how the hell this has turned into a blockbuster hit. The promotional material (of which I had seen none--I saw this movie knowing nothing but that Clint Eastwood helmed and starred) must have been all guns-and-surliness. The film really seemed to be the sort of thing, all told, that I'd expect to play an arthouse.

Good stuff.

[Ezee E]

I saw this yesterday! I rather liked it! I could reiterate the points that Raiders and Arya made, but I'm not going to. I liked it when its first half hour was the Crazy Adventures of Grump Clint Eastwood, Old Man Next Door, and I like it when it turned into one of the soundest philosophical interpretations of Christianity I've ever seen produced in American film.

Though I must admit, I was baffled as to how the hell this has turned into a blockbuster hit. The promotional material (of which I had seen none--I saw this movie knowing nothing but that Clint Eastwood helmed and starred) must have been all guns-and-surliness. The film really seemed to be the sort of thing, all told, that I'd expect to play an arthouse.

Good stuff.
The trailers showed it as a Grumpy Clintwood ready to take it to some Asian Gangsters, with a hint of Christianity involved.

It really didn't seem too much different that what it really was.

[megladon8]

Is there anything particularly "objectionable" in this film?

My grandparents randomly want to take me to a movie today (I think it's their way of saying "good bye and good luck" before I leave for NYC). I was thinking maybe this one.

I know there are lots of racial slurs here - that surely won't bother them, since they are lifelong racists themselves. :lol:

I'm just wondering about sex/nudity, or any particularly brutal violence?

[Ezee E]

No sex, and the violence isn't anything gory really. Just the language.

[megladon8]

No sex, and the violence isn't anything gory really. Just the language.


OK, thank you. Appreciate it.

I think I'll try to coax them into that one.

[megladon8]

Hmm...best movie of the year?

May very well be.

[Dukefrukem]

Hmm...best movie of the year?

May very well be.

I thought so.

[megladon8]

I'm trying to put together a review for this, but am having a lot of trouble. I have a million thoughts about the film, but every time I try to write any of them out it feels cliché and vapid.

Suffice to say, I adored this film. It seemed like a perfect way to cap off the career of a man who's known as the protagonist of the morally confused "Dirty Harry" movies.

As if mimicking his love of jazz music and his career in that field, his directorial work has become more refined - more elegant - over the years, but has never lost Eastwood's slightly snarky (but charmingly so) edge. He speaks his mind when its required of him, and he does so bluntly and without regard for all the PC-B.S. and insincere politeness that Hollywood is known for. Even when I disagree with his political or moral views, I find it admirable that he is so uncompromising in presenting these views.

And like Unforgiven, Gran Torino presents its violence as a disgusting, horrible thing. It makes you sick, but not because he is gratuitous with its on-screen depiction, but because he, himself, has a more passive mentality. Sure, he plays The Man With No Name, and the aforementioned Dirty Harry who blows the bad guys away without a second's hesitation...but they're just movies, and he recognizes this. That isn't what or who he is in real life, and I think Gran Torino represents not only a closer look at what his views on violence are, but also how these fit in with being a man known for playing violent characters.

His direction has been called many variations of "plain", but I feel it is anything but. Again, like his jazz music, the films he directs feature all these seemingly simple elements, but they all combine to create something far from "simple". Morally complex, with rich characterizations and affected camera work. He lets each character, line, action and beat of the screenplay speak for itself, without clouding them with over-stylization or unnecessary cues. Like a refined jazz pianist.

The ending song "Gran Torino" performed by him and Jamie Cullum was bittersweet, heartfelt, and had the same sincerity that the film did.

I adored this movie.

[megladon8]

Terrible acting from the actors who played Thao and Sue really stood out on a second viewing, but I still found it a great, powerful film.

It would make a nice companion piece to many other Eastwood films.

[Dukefrukem]

Terrible acting from the actors who played Thao and Sue really stood out on a second viewing, but I still found it a great, powerful film.

It would make a nice companion piece to many other Eastwood films.

I can see that. I'll def. be buying this the week it's out on DVD.

[megladon8]

Thought this would be as good a place as any to say that once a few others have finished list threads here on MC, I'm going to start a countdown of my top 100 songs of all time.

Why say that here?

One of the songs to make the list is the theme song to this film, a heartfelt jazz song performed by Clint Eastwood and Jamie Cullum made all the more touching by the fact that it's Eastwood who sings the first few stanzas.

Here are the lyrics...

So tenderly
Your story is
Nothing more
Than what you've seen
Or what you've done
Or will become
Standing strong
Do you belong
In your skin
Just wondering

Gentle now
A tender breeze blows
Whispers through my Gran Torino
Whistling another tired song

Engine hums
And bitter dreams grow
Heart locked in
A Gran Torino
It beats a lonely rhythm
All night long

Realign
All the stars
Above my head
Warning signs
Travel far
I drink instead
On my own
Oh how I've known
The battle scars
And worn out beds

Gentle now
A tender breeze blows
Whispers through
A Gran Torino
Whistling another tired song

Engines hum
And bitter dreams grow
Heart locked in
A Gran Torino
It beats a lonely rhythm
All night long

These streets are old
They shine
With the things I've known
And breaks through the tree
They're sparkling
The world is nothing more than all the tiny things you've left behind

So tenderly
Your story is
Nothing more
Than what you've seen
Or what you've done
Or will become
Standing strong
Do you belong
In your skin
Just wondering

Gentle now
A tender breeze blows
Whispers through
A Gran Torino
Whistling another tired song

Engine hums
And bitter dreams grow
A heart locked in
A Gran Torino
Beats a lonely rhythm
All night long

May I be so bold
And still need someone to hold
That shudders my skin
They're sparkling

The world is nothing more than all the tiny things you've left behind

So realign
All the stars
Above my head
Warning signs
Travel far
I drink instead
On my own
Oh how I've known
The battle scars
And worn out beds

Gentle now
A tender breeze blows
Whispers through
A Gran Torino
Whistling another tired song

Engines hum
And bitter dreams grow
Heart locked in a Gran Torino
Beats a lonely rhythm all night long
It beats a lonely rhythm all night long

[Kurosawa Fan]

Finally got around to seeing this. Pretty much could have skipped it. Entirely mediocre. TERRIBLE acting across the board, especially the kids and the priest. ATROCIOUS dialogue for damn near the entire running time. Silly conclusion, making this fearless "gang" seem completely limp. Eastwood's character is inconsistent, his "evil" kids and grandkids were a terrible device. The story was interesting when it was just Walt and the kids, but anytime it decided to become a serious, meaningful experience, it was laughable.

[B-side]

Finally got around to seeing this. Pretty much could have skipped it. Entirely mediocre. TERRIBLE acting across the board, especially the kids and the priest. ATROCIOUS dialogue for damn near the entire running time. Silly conclusion, making this fearless "gang" seem completely limp. Eastwood's character is inconsistent, his "evil" kids and grandkids were a terrible device. The story was interesting when it was just Walt and the kids, but anytime it decided to become a serious, meaningful experience, it was laughable.

It's about goddamn time someone brings some sense into the discussion of this film. I was beginning to think everyone was going insane. It's not a good film by any means.

[Ezee E]

I don't think the gang was ever really a fearless gang. Mostly wannabes that got in trouble and raised hell. Like the little kids in City of God.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I don't think the gang was ever really a fearless gang. Mostly wannabes that got in trouble and raised hell. Like the little kids in City of God.

Everyone in the neighborhood feared them and wouldn't talk to the cops anytime they did something. That was evidenced by the priest confronting Walt the first time he pulls a gun on them and tells them to get off his lawn. He goes off on him about not calling the police, and how Walt doesn't know what he got himself into, and how the priest knows the gang and what they're capable of, etc. etc. And the cops at the end saying:

"We finally have witnesses. These guys are going away for a long time." That implies that the cops have been after them for awhile, but no one in the neighborhood would help.

[Dukefrukem]

Finally got around to seeing this. Pretty much could have skipped it. Entirely mediocre. TERRIBLE acting across the board, especially the kids and the priest. ATROCIOUS dialogue for damn near the entire running time. Silly conclusion, making this fearless "gang" seem completely limp. Eastwood's character is inconsistent, his "evil" kids and grandkids were a terrible device. The story was interesting when it was just Walt and the kids, but anytime it decided to become a serious, meaningful experience, it was laughable.

Laughable? You can't even pretend to understand the meaning of the film?

[Ezee E]

Everyone in the neighborhood feared them and wouldn't talk to the cops anytime they did something. That was evidenced by the priest confronting Walt the first time he pulls a gun on them and tells them to get off his lawn. He goes off on him about not calling the police, and how Walt doesn't know what he got himself into, and how the priest knows the gang and what they're capable of, etc. etc. And the cops at the end saying:

"We finally have witnesses. These guys are going away for a long time." That implies that the cops have been after them for awhile, but no one in the neighborhood would help.
Hmm. I just saw them as hoodlums like in Boyz in the Hood. No ambitions, just mugging people. They all lived in one house together and didn't seem to have much money really.

People in the neighborhood could still fear them because they're unpredictable. Random shootouts are reason enough. It's a different type of fear compared to say, the mafioso that collects money for "protecting the neighborhood." As for the Priest, he's simply trying to make sure Walt does the just thing instead of taking it into his own hands. If he found out about pulling the gun on the Blacks, I'm sure he'd have had the same conversation.

With that, I've watched it recently, and I still like it. The acting from the Asians is pretty atrocious though. I'll agree with you there. I'll also agree with Walt's family being very bland and predictable in their dialog. Yet, it still works for me. Maybe because I like the Walt character a lot.

[Dukefrukem]

Maybe we perceive them as bad actors, but their characters are trying to emulate English as a second language?

[Ezee E]

Maybe we perceive them as bad actors, but their characters are trying to emulate English as a second language?
No. The main brother and sister were born in America. They suck at saying dialog, showing emotion, and Eastwood's direction of the boy showed that. Especially when screaming through the screen door.

[Dukefrukem]

No. The main brother and sister were born in America. They suck at saying dialog, showing emotion, and Eastwood's direction of the boy showed that. Especially when screaming through the screen door.

Ah yes. I remember that scene. :|

[Raiders]

ATROCIOUS dialogue for damn near the entire running time.

The stilted English was bad, but I loved Clint's ol' coot dialogue. Actually kind of reminds me a lot of my wife's grandfather.


Silly conclusion, making this fearless "gang" seem completely limp.

Pretty standard bully logic we've seen 100 times before. Not sure how accurate this portrayal ever is, but not sure it is any sillier here than in any other film.


Eastwood's character is inconsistent

I actually think his character is vastly more consistent than we'd expect. He has no big, sudden character change (I admire they kept with his ignorant, racist dialog), just a gradual warming to his neighbors to the point he thinks of them as his family...


his "evil" kids and grandkids were a terrible device.

I won't disagree, but I found them more believable than their counterparts in Eastwood's Million Dollar Baby, mainly because they are selfishly trying to put him away for their sake and, in their minds, his sake as well. The relationship is strained just as much due to him as them, even if they're obviously assholes.


The story was interesting when it was just Walt and the kids, but anytime it decided to become a serious, meaningful experience, it was laughable.

Wasn't it trying to be serious and meaningful most when it was Walt and the kids?

[number8]

I thought the dialogue was pretty great.

"Excuse me, I need a haircut, you Italian son of a bitch prick barber. Boy, does my ass hurt from all the boys at my construction job."

[B-side]

It was funny when it was trying to be just as often as when it wasn't.

[number8]

And it was trying to be funny for about 90% of the movie.

[B-side]

And it was trying to be funny for about 90% of the movie.

You sure about that?

[Ezee E]

You sure about that?
Yes.

[number8]

Yes.

[B-side]

Eh. Pretty sure it would've been marketed differently if it were a comedy.;)

[number8]

I never said it was a comedy.

[B-side]

I never said it was a comedy.

You're splitting hairs. If it was trying to be funny for 90% of the movie, I'd label that a comedy. Not that labels matter at all.

[number8]

Now you're confusing me. If labels don't matter, which I agree with, why should we determine it from how it was marketed?

I don't believe I'm splitting hairs because there are plenty of movies not marketed or labeled as comedies which are for the most part funny, and intentionally so. Off the top of my head... Every movie Quentin Tarantino has made.

[B-side]

Now you're confusing me. If labels don't matter, which I agree with, why should we determine it from how it was marketed?

I don't believe I'm splitting hairs because there are plenty of movies not marketed or labeled as comedies which are for the most part funny, and intentionally so. Off the top of my head... Every movie Quentin Tarantino has made.

I'm not even sure this is worth debating. You're trying to tell me 90% of the movie was funny. I'm saying it wasn't trying to be funny 90% of the time, and that's fairly obvious to me. Yes, it was occasionally intending to be funny, what with the racial bigotry and all, but you're not telling me scenes like Clint punching the cupboards was intended to be funny, nor his whole sacrificial man bit.

[number8]

Or Sam Raimi, come to think of it.

[Kurosawa Fan]

The stilted English was bad, but I loved Clint's ol' coot dialogue. Actually kind of reminds me a lot of my wife's grandfather.

I liked it at times, but other times it just felt forced. The growling was absurd though.


Pretty standard bully logic we've seen 100 times before. Not sure how accurate this portrayal ever is, but not sure it is any sillier here than in any other film.

But certainly not any better. And the fact that we've seen it 100 times before makes it less and less effective each time. This was no exception.




I actually think his character is vastly more consistent than we'd expect. He has no big, sudden character change (I admire they kept with his ignorant, racist dialog), just a gradual warming to his neighbors to the point he thinks of them as his family...

He's shown as fairly feeble in the beginning of the film, groaning when he bends over once, and limping down the stairs, giving his grandkids enough time to shut his military chest and run to the couch before he sees them. He is never again shown this way. That's minor compared to his "warming to his neighbors", as you put it, which wasn't convincing in the least. I can't see Walt going over to their house after one encounter with the Soo standing up to those thugs that were man-handling her. Thao had still tried to steal his car, the grandmother still yelled or scowled every time she sees him, etc. He had just finished throwing all of their gifts away two scenes prior, seemed downright hateful when they moved in, and one conversation in his truck warms him enough that he'll go to their house, try to learn their customs from her, be read by a shaman (after he just scoffed at a horoscope in the paper, nice subtlety there Clint) and have it affect him, sit down with a group of women he can't understand and smile and be kind and eat their food, then go downstairs, fix their dryer, hang out with a group of teens for a bit, and hand out advice to the kid who just tried to steal his car a couple nights prior. Made absolutely ZERO sense. And a couple scenes later he's back to his gruff self, telling the mother he doesn't want Thao on his property and won't accept his help. I realize he backs down at Soo's insistence, but he seemed like old Walt again, not the warmer version.


I won't disagree, but I found them more believable than their counterparts in Eastwood's Million Dollar Baby, mainly because they are selfishly trying to put him away for their sake and, in their minds, his sake as well. The relationship is strained just as much due to him as them, even if they're obviously assholes.

Again, this doesn't make it good, or any better. They were still paper-thin devices.


Wasn't it trying to be serious and meaningful most when it was Walt and the kids?

I meant life or death serious, to use a term tossed around by the film so regularly. Not just "creating a bond" serious and meaningful.


The more I think about this film, the more I dislike it.

[number8]

I'm not even sure this is worth debating. You're trying to tell me 90% of the movie was funny. I'm saying it wasn't trying to be funny 90% of the time, and that's fairly obvious to me. Yes, it was occasionally intending to be funny, what with the racial bigotry and all, but you're not telling me scenes like Clint punching the cupboards was intended to be funny, nor his whole sacrificial man bit.

I've watched this movie like 4 times, and I'm pretty sure those scenes don't even make up a quarter of the film.

[Kurosawa Fan]

I'm not even sure this is worth debating. You're trying to tell me 90% of the movie was funny. I'm saying it wasn't trying to be funny 90% of the time, and that's fairly obvious to me. Yes, it was occasionally intending to be funny, what with the racial bigotry and all, but you're not telling me scenes like Clint punching the cupboards was intended to be funny, nor his whole sacrificial man bit.

Yep. There is no chance that Clint was going for comedy with 90% of this film. I wouldn't even go 50%. It had some funny moments that were certainly intentional, but this was intended to be an emotional drama.

[B-side]

I've watched this movie like 4 times, and I'm pretty sure those scenes don't even make up a quarter of the film.

I was giving examples. Even if the film was largely comedic in intention, it's not a good enough comedy to warrant a recommendation anyway.

[number8]

Come on. This movie practically has a punchline at the end of every scene. You've got "serious" scenes like him chasing away the gangmembers, and the scene ends with "I used to stack fucks like you in Korea and use it as a punching bag." That's like something Rip Torn would say. It's entirely humorous.

And ridiculously awesome.

[B-side]

Come on. This movie practically has a punchline at the end of every scene. You've got "serious" scenes like him chasing away the gangmembers, and the scene ends with "I used to stack fucks like you in Korea and use it as a punching bag." That's like something Rip Torn would say. It's entirely humorous.

And ridiculously awesome.

I would never deny the humor in those scenes. The rest, however, is a big grab-bag of mediocrity with the occasional bit of terrible.

[number8]

Note to self: rent Gran Torino again and watch it for the 5th time, this time imagining the entire movie played by Rip Torn.

[Grouchy]

Plenty of non-comedies are consistently hilarious, and intentionally so.

[Pop Trash]

I put this in the same category of Herzog's Bad Lieutenant or A History of Violence where the filmmaker is self-consciously playing around with genre tropes/cliches often for comedy and often intentionally, but all three movies seem to also dig at deeper truths both about movies themselves and human nature.